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#Just let Odysseus have a peaceful life okay??? Please???
dootznbootz · 1 month
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The Telegony goes against what the Odyssey tells us not only because of Tiresias' Prophecy but also because Odysseus' family line only has one son each.
Zeus made our line a line of only sons. Arcesius had only one son, Laertes, and Laertes had only one son, Odysseus, and I am Odysseus’ only son. He fathered me, he left me behind at home, and from me he got no joy.
(Book 16, Fagles)
Telegonus can't even realistically BE Odysseus' son as he already has Telemachus. The Only son
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sometimesrosy · 4 years
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1: Do you think it’s odd that C fell in love with L after she was not only responsible for Finn’s death, causing C to have to mercy-kill him, but also the reason C was forced to kill all those people in Mt Weather? I’m trying to understand their relationship and how it all worked. Her people were so angry at C for falling for L, but she wasn’t trying to betray them; it was innocent. And she chose her people in the end, right before L was killed. L’s made to be this great love for C. Is she?
(I’m answering your 1 and 2 separately because I think they are separate questions about two separate characters’ experiences with the same narrative element.)
Okay. So I didn’t understand in season 3 what all was going on with that and did a lot of work to understand how Clarke could so easily forgive and love L for what she did and what I came up with is two different interpretations one authorial (the Doylist explanation) and one in narrative (the Watsonian explanation.)
Before I start, no. I don’t think L was made to be this great love for C. I think the fandom fell in love with L for many decent reasons, and picked up on some archetypes in the story as a whole, and the traditional romantic tale of the warrior king and the captive princess, and they just really wanted that story, even deserved that story, so the fandom interpretation made The 100 INTO that story. 
I have rewatched the story looking for that great romance, and while there’s some hints of it, and it’s NOT subtextual (which is possibly why the LGBT community was so happy to get it since they are denied that in most of pop culture) the romance of C and L was for me far, FAR too political in nature for me to find it a great, passionate romance. It was all power games except for the episode with Pauna, if I must be honest. And their love scene, in which L had already sentenced her people to death and Clarke had already decided to go home and it was just two women outside of politics consummating their connection. That part didn’t bother me, it was lovely and a moment of peace. I didn’t love that they didn’t talk about anything important, that they COULDN’T, because for me, intimacy and a great love REQUIRES that kind of openness and honesty, at least for the moment. What I need to see in a romance wasn’t there for me. But I’m sure what other people need to see in a romance WAS. It is quite clear that a large portion of the shipping community LOVEloveLOVES the dynamic of powerful dominating warrior who kidnaps and falls for the warrior princess turned vulnerable maiden (witness the latest craze in Star Wars which is also something I *do not like.*) My distaste for that dynamic does not mean that others are wrong for loving that dynamic. I don’t have to get it. It’s not my preference to reconcile with my life and understanding. It’s theirs. Ship and let ship.
Okay, onto my understanding of what the heck was going on with CL in Polis after L betrayed and harmed her so terribly. The doylist interpretation, why they would write that story and what their intention is, is about themes and symbolism and the journey of the hero. No problem there. But my watsonian interpretation, about why Clarke, the character, would submit herself to that, is psychological, and has gotten me into major trouble. But I’m gonna say it anyway, so if you love Lxa and are offended by people looking at the dark side of the CL relationship please do not read.  I’ll put it under the jump, but for some reason that doesn’t work all the time, so when I warn you to stop reading please stop. Be a responsible consumer of the media. And if you choose to read it anyway, recognize that it was your choice and I gave you plenty of opportunity to not be offended, so don’t send me nasty anons please, because you accepted the risk to your sensibilities.
Allright. Doylist:
Clarke is the hero, and Lxa is Clarke’s shadow, her dark side. Her animus.The masculine version of herself who is a ruthless mass murderer willing to sacrifice anyone and anything for her goals. She has always had this side. Maybe her first kill, Atom, was one of mercy, but her second kill, the grounder holding her hostage was NOT. It was to get free and save her people. But Atom and the grounder guard were killed in the same way. Get close, distract with gentleness, then insert blade into jugular. Clarke’s shadow side is the one that allowed the bomb to drop on TonDC (notice she was egged on, if not bullied into it, by L.)  It was the same part of her that even contemplated killing all of MW to save her people. Her shadow betrays her allies for her own people. Clarke was unable to do it on her own until Bellamy helped her. Bellamy is a different kind of dark to her light, but with a similar symbolism, yin/yang, and kind of actually ends up being the light to her dark, which is a whole other symbolic journey that totally transforms the yin yang of CL into something healing seasons later and not what we’re talking about but if you can recognize that similarity to the archetypes there you can recognize what it is about that dynamic that people love so much.
Okay, so the whole point of having that shadow side for a hero is that the hero has to EMBRACE their shadow side in order to be a full identity. They need to stop resisting their darkness and encompass it in their selves, only then can they step into their full powers. I think this is considered Jungian analysis, if you want to read up on it. That’s where you get a lot of the archetypes and symbolism going. Also, you can see it in the Hero’s Journey by Joseph Campbell which builds on Jungian analysis to create a mythic journey we see in many archetypal tales.
