#I just. genuinely don’t understand why this is an argument ppl want to win lol | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

heartate-aa · 3 years

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good morning! raphael trying to blame me for this situation not being private is a reach and super shitty and they are clearly not sorry for literally ANYTHING with the way they worded their doc. they are literally unapologetic and it SHOWS. it’s so obvious that they’re not fucking sorry at all. this is literally just about trying to save their fucking ass and make me look bad lmao. lying and being like “well i never tried to silence her, i offered to talk to her and she refused, the door is still open” like that’s such a weak way to be like oh well im not silencing her as if you didn’t tell me to “shut up” and “shut the fuck up” or “let’s not do this” as if that gives me any room to speak. you constantly blamed me for “deciding when/where conversations ended” and constantly made me feel like i was being fucking punished FOR EVERYTHING THAT I DID. me not wanting to talk about something because i was getting very upset and then frustrated is a valid reason to not wanting to talk, but YOU would push me and guilt trip me by saying “oh, so when i want to talk, fuck my feelings, but you get to decide when we do/don’t talk” like. i understand how this might be hypocritical because i used to force you to patch things up with me immediately (which i admitted to in my first imgur) but i learned and stopped. i don’t think, at least from my perspective and im sorry if i’m wrong, that i continued this behavior. i really don’t think i kept trying to force you to talk. if arguments got strong on, i feel that it’s because you brought them up. i literally did anything to avoid fighting with you at all costs but literally everything i did would just piss you off and i just can’t fucking win lol.

it’s so unfair to fucking use caps from someone vent twitter where, by the way, a lot of the shit i tweet out of anger/being sad are???????????????? twisted out of context and it’s so fucked up because 85% of the time im having a god damn meltdown and im spiraling????? you’re so fucked up for this, especially you ki you’re literally like. the most two-faced snake i have EVER met like dude. you’re so fucked. up. how do you fucking sit there with a good and clean conscience without guilt for constantly capping people’s vents and sharing them around or talking about them to other people like? you’re so gross for this hello??? you’re a fucking adult and you shit on people for 2014 tumblr behavior but you literally capping people’s shit like this is so. 2014 tumblr. grow up. grow. up. you literally act so fucking nice behind ppl’s backs and pull shit like this and i feel so fucking stupid for defending you to raphael so hard when they shat on you about savage/extreme raiding and yes i have caps for this because i’m sure they didn’t show you everything lmao. you are literally. so childish dude. like dude??? it’s so fucking disgusting of you to pretend to be my friend and just like, sit in my vent account to what, just watch me??????? like no one ever made u fucking follow me on my private twitters and like it’s so gross that u’d take my shit out of context and and run with them and twist them and then not even fucking ask me like i get? you having avpd but that’s literally no excuse for how u acted or what ur doing rn like lmao man you’ve hated me for so long and it fucking shows and it’s so rich considering you admitted to other people that you thought raphael was treating me like shit and that you had your own issues with them. it’s so. rich. lmao i feel so dumb ever defending you when you like ?? just literally have done everything time and time again to do shit like this. like i don’t think im in the wrong for fucking ????????? venting about my relationship or wanting to seek out advice for it and you literally lying saying that i TRIED to make raphael look bad to you when i literally TRIED SO HARD TO DO THE OPPOSITE and that’s why i didn’t give you caps bc i didn’t want it to blow harsher than it TRULY was but yeah no i have caps and they’re yours. don’t worry. and like. you’re so fucking sick in the head to put this on me saying “this isn’t a new realization” AS IF ??????????? I WASN’T SITTING IN DENIAL OVER HOW RAPHAEL TREATED ME BECAUSE I KEPT GETTING GUILT TRIPPED AND MANIPULATED AND I GENUINELY. WAS SO IN LOVE WITH THEM LIKE YOU HAVE NO IDEA. HOW MUCH SHITTY BEHAVIOR I TURNED MY EYES AWAY FROM AND ALLOWED TO SLIDE BECAUSE I THOUGHT IT WAS NORMAL, I THOUGHT WE COULD WORK THROUGH ANYTHING. I DESPERATELY WANTED THINGS TO WORK BECAUSE I LOVED THEM AND I DIDNT WANT TO GIVE UP AND WALK AWAY BECAUSE IM STUPID AND SOFT AND I WANTED. THINGS TO WORK. WITH MY BOYFRIEND LOL. i was in denial. for so. long. even with so many fucking people trying to tell me “this behavior is shitty, it’s abusive” i didnt fucking listen and i stayed there so fuck you with this victim blaming bullshit and saying “this isn’t a new realization for her and her eyes aren’t just suddenly open” like. lol. that’s so???????????????? victim blamey you’re fucking sick for it.

anyway that’s all i wanted to say for now. i’m gonna respond properly to everything and it might take me a few weeks bc i have to go through so much shit so. if anyone else has questions in the mean time feel free. but my spoons are sparse.

