#AND I need to see elmike being best friends :')

[morganee]

A comment on this post on twitter made me think about something and how the theory about El and Mike being already broken up at the end of S4 could actually work.

So the tweet is about the time jump at the end of episode 9, when we get the “two days later” board. I guess it’s safe to say that the “two days later” bothered pretty much everyone. It felt out of place, almost lazy writing. While I can understand, up to a certain point anyway, why they did that, I’m still confused as to why they didn’t somehow show us snippets of those two days. I get it, there was no time to actually show the Cali gang travelling for two days or have the Hawkins group gather together and deal with the consequences, but I think they could’ve given us something like a few glimpses of what happened in those two days in a short montage (e.g.: Max being rushed to the hospital with Lucas following her, Steve, Nancy and Robin finding Dustin with a dead Eddie in his arms, El being hugged by her brothers and Mike, the Russian group hopping on a plane, you know, little scenes like that). Still, we got nothing.

A comment underneath the tweet said something about getting to know about these two days in S5 through flashbacks and I can see that happening and actually, this might work for certain plot lines.

I’m a firm believer that they already shot some scenes for S5 while filming S4 and this flashback comment got me thinking: what if they already shot El and Mike breaking up?

Imagine this: at some point in the first episode of S5 we have Mike and El talking about something and it’s clear that they’re not in a relationship anymore. Cut to: a flashback of two days earlier where we have El and Mike in the pizza place. It’s right after the monologue, El just woke up and she has a blanket around her shoulders. Jonathan, Will and Argyle are outside, giving them some privacy. It looks like a sweet moment, the one you would get after a love confession, but it’s actually sad. El is telling Mike what Brenner told her, that maybe he was right about her not being ready, but she doesn’t go too deep into this conversation because she wants to talk about Mike’s speech. They talk, she’s sad because she knows Mike lied to her and at the end of it they break up because they both realise that this is not working. (And I really hope we get the "I dump your ass" line again but with them laughing, that'd be so sweet!)

I never liked the theory about Milkvan being already broken up at the end of S4 because I think that’s something we need to see. In my opinion, no ship that’s been this relevant deserves an off-screen break-up because it leaves such a bad feeling (I had to live through one for one of my OTPs, I don’t wish that on anyone, it leaves you confused and hurt, and you feel like they just made fun of you). But I would be okay with that if we get a flashback in S5, because it wouldn’t be off-screen anymore but it would be something that’s already happened.

And honestly that would explain so much.

Why did El and Mike barely talk during those two days? Why is Mike so detached from El? Why doesn’t he stay behind to comfort her when they get to Hopper’s cabin for the first time? Why doesn’t he stand next to her on the field? Why is he always paired with Will?

Because they already broke up!

El leaning on Mike in the hospital can easily be a platonic scene (it also parallels with El leaning on Hopper, her dad, at the end of the episode). It's the first time El sees Max after trying to save her and she didn't know the extent of her injuries. It's a shocking moment and she needs comfort and Mike’s still an important person in her life, even if they're not together anymore, so it's only logical that she would seek comfort from him.

Honestly, I feel like this would be a good way to handle the break-up off-screen in S4 but still give it to us on-screen in S5.

#byler #stranger things #mike wheeler #el hopper #will byers #byler theory #elmike #I would actually be very happy with this #they need to show the break-up on screen #I will actually be mad if they don't because no one deserves that #unless they find a way to magically make it make sense??? #but the break-up has to happen and we have to see it #and we have to see how that is actually the best thing for both mike and el #AND I need to see elmike being best friends :')

[aemiron-main]

ok so I was in a gay mike Mood today so here’s a passionate ramble abt it from earlier because regardless of whether you’re a gay Mike truther or anything else, the idea that Mike being gay/having never loved El would hurt El more than him falling out of love with her/is inconsiderate to her and her character arc is absolutely fucking stupid and imo, Mike being gay is actually the sexuality for Mike that is the GENTLEST and KINDEST to el’s character and works with her themes and arcs Perfectly in a way that no other version of Mike does. You don’t have to agree with me on this but I’m literally going insane seeing the “people who think Mike is gay don’t care about El” takes because IMO and like I’m gonna talk abt more in-depth in my full analysis, again, gay Mike is actually the resolution/sexuality for Mike that is the best for El/cares about her the MOST.

Why do I think this? Why do I love gay Mike narratively when it comes to Mike and El’s relationship and the end of it and SPECIFICALLY from the perspective of caring about El and wanting to make sure that she gets her happy ending/that her arcs and themes are resolved in a happy and satisfying way?

BECAUSE EL REALIZES IT WAS NEVER ABOUT HER!!!! SHE REALIZES THAT IT WAS NEVER ABOUT HER ABILITY TO *BE* LOVED BUT RATHER ABOUT HIS INABILITY TO LOVE HER, AND THAT ITS NOT ANYTHING AT ALL ABOUT WHO/WHAT SHE IS OR ANYTHING SHES DONE BUT INSTEAD ABOUT WHO/WHAT MIKE IS (GAY). AND SO SHE REALIZES. WHY MIKE COULDNT SAY HE LOVED HER. WHY HE PHYSICALLY STRUGGLED TO SAY IT TO HER FACE IN THE S3 AISLE SCENE. ITS NOT THAT HE DIDNT WANT TO SAY IT, IT WAS THAT HE COULDNT, IT WASNT THAT HE DIDNT WANT TO LOVE HER ITS THAT HE CANT. EL REALIZING THAT THIS IS SOMETHING MIKE CANNOT CONTROL AND REALIZING HOW HE *IS* DIFFERENT (callback to the s4 bedroom fight scene where she said he doesn’t understand what it’s like to be different & I think that in the s5 OST in this Mike and El breakup scene we’re going to get a track that has parts of the ‘being different’ track incorporated into it) AND JUST. EL REALIZING FINALLY THAT ITS NOT HER THAT NEEDS TO CHANGE THAT HE DOESNT SEE HER AS THE MONSTER, BUT INSTEAD SEES HIMSELF AS THE MONSTER, AS THE FREAK.

El who realizes that every single time mike lied to her was because he was lying to himself. El, who is so focused on “friends don’t lie,” and was upset about Mike lying to her because it implied that they weren’t friends, realizing that it was never about anything she did, but rather, Mike was lying to himself, it was about him, and that he doesn’t have to lie anymore and they can be friends.

El, someone who feels unlovable not only realizing that it was never about her being unloveable but rather abt mikes inability to love her bc he’s gay, but also seeing somebody who tried so HARD to love her, who saw her as somebody who deserved love SO MUCH that he would cut out parts of himself and repress himself in an attempt to give her the love that he thought she deserved. And how people in el’s life like brenner have never actually *tried* to love her, but Mike tried SO HARD but couldn’t love her in the right way (not that brenner loved El romantically but yknow general love) and how Mike can’t fully love her platonically as long as they’re in a relationship bc of the lying and the idea that lying = not friends/lack of platonic love. People who COULD love El didn’t even try to, but Mike, who CANT love her still saw her as SO worthy of love that he tried so hard to love her.

Mike didn’t not love her bc he felt she didn’t deserve love- he COULDNT love her but tried so hard to, because he DOES feel that she deserves it. El feeling like Mike didn’t give enough in their relationship- but then realizing just how much he gave up for it, how much of HIMSELF he repressed and gave up for it.

Like. Platonic Elmike with gay Mike specifically makes me so emotional for these reasons!! It’s such a beautiful conclusion to their arcs!!