Oh, also. Another doylist interpretation. Clarke in Polis is like Odysseus on Circe’s island. Odysseus stays with Circe and is enchanted with her, despite her turning his crew into pigs. He stays for years with her. All while Penelope is left behind to fend off suitors. So Clarke in Polis would be alluding to The Odyssey, a text that is OFTEN referenced on this show. Yes, that would make Bellamy Penelope. (does that mean the suitors are Pike and Kane as well as Gina and Echo? I think it might, actually.)
So why does Clarke fall for L after all that damage? My Doylist interpretation says because Clarke needed to embrace the shadow and because they were reinterpreting The Odyssey. L was Clarke’s shadow the way Circe was Odysseus’ shadow. Anima/Animus. Also, this embracing and acceptance of the shadow story continued on all the way until s5, and I think you can see it in the “be the good guys/maybe there are no good guys/there are no good guys/be the good guys” journey, which was NOT embraced until Clarke talked with flame Lxa and she said she was wrong, betrayal was wrong and love was not a weakness. Shortly after that, Clarke identified the good guy, and it was Bellamy. Then Monty told them to be the good guys and Clarke has not wavered since.
OKAY. Watsonian incoming. All CL and L faithful, please turn away.
okay, so it turns out that when i write about something that once got me harassed or made friends/fandom turn against me, I have to emotionally prepare for it. 
So here’s the thing. The 100 is about Clarke Griffin as the protagonist (and Bellamy Blake as the secondary protagonist,) and s3 is about TRAUMA. Trauma and recovery. Both Clarke and Bellamy are traumatized by MW and encounter a shadow self that represents who they COULD have been, if not for the presence of the other. Clarke could have been the tyrannical leader who thinks she is always right and Bellamy could have been the vengeful leader out to exterminate his enemies. Here you connect the symbolic shadow symbology to the psychological wounding of the trauma and recovery.
If you read Polis as Clarke’s mental journey, it starts to make sense. She lost it and became feral, L kidnapped her and dragged her to Polis. She imprisoned her and, through a series of positive and negative reinforcements (the carrot and the stick), gaslighting, and power games, she turned Clarke to her side and made her empathize with her captor and betrayer. She gave her a way to survive the trauma of what she’d done by telling her everyone does it, it’s okay. 
Why does she believe her? Because she is traumatized and she’s been isolated from her people in a dangerous place where only L keeps her safe. 
Why does she begin to empathize with L? Because this is a psychological phenomenon that is actually common when a person has been kidnapped, removed from their world, and forced to join the other side. We call it Stockholm Syndrome, and the most basic definition is when a kidnap victim begins to have feelings for and empathize with their kidnap victim.
It’s how you survive. And it’s not a thing that is just about Clarke. It turns out that it happened to a LOT of women in tribal times when one tribe would raid another and kidnap women to bring back as wives or slaves or what have you. 
The women who were kidnapped JOINED the kidnappers tribe, because what else could they do?
Anyway. Clarke is dealing with her dark traumatic experiences, L kidnaps her and draws her to her side, she empathizes with L, falls in love, psychologically accepts that her dark side is the right side to handle all this horror, and then returns to her people, not quite whole, but partly healed and limping along in her journey. 
Polis itself was part of the seduction. It was beautiful and comfortable and passionate and romantic and candlelit. A lot of the fandom saw the romance of the seduction and decided that meant the creators were saying that CL was beautiful and L was the new hero of the story, without noticing that it was Clarke’s unreliable narrator, traumatized POV that was clinging to that beauty so she didn’t have to face the pain of what she did, and her people. Shoot. No matter if some people, when getting confirmation from the writers that Polis was a dark psychological story for Clarke, then blamed the FANDOM for never noticing and saying that the only people who did were screaming “ABUSE!” and so were then clearly unreliable. Yes. They were talking about me. Because I TOLD them, personally, in a huge meta discussion, that it was a dark psychological journey and I laid it out for them, and they well. Turned on me, blocked me, ignored me, and then blamed me for them not understanding the damn story. I am still salty to this day. But then, they are no longer in the fandom.
Other people, CL fans, didn’t like that I said Clarke was suffering from Stockholm Syndrome, but if you look it up, you’ll see she fits the definition. L literally kidnapped and imprisoned her and this is evident in narrative, dialogue and word of god. 
Why do we think that’s a romantic story? Because it is an old school, traditional romance tale of literal raiding warriors kidnapping women and bringing them back as wives. So romantic. It had to be, because otherwise the women suffering from trauma would not be able to survive. 
There are no more raiders in modern western society, but the story is imbedded in our collective unconscious and our archetypal stories.
I hate them.
Some people love them.
And the people who love them are immensely offended that the people who hate them recognize an abusive, oppressive and traumatic story within them. And then they send us hate anons and mock us for being abuse survivors and “irrational” and telling us “it’s just fiction, Janice.” and on and on and on. 