#ooc.#tbd.#abuse cw -#ask to tag

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tonyglowheart · 4 years

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This entire thing is a rant, feel free to ignore it, but I saw your post about how destiel fans can’t win in this context, and yeah. So have some rambles.

I’ve been thinking about the fact we (current spn/destiel fans) can’t win all night... I’ve seen so many people talking about how homophobic it is - and while I would very much like to argue, as every point I’ve seen made by a non-spn fan has been wrong so far, if I did everyone inside the fandom would agree and everyone outside would either call me straight or pity me for believing it’s okay.

(Cas wasn’t even sent to hell lmao. He was sent to angel death (the empty), a place he has escaped in the past. Other points, like that meta about spn has been predicting exactly this for months, that Dean ended up sobbing on the floor because he was so upset, like that death means next to nothing on spn, like that there is two episodes left, etc etc. you feel me right? I just don’t want to post wank to other spn blogs atm, we’re getting enough frustration as it is, no need to add to it.

It’s also worth pointing out that the bar is very, very low. Spn is a prominent TV show - not a Netflix show, or indie, or whatever - and it just said “main character in gay love saved the world”. [insert gif of ghostfacers dude saying that gay love can pierce through the veil of death and save the day here]

I just saw someone saying that spn having Naomi try to brainwash Cas out of loving dean makes spn homophobic (it is a conversion therapy parallel). My first response to that is that Naomi was the villain lmao? I guess we can’t write villains doing anything homophobic because having villains do homophobic things makes, uh - checks notes - villains look homophobic, and clearly we can’t have that.

There certainly are legitimate things to criticise spn about, but this isn’t it lol.

Also now some people are unironically trying to cancel Jensen because “his acting was homophobic, and so he’s clearly homophobic”, nevermind that he’s an actor and his character struggles with understanding his emotions (which I think he played excellently, myself. That scene had a very Dean delayed emotional response), nevermind the support he’s given to us queers in the past. Like. Idek man.

We would have been laughed at if we got no destiel, too.

It would have been worse, had the writers pulled a dumbledore. At this point I also trust the writers not to pull a GoT - they have explicitly criticised that ending in spn’s canon.

Spn’s writers did that by making the main villain of this season, Chuck / God, say GoT had a good ending. To reiterate a previous point I had: villains do bad things because they’re bad. And the bad things they do make them bad. For the people out there not still following, if someone does something in a story and it makes them a villain, that is explicitly telling you the story (and probably the writers) thinks that thing is bad. In this case, Chuck likes to write things for him, and we the audience have been shown and told that is bad.

Apparently thinking a gay confession is good in 2020 makes me straight. Seems unlikely, but whatever. Sorry for the length, I guess I went overboard, I’ve been holding it in lol. Anyway, DESTIEL IS CANON 💚💙 hope you have a good night

Helloo supernatural anon I hope you are living your best life right now. Yeah I’m like..... skeptical and leery myself but having lived through some absolute garbage discourse that is general purity wank, as well as the C/QL greater fandom here and on Twitter I find myself... much more wanting to question the “general wisdom” of things esp in terms of negativity, bc a lot of the time I find.... it’s wrong? Like so wrong. Or at least presents such an incomplete picture of the whole situation and also presents it in such a removed context that words that have meaning and are operationalized in a certain way for a reason, no longer have meaningful usage.

Anyway I don’t... know too much about the specifics of Spn but someone I follow is into it and talks a lot about the Gnostic stuff and that all was very fascinating to me, and I also have been grappling a lot with cultural Christianity bc of cmedia and the way ppl just *clenches fist* unthinkingly or uncritically slap some Christian norms on it and call it a day 😩 help I’m Tired. My thing here being... I actually got tired of the uncritical “superhell”s at some pt bc I am, in fact, incredibly exhausted with cultural Christianity, and because it does seem like, even possibly(?) without the Gnostic stuff it’s different from a “hell” or other Protestant-derived afterlife concept, and also yeah that it wasn’t seeded out of nowhere, it was set up to happen, which then... lends credence to the idea that whatever the current era of Spn is doing, the current showrunners are doing it with purpose.