El feels unlovable for who she is & so if there’s smthn that Mike doesn’t like about her & fell out of love with her over then it’s still ABOUT HER, she still feels unlovable. Those sort of messy situations happen IRL and Mike wouldn’t be morally bad for falling out of love with El, but it wouldn’t be a satisfying, happy conclusion to El’s themes and arcs, because El has been set up in a way with gay Mike in mind from the start, so her themes and arcs are meant to work in tandem with Mike being gay.

Like I just!! Not to mention the acceptance and relief that Mike would feel from El in all this and the deepened understanding between them!! But focusing on El and her feelings specifically because that’s what this post is about: I just am so emotional rn about El realizing that Mike tries to love her, that despite everything, he saw her as so worthy of love that he tried to give it to her even when it was killing him and forcing him to repress himself. He saw El as so worthy of love that he’d stew in hatred towards himself if it meant that she could feel loved, because he TRIED to love her even at the cost of his own mental well-being. El, who thought that Mike didn’t love her because of something wrong with HER, realizing that it was something “wrong” with him instead, realizing that he IS different, just like her, and that she was wrong to say that he isn’t different during the bedroom scene. The narrative BEAUTY of El feeling most loved at the END of her relationship with Mike, how his inability to love her is beautifully and ironically exactly what makes her feel loved, because a.) it wasn’t about her/her ability to BE loved but his ability TO love her and b.) he tried SO HARD to love her because he saw her as so worthy of love. El feeling so loved because of the realization that Mike can’t and didn’t love her romantically?? It’s such a beautiful narrative!!

El feels unlovable. Mike feels incapable of loving. But neither is true. El cannot be loved romantically by Mike because Mike is incapable of romantically loving her- but that doesn’t mean that El is incapable of being loved as a whole, and it doesn’t mean that mike is incapable of loving as a whole, he just can’t love her, and so she can’t be romantically loved by him, and because of the ties between “lying = not friends,” and the strain that their romantic relationship put on their friendship and prevented them from even getting to fully KNOW eachother, he can’t fully platonically love her until the romantic relationship is over!!

El Hopper is so loved. And she’s going to realize this and it’s going to be tied to gay Mike!! And it’s so narratively beautiful!! El realizing how much Mike tried to love her, how highly he thinks of her, how much of himself he gave up in his attempts to love her, how much it hurt him to try and love her, but he did it anyways because he sees her as being worthy of love and happiness and was trying to be the one to make sure that she got it?? It’s so good!!! There’s so many people who treated El HORRIBLY, and didn’t even fucking try to love her, people from the lab, and the bullies, but Mike TRIED, people who COULD have loved her but didn’t even try versus somebody who CANT love her but tried so hard??? El is going to feel so loved, it’s a perfect tie-in to her arcs about feeling unlovable, like a monster. El realizing that Mike doesn’t see her as a monster but instead sees himself as one?? Sees himself as the different/freak one?? And dismissed El’s feelings of being a “freak/monster” because Mike thinks so highly of her and so lowly of himself & sees HIMSELF as a freak/monster for being gay that he can’t process El feeling like a freak/monster because he sees her as being in completely different league than him. But that also puts him in a position of seeing her as a superhero which is something she Doesn’t want- but then they both realize that neither is a hero and neither is a monster and that they’re both actually deeply similar and that the they’re both just different, they’re not monsters, they’re different. And that’s not a bad thing! And Mike is going to realize that it isn’t a bad thing! Because El is different and so is he, and he thinks so highly of El that if he’s different, like her, then he can’t be a monster/awful for being different, because El isn’t a monster/awful for being different.

So yeah. Please cut it out with the absolutely ridiculous “gay mike ‘truthers’ don’t care about el,” and “mike being gay would be mean to el compared to mike being bi or unlabelled” rhetoric because it’s the literally the absolute opposite.

#stranger things #byler #mike wheeler #st analysis #mike wheeler analysis #milkvan #elmike #and before people start whining I’m not saying ‘thinking Mike is bi is stupid’ I’m saying ‘thinking that Mike being gay means ppl don’t care #about El and it would be mean to el’ is fucking stupid and demonstrates a lack of understanding of both El AND Mike and their themes & arcs #gay mike wheeler

[emblazons]

you've been writing a lot about parentified Mike lately, and while I appreciate it, from a story perspective I just don't understand why.

Maybe its just because I'm an elmike truther, but it really doesn't make sense to me why they would put such an unpleasant aspect into their friendship or romance when they could have just had her upset at him over Max's death or not sharing interests? With steve and nancy they broke up over barb and nancy wanting something else which made of sense without making steve "parent" her. idk. Maybe you're the wrong person to ask lol I'm just thinking out loud

I mean. Maybe I'm not the best person to give insight into why the duffers do what they do, but I can give why I think they did it?

Forewarning: this got really long, apologies lmao

Honestly (and take this from an out-of-universe perspective): I think they're fully aware of the strangeness of El as a character, and how she has a lot of narrative/personal "growth needs" that other characters don't just by nature of her background. She even from the pitch is referred to as "the outsider," and all of her arc, not just the romantic one, has been centered around finding a 'home' in the world, on top of finding the family she lacked before.

This, I'm almost certain, is why she always ends up on different paths than every other person she interacts with—she started with almost no sense of self as an individual, which means a sense of "self" has to be built and discovered (and remembered) for El in a way it already has been for our other characters. Max, Mike, Will, Dustin, Lucas—all of them have interests and desires, a sense of family (good or bad), know what they enjoy, and are evolving as they go along...but El didn't at the start of ST beyond lab trauma, which is why The Duffers have centered almost all of her character growth since then around discovering where she came from & who she wants to be.

With Mike though...there is an entirely different set of relational and character needs that have to be addressed. With Mike, the main struggles he has (from the pitch, again) are with insecurity, his belief that a girl will resolve that insecurity, his feeling valueless unless he can do something for the people he loves (almost like 'earning his place' in their lives) and his (almost certain) queerness...combined with how he is, at the end of the day, just another "everyman" guy.

Unlike El, Mike has some sense of personhood, his own established friends and interests and a home—but he doesn't feel like he has a place he's intrinsically appreciated, because (for whatever reason) he feels who he is inherently inadequate. Its why every season (and every time we hear Finn dig a little into Mike's character) we hear about Mike trying to serve others and "feel needed again," despite being hesitant to let them in—he desires unconditional acceptance, and to be valued for who he is inherently...while also being terrified to let people in enough to see him (lest his core identity be rejected).

When Mike and El were just friends, it was easier to sort them out as some version of "equals;" we all have friends who are in different life phases than us, or who have different needs we're trying to walk alongside as they try to meet them, which is why their friendship is cute in S1. With actual romantic partners though, we introduce an element of "trying to get your needs met" with the person you're most closely involved with...and for Mike and El, that means blending "a nebulous sense of self and desire to find an identity + family" with "a desire to have a girl fill a sense of inherent unworthiness," which, as most of us can see, leads to disaster.

Basically: From the snowball onward, writing romantic mlvn meant exploring what happens when you mix what El is looking for with what Mike tries to do to feel valued...and The Duffers have decided (rightfully, I think) that this means Mike is going to (consciously or not) move towards becoming the things El lacks to "become valuable," aka: protection from the "bad men," someone who is able to keep her safe from them, and...someone who can help her fill her needs for home + family, even though he is dramatically under-equipped at all of 12-15 to meet that task.