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asdfghjkl1x1 · 4 years
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Hunters | Grace, Kozue, Lucas, Régine
The previous day was spent in hours of catching up, and lots of walk with the wolves. Everyone took on the roles they eventually fell in with the time they've just spent. Grace and Kozue would lead, Régine would take out the rear guard while Lucas made sure they were good all over the road. As for William, he would take care of their direction as he mapped out where they were going.
"So, you're the leader of the pack?" Kozue asked Grace.
"I think the word is Alpha, chérie" Régine corrected.
"I lead this pack since that night I drove them out of town, I've spent some time with them, on top of that, the wolf I fought happened to be their leader."
"Did you...?"
"No, he's over there" Grace pointed at a gray wolf. The animal saw her and went to where she was, then lied by her feet. "I'm more of an accidental Alpha, so the least I can do is take them to a new home"
"If you're the Alpha, then what's Lucas?" Kozue asked.
"A beta, same for Régine, these wolves took her in immediately, I'm surprised"
"Don't be. You hugged me yesterday. They only took me in because I smelled like you. As for Jean-Luc, I'm sure it's because they've spent enough time with him."
"Yes, he would heal them when they were wounded"
"Et voilá" Régine pointed at Grace while looking at Kozue.
"William-san is your cousin, why didn't they take him in too? Shouldn't you guys have the same smell or something?"
"That I'm not sure, but so far, the wolves seem to not like him, and I don't know why." Grace said as she looked at William by the lake taking notes on a notebook.
"Uhm... if Régine and Lucas are betas, am I a beta, too?"
"Uhm... no, Kozue, you're not."
"But they're extra careful with me, they probably love me" she giggled.
Grace smiled and sighed "I told you you would hate me but I didn't tell you why" she swallowed "You're... the Alphasmate"
Régine laughed, and Grace blushed. Kozue, on the other hand, was confused "What's that?"
"Uhm..." Grace was nervous and didn't know how to convey the information.
Régine noticed and went ahead "Cherié, to the wolves, you two mated. Like, let's put it in this way, you're married in their... law. So, they will obey you and Sadako as much as they do with Grace and Marion."
Kozue froze, she looked at Grace then at Régine, stood silent for a while before finally protesting "Couldn't you at least be nice and propose properly?" then realized about something else "Oh God, I can't be married, I'm  supposed to marry F..." she bit her lip at a certain name, and looked down sad.
"Who?" Grace asked.
"None of your business" Kozue said in a serious tone, so unusual for her that she blinked in disbelief, before walking away.
Lots of thoughts were going through the Asian's mind as she walked deep into the forest, she knew that the Welsh was not going to let it rest, not because she wanted to nag at her for anything, but because she might offer herself, as usual, to help her. Kozue thought that Grace already had enough on helping people, and that for once, she should let others help her.
The steps being heard behind, confirmed her that such thing was not going to happen yet, so she stopped.
"Talk to me, Kozue"
Kozue hugged herself. How to start and where to start were things she didn't know how to convey.
"It's Freya you're supposed to marry, right?" Grace dared to shoot. Kozue and her weren't much about beating the bush, and that was one aspect she loved about their friendship. Not to mention it was something agreed between them, thanks to Kozue's cousin, Haruko.
The Asian froze, then let out a long sigh without releasing her own arms nor facing the Welsh, "I think that'd be an arrogant and childish thought."
Grace smiled and approached slowly behind her before hugging her from behind "Loving someone is not arrogant or childish, Kozue. Maybe assuming it's like your fate could be, but that's how love works. It makes absolutely not sense sometimes" she giggled.
Kozue leaned her head back and rested it against Grace's chest "Why you're always so warm?"
"Why you haven't told her about your feelings?"
"It's not that easy, Grace"
"Why?"
"There's someone else I don't know" Kozue groaned softly "I left feeling jealous of that someone I don't even know"
Grace sighed "Haven't you thought that maybe... it could be you?"
"What?"
"Okay, Penelope, you're into war themes and stuff. Let's say you're a princess who's supposed to find a suitor soon, because your father want it so, and you've been single for way too long. Your name is Penelope."
"Am I getting a story from you?" Kozue giggled.
"Yes, you are. Let me continue."
Kozue nodded and Grace continued "Now, there's a lot of people who try to go after you during your daily life, and then there's your best friend, Minerva, someone who's grown with you, someone who actually you enjoy spending time with, but never considered taking her as your wife, even though you would be okay if that happened."
"One day, this friend asks for your hand to your parents without you knowing, they're not agree with it, because despite being honourable, she has no dowry, nor comes from an important family. Then informs you she's departing for a long time, but promises to come back to you."
"Time passes and every day, Penelope gets sadder because Minerva is not with her. Then she starts overthinking on how many other people her best friend must be with, because this person had the freedom and strength to go on adventures every time she wanted. So Penelope, started to feel jealous, not only of Minerva's status, but of the amount of imaginary women her mind created that would be of her best friend's taste, blondes, redheads, tall, short, it didn't matter. She just assumed there was someone else and that it was not her."