And idk I just... refuse to believe the concept that ALL of the fans of Spn - esp the ones who have been following it still, or got back into it and are following it currently, are acting under delusion or are fooling themselves into liking it or thinking it’s good or whatever. I personally find that kinda infantilizing and patronizing and playing into issues of dismissing things women and/or other marginalized identities like.

Plus I find the concept that (from what I think I’ve been seeing Spn fans say) that the current era of the show is quite actively grappling with itself, its past, its legacy. to be very interesting and compelling; it hearkens back to like an old lore kind of feeling, of a thing that has grown into a nigh undefeatable monster and realizing that, also realizing that the only way to defeat itself is through grappling with its own nature and transforming and transmuting itself into something else. I personally find that more plausible and compelling than “Supernatural has been actively and continuously queerbaiting for 15 homophobic homophobic years., so right now we’re all very sorry for you because this maybe is no longer queerbaiting but it’s still homophobic and it can never be anything different ever.” I’ve been sort of tangentially aware of Spn thru the years and didn’t we agree, around the time of that in-universe play about Spn and with the lil Destiel shoutout, that Spn has come a ways as far as coming to terms with its fandom and working to treat its fans better? Why the sudden regression into “oh no, Supernatural is and forever will be homophobic and a hate crime”? 🤔

The rest under a cut bc the ask is already long and then my rambling will get longer-

But yeah I mean..... I get that the legacy of Supernatural has been certifiably Rough, but I think people also forget how different of a time 2005 was? Hell, how different of a time 2015 was, even, prior to, say, Obergefell v. Hodges. Now I’m not saying that to blanket-excuse Supernatural, but like, you look at mainstream shows from the era and... there’s a lot of shit lmao. The fact that Supernatural has existed this long seems to me like.... maybe we CAN look at how it’s developed through the years vs just insisting it is what it was 15, 10, hell, 5 years ago. Especially since, to my knowledge, there’s been showrunner changes? Which seems to me like it would... affect things? I mean honestly, I remember back when I got into Spn for a hot second because of Castiel, I remember watching panel, Q&A, etc vids thru the years, and like... I thought we agreed that... it was the fans who were going a bit far pushing the shipping question like literally ALL the time to the actors, who are not in control of the show and.... like at the time.... that could have had personal implications for them? And yes homophobia bad, and people can still be allies despite that, but again like.... I do feel like - from what I’ve seen - that these guys were NOT ready to deal with a lot of that but they’ve (okay Jensen I’m talking about Jensen here) genuinely grown and learned? Also how many years ago was the essay autograph thing that people keep trotting out, like what year was it in and what year of spn was it, and what were the prevailing opinions on LGBT issues and bisexuality then.

I’ve been seeing some murmurings of identity politicsing surrounding ppl who enjoy Supernatural, and I’m sorry that that’s happening to you, it really fucking sucks and it’s also the dumbest way to “make” or “win” an argument because it shouldn’t ever be a final determiner, just factors to consider when considering what life experiences might have informed someone else’s PoV and views as well as maybe how you can better communicate with them. Instead of it being a “weapon” or “tool” to either dismiss someone or de facto validate an argument.

Also yeah I get it that you don’t want to send discourse to spn blogs bc I imagine you guys ARE actively grappling with all the bs rn and it’s a lot. Even just from like, the stuff I see around, I’m like tired of it. I’m genuinely having more fun with ppl who are having a good time with Supernatural than the ppl who are hating on it, even in this sort of backhanded “oh we’re not clowning YOU we’re clowning the writers and showrunners who think you should be satisfied with this,” when... yeah? the people who HAVE been watching the show and therefore... know what’s up.. DO seem to be? And all this based on *fake gasp* context. And that’s where the backhandedness becomes kind of poisonous to me, because it implies that it IS bad, and that you SHOULDN’T be satisfied, but poor little you are but don’t worry, we’re not making fun of YOU for liking garbage, you’re just the hapless victim who is consuming the garbage bc... idk, whatever reasons ppl are coming up with ig.

idk man it’s 2020. Fandom isn’t activism, performative or otherwise, it’s okay to let people enjoy things even if you think they’re “objectively” bad, and like... I don’t know if people can call something bad when they’re not even working with the whole context and instead are dealing with rumor and reputation.

#supernatural cw #I tag this for ppl who I know want nothing to do with spn rn and are blacklisting and so it doesn't end up in main tag #Anonymous #asks answered #long post

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