Because (especially s4) one of El's core needs has become a healthy father figure and found family, Mike is going to move toward behaving that way to be valuable...which means he's going to inadvertently conflate himself with the men who have also placed themselves in that role: Hopper and Brenner. It also means that Mike is going to feel that same "my child is leaving the nest" energy when El "grows up" and into herself as a wholly independent entity—which is why we see him say as much to Will in the van before the painting—

—and why it sometimes seems like El is almost "rebelling" against Mike as much as she has Hopper and Brenner over the seasons.

To your point though: all of this is inherently different from Steve and Nancy...because both Steve and Nancy had that sense of individual identity that El lacked at the start of the show. There was no space for a "parental" aspect to enter their romance in that sense—it was just two people who were incompatible, which is why they failed. Similarly, if Mike and El would have started the romantic part of their relationship at end of S4 points of the narrative—or even end of S3, after El had a second to come into her own with Max—things would have been a lot different for them, I think.

Only...that's not what happened, and...not how they're resolving Mike's insecurity about being inherently valuable. They broke Mike and El down romantically vis a vis this "she's looking for herself and he's trying to fill his own void with her" track, and then gave Will the entirety of the hand to soothe Mike's deepest fears instead, which is why Mike and El will break up and Mike will end up with and around Will more, because Will knows Mike’s heart and sees Mike as an equal even with his flaws...and loves him for it. 🤷🏽‍♀️

(There are also (in my opinion) fundamental thematic reasons they were working toward as reason why they wrote even the breakdown of mlvn that way (the themes of rejecting forced conformity, found family, and even embracing your love for things other people might think are childish are served by this "version" of the Mlvn to Byler transition) but. I can see why someone wouldn't like it if they were attached to Mike and El being close anyway lmao).

Anyway! I hope...that helps? Honestly that's just how I've come to understand it, and hope that offers some sort of solace or explanation. Its what makes the most sense to me anyway (lol).

Regardless, thanks for the ask! :)

#anti mlvn #elmike #stranger things #byler #mike wheeler #el hopper #st analysis #my st commentary #st writing #asks #the me tag #duffer brothers #the come back tag

[mikesmelodrama]

eleven doesn't need a boyfriend to be happy. (an analysis)

some mlvns say bylers hate el but that just isn't correct at all?

the argument is near always that "wanting mlvn to break up means you hate el because she's happy with mike"

now, first of all: did you ever stop to think whether mike happy with el?

because maloobans also say things like "just because will likes mike doesn't mean mike has to like him back."

okay! with that same logic, just because el likes mike doesn't mean they have to stay together. their relationship has been rocky for a while. mike has trouble saying he loves el. if els feelings are unrequited in s5 (which i don't believe because i think she realised she doesn't love mike at the end of s4 and neither love each other anymore), it wouldn't make sense to keep them together.

second of all: is el the happiest she can be with mike? in s3, we see el finding herself with max who says "there's more to life than stupid boys." and el IS happy without mike, but i believe she was still in love with him in s3 and that's why they got back together. however, i think mike wanted to stay broken up at the end of s3 but was caught off guard by the love confession

i'm not even gonna get into the shitshow that was mlvn in s3 but y'all have seen it, so...

third: i'd assume most mlvn shippers are straight - therefore they're watching the relationship through a heteronormative lens, and thinking that el would need a boyfriend to be happy is a heteronormative idea.

some melvins say they want mlvn to get married and have kids, which is also a heteronormative idea.

i don't necessarily like eddie but in his wise words: "forced conformity is killing the kids."

so, what do we learn from this?

el needing to be in a relationship goes against the idea stranger things is trying to push. the idea that stranger things is saying over and over over again is that you don't need to be "normal" according to society.

for example:

dustin is disabled. will is gay. lucas is black. max is (likely) disabled in s5 if she wakes up. joyce is a single mom. robin is gay. jonathan is bullied. murray believes in alien conspiracies.

obviously, all of those things (except the alien conspiracy lol) are normal but in the 80's they weren't treated as such, or even now.

with characters like that, is ST really going to push a relationship like mlvn to be endgame? NO.

you don't need to be in a straight, unhappy relationship because it's what society wants you to do. you can be a freak, and just because a boy and a girl are friends, doesn't mean they need to be together.

also, "boy finds traumatized girl in woods, takes her under his wing, they fall in love, end of story."

does that sound like what's best for el? because when you think about it, el doesn't need mike and vice versa. she hasn't needed him since she moved in with the byers, because she has a loving family & friends. mike isn't the only important person in her life.

and having els arc to be diluted to being some nerds superhero girlfriend with very little personality of her own wouldn't be a good way to end s5 on.

having mike just be rude to will for no reason and magically figuring out all his troubles with saying i love you to his girlfriend (that can't possibly have anything to do with him being queer, can they?) and them being happy forever wouldn't be a good way to end s5 on.

what el needs is to be independent and learn what she likes without a boyfriend she's heavily codependent on. SHE DOESN'T NEED A RELATIONSHIP AND ISN'T READY FOR ONE.

the truth is, she doesn't know enough love and healthy relationships to be with mike while being independent and figuring out her own identity. i honestly believe even canon elmax would work out better than mlvn, even though i'm a single, independent el truther at heart.

hope you liked my little ramble!

i really hope we get platonic elmike in s5 cause we were ROBBED 😭

#byler #stranger things #mike wheeler #anti milkvan #anti mileven #el hopper #independent el truther #mike wheeler is gay #anti midleven #byler endgame 2025 #eleven jane hopper #eleven analysis #platonic elmike #platonic mileven

[kaypeace21]

i think with noah's interview and confirming that will's gay and in love with mike; and that the duffer brothers have been building it up since season 1, i'll be anticipating for a big payoff in s5. they can just build up byler and make it unrequited. it doesn't make sense plus it completely deviates from all the subtexts and hints they've given us for four seasons already.

I agree that it wouldn't make sense to not have byler endgame. And to do all this set up just for it to be unrequited. I've been pointing out all the subtext for years. And yes , there is alot of queer subtext in s1. That made it pretty obvious Will was gay and even hinted that mike wasn't straight either. Which my followers know I've talked about extensively. I also pointed out how most of the byler scenes were initiated by mike in s1-2. And how s1, 2, 3 and 4 still had a bunch of byler subtext for both Will and Mike. One of the positive aspects about s4 byler is that they showed it's not simply mike always taking care of Will. But that it's mutual: Will also takes care of and checks on mike's emotions too. The best part of their relationship: is that they actually talk to eachother about their feelings . And s4 pretty much confirmed Will is gay and in love with Mike (to the oblivious fans who missed all the prior hints in past seasons- but hilariously there were still "gay- Will" deniers after s4).

Which is why I need byler to not just be subtext anymore (because alot of queerbaits are subtext). Byler may be endgame in s5. But it's tiring that we only get subtext,and m*leven gets a whole love confession (even if behind the subtext we know mike didn't fall in love right after seeing her, the vines tightening around El as mike spoke, the fact some of mike's line were literally identical to brenner's speech to el , not even getting into the superhero line again, or how awkward the 2's dynamic is after the confession .) Plus, in s4 (and prior seasons) they constantly show Elmike parallel familial dynamics - probably to hint it's familial love (not romantic love). But, in spite of that, plenty of people will take the romantic confession as straight forward confirmation for m*leven.

