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jade-len · 6 days

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before i say anything, i would just like to say that i definitely agree with many of your points; that abuse was normal back then, that liu qingge beating the shit out of his students is NOT a good method of teaching, justice being a scale, and that luo bingge is an awful, cruel person who went above and beyond for revenge.

while i know the main point of your post is that luo bingge wasn't "cool" for "taking revenge" (which i also agree with... because bingge, holy shit), at least to me, it feels like you're slightly dismissing how shen jiu was also cruel to luo binghe. i do see that you already acknowledge that abuse is abuse, yes, but fail to mention that shen jiu specifically went out of his way to exclude and abuse luo binghe, a child who didn't do anything. he wasn't just mean to everyone (excluding ning yingying). there is a difference between just being mean and being horrifically cruel, just like how there's also a difference between wanting justice and being cruel.

lets be honest: in ancient china, there was nothing wrong with a teacher physically abusing a student. it was common even. im not saying its okay but it HAPPENED and A LOT. for gods sake, it was normal in my country to teachers beat students until the 90s! even after that!

yes, definitely! it wasn't okay but it did happen a lot. but, i believe you forgot to mention that yue qingyuan himself thought the punishments to be too far. in the first chapter, yue qingyuan literally tells his xiao-jiu this, and he lets him get away with everything! if he, a guilt-ridden man (or even any authority back then who wouldn't blink an eye at ancient china abuse!) even slightly goes, "uh.. hey, i know you don't like him but aren't you being too harsh..?" it's a pretty big deal.

"Yue Qingyuan sighed. "I know you don't like him. But that child's already worked hard enough, and he hasn't made any significant mistakes. Don't punish him any further, all right?"" - Chapter 1: Scum

pouring boiling hot tea on a child upon first contact? giving a preteen a false cultivation manual that could literally kill him? having luo binghe's peers actively group against him?

"He always found new ways to taunt and demean Luo Binghe, even enlisting the boy's peers to belittle him. Throughout these years of studying, Luo Binghe endured every humiliation. It was another heart-wrenching arc in his story, filled with blood and tears." - Chapter 1: Scum

this could just be shen yuan over exaggerating and being a bingge stan, but he is the oh so infamous peerless cucumber who has everything memorized despite being an unreliable narrator when he goes through the action himself. the whole thing with him is that he's so familiar with PIDW so well to the point he's blinded by it, unable to see the new storyline SVSSS offers.

im not saying shen jiu was right, or what he did a good thing, because it wasnt. abuse is always abuse, and it should be treated as it is. but lets take Bai Zhan Peak as an example. Liu Qingge beat the shit out of his disciples, and no one batted an eye

i believe the reason why no one really batts an eye at liu qingge beating his disciples is because he, while it is still child abuse and not at all a good teaching method or teacher, wasn't specifically cruel to one or a couple of kids. to him, i'm sure it was a teaching method to him. beat up a couple of little brats and they'll learn how to fight, surely (hey, i could be wrong! we never get liu qingge's pov, but i genuinely believe this is what he thought based on just watching how his character works). shen jiu wanted to torment and outright kill luo binghe.

plus, shen jiu is known to be a cruel and lecherous teacher (yes, i know the lecherous part is false, but the cruel part isn't). what does that say about him, when even this xianxia world with slaves and horrible abusive punishments thinks that?

but thats not my point right now, my point is: Luo Bingge was not "cool" for "taking revenge" cause what he did was not revenge, it was pure CRUELTY

it would be revenge if he hit shen jiu with a whip several times. it would be revenge if he made him do forced domestic work. it would be revenge, if he made him go through the same suffering that shen qingqiu put him through in the abyss

like i said earlier, i do agree that luo bingge wasn't cool or anything for taking revenge.

but, everyone has different viewpoints on what exactly revenge is. you may see revenge as a scale, but luo bingge sees it in a more twisted, crueler way. just because he's heinously cruel with it doesn't mean it isn't revenge.