"Next day, your father comes to you and informs that you have until the next feast to choose a suitor, he already picked 5, so you should choose among those. The day comes, and considering you had no time to get acquainted, you assumed this is the last day you're free, so, true to yourself on looking someone to admire, you make someone bring your mother's bow and tell all of them that the one who would fix it, would marry you."
"Since these were mainly aristocrats, none of them knew how to fix the bow. Then, someone under a cloak came over, and did so. The person first made the King to promise that if they fixed the bow, no matter what he'll keep his word. The King agreed, the person, after some struggle, fixed the bow."
"The person turned out to be Minerva, right?" Kozue giggled
"Yes, how do you know?"
"Because you're doing quite the crossover there, and Ulysses or Odysseus did sleep with some other women, and the tale actually made a good deal on Penelope's loyalty"
"You know I'm not as well-versed in Greek mythology as you are"
Kozue giggled "It's okay, Penelope deserved the goddess as her wife. Both were loyal in your tale."
"That's precisely what I'm trying to illustrate, and I just don't know how The Iliad went."
"Odysseus and Penelope are from The Odyssey, Grace"
"I always confuse those two. Maybe we should talk about Arthurian legends, I would be glad about it."
Kozue giggled "I'm not going to give you the upper hand" she turned to face her and smiled. Her face slowly went sad "I can't just tell Freya I like her."
"Kozue, I think a certain number of people can see Freya has feelings towards you."
"I never said I didn't know her feelings towards me"
At this, Grace froze, "What do you mean?"
Kozue smiled at her sadly "When you told me everything about Marion, I first disliked how much it seemed that you wanted her to be out of you, to be put aside, as if she wasn't part of you, too. I said I was not going to do that with Sadako. So, I made a deal with her, well, you know that, the memory part. But there's one I never told anyone..." she bit her lip, then took a deep breath "I wanted Sadako to be loved by Freya instead of me, because if she did so, maybe, just maybe, we could be together because she would love me the way I was" she took a deep breath and stared at Grace's face.
"...Did it work?"
Kozue smiled "It did, just not the way I expected. Everything comes with a price. That's when I understood part of who we are, and the things you did. I realized that what you did was not trying to get rid of her. I mean, Marion wrote books. You gave her a life, freedom, and a place where she was going to be accepted for who she is, and it worked. But in exchange, you got this personality trait of disliking yourself, of feeling inferior."
Grace started to ponder about it, and Kozue was right, while she occasionally knew how to recognize when she was not someone else's size, on her youth, she didn't remember treating herself as someone less than others.
The Asian pursed her lips "Naivety is not exactly part of me"
Grace stood silent for a few seconds before finally understanding "You sold your love for Freya to Sadako.., right?"
Kozue looked down and nodded.
"Why?"
"I was afraid"
"Of what?"
"That one day she would leave like Lucy... or would be completely scared of me, or won't trust me anymore." Kozue shut her eyes "Maybe is for the best there's someone else. I'll feel better if she has someone... normal to be with."
Grace's hug went tight, she completely understood that feeling and had no intention of condemning her for it.
"Please, at least let her know about it. Tell her about your feelings and get some peace from it if it turns out she's not willing to correspond your love."
"I should"
"If you two are done, would you please come over and start with today's hunt? We have 57 mouths to feed" Régine's voice was heard behind them.
Grace frowned in confusion and corrected her "We're 55"
"Sadako and Marion count, too."
The morning was fresh and windy, good for hunting—Grace thought, since it was easy for Marion to catch the smell of her prey in the air and know where to go. "You should take off your jacket, shirt and shoes, it'd be a good training for you, you should try to bring out Sadako, it'll be quicker for both"
"I don't know how to call her on will. Though..." she looked up "at midnight she'll take over"
"Day 29th, right?"
Kozue nodded. Deep down, and maybe for the first time, she was excited it was happening.
They ran several meters, which easily made it to a kilometre or two, Grace's original experience on hunting served for Marion to be more accurate on the task and not acting on mere instincts.
It was quite a novelty for Kozue to be her in front of Marion, at the alter's 'Hey, kid' she blushed easily. She tried to keep up as much as she could with the running, but at some moment she had to stay slow down.
Marion would go over her and try to run in the same speed, since the hunters of the pack are supposed to move together, and it was demanded of her as the Alphasmate, after all, the latter was supposed to be an equal to the Alpha.
However, when she got tired, Kozue decided to use her own skills to keep up by organizing the attacks and make the wolves move better along Marion. It worked perfectly, and at the end, she earned their respect.
"I don't think those are enough rabbits for this pack, there won't be many for all, shouldn't we go for a deer or something?" Kozue suggested as she counted what they got.
"That'd be hard, I'm not sure where we are, and I don't think they come out around this time. Unless you plan—"
Kozue raised her hand, she seemed to be picking some nearby sound.
"Your ears are working already?"
"The more we approach to midnight, the more they will heighten" then she groaned. "I forgot my earplugs"
"Shit" then realized about something "Cotton balls, I'm sure Lucas can get you some if it gets unbear—"
Kozue raised her hand again "Do wolves eat fish?"