Right now if they wanted they could theoretically still sell out- and go the cliche route (with m*leven etc). They retcon all the time anyways. And alot of the general audience wouldn't question how it contradicts - the narrative, character arcs ,the background details, subtext/dialogue, etc.

So at this point- I really think the love confession was a poor choice. Even if it's meant to subvert expectations . They just lost a lot of queer fans' trust and m*levens would have some right to be upset in s5 (if byler is canon.)

And yeah the fact El (originally) In s1 was supposed to die and be 2 years younger than mike .Doesn't scream romantic endgame. Not to mention how unhealthy they are as a couple - but I can't always expect people not to sell out. Or even write healthy romances.

I'm hoping for the best... but they still lost my trust a lot (given certain elements in s4). The way they handled certain story beats besides byler /m*leven (but also the whole lucas /erica fights + how they planned on k*lling max originally- going against the whole vecna allegory of max "running up that hill" to overcome her su*cidal thoughts). It just made me question their writing. Did s4 have alot of positive elements though- yeah, it would be a lie to say otherwise.

Do I still think byler was the original plan, and could possibly still be endgame- yes. Alot of evidence points to byler being endgame: the byler subtext in literal every season (even making direct contrasts/parallels of byler to m*leven).While m*leven has relationahip issues every season they date. And mike/el dating brings out the worst in eachother, and literally every season when they get back together they undo all their past character arcs/lessons. They don't improve. M*even in s3 and 4: they ignore their friends for eachother, lie to eachother, fight, say I love you. Wash and repeat. Mike in the beginning of s4 is hero worshiping el- is it solved in s4 , nope. Just double downed on that mike hero worships rather than sees her as his gf. And even before dating it was hinted it wouldn't be healthy (el's spying , jealousy,etc)- so I'm not surprised. Plus, how s4 ended, and how alot of the films that inspired s4 -have couples that parallel byler. And also because Will in s5 is "supposedly" a primary focus again. But do I 100% trust the duffers to actually give us endgame byler like I used to - no.

[ven0moir]

Without heart, we’d all fall apart. Why J*ncy, J*pper and Byler are the endgame couples.

This analysis briefly focuses on the three pairings that constitute Eleven's core family, so there will be no mention of the extended party for this one. Moreover, I will work on more detailed Byler-centric and Eleven/Max posts later, but I wanted to get my initial discoveries out there! 

J*ncy, J*pper and Byler

In S4, J*ncy, Byler and J*pper were either separated (J*ncy) or not present in Hawkins (J*pper + Byler) and unable to communicate with the rest of the party. This miscommunication trope was also present in their personal dynamics in the form of ‘not being on the same page’ and ‘lying to each other’ which created feelings of uncertainty and insecurity, especially in J*ncy and Byler, removing their ability to make fully informed choices about their relationships. 

But why? Why did the writers choose to do this? Well … 

Unlike Henry/Vecna/001, Eleven draws her strength from LOVE. This is the force that led her to unleash her full potential back when she banished Henry to the UD and is what kept Max’s own heart beating despite the party having lost. Eleven’s family and friends make her strong because they are her HEART. 

We’re constantly shown throughout the show how these three pairings are interlinked and paralleled, and how their dynamics shape their arcs as both individuals and as teams. J*pper finally found each other, and J*ncy and Byler will follow suit as a natural consequence of the TRUTH finally coming out. 

THE DOMINO EFFECT …

Hopper being back begins to turn the wheels for what follows. This is how it all connects.

J*PPER

S4 saw Joyce and Hopper finally achieve harmony in their relationship after a long journey once Hopper CHOSE to contact Joyce and Joyce CHOSE to go find him, with both knowing the risks. Once the TRUTH came out, that Hopper was alive, they CHOSE each other. They rely on each other and motivate the other to be the best version of themselves. Being the leaders of the group, they influence the Byers-Hopper family dynamics, starting with …

Eleven + Mike (ELMIKE)

While Eleven was suffering from the absences of both Hopper and Max, Mike understandably became the closest person who could fill that void. This is why Mike and Hopper (and even Max and Mike in S3) are paralleled often, because Eleven and Mike’s platonic love is the foundation of their relationship, and that will always be there regardless of the fate of their romantic feelings. 

Hopper being back will help Eleven and Mike open the door for an honest conversation where they will find harmony by choosing NOT to choose each other romantically, but platonically. Eleven’s priority will be Max, and Mike’s will be Will’s. Hopper being back and Mike choosing Will connects to J*ncy because … 

J*NCY

Nancy 

Nancy values honesty and good communication, which Jonathan has not been providing given the responsibility that the circumstances have placed upon him (filling in his father’s shoes in the lives of his brother and mother). As well intentioned as Nancy knows Jonathan is, as she herself described, his lack of honesty and communication is harming their relationship, which we see Nancy struggling with in S4 as she mentions feeling like there might be someone else to Robin and not being clear on what’s going on with him. 

(I won’t go too deep into Stancy, but I will say Steve just needed closure by confessing to Nancy since in the previous seasons the circumstances had prevented him from doing so. But he and Mike were paralleled this season because they both idealize Eleven/Nancy.)

Jonathan

When Joyce was with Bob, J*ncy got together. When Bob died and his mom and brother were alone again, J*ncy began to deteriorate because Jonathan felt obligated to take on the role of protector and provider in the lives of his mother and brother yet again.  

With Hopper returning and being his mother’s partner, the TRUTH will come out, that his self-sacrificial nature was causing him to sabotage his own relationship but that there isn’t anyone else/he hasn’t lost interest and in fact it was the opposite. With this in mind, they will be able to CHOOSE each other and work through their issues.

But even when Bob was around, Jonathan worried about Will and he will likely continue to prioritize him unless … he knows with certainty that Mike will be there for him. 

BYLER Mike

This season, we got some insight into Mike’s feelings of inadequacy and inferiority in his romantic relationship with Eleven. Moreover, the circumstances stripped Mike from CHOICE. He was perfectly fine with Jonathan’s plan to go to Hawkins and even decided to apologize and mend his relationship with Will as a result of said plan, yet when it came to the monologue, we will never know what it would’ve been like (or if it had occurred at all) if he hadn’t been forced to do it in order to, in his mind, save Eleven and Max + move the party forward.. 

Will 

He spoke on Eleven’s behalf without it being clear whether or not what Will said was indeed her TRUTH. Will’s choices, as sincere and pure as they were, were tainted by his own interpretation of what Mike and Eleven needed. Mike WILL find out that the painting did not come from Eleven, and that will open a door for them to finally be on the same page. 

They have already mended their friendship and despite this, Will is still hurting, as we saw in the JonWill script. Mike’s love confession doesn’t magically erase his feelings of inadequacy because the feelings that pushed him to confess weren’t Eleven’s, but Will’s. Once Mike finds out that the feelings and painting that made him incredibly happy and made him feel loved/appreciated came from Will … they will find balance by CHOOSING each other romantically.  

The writers drove them all apart for S4 because had J*pper, J*ncy and Byler known the full TRUTH between them, they would’ve CHOSEN each other. And by doing that, they would’ve been fully able to support Eleven in the way that she needed. In this scenario, Vecna, the opposite of love, would not have succeeded. 

So, during the last few minutes of S4, we see them having made small steps towards choosing each other and strengthening their family ties in the process, and thus increasing their chances at defeating Vecna. 

This is why in the final scene, they are standing together, UNITED, as the script says, foreshadowing the endgame couples and teams that must be in harmony to aid Eleven in saving Max along with Hawkins.