Revenge: the action of inflicting hurt or harm on someone for an injury or wrong suffered at their hands.

now, to clear things up a bit more, i am in no way saying this to try and defend bingge and i don't believe you should like him or whatever. everyone has their own opinions, hate him, love him, whatever! but, i do wish for what he went through to be thoroughly recognized. just like how i wish for shen jiu's struggles to be recognized as well. hurt people hurt other people.

it's horrible what luo bingge did. he brought everyone down, not just shen jiu. but to him, in his sick way of what he believes is fair, that is perfectly acceptable revenge. that is the only way he can (unhealthily) cope with the abuse he went through.

maybe to you it's not equal. that a couple of whips should do it, or throwing shen jiu down into the abyss.

but luo binghe does think it is. the bottled rage has been building up for years, and he cannot let go of it until he throws it up on shen jiu and everyone else who has ever wronged him. those lonely nights at the shed as a scared, confused child. being discarded as a disgusting mix of human and demon. his first time of intimacy being with someone (qin wanyue) who basically coerce raped him. the knowledge that shen jiu, this almighty cultivator who he so desperately looked up to and forgave and made excuses for time and time again as a lonely child didn't care about him at all? to the point the man outright just wanted to kill him? how can he possible make shen jiu understand how he felt? his pain? betrayal? misery?

so, luo bingge destroys everything shen jiu has, and ultimately, him as well. but it doesn't help. because no matter what, shen jiu will never understand. and it continues and continues, the misery and incompleteness. the suffering and emptiness. to the point where luo bingge throws away all his hard work in the bingge vs bingmei extra just so that the void from meaningless vengeance can be filled with love instead.

that doesn't excuse anything luo bingge did though. he's a murderer, a manipulative womanizer, a rapist, a selfish man-child who can't let go of the past and move on because his rage is the only thing that keeps him warm. like you said, luo bingge is a horrible, disgustingly cruel monster who can only live with the blood of his enemies on his claws and pumping through his veins. he only proves shen jiu right in the end (but, obviously this doesn't mean what shen jiu did to him was right and that just because someone turns out to be a terrible person, what they went through as a child shouldn't be used against them or justified, like "oh, well they did this so what they went through was completely deserved!").

and, i'm sure someone out there in PIDW is planning to do the exact same thing to luo binghe as luo bingge did to shen jiu.

luo bingge and shen jiu are both tragically horrific characters. abusers. the products of the cycle of abuse. cruel in their own ways, but ultimately parallels with their own twisted morals and ways they see the world. they are fascinating and i want to put them under a microscope as they rip each other's faces off. i personally actually love both of them and their little fucked up shit they have going on. i would've done the same explaining shen jiu's whole thing if this post seemed dismissive of luo binghe's actions and cruelty against him.

all in all, again, i know that the point of your post was that, but to me, the way you worded some things comes off as dismissive to the horrific treatment luo binghe suffered through/shen jiu's actions and character. i don't believe "bad" can be measured, since everyone has different ways of scaling. to someone else, they may think that stealing is just as bad as smacking someone. they may think that murder is wrong no matter the situation, even if it was self defense.

but, i could be wrong about your intention with that! i'm not you, i can only come to my own conclusions based on what i read. i hope you know that this wasn't meant to attack you or anything of that sort. i really do agree with the general gist of this post. while i don't really see people exactly praising luo bingge for what he did like you, it would definitely unnerve and disgust me if i saw people doing that as well. and, apologies for the long reblog

i think i finally understand why i hate luo bingge so much

i usually love the kind of character he is: vengeful, merciless, villainous. im all the way down for villains with a reason for them to be evil (and if you think bingge is anything BUT a villain, youre wrong). but i didnt felt that way toward bingge. and that really bothered me

there is a very thin line between revenge and cruelty. but its still there. and bingge crossed that line

that 👇👇 is the best way i could explain the difference

but thats not my point right now, my point is: Luo Bingge was not "cool" for "taking revenge" cause what he did was not revenge, it was pure CRUELTY

!!Spoiler alert!!

but no.