"Yes, they can't fish, but can steal it from other animals and eat it without any problems"
The Asian smiled "There's a river close. And I can tell there's a lot of flopping sounds"
Both ladies reached the river, and indeed, the current was flooded with fishes of a few kinds, Marion looked for the others and they started to fish for everyone. The alter was impressed with Kozue and how easy it was for her to fish with her bare hands. On her side, she was not that skilled, all the fishes would navigate and slip through her hands without staying in between them, making her groan in frustration.
Kozue giggled at her status, "You should get some branches, I'll make you something for you to fish. You got a knife?"
Marion gave her her knife after going for some branches, she felt a bit uncomfortable for being unable to do so, Grace had a few handful skills but fishing wasn't one of those.
The Asian prepared the branches in a way one could take the fishes, by piercing their bodies while in the water. "Here, I think you can do it now"
Marion took the long branch and with a bit of focus she would catch fishes and give it to the wolves easily, she smiled in triumph and kept fishing for a while.
Lucas and William started a fire and prepared everything to cook the fishes for them, while Régine would feed the sick and old wolves with rabbits.
Once they ate, the Frenchwoman stared at them, then at the river "We can't stay that long here"
"Why?" asked Kozue as she caressed Yuki's back.
"Just a bad feeling"
William would look around them, then briefly thought that Régine held her eyes on his, but as soon as he blinked they were no more. I must be imagining things.
They picked up their things, put out the fire, and kept walking, they needed to cover their quote for the day, otherwise, the trip might get longer, and who knows what dangers could lie ahead if they didn't move fast, after all, they weren't exactly difficult to spot with a pack of 50 wolves among them.
On the afternoon, they took a rest, after they got a bit away from the river's current. Régine and Grace decided to keep it as reference to know when they would get to the sea and how far they were from it.
They walked some more until the sun started to lower, and the light started to fade. William made a bonfire, Lucas examined both Grace and the wolves, not finding anything bad with them.
Kozue on the other hand, started to frown while seeing, and listening to the flames and the burning wood.
"Are you okay?" Luke asked.
"I am" she smiled "It's just a headache. I had a lot of activity today, maybe I should just sleep."
Grace didn't notice because she was busy observing the wolves and William, The latter seemed more and more interested on keeping an eye on Lucas, that when he smiled, his cousin got a bit alarmed and avoided to think out of the friendship perspective. I hope this trip ends soon.
Kozue went to sleep first, an hour later the rest followed, Grace being the last, the Welsh observed how the Asian seemed to have troubles in her sleep, but still managed to calm down after a few seconds. She lied next to her and pulled her close. Must be a nightmare.
A few hours later, a sharp and terrible pain on her shoulder woke up Grace, it took a few seconds to understand that it came from teeth. Who— Her eyes went wide open at seeing a Kozue with still closed eyes biting her. She had to do something and fast.
Régine woke up, alarmed at the vision and approached quickly to them.
Grace raised her hand, to stop her, the least she wanted was to alarm all the wolves with the idea that their Alpha was being apparently betrayed by her Alphasmate. She took her index to her lips, and her eyes went to William and Lucas.
The Frenchwoman understood.
thig air adhart.
Marion took Kozue gently, holding any sounds of pain and took her apart from everyone, whatever the nightmare was, it made the lady act aggressively and sleepwalk easily during it.
The Asian stopped, only to change the teeth for her nails.
The alter made her best to avoid the attacks, but the speed was far superior from the girl she hunted with earlier that day. She had no choice, she had to try to wake her up by responding to the actions.
After avoiding more swift attacks on her way, she managed to slap her face, without any success, she tried pulling her hair, pinching her, but this was indeed a deep sleep, and the nightmare seemed to not end. Finally, she decided that it was better to do the same as her. She took her arm, bad bit it, holding into it.
The sleeping Kozue managed to take Marion's arm and bite it as well.
Blood dripped from their arms, making their bites harder with every second it passed. Marion finally whimpered out of pain, she shut her eyes and covered her mouth, she couldn't wake up the wolves. When she opened her eyes, she found the other's eyes looking back at her, first confused, then alarmed, letting go of her arm.
"Are you okay?" Marion asked.
"I am" the Asian panted "I am" she repeated in a serious and slightly low tone, then looked around, not recognizing the place "Where are we?"
The alter noticed the change and knew who she was talking to "Nice too see you again, Sadako. Sure, you could have spared my arm"
Sadako winced "Shit. I'm so sorry, Marion" and checked her arm. "Again, where are we, how did I get here?"
Marion explained everything to her, and she nodded any other time, feeling more calmed about the situation and glad that her equal had a way to go to her original personality and back. "Let's go with the others, we'll let Lucas take care of this."
All of sudden, a mighty roar was heard that made both the ladies jump in surprise. "A bear"
Marion tried to pick the smell of the animal "It's been trailing us... since our stop at the river, apparently. It smells of fish" then observed her arm "and this blood is not going to help. We'll cover this and move as silent as we can."
Sadako heard enough to know that it's been after them, and it was approaching.
When they made it with the other and woke them up, Marion pushed the once Alpha to the others, telling him to go with the others, but apparently, the wolf was trying to find who hurt her instead.