#byler #byler analysis #byler endgame #will byers #mike x will #mike wheeler

[annes-andromeda]

Stranger Things Ship Ranks

I’ve seen people do this ship rank thing, so I thought I’d jump into the trend! Obviously, not every ship is on here so I put the most well known ones. I excluded the poly ships cause I personally don’t have any opinions on them

Byler 1000000000/10- Beautiful. Amazing. Spectacular. Inspiring. They are legends. They are icons. And they are the moment.

In all seriousness though, this ship is amazing. They’re both so in love and it’s just a gorgeous friends-to-lovers story. The fact that Will sees Mike as his knight in shining armor and Mike sees Will as the light of his life😭😭Jesus Christ these two are absolutely WHIPPED for each other and I LIVE for it

They’re just so happy with one other and I desperately hope they get together cause y’all best believe they’ll be the most adorable, loving, and iconic couple ever.

M*leven 0/10- Tbh, I used to ship milkvan back in 2017 when I first got into the show, but S3 ruined it for me. That, and I got into byler lol.

Honestly, these two work better as friends and El isn’t really ready for a romantic relationship yet. They both lie constantly, aren’t interested in each other’s hobbies, and most of the time they fight and don’t actually get to know one another.

Now platonic Elmike? I’m all for it! But romantic? Nope. I sincerely hope milkvan breaks up in S5 cause it’s honestly the best option for both of them and it’s about high time they did.

Jopper 10/10- I’ve shipped them since the very beginning. I read fanfic about them and even planned their wedding back in 2017. Their kiss/make out session was one of the few saving graces of volume 2. Need I say more?

Lumax 10/10- Another one of the best ships in the show. At first, I thought these two were cute in S2 but I didn’t think much of them. Then in S3, they were kinda iffy but again, I didn’t have an issue with them.

But then in comes S4 and suddenly I’m hooked on them. They’ve matured so much and they’ve grown from a cute couple to a genuine, loving relationship. And the fact that Max listened to Lucas’s big game despite not being there was adorable and Lucas not leaving Max’s side even when the portals were opening. That’s devotion right there🥺

Hopefully we’ll see more of them in S5 when Max wakes up.

J*ncy 0/10- Ooo this is probably gonna upset someone but yeah, I don’t ship jancy. Like, at all. I’ve never cared for them as a couple and I honestly find them a little boring. I’m just sick of the whole “jancy vs stancy” thing and honestly just want Nancy to end up single cause she’s better off for it

St*ncy 0/10- Same thing I said for jancy: I don’t care for it. Never have, never will. I don’t know why the writers brought it back for S4 but they did and I hate it.

We’ve clearly seen that Steve and Nancy don’t work together so why did they bring it back? It’s not like there was a high demand for it.

Not to mention, that scene where Steve admits to having six kids with Nancy was honestly pretty cringe.

Just please for the love of god, let Steve move on from Nancy. Please. No one cares about this ship war anymore

Stonathan 10/10- One of my ride or dies. It’s a small ship but I’ve loved it since I first got into Stranger Things.

The potential they have, the enemies-to-lovers trope, the introvert and the extrovert, the loner and the popular boy, the photographer and the jock, it’s all right THERE.

I don’t understand why the writers don’t have them interact cause Joe and Charlie have great chemistry together and they’re both tired of stancy and jancy so just have Steve and Jonathan get together. Boom, problem solved

Ronance 6/10- I’ve shipped ronance since S3, before it was cool and popular. And yeah I still do, but not as much as before and I honestly prefer Nancy as single.

But I still think they’re adorable together and their dynamics in S4 were perfect. Sunshine and grumpy🥰

St*ddie 0/10- Yeah no I don’t get it. I don’t understand the appeal of this ship. If you like it fine, but I honestly think it’s overhyped and people just made it into a bigger deal then what it actually is.

Not to mention, the fandom ruined it by being awful to Grace Van Dien, harassing Joseph Quinn, and just generally being toxic.

Jargyle 5/10- Whilst I personally don’t ship it, it get the appeal. Stoner bfs who are cute and high together. What more could you want?

Eddissy 10/10- Alright, I’m just gonna say it: this ship gets way too much hate for no reason.

People say they hate it cause it’s a straight ship but then go and ship jopper and lumax. They say it’s gross cause apparently Chrissy is like 16 but like: Chrissy was the cheerleading captain, a position often given to seniors, she had a necklace with the number ‘86 on it (her graduating year), and Grace Van Dien confirmed that for the casting, Chrissy was always meant to be 18.

And if you don’t wanna take her word for it, then Joseph Quinn literally confirmed in an interview that yes, Eddie did indeed have a crush on Chrissy. Hell, his last concert was dedicated to her.

I don’t understand why people hate this ship so much when the shippers are literally just minding their own business.

But anyways, yes I adore hellcheer and think they would’ve been an adorable couple. Stay mad✌🏼

Rockie 9/10- Another ship that gets unnecessary hate. Yes I know Vickie is underdeveloped but like, that’s no excuse to hate her or the ship. I get not caring for her, but hate? That’s a little much.

I hope she and this relationship get more development in S5 cause her and Robin are honestly cute together.

Elmax 7/10- Like Jargyle, I don’t ship elmax but I totally get the appeal. El is so much more confident and happier with Max than she is with Mike. She was learning to be her own person and finding out what she liked. With Max, El was allowed to have fun and be a kid and not worry about people using her for her powers.

Not to mention, she got the will to fight in volume 2 not because of Mike’s speech, but because Max was in danger.

So while I don’t ship them, I definitely get why others do.

Henderhop 8/10- It’s a small ship but I ship it nonetheless. While they’re most likely not gonna be canon, I honestly think Dustin would be a much better boyfriend for El than Mike. Hell, I think any of the party members aside from Will (cause that’s her brother) would treat El better than Mike (sorry Mike)

Whether platonic or romantic, Dustin and El’s relationship is sweet and I love how he sees her as an absolute badass.

DustinxSuzie 3/10- Eh they’re fine. They’re cute but that’s really about it. I don’t really care about Suzie but her relationship with Dustin is cute and that’s all I can say tbh.

H*rringrove 0/10- I don’t like B*lly so no. Just. No

#stranger things #byler #byeler #jopper #lumax #stonathan #ronance #jargyle #eddissy #hellcheer #robin x vickie #vickie x robin #elmax #henderhop #dustin x suzie #suzie x dustin #anti mileven #anti stancy #anti jancy #anti harringrove #anti steddie #well just in case

[mylittlevsoldier]

I love making everything about byler and Taylor Swift's "folklore" (my favorite Taylor Swift album) In folklore, there is a love triangle between Betty, James and Augustine. And Taylor herself said that "Betty and James ended up together but he put her though it." But they willelmike love triangle goes a little bit differently.

How the folklore love triangle goes is, Betty and James were together and had a falling out (but didn't break up) Then, he went away for a summer and cheated on Betty with Augustine. And after that summer, James shows up at Betty's party and apoligizes, Betty ends up kissing him on her doorstep (in front of all her stupid friends) and start dating again. Eventually, they "end up together" But. this is where byler and El come in. How I think, Mike is James, Will is Betty and El is Augustine.

The folklore love triangle is a musical parallel to Mike's relationship with El and Mike. This is why:

Will has been with Mike from the start, just like Betty and James. While, yes, Mike and Will have never dated, they've been best friends since kidergarten (i think) and they've been friends the longest out of anyone else is the party. While they have also had several falling outs but Mike has always been the one, at Will's door, apoligizing to him and begging for forgivness.