he made the entire cultivation world see sqq again as nothing more than the slave he was, he ripped off shen jiu's legs and arms, he tortured him for god knows how much time, he let his wives torture him, he destroyed the ENTIRE sect that had nothing to do with it, and he killed the only person shen qingqiu really cared about

and dont get me started on how he destroyed earth by bringing together the demonic and human worlds

lets use a metaphor for better understanding: theres a perfectly balanced scale between you, and every other person. And when someone hurts you, theres this natural desire to push back. To seek justice. To bring those scales back into balance. But when you do the other side of the scale never dipped below the balancing point

and thats not what bingge wanted. he didnt want the scale to be equal

because even if things were restored exactly to the way they were before, shen jiu would never knew what bingge felt like

he would never be brought down. And THATS what bingge wanted

he didnt wanted justice for what shen jiu did to him. he didnt wanted revenge either. he wanted to be cruel

he turned into a monster

and that make me sick

i honestly cant stand seeing people praising bingge as if he was a good person for doing what he did

#svsss #mxtx svsss #shen qingqiu #luo binghe #luo bingmei #luo bingge #shen jiu #shen yuan #svsss meta #phew i pulled yet another peerless cucumber #actually i dont think i usually do this but eh

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jade-len · 12 days

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THERE WAS A WHOLE SVSSS GAME IN PROGRESS AND I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW ABOUT IT???

AM I LATE? WHEN DID THIS HAPPEN? WAS I THE ONLY ONE WHO DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT THIS??? IT'S GOING TO BE FREE TOO OH MY GOD

original post here!

heres their patreon btw go support them!!

#HOLY SHIT #svsss #mxtx svsss #shen qingqiu #luo binghe #the scum villain's self saving system #scumbag self saving system #scumbag system

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jade-len · 13 days

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alr i can't be the only one unsettled and weirded out by bingjiu

now don't get me wrong, i'm not those people who think you can't ship enemies together or whatever, ship what you want... but holy fuck there's something about bingjiu that just disturbs? uneases? me on another level

#i think its the fact that theyre so fucking dysfunctional to the point where it's not even fun to put them together #it just makes me so.. idk. like it kinda has me going 'oh... oh what the fuck.'#binghe was abused by shen qingqiu for years and years and now is so SEVERELY fucked up. his rage and vengeance is horrifying #shen qingqiu also went through years of shit and took it all out on a small fucking child and repeatedly got away with it until it all #bit him back in the ass and binghe turned him into a human stick. but binghe also abused and hurt so many others as well #and theres just whole cycle of abuse and oh my god it just disturbs me I DONT KNOW HOW TO EXPLAIN IT BETTER #they are both each others downfall. binghe will never get that closure of an apology and escape his madness #shen qingqiu will never see the light of day and continue to suffer for as long as luo binghe feels is right which is.. forever tbh #and its. its not even sexy. its just fucking miserable. you cant fucking have a new light or perspective on this #this ship is genuinely terrifying to me no matter how you angle it. luo binghe even having an interest in sj feels *wrong*#sj having any sort of romantic or sexual interest in lbh also feels wrong #no matter what angle you look at this its just /wrong/. you cant even redeem sj or lbh in this. cant shift it.#again its not even hot in an enemies to lovers way?? its not hot at all. and honestly i dont even think lbh would nonc0n sj or whatever #because i genuinely believe lbh would feel so disgusted even touching or thinking about his abuser in such a way #theyre both fucking insane. and not in a good haha ship way. its terrible and honestly this ship makes me sorta sick thinking abt it lol #they are both terrible people and they do not have any underlying desire for one another. its miserable. at least with sj/yqy theres #SOMETHING there but not bingjiu. bingjiu only knows genuine #fucked up abuse and pain. theres not even a moment of tenderness that can redeem this. nothing. holy fuck #svsss #mxtx svsss #luo binghe #shen qingqiu #luo bingge #shen jiu #bingjiu #the scum villain's self saving system

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jade-len · 16 days

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One day I'm going to write a fic from SQH's POV and there's gonna be a giant elephant in the room. A horror element whenever he's chatting with SY!SQQ. Something off that he just gets progressively guiltier about.

SQH's System was abundantly clear that this was his hell (it was in his notes during a major depressive episode). That he deserved to live in the world he made and suffer the consequences.

