#sorry to say this but marinette is the emotionally immature one between her and adrien

[starguardianniom]

The emotional immaturity of Adrien and Marinette

This need to be said.

You cannot tell me Adrien lacks the emotional maturity to handle his father being the villain he fights for 5 seasons, his assistant helping him, and his mom being alive in a coma in the basement and tell me he can't handle it. Who the hell would?

And yet, he still should have been there for the final battle, because after spending 5 seasons trying to break free from his caged life that Gabriel threw him in, he deserves to have a final face off with the man and see the reality of the situation, while also denouncing everything his father fought for by saying he was wrong, and he's gonna fight to end his madness.

Somehow, Marinette gets to be in the final battle alone with 2 miraculouses against her boyfriend's father who's the antagonist, and at the end when he wins, she complies with his last request to not say anything to Adrien.

How the hell is that her handling it in any kind of mature way possible, or saying she didn't have her emotions messing with her judgement here?

Cause I'm sorry, but past seasons proved time and time again that Marinette is just as emotionally immature as Adrien, if not more, when it comes to world shattering stuff thrown her way.

Starting with her being very immature emotionally whenever it concerns Adrien.

We saw her screwing up in 3 seasons finales because of her feelings for Adrien having a factor in it.

In season 1 Volpina, she impulsively humiliated Lila in front of Adrien to not only call her out on her lies, but also to get her away from Adrien, after spending a lot of time following them around because she was jealous, before Tikki noticed the Book.

Season 3 in Heart Hunter, her being heartbroken over letting Adrien and Kagami be together and then later seeing them together as Ladybug mess with her feelings and she choose to get Kagami away from Adrien instead of finding Chloé who told her she was ready to fight, and honestly there's no way she chose Kagami purely for selfless reasons 100%, she was still affected by her feelings of being crushed, and when choosing which miraculous she should take, she was clearly debating either to choose Chloé who was already aware of the situation and it was her parents, or choose Kagami who was having a romantic moment with Adrien. Do not tell me she was completely focused when she had been distracted earlier as Ladybug at seeing Adrigami in display, she freaking crashed into a tree when seeing it.

Season 4 Strike Back showed her, after spending the last episode being driven impulsive by Risk, which she became aware of in the end, she decided to go fetch "Adrien" to pull off her plan, despite having much easier options to go as. Not to mention her Lucky Charm saying she had to go in the past, knowing the entire city was affected, yet somehow Adrien wasn't, yet it didn't tip her off that maybe if Adrien wasn't affected it was because he wasn't there the day before, and thus couldn't have been Adrien, but maybe his cousin, since she knows he pulled a twin switch once with him. She could have fetch Sabrina who was already familiar with the Dog Miraculous, heck better yet, she could have just unified her miraculous with the Rabbit and the Dog without having the Horse, and do the travel herself, if she use the beyond broken Rabbit miraculous, then she can freaking use the Dog, but she decided Adrien was trustworthy. She even questionned herself if the idea made her reckless. But since she can't shake her crush is perfect, she stood to her initial plan, and got completely fooled by him which gave Gabriel all the miraculouses but hers, Chat Noir's and the Peacock. She thought with her heart, not her brain there.

It's not the first time she does it either.

When it comes to Adrien, or perfect guys, Marinette becomes one of the least emotionally mature people on the show.

We saw how in Desperada, her knowing Aspik was Adrien couldn't make her focus at all.

In Kuro Neko, having a new partner, which was basically Adrien's model routine up to the max, she couldn't concentrate at all on the mission, let alone KNOW HOW TO USE HER FREAKING LUCKY CHARM.

And now Marinette herself when it doesn't have anything to do with being Ladybug, just being Marinette, or it being about Adrien in any way.

Marinette is a girl who is insecure, nervous and prone to self-spirals to the simplest mistakes, and goes above and beyond to try to either salvage the situation, or try to cover it up with others being none the wiser if she wants to and plays her cards right.

She will go to extreme answers to basic problems, which usually cause more trouble for herself in the long run.

She is extremely reckless in that aspect and doesn't think things through completely like she thinks she is doing.