Now it's time to talk about El. Don't get me wrong, I am not one of the bylers that hates El, I love her. BUT, she was and is Augustine. She hasn't been there (with Mike) as long as Will has. She's basically a disraction for Mike in a romantic sense. And, hear me out on this, I think Mike is basically using El as a shelid. To cover up his interilalized homophobia and so he dosen't get picked on, so he isn't a target.

Time for lyrics breakdowns! (I have alot of headcannons about these lyrics but I'll try to keep these as close to canon event as possible)

"i knew you" -cardigan

Like I said, Will has been there from the literal start and he knows Mike better than anyone. a n y o n e.

"a friend to all is a friend to none. chase to girls, lose the one." -cardigan

We all know Mike hates being or feeling alone, espically without Will. (See all of Season 1) And I think he knows that he loves Will (that he's in love with Will) but he's too scared to pursue Will because he might lose El or Will or both of them. Also, I do think Mike needs El but not as much as he needs Will.

"but i'd knew you'd linger like a tattoo kiss. i'd knew you'd haunt all of my what-ifs." -cardigan

(i can't help but sneak a hc in here but idk if it is bc i might be canon already) I think that Will has stayed up late at night, just thinking about why he likes Mike and how he's never going to like him back. Why does Mike have to linger in his thoughts?

"i'd knew you'd miss me wants the thrill expiered and you'd be standing in my front porch light." -cardigan

This lyric reminds me of the aftermath of the rain fight in season 3, where Mike (with Lucas) stood in the pouring rain and basically almost kicked down the door, begging Will for forgivness (and later rain though the dark fucking forest, still in the pouring rain, to find Will and make sure he was okay.)

"cause you were never mine." - august

El has to know about Mike and Will at this point. She isn't dumb. This is highlighted in the "You never say it" scene. She knows that Mike isn't loving her the way she wants/needs to be loved, but she knows that Mike loves Will the way he needs to be loved.

"i remember thinking i had you." -august

While I think El knows, I think this is a new(er) realization. I think this was as nesw as that "you don't say it" and airport scenes. And just a friendly reminder that Mike only said "I love you" to El with Will's encouragment.

"and say, meet me behind the mall. so much for summer love and saying us. 'cause you weren't mine to lose." -august

This entire lyric reminds me of season 3 elmike and the whole "I dump your ass" scene.

"betty, one time i was riding on my skatebaord when i passed your house, it's like i couldn't beathe." -betty

(another hc im sorry) i 1000 percent think that Mike would go back to the Byers' old house after they moved. And everytime he felt like he was gonna cry so hard he would throw up.

"the worst thing that i ever did, was what i did to you." -betty

We all know Mike regretted the whole "it's not my fault you dont like girls" thing. (y'know banging on his door, running though the woods. all the stuff i already brought up.) But he proably also lies awake at night after Will moved away, staring at the celing, thinking about what he said, replaying it in his head, wondering why he was such a bad fucking friend.

"slept next to her but, i dreamt of all sumer long." -betty

I definitly think that Mike realized his liked Will in season 3 but got back together with El and that's when he started using her as a sheild.

I love the folklore love triangle and willelmike. i even write a whole one shot about byler and the song betty. (ill proably post a poll abt that to see if yall wanna read it.) ive been wanting to write this for a while so thank you for reading! and let me know if i missed anything so i can add onto this. i love you! bye!

#sagey writes #sagey is a swiftie #sagey is a byler truther #byler #<< target audience #swifties #<— target audience #mike wheeler #will byers #el hopper #mike is james #will is betty #el is augustine #byler endgame #stanger things #byler is real #stanger things season 5 #folklore long pond studio sessions #folklore love triangle

[untitled-byler-blog]

Who was Mike talking about in the Pizza Van?

Hi friends; it’s 7am and I whipped this up because I’ve been procrastinating it and people were talking about it in the tag last night and I don’t want someone to do it before me... sorry if this is incoherent!

*every time Mike looks at Will

“We could play DnD and Nintendo for the rest of our lives”* (Mike looks away before replying)

Mike gets distant because he doesn’t want to admit how much he wants this. Will interprets it as his missing/worrying about El – “she’s gonna make it”* – so Mike jumps on that, looking away before he opens his mouth:

“But*… but what if after all this is over, she (Mike looks in the opposite direction of Will)… sh… she doesn’t need me anymore?”*

Hesitancy on the word “she”

When has El shown her reliance on Mike? She’s shown a wish to be in a relationship with him, but Mike very seldom “protected” her… the only time coming to mind being when he tried to keep her from overexerting herself in s3, but everyone (El included!) is against him then.

“I keep telling myself that [she’ll always need me], but I… I don’t believe it.”*

El has been shown to not be coping well without Mike, going so far as to lie to him and get mad at him for what affection he tried to show her (the letters); whereas he and Will haven’t been in much contact. And it’s “El’s being bullied’ not Will, who was constantly the target in Hawkins. Especially prior to the ElMike fight, if Mike thought one of the Byers twins didn’t need him, I’d definitely think it was Will. Even after the fight, El wants Mike’s support. That’s why she wants him to say “I love you” and that’s why she makes a point of telling him “I have gone to become a superhero again” – I’ve gone to become what you want me to be so that you still need me.

“I mean, she’s special*. She was born special. Maybe I was one of the first people to realize that.”

I know this has been addressed by itself before, but… El grew up in a lab that experimented on her in order to develop telekinetic abilities – and Mike knows this – so in what world would Mike think himself the first person to see El as “special” ?? I think it more likely that he’s thinking again about asking Will to be his friend. “[I saw this boy all alone on the swings when we were five and decided to ask him to be my friend.]”

“But the truth is, when I stumbled on her in the woods, she* just needed someone. It’s not fate. It’s… it’s not destiny. It’s just dumb luck. And one day she’s gonna realize I’m just some random nerd* (the camera had been focused on Will, and when it switched back to Mike he was already looking at Will again.) that got lucky that superman landed on his doorstep. I mean, at least Lois Lane is an ace reporter for the Daily Planet, right? *But…”

So, if this is about Will, the “stumbling on her in the woods” is his meeting Will at the swings. And it also draws a parallel between Will and El: they both needed someone when they met Mike. While I agree with the idea that Will was alone because he “already knew how to handle being alone” I don’t think that means he didn’t want to make friends; and so Mike sees that as “dumb luck” because he was just in the right place at the right time to befriend this boy that he reveres so much; and now, with him seemingly thriving out in California, he’s worried his best friend doesn’t need someone to “look after him” anymore (like Mike was too willing to do in s2.)

I don’t think I need elaborate on the Superman line, especially when he uses the word “superhero” whenever he addresses El (403 fight, 408 monologue). And I think his jumping on the Lois Lane analogy without seemingly having a point he’s trying to make is because he realized his mistake “oh yeah I’m saying El is like superman and I’m Lois Lane – genders are irrelevant to the metaphor; I’m not trying to imply that I’m actually talking about a guy.”

And I think this ties nicely into Mike’s monologue in The Piggyback. By now, we (mostly) all acknowledge that everything Mike said was in response to what Will told him; but what if that was partially because he was pretending to be talking to Will when he was reassuring El. He only says “I love you” after being urged by Will – what if his hesitancy was his psyching himself up like “just pretend you’re talking to Will. You’re in love with Will, so you can say ily to him. Oh shit wait– ‘you’re my superhero. Listen to all this stuff that you (El, you’re EL) can do that no one else can so no one thinks I’m thinking about someone else!’” (My boy is, like, constantly in panic mode and I love him for that. Big mood – very relatable.) 