Meanwhile, Peerless Cucumber never let up while SQH was alive. Was always there for him every time he posted. Basically aired out SQH's own grievances against the state of his writing. SQH didn't jokingly ask for rich fuck Peerless Cucumber to be his patron because...

🥒-bro was a ghost account. SQH created Shen Yuan. Used his own money to buy every chapter to rip it to shreds. It was therapeutic and deranged but it generated traffic like you wouldn't believe.

SY is exactly how he was written: madly in love with LBH and repressed about it and pissed that PIDW didn't have more monster lore and less papapa scenes. LBH deserves a happy ending!! WHERE WAS IT AIRPLANE !

SQH is in hell because his best friend-anti fan-meme generator is as imaginary as everyone else in this damned world. An NPC who holds the reins of their reality and is doing a bad job at making LBH happy because 🥒-bro refuses to let himself be happy.

Ironic!! Just like his Dad!! Hahahahaha!!

Shang Qinghua is in hell but acts like nothing is wrong. He can't be OOC towards his Frenemy Bestie, his greatest black powder fan, his greatest real life con. It would break SY if he actually thought through the ramifications. Ha! Who was he kidding? 🥒-bro would probably brush it off like his 'homo? Me? Pah! No homo!' tendencies

SQH wants to lock himself in a room and sob himself hoarse but his eyes are dry and his smile remains stretched tightly over his teeth while SY rambles and complains about shit that doesn't really matter.

In this world SQH is the NPC and Cucumber-bro is the Godly Protagonist with wife beam eyes.

The translucent System-faced android next to him, scoring his every interaction and completely undetectable to anyone else, doesn't help either.

#genuinely need more slowly-going-insane shang qinghua #svsss #shang qinghua #shen qingqiu #this is horrifying and i love it

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jade-len · 19 days

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well what if the only person sqh doesn't know ANYTHING about is lqg because he was just there to be killed off and so he has to actually try to get to know him and can't use his author knowledge and so they bond and he sees lqg as so much more than just a character whose life was meant to end for a cheap shock and lqg also gets to know him as well and sees sqh in a new light because that coward he grew up distantly with is weirdly able to understand him and actually see him as a person and not just a dumb brute and a new friendship blossoms and

anyways i created the perfect ship/platonic ship name for them it's attack helicopter thank you for coming to my ted talk

#plspls hear me out #PLEASE THE DYNAMIC WOULD BE SO GOOD AND INTERESTING I LOVE IT #theyre both weird in their own way #shang qinghua understands him bc liu qingge shows signs of autism forreal #he comes from a modern world he knows it when he sees it!!! hes very gentle abt it too compared to others in ancient china bc #obv they dont know what that is #i need to. create a fanfic with this holy shit #svsss #mxtx svsss #the scum villain's self saving system #shang qinghua #liu qingge

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jade-len · 19 days

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Since Tianlang-Jun is a heavenly demon, then that means a lot of stuff that was deemed incurable can be cured by him. Anyways, what do you guys think about Tianlang-Jun and Mu Qingfang-

#WAIT I THINK YOURE COOKING!?!?#NO YEAH YOU COOKED A FIVE STAR MEAL!!!#svsss #tianlang jun #mxtx svsss #mu qingfang

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jade-len · 20 days

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(sorry this was from another reblog i did and i wanted to just put this here lmao w/o typing it all out again but anyways you get it)

i really don't know how to feel about fics/aus where it turns out that sj's treatment of lbh is his own fault because he didn't speak up about issues with other disciples, genuinely misbehaved etc and also later (as bingge) lied about how much he actually got punished and in truth it wasn't any more than any other disciple, and that sj didn't know about the fake manual, when all of this is explicitly against canon.

yqy adresses this when sy wakes up, telling sqq to stop being so mean to lbh. in the sj extra, he himself says that lbh should have died a long time ago bleeding from the seven apertures due to the fake manual. sy says that pidw explicitly states that lbh was punished WAAAY more than any other disciple, and in those conditions obviously noone would tell their teacher about being bullied??

idk i understand altering canon for the sake of telling a story but... somehow it feels like a disservice to sj's character to ignore canon and water him down for the sake of making his redemption easier. and villifying lbh, which is what these fics inevitably end up doing, is also messed up - he was around 11 when he joined cqm. that's a CHILD. no matter how you look at it, sqq's "treatment" of lbh is neglect at best, horrible abuse at worst, and in modern times it would put him in jail faster than you could blink. giving him a realistic redemption arc is difficult, if not impossible, but if you truly love him with all his flaws and faults, isn't it worth the effort?