Sadako called on Yuki, regrouped the pack, and started to walk. If they didn't move soon, the bear will get them.
Lucas stayed with Marion since she refused to leave blood trails to the animal, which was the wisest thing to do, while the others went ahead.
A gunshot was heard in the air, from behind them, the bear roared once more and ran to the other direction.
Hunters?
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woozapooza · 6 years
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Black Sails: The Verdict
not to be obvious but this was a really good show
If I try to get into all the things I want to say about this show I’ll be writing this post for the rest of my life so I’m just gonna touch on the most important things.
I’m not sure there’s ever been a show that had this much of an emotional impact on me. I woke up in the middle of the night last night thinking about the show. I guess I must have been dreaming about it and dreamed so hard I woke myself up. I’m sincerely hoping that the day is not far off when I can think about this show more calmly. I think I’ll be able to enjoy it more when the very thought of it doesn’t make me drown in feelings. I’m grateful for the BS humor videos on youtube that are helping me take the show less seriously.
I’ve been looking at other people’s reactions to the finale and two things are clearer than ever (and they were already pretty clear): 1. This is a very complex show where no one is ever totally right or wrong. 2. My standards for TV are a lot lower than many TV fans’. I’m impressed by people who are able to be like “here’s why such-and-such episode didn’t make sense/was dissatisfying” and I sort of envy people who are that good at watching TV but I’m a lot more willing than some people to accept what a show gives me and that’s just the way it is. So I understand some people’s complaints about various things about how the show ended, and I also understand the people who have the complete opposite points of view because this show is wicked complex and there are no right answers to a lot of the big questions about it. Anyway, the following are just my onions.
Ultimately I think my favorite character was Silver. I’ve never seen a character with development like his. I know his actions in the finale are very controversial and I’m trying not to take too hard a stance on them in one direction or the other, but I think what he did was ultimately right. He prevented a war that would have been devastating (because it’s a war) and that England probably would have won anyway. It’s not like the fact that the war got cut short means people aren’t going to keep resisting the bad things about the British empire. As for what he did to Flint, I’ve seen some people get very angry with Silver for essentially selling Flint into slavery, which okay yes, but…what was he supposed to do? If he wants to end the war, he has to sacrifice Flint. Flint’s whole identity was built around fighting civilization. If Silver wanted to end the war, he had to end Flint, and the only ways to do that were to kill him or “unmake” him, and what’s the best way to do that latter? By forcibly removing Flint from his life of piracy and reuniting him with the very thing whose loss turned James McGraw into Captain Flint in the first place: Thomas Hamilton. Flint’s life was basically miserable and I can’t see any way Silver could have found happiness for Flint except by reuniting him with the man he loved. It sucks that Flint is basically trapped on the plantation, but he hates the world anyway, so I’m not sure he’d be all that devastated about being shut off from the world for the rest of his life. Plus, it was repeatedly stressed that this is place as humane as it could be while still being what it is—I mean, no one got mad at Thomas for stopping work and hugging and kissing his lover—so it’s not like he’ll be treated terribly. I’m not trying to pretend that what Silver did was totally fine, but he gave Flint the happiest ending realistically possible. What else was he supposed to do?
I know some people suspect that Silver actually killed Flint and made up the story about sending him to the plantation, but not only is that needlessly depressing when the show is throwing a much happier option at us, it doesn’t even make sense. I mean, I don’t understand the logic of literally seeing something happen and then being like “well what if that didn’t happen!” Like, it’s a show, none of it really happened, but there is still a reality at the fictional level and if the show is clearly telling us that an event is part of that reality I don’t understand the impulse to reject that event as real.
It’s striking—and pleasing—that for such an angsty show, the ending was relatively happy. The world changes, civilization wins out, but that doesn’t mean everyone’s lives are over, that there’s no room for them to be happy going forward. Flint gets to “walk away from the sea and find some peace” with his true love. (Also note that he and Thomas were separated for approximately ten years, which is, well, half the time Odysseus and Penelope were separated? So the parallel sort of works. Half works.) Silver and Madi have gone through a very rough patch, but Madi returns to Silver and I have to believe that that means she’s come to see that his point of view is legitimate, that the issue of the war was an impossibly complicated one and the fact that they had different opinions on it doesn’t make either of them wrong, and that he really loves her. I know Silver has a wife in the book (which I CANNOT WAIT TO READ), so I assume we’re supposed to think he and Madi worked it out and got married. I’m more than willing to think that. Jack and Anne are still together (till they put us in the fucking ground!), still doin’ piracy, and Jack got another lesbian for his collection. (Hi, Mary Read!!!) Max is still running Nassau, happy, powerful, able to make the world a better place, and on good terms with Anne and Jack. Featherstone is governor! I love it! Everything sucks for Woodes Rogers, which, while I didn’t really like him, is not entirely fair, to be honest. He was no more a one-dimensional villain than Flint. Billy is, uh, marooned on Skeleton Island, I guess? Well, I know he can’t die yet because he’s in the book. Actually, let me start a new paragraph about Billy.