“No, I… it’s so stupid given everything* that’s going on” [with El, to be thinking about our relationship friendship]

M: “It’s just … I… I don’t know, I just… uh…”

W: “You’re scared of losing her”*

(and not just a glance, Mike full-on stares at Will, watching his every move as he takes out the painting.) [tender, emotional music]

His face lights up when he looks at the painting because he thinks “Holy shit, could Will feel the same way?” And I do also think that Mr. Rocks for a Brain could have connected the dots of “this is the painting Will was working on for someone he likes” UNTIL Will pulls out the uno reverse card of “El commissioned it” and suddenly Mike is dejected because 1) not the same painting, because El didn’t know what the other one was about and 2) he’s reminded that he was just talking about “El” and is sad that Will didn’t understand his double mean. (And, if Mike was genuinely talking about Will, I don’t think Will realized this, solely because he believes it impossible for Mike to return his feelings.)

In conclusion, this boy is so scared of losing his best friend because he’s in love with him.

Ok I’m done <3 ✌🏻👀😮

#sorry not sorry if someone's already talked about this i've been here since before vol 2 and don't remember seeing anything 👀 #also: #it's Early in my household and I'm blasting the Lizzie cast album so I relied solely on the captions on Netflix for the dialogue #this was supposed to be me just making bullet points before typing it up later but then i got pretty detailed so i figured it was #good enough to post #whatever #shut up lilly #byler #stranger things #will byers #mike wheeler #st4 theory #stranger things analysis #byler analysis #s4 ep8 #let's chat

[maddy-ferguson]

Ik you don't like ambigulous sexuality Mike so I would like to know, do you think canonically Mike will be explicitly gay? I don't even mean like saying the word gay I mean even just explaining that he didn't like El romantically. Bc I'm confident in endgame Byler but I find a lot of gay Mike theories far fetched in the sense that it makes sense but I don't really believe they'd do that in canon and I don't think it's what the Duffers intended (like the Phoebe Cates scene). I think that if they wanted to do explicitly gay Mike then they dragged on the Melvin storyline for way too long for it to make sense to anyone who isn't spending time analyzing Mike's behavior because so much gay mike proof is so subtle unlike general Byler proof which a lot of the GA has picked up on.

I know the show certainly shouldn't cater to the GA, but it should still be understandable to the audience even if they haven't spent hours analyzing, and I think by now they've passed the point where they could convincingly show that Mike never liked El romantically in the first place.

I know I sound like I'm repeating a lot of Byler anti talking points so sorry if I sound like a Byler anti, I promise I'm not. I just really don't understand how they would do gay Mike and would like to hear what you think.

this is from a week ago and i've talked about it again since but i was so flattered that you a) knew i don't like ambiguous sexuality mike and b) wanted to ask this to me. <3 and don't preemptively apologize omg i love you

i honestly feel like the main thing is an unhappy mlvn breakup. think this. in spirit. i am sorry to every platonic elmike enjoyer i think they could've had a relatively fun onscreen dynamic post-breakup had the s3 breakup been final i really do but this is a post-season 4 world. failed monologue and all that. only one season left. i need it to be clear somehow someway that this relationship hurt el and that their relationship was bad from the get-go. no idea how realistic this is btw but i feel like they can't afford to have them break up off-screen or to have it be vague à la season 2 stncy because it's their quote unquote main couple lol.

i feel like making it apparent that the relationship was bad for both of them would be ideal. and specifically el not being all mature all oh it's okay because i don't love you either would be good i think. we would've had that had the monologue not happened but we're past that now. i don't think they'll be on bad terms by the end of the show they're not gonna hate each other or anything but i don't see them being instant best friends after breaking up AT ALL

and yeah i agree that a lot of gay mike proof is only proof in the sense that it's in there and some of it is inconsequential. but that could also be said of some byler proof lol, like no one in the ga is thinking oh look blue met yellow in the west they're color-coded!!

i don't think they dragged mlvn on for too long and i can't for the life of me word it in a way that makes sense so i'm gonna link this post (inluding the tags from my mutual who reblogged it) :) i hate mlvn, hate with a capital h but i think them staying together this long (it's only been like a year and three months in the show which is kind of crazy) makes sense for them for multiple in-universe reasons (mike being the one who introduced the concept of romance to el, el only getting back together with mike after hopper died, i can think of about a thousand reasons for mike), but for us as viewers, yeah idk, obviously ending the season 4 with them being broken up for good would've made it easier for the ga to accept the possibility of byler being endgame and of mike being gay but it would've also been very obvious so i can see why they didn't do it. they still need people to tune in and also we needed to feel like we lost at the end of season 4 and that includes me and the other...27k tumblr bylers at the time

when you look at the facts i don't think gay mike would seem far-fetched to the average non-homophobic viewer: mike takes in a girl. kisses her after being told by everyone that he must like her, after telling her that his sister would be her sister and that and after 8 episodes of her being repeatedly mistaken for a boy and for will specifically. doesn't see her for a year, spends a season glued to will's side, kisses her again at the snow ball. pushes will away in season 3, inadvertently calls him out for being gay and for not growing up. starts having problems with his gf as soon as said gf starts to look like a girl and learns that she can have preferences of her own. lies to gf and gets broken up with, is very obnoxious about it all season. indirectly tells will he actually doesn't want to grow up and wants to keep playing with him at the end of the season. goes back to playing dnd as soon as s4 begins, which goes to show that he actually didn't mean what he said about wanting to grow up last season (either that or he's a hypocrite and hates will specifically. lol). acts weird with will again. focuses on his gf WHO LITERALLY LOOKS LIKE WILL IN A DRESS for the day. gets lied to by his gf and is then left behind by her, isn't as obnoxious about it but also keeps talking about his relationship without ever mentioning why they fought so he never has to explain why exactly he couldn't say That thing. to his boy best friend who he keeps having emotional talks with. doesn't say the thing until he gets told that he's the heart and all that by said boy best friend and still struggles to tell gf that he loves her. end of the world

i really think most of them are just not thinking about it. i remember asking my friend how likely byler being endgame was to her in august and she was like i...had never considered the possibility of el and mike not ending up together. then i talked her ear off for 60 minutes and she was like okayy i can see it maybe And she was sad for mike. so!

i think no matter how it goes we're gonna get an interview confirming it because they had to do it FOR WILL because people couldn't possibly imagine that the character who'd been called gay for the first time in the first twenty minutes of the show could actually be written to be gay

but maybe he'll tell us he's gay himself lol who knows

#added the instant before best friends to be nice<3 #and i've said before that i don't think el was ever in love with him either and i still don't but i still think she's been hurt by their #train wreck of a relationship lol. mike too but he's the one who just said he loved her on her good days and on her bad days so i don't #feel like he's in a position where he gets to...voice the hurt? and he's the one who could hold a normal conversation in s1 so hm...idk :/ #the hurt caused by their relationship specifically. like i can't picture him saying i don't think you're loving me very well either you #dismissed me when i tried to relate to you being bullied even though you saw me get bullied to the point of jumping off a cliff. yk? lol #i didn't write Hate because i wanted to be funny. it worked for me #el literally looking like will in a dress at rink o mania is actually crazy #literally the socially acceptable version of will el bff i'm so sorry this is happening to you #my friend had actually asked for the stranger things oral dissertation. for the mike dissertation specifically #i thought about this for like a week and after my first paragraph (well second) i was like wait...was else was there again? and i don't #know actually. was there anything else? #ask

[thewrongmoon]

S5 team predictions

I swear I have actual analyses I'm working on, but since s5 predictions are at the forefront of my brain rn, let's do some more speculation!!