#i keep reblogging svsss meta but CMON #ur so real #svsss #shen jiu #shen qingqiu #pidw #luo binghe #orginal luo binghe

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jade-len · 20 days

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sometimes i'm having fun in the mxtx (primarily svsss) fandom and then have the horrible realization that there's definitely at least a few thousand people who're only here because they fetishize asians or queer men/people. or both! how delightful

#i'm not saying you're a bad person if you do have those fetishes.... but you're definitely weird. and not in a silly good way #i find the word 'fujoshi' funny but if you're using it unironically to describe yourself #kindly fuck off #im not too sure about people who make sqq a feminine small twink but it does slightly rub off as fitting bingqiu into the whole #gender roles thing? like 'who wears the pants in the relationship' which. uh. idk #not saying thats the intention of them but at least to me it feels a lil odd #anyways join the #stop twinkifying sqq group #also this doesnt mean people who arent queer men n such cant read BL. bc lets be honest some straight media is wack lmao #mxtx #svsss #tgcf #mdzs #mxtx svsss #mxtx tgcf #mxtx mdzs #danmei #boy love #bl

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jade-len · 20 days

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i love it when fandom infantilizes characters to the point of denying them their own agency.

"if people in cang qiong had treated shen jiu differently-" do you have any evidence that they mistreated him? or is it too hard a pill to swallow that shen jiu was the one who decided to close himself off and be an asshole. that cang qiong treated him just fine, that his martial siblings tolerated him to the point that even when he was suspected of murder nothing was done to him?

who forced shen jiu to abuse luo binghe? to abuse other disciples? those were his decisions, that was him acting in a position of power.

the moral of the story is not "shen jiu was misunderstood :(" the moral is: the person who was abused can also become an abuser. the one who suffers violence can be violent towards others. you, despite what you've gone through, have the capacity for kindness and cruelty. so be wise on how you decide to act, because your pain doesn't justify hurting others, and your actions will have consequences.

you have agency, you have whatever amount of power you have over your own life and the things you do have an impact in the lives of those around you and yourself. so maybe try being at the very list neutral to the world and yourself, if you can't be kind.

but no, shen jiu's mentality was "since I suffered, they deserve to suffer too". and by taking that path he perpetuated the cycle of abuse.

bingge is the same, because he could have stopped at taking revenge on shen jiu, but he decided to involve the whole sect and the rest of the world, no matter who was innocent. he was unnecessarily cruel, but so was his master.

both shen jiu and bingge had the capacity for some form of "niceness" (in the way they treated women), so it wasn't as if they'd never known some form of love. at some point in their lives, they stopped being abused children and became abusive adults.

and that's an expression of human behaviour that we have to accept as possible. the svsss narrative invites us to examine ourselves in this light, to witness our capacity for both love and hate, to realize that even in the most adverse of circumstances, there's always a small sliver of agency over how we feel and how we act. that, despite the things that defines us from birth through childhood, our decisions also define what we'll become in the future.

#youre so real everytime you make an svsss meta #svsss meta #svsss #shen jiu #luo binghe #pidw #pidw luo binghe #luo bingge

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jade-len · 22 days

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i just think it'd be funny if shen yuan wasn't the short, young college aged lanky nerd looking guy everyone keeps drawing him as. like, same sorta loser vibe but in a different font with bolded italics

what if he was actually a mid to late 20s dude with an unshaved face. heavy eye bags from pulling an all nighter reading web novels with glasses that barely help him. a deadpan, low and tired sounding voice that only actually gets emotion when you talk about pidw or monsters. tall but awkwardly so to the point it's uncomfortable for him to sit down at restaurants bc the table is average asian short low. stranger you see and go "mans must got it rough" but the only rough thing he's going through rn is whether or not he should buy binghe figurine #1 or binghe figurine #2