I know a lot of people ended up straight-up hating Billy, but I didn’t. I don’t want to go into too much detail because quite honestly I’m afraid I’m going to end up saying things that are just factually incorrect but I think Billy had good intentions that led him astray. It’s sad, really. His hatred of Flint was honestly totally justified but it led him to do things he shouldn’t have done, like going through with the raid on that one plantation. I don’t know, maybe I’m going too easy on him because he was so wonderful in the first three seasons, but maybe it’s not a bad thing that I choose to remember who Billy used to be and try to see that person in who he became.
I have a ton more things I want to say but those things will have to wait for other posts. Some of them I won’t be able to articulate unless I rewatch, and god knows when I’ll have the strength to do that. I’m just so fascinated by the theme of stories (one of my favorite themes for any show to have) in particular as it relates to my dear boys Flint and Silver. Both of them take on identities they didn’t start with—civilized lieutenant James McGraw becomes “the bloodthirstiest buccaneer that sailed,” Captain Flint, and tiny precious happy John Silver becomes Terrifying Indestructible Pirate Long John Silver—and we see the stories that spring up around both of those characters but we also see these guys for who they truly are underneath all the legends and ahhhhh I’m becoming inarticulate so I’m gonna just stop that thought here. In fact, I think it’s time to wrap up this post because if I even try to say more I’m gonna be here forever. Oh, but let me just say bless Jack Rackham for that beautiful speech about stories. Whenever a character in a show or movie makes a grand speech on that topic I’m GUARANTEED to just lose it emotionally.
Last thing: the reasons I wanted to watch this show in the first place were simply that it was a period drama about pirates that had quality gay/bi representation. I built it up so much in my head that I was apprehensive about watching it but guess what, it totally met my expectations! The representation was beautiful (I want to say more words on that topic but I’ll save that for another post) and, like, there were pirates. If I may end on a shallow note (which I may because it’s my blog and I’m in charge) anything with pirates is guaranteed to be awesome.
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Monado Mandala: Part Two
The next part is the World of Knowledge.
In the Room of Knowledge:
the scene is in a graveyard. a woman is pinned to a tree by a figure
Miki: Kaoru... Miki Asai: An investigator who was Baofu's partner. While investigating "Tien Tao Lien", she was killed by Yung Pao in Taiwan. Baofu: Miki...!? Ulala: Is that... Miki...? Reverse Odysseus: Kaoru Saga... I am you... What is yours, is also mine... Miki: Uh...! Please... Ulala: Stop it!! Reverse Odysseus: Do you feel the anger inside of you? Who is it for? I'll give your answer in this woman's blood. Baofu: Why you...
The Persona slams Miki against the tree until she goes limp.
Miki: ......... Baofu: You f##kin' bastard!!!
Maya: >Don't do it!
Baofu: ...Me!! It's not Tatsuzou, not Yung Pao, or you...!! The one I can't forgive is... me!!
The Persona and Miki vanish; Miki reappears by the grave.
Baofu: I'm sorry... Miki... That time I was just a hot-shot... I wasn't able to do anything... I shouldn't have gotten you involved... It was my fault that you died that day... It wasn't the Persona, it wasn't the law... It was me... It was my fault. I was so damn selfish... Miki: Don't blame yourself... I knew the risk I was taking... You never looked back... You always believed you were right... I liked that person...
She vanishes and the scene returns to Monado.
Baofu: ......... Katsuya/Maya/Tatsuya: ......... Baofu: How pathetic... Everything's... out in the open... Now you see... I was planning to use you guys from the beginning! Somewhere inside, I knew... That I couldn't do anything by myself... Heh... I wanted revenge so bad... But I couldn't do it by myself... I didn't even give you my real name... Ulala: ...I... I think that's a nice... name...! I... I think it's a cool name...! It has a nice ring to it... Katsuya: I was thinking... and now it's clear... "Kaoru Saga" died on duty 5 years ago... The man in front of me is a completely different person from the one we saw... A bit misguided perhaps... A "free spirit"... A "loveable lush"... Ulala: ...Didn't you forget "twisted person"? Baofu: ........ Ch... Don't put me in the same shot glass as those sentimental wussies... And you know what, Suou? You're not cut out to be a police officer. Investigations are supposed to be...
(this is the good choice)
Maya: >.........
Baofu attacks Reverse Odysseus and both the Persona and Miki vanish.
Baofu: So that's how it is...
The scene returns to Monado.
Baofu: I'm sorry... Miki... I finally understand... The person I couldn't forgive... was... me... Back then, I was just a hot-shot... I wasn't able to do anything... In the end, I got you killed... It wasn't the Persona, it wasn't the law... It was me who couldn't think of anything but myself...!! Ulala: Bao... fu... Baofu: Now you see... I was planning to use you guys from the beginning! Ulala: That's... enough... Baofu: Go ahead and laugh... My attempt at revenge was pointless... I'm no different than Tatsuzou!! Ulala: Stop it...!!
Katsuya decks him.