- POSSIBLE TEAM UPS IN S5 - PART 1: THE KIDS -

El:

El has a looot of people she could be potentially paired with going into this season. I'm gonna rank them from least likely to most likely.

Least Likely:

Characters with little to no connection with El, have never had a single interaction with her really.

Not Likely:

Characters that could/have interacted with El, but still don't have much to do with her

Likely:

Characters El does have a connection with personally, but still aren't really super connected narratively to her.

Most Likely:

Characters that El has a strong personal and narrative connection to.

El and Hopper (and potentially Joyce) - Hopper is obviously her father figure, and we end S4 with them hugging. The last time we saw then really share a storyline was S2, in the very beginning and end of that season. Hopper has done a significant research on Hawkins Lab which would help them find more info on One. Overall, this pairing seems plausible.

El and Will - El and Will will be the main characters of S4. They both also have the strongest connection to One, which means they are going to be integral to the plot. I believe it will take of them to bring him down. For this reason it seems likely that they will have to work together at one point or another.

El and Mike - We've never really seen these two have a storyline all to themselves. There's a considerable amount of tension between them atm, and I don't think they've really seen eye to eye since season 1. Because the Duffers have said S5 will circle back to S1, it's possible that we can see that version of Elmike coming back, but even in S1 they were not alone (they had Lucas and Dustin with them.) El and Mike being alone in a plot line seems unlikely to me for this reason.

El, Will and Mike - This one seems extremely likely. We've had plenty of love triangle symbolism already, and it all will come to a head in some manner. All three of these characters are telling some type of lie to each other and putting them together, possibly in a dangerous situation where close proximity is needed, could be the solution to getting them all to be truthful for once.

El, Lucas, and Max - Another pretty likely scenario. Lucas is Max's boyfriend (basically) and El is Max's best friend, and they were the most effected by her near-death. El and Lucas teaming up to save her would make perfect sense, and it would also loop back to the tension these two characters had between each other in S1 and resolve it. Lucas trusting the girl he had labeled as a "traitor" and El proving that she's not a monster, but rather a hero to the character who was designed to be her adversary in S1 really ties this story into a neat little bow.

El and the OG party (Mike, Lucas, Dustin and Will) - The Duffers said it all goes back to S1, and this assortment of characters working together really would make it go all the way back. Putting all of them together also means it could contain the four previous storylines.

Will:

most of the same points for El, so i'm gonna go through this quicker.

Least Likely:

Not Likely:

Likely:

Most Likely:

Will and El- see above

Will and Mike - Yeah there's a lot of foreshadowing for this one. Like the cabin scene being a direct parallel to S2 (a season where Mike is glued to Will's side for most of it), and the final scene showing them standing next to each other. And again, there is a lot of things these two aren't telling one another so it's reasonable to believe the writers would have to force them to be together so they can finally open up (like they did in S4.)

Will, Mike and El - see above

The OG party and El - see above

Will and Jonathan - The Byers family is the heart of this show IMO, and I think we haven't seen the end of it. Jonathan mentions that he wants Will to be more open with him, they promise to be there for each other. Personally I would love a Will, Jonathan, Nancy and Mike plot line but I don't think that's happening.

Mike:

Least Likely:

Not Likely:

Likely:

Most Likely:

Mike and Will - see above

Mike and El - see above

Mike, El and Will - see above

Mike and Lucas - Lucas's efforts to save Max will likely serve to parallel Mike's efforts to save Will in seasons 1 and 2. It's also mentioned in S1 that Lucas is Mike's best friend. Tbh we don't really get to see much of this, except maybe in S3? S5 might be a good time to actually show that Mike and Lucas are close, especially because there seems to be some tension between them in the very beginning of S4.

The OG party and El - see above

Mike and Nancy - Close to the end of S1, we see Mike and Nancy promise to not keep any more secrets between each other. and obviously that didn't fucking happen, so maybe they could finally make good on that promise in this season? They're going through similar struggles so it would make sense for them to actually talk about it.

Lucas:

Least Likely:

Not Likely:

Likely:

Most Likely:

Lucas, El and Max - see above

Lucas and Mike - see above

Lucas and Max - Lucas's story in the season will no doubt involve his efforts in trying to revive Max, however due to Max's condition I think it's more likely to have a supporting character in his storyline (Likely El but possibly Dustin.)

The OG party and El - see above

Lucas and Erica - Erica is definitely more of a minor character in ST, but we see more of Lucas and Erica having genuinely heartfelt moments in this last season, so it's likely that relationship between the two of them will be continued going into the next one.

Dustin:

Least Likely:

Likely:

Most Likely:

Dustin and Steve - The Duffers know that these two on screen together is absolute gold so I don't see them being separated, at least not separated completely.

Dustin and Robin - Because they both have chemistry with Steve, them being placed together is likely.

The OG party and El - see above

Soooo with all that being said, I think the most likely set up for the kid's storylines are as follows:

El and the OG party

OR

Will and Mike

Lucas, El and Max

Dustin, Steve and Robin

OR

Will, El, and Mike

Lucas, Dustin, Steve and Robin

#stranger things #stranger things s5 #analysis #byler

[maddy-ferguson]

i don't give a shit about elmike but logically speaking their friendship is one of the core parts of the show. even if they have a messy break up it will kind of be a necessity for the writers to focus on their aftermath and fix their dynamic. you cannot really end the show where they are being weird or cold towards one another ifykwim. that's actually why i don't want them to have a messy break up because that would requite to add a drama and angst and focusing on that to fix it later on.

yes i guess but that's why i don't actually know how messy i'm expecting their breakup to be because i don't see it being an i love you mike i love you el okay we're gonna be the best of friends now situation but like you said if they hate each other then they have to make up which...well like i was saying i don't see them spending time on el and mike making up and becoming bffs at all. but idk even with that in mind i can't see them having a totally drama-free breakup that's just a sweet (bittersweet) conversation because they could've literally had that at surfer boy pizza yk? before max died while mike was telling her he loved her etc etc lol. so i definitely know what you mean but i just don't know what i'm hoping for or expecting lmao but there's something between very messy and angry breakup and very easy and sweet breakup? idk. but i think if them having to fix their relationship (i really literally can't picture it because i don't even feel like they were written to be best friends like i can't imagine it i know their relationship is getting in the way of their potential friendship but like. what would their relationship as friends even look like omg) is the price to pay for a breakup scene that feels earned (which to me means something that isn't el saying a variation of it's okay mike thank you for being gay) then i'd rather have that? but they have eight episodes how many scenes would they even need to show that they're friends/that they do love each other and are gonna stay in each other's lives and be friends after the end of the show. idk. because i do get what you're saying. i'm not sure what i want or what i'm expecting or hoping for but i also have no imagination we know this so. idk lmao

#take a shot every time i say idk #thank you for being gay is a jokey joke but also thinking about that post by stav where she says that el literally wouldn't be like i get #why you lied because while of course she wouldn't be homophobic but like. the other side of the coin is that she doesn't KNOW lmao #ask