#i swear if you have this version of sy in mind while hes now sqq it feels so much funnier than if it were you average chinese twink or wtv #and itd help solidify binghes age difference kink lmao #svsss #mxtx svsss #shen qingqiu #luo binghe #shen yuan

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jade-len · 23 days

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and people will say, "well.. punishment like that was normal back on the day!" or something along those lines

like. did we not read the same book or?? it's so clearly stated that shen jiu purposely tormented luo binghe specifically

shen jiu literally gave him a fake manual (which i'm certain is NOT something a teacher, no matter how normal harsh punishment it was back then, can do) and the abuse was so bad to the point where even yue qingyuan in the very first chapter who kinda just lets it slide because its him is like, "uhm..?? don't you think luo binghe suffered enough..? haha...???"

i'm sure shen jiu gave out harsh punishments to other students as well, but he literally did the most insane abusive shit ever to binghe.

yes, shen qingqiu is an unreliable narrator. yes, he's very biased towards binghe... but it's not that hard to pick up that, yeah, shen jiu was a terrible person who specifically fucked over binghe, a literal teenager who followed him around with so much hope and respect and carried out his duties with perfection and tried so so hard and for the love of whoever you believe in it's absolutely crazy when people completely dismiss what he did all because of whatever reason!

guys, we can acknowledge the trauma a character went through while ALSO acknowledging how fucked they are/fucked up things they did.

for example, i love bingge. i think he's a deliciously tragic character. i also know that he's a terrible person who's a dictator, murderer, rapist, manipulator, a two faced revenge crazed maniac, and so much more! it's horrible what he went through!! but i still know he also did shitty, disgusting things!!!

plus, one of the themes or whatever in svsss is the cycle of abuse. is about villainy. MORAL AMBIGUITY PEOPLE! MORAL AMBIGUITY!! i am gripping you by the shoulders. IT IS OKAY FOR A CHARACTER TO BE FUCKED AND ALSO HAVE REDEEMING QUALITIES. NOT EVERYTHING IS JUST BLACK AND WHITE MXTX LITERALLY MADE FOUR NOVELS WITH THIS IN MIND AND WROTE IT OUT FOR US!!!

anyways yeah love shen jiu too man but. please. that whole thing is a pretty damn important part of his character how can you just dismiss it as shen yuan being an unreliable narrator??? we are (technically) smarter than him in this because we are the reader and can read in between the lines!!

ehem. so. since sometimes certain people won't believe sqq's recap of thing because he's an "unreliable narrator", here's bingge's own pov from the showdown extra on the abuse he suffered in qing jing peak:

Since he’d come of age, no one had ever managed to push him this far. Being at such a disadvantage reminded him of the days when he’d been persecuted and humiliated, trampled over in all kinds of ways. The hot tea spilled upon his head, the cold and drafty woodshed, the relentless beating fists, the verbal abuse, the kneeling that lasted from the blazing afternoon into the dead of the night, the paucity of his meals. And connected to those days via a thousand inseparable threads was the face before him.

he's referring to sqq's face ofc

so mxtx confirms it all happened through bingge's pov, and later from sj's pov too.

┐(︶▽︶)┌

#to the people who genuinely believe shen jiu did absolutely NOTHING wrong:#pls stop cutting off the flavor of these little fucked characters and boiling it till it turns white ppl chicken pale.#my meal is ruined and all of the spice sourness and bitterness from the famous Shen Jiu Special Seasoning bottle.#has been wasted bc apparently you guys see the world in only burnt-to-black dino nuggets i left in the air fryer for way too long #or scarily dry 'authentic mexican' public school chicken tacos as white as the ppl making them #guys PLEASEPLEADEPLEASE #lmao sorry for ranting just reread the books yall #ill even lend my annotated scum villain books if you need even more help!!'#svsss #mxtx svsss #shen qingqiu #luo binghe #luo bingge #luo bingmei #shen jiu

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