Katsuya: Get ahold of yourself! Why did you even come here...? Tatsuzou is dead... You got your wish. If you can't say it, I will. You knew all along that you were stuck in the past... That's why you came here. Stop looking down on yourself... Isn't it... about time to start over...? Let it go, Baofu! You ought to cherish those memories you had with her. Baofu: ......... Alright... I'm okay now... Did you all like my acting skills? That was pretty good, huh? Ulala... Ulala: What...? Baofu: That was for the time at the bar. Fooled y'all, didn't I? Ulala: ......... It looks that way.
(this is the bad choice)
afterwards, regardless of option:
Ulala: Ma-ya... You remember that fortune I told you about in the beginning? I think... it's right... Tatsuya: I've never met anyone like this guy before... Katsuya: Geez, what an antisocial Baofu... Ms. Serizawa must have a difficult time. Baofu: Well... um... ya know... There's a lot... in life...
Next, is the World of Emotion.
Inside the Room of Emotion:
Nyarlathotep: I'm glad you made it here without dying. Of course, it would be dull for you to die so easily. Now, Maya Amano... After coming here, what are you angry at?
Maya: >At you...!
Nyarlathotep: It's an honor. Well then, you can move on ahead. I shall watch you struggle a little while longer.
after:
Tatsuya: I've never seen such an angry face... ...since that time... Katsuya: Ms. Amano, I know exactly how it feels... But calm down... I finally understand... Anger, ignorance, vengeance... He is trying to coax the shadows of our hearts to gain power... Don't listen to him. Baofu: That's definitely a human... That's the way he looks down on others, that's something only humans can do... Heh... All right... I'll tango with ya. As another human... Ulala: Going through all this, and you're not supposed to get upset!? I ain't no nun or priest! I can't stand it!!
(this is a bad choice)
Maya: >I'm just... very sad...
Nyarlathotep: Hmph... How sentimental... What are you so sad about? Now go ahead and shoot. Deep down inside, I know you hate me. Pull the trigger, Maya. Well then, I'll say the one thing you want to hear the least. The young man who holds your heart... He's mine. He's a toy in the shape of a human! He'll never be yours! Never!!
Maya: >Pull the trigger.
Maya shoots Nyarlathotep but Tatsuya is hit.
Tatsuya: Wh... at...? Katsuya: Tatsuya!? Nyarlathotep: Hahahahahaha! You simply don't learn, do you? I told you that I am you... People who think that they are strong are weak, especially when their loved ones suffer... Maya: ......... Nyarlathotep: Yes, that's good... Let your impulses control you! That is what it means to be a human!! Hahaha...!!
after:
Tatsuya: You don't... have to worry... I said it before... I can withstand this pain... Katsuya: Ms. Amano, I know exactly how it feels... But calm down... I finally understand... Anger, ignorance, vengeance... He is trying to coax the shadows of our hearts to gain power... Don't listen to him. Baofu: That's definitely a human... That's the way he looks down on others, that's something only humans can do... Heh... All right... I'll tango with ya. As another human... Ulala: Going through all this, and you're not supposed to get upset!? I ain't no nun or priest! I can't stand it!!
(this is another bad choice. also Tatsuya's HP is dropped to 1 after this. only his comment changes afterwards compared to the other bad route)
Maya: >Don't pull the trigger.
Nyarlathotep: Hmph... This will be something to watch. How long can you keep this up?
after:
Tatsuya: It's alright... That sadness... will end soon... Katsuya: Ms. Amano, stay strong... He is trying to coax the shadows of our hearts to gain power... I finally understand. Baofu: That's definitely a human... That's the way he looks down on others, that's something only humans can do... Heh... All right... I'll tango with ya. As another human... Ulala: Going through all this, and you're not supposed to get upset!? I ain't no nun or priest! I can't stand it!!
(this is the good choice)
While exploring World of Conviction:
Baofu: Hey, Maya... Guess it's our turn next... Maya: .........
In the room of Conviction, Lisa hangs from the 'ceiling'.
Tatsuya: Lisa...! Shadow Maya: Are you relieved... little boy? But we can't let you have her back quite so easily. Shadow Baofu: Heh... Such being the case... I'll be sure to teach her a lesson, so you can die in peace. Maya: ......... Baofu: Try picking on someone your own size... How about me? Shadow Maya: (snicker) You make me laugh... Shadow Baofu: Yeah, that makes me laugh!!
If contacted:
Shadow Baofu: Beg for mercy! Maybe I'll let you go? Shadow Maya: Let's have some fun...
After the fight:
Tatsuya: ......... Baofu: Did you know, Tatsuya...? There are two types of men in this world... A "normal" man and... a "real" man. A "real" man knows how to ease sadness... You're undoubtedly the latter... Tatsuya: .........
Philemon appears.
Tatsuya: Philemon... Please... Philemon: I know... I will take her back to the real world...
Philemon and Lisa vanish.
After:
Katsuya: ......... Ulala: Is this... the burden an 18-year-old boy is supposed to carry on his shoulders...? It's just too brutal... Baofu: You should be proud... The person that's been protecting you is the world's finest... Undoubtedly, the real thing... Tatsuya: ......... Let's move on. I'm ready.
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