Mostly because she has an immature response to anything that could cause her any embarassment or having to confront a though situation she doesn't want to deal with or just hope it goes away on its own.

Accidently leaving an embarassing message on Adrien's phone?

Break into his locker, steal his phone, learn his password and delete it, instead of maybe explaining herself calmly.

Accidently erasing a video of Ladybug on Alya's phone? Steal the phone, lie to her bestie, try to redo the video so she won't notice, being afraid she'll break her friendship with her if she finds out, not thinking Alya might have posted it on her blog before showing it to her.

Juleka needs to be in the class photo? Go steal the memory card of the photographer and erase the previous photo so he'll need to take another one instead of just asking to redo it, because she is sure he won't want to.

She didn't do anything grand like her classmates for Heroes Day? Lie about what she actually plans to the entire class and get caught up in her plan when she can't pull it off, despite Alya defending her earlier, her parents and Tikki telling her she needs to come clean, and her classmates, sans Chloé, not being bothered by it, probably understanding that she was very busy and did what she could on a short notice.

Adrien is at a movie premiere with Kagami? Team up with Chloé to humiliate Kagami so she'll be seated next to Adrien and prevent him and Kagami from leaving Japan, instead of trying to stop her bully from 4 years from pulling a cruel prank, a bit similar to what she went through the year prior, being humiliated publically in front of a guy she liked.

Can't give Adrien a gift at his house? Abuse her powers to transform and break into his room to deliver his gift, instead of waiting at the front gates until he arrives like a normal person.

The guys having a boys only party at Adrien's house? She needs to ditch her friends to go to that party, and pass herself as a boy to join, instead of just letting them be, because how dare they have a guy only party the one time they all group together, not like she only hangs out with her girl friends all the time without any guys.

Doesn't know why her grand-father is estranged from her dad? Pretend to be someone else, and lie to him, instead of coming clean from the start.

Learned Kagami and Adrien broke up? Push Kagami to try to make her fall in love with him again and ignores everything Kagami tells her, at one point literally lifting her to get her to talk to him, projecting her feelings on Kagami the entire episode, instead of listening to Kagami and trying to learn what happened.

Ghosted Kagami by ignoring her calls because she didn't want her to be disappointed in her not being able to tell Adrien "I love you" despite dating him at that time.

She doesn't want to see Luka because she's afraid to break his heart again and get him akumatized? Ask his twin to tell him to not come to HIS OWN BIRTHDAY PARTY BECAUSE SHE'S TOO MUCH OF A COWARD TO FACE HIM! Not to mention not listening to Alya telling her she exaggerate and that Luka would like to see her again, as unlike her, Alya has been talking to Luka and knows he would prefer to stay friends with Marinette even if he still has feelings for her, cause Luka is that mature.

Su-Han wants to know Chat Noir's identity for safety reasons in case anything happens to him? Why, lie to Chat Noir about wanting to knows each other's identities, have 2 people knowing his without his consent, then erase the deed so neither he or she will remember it, her thinking Chat Noir will never reveal himself to anyone but her, without her ever bothering to talk to him and explaining the reasons, which given how much more understanding he is than her most of the time, he would get it and would do so without complains, but nope she goes behind his back and immediatly thinks she knows him better.

Learns Adrien is sended to Shangai without her knowing? Welp, time to lie to her parents about wanting to connect to her maternal origins from China and wanting to go there to know her roots, making them pay for what was supposed to be a family trip that they had planned since she was born, just to go stalk her crush whom she basically sees everyday in class in another country, just because she was miffed that she didn't know about it, despite boasting how she knew everything about him and she would know if he was going.

Those are the many emotionally immature actions that she made throughout the show, and you tell me Adrien isn't emotionally mature enough for the final fight in the finale of season 5?

Fuck you, the main protagonist is even more emotionally immature than he'll ever be with all the crap she pulled.

The creators even said Marinette has a very poor control of her emotions. Even as Ladybug she's not immune.

Adrien is probably more mature than her because of all the mental strenght he builded up just to keep up with his life before getting a miraculous.

Marinette is just a normal kid who kids herself, she is very clever and intelligent, but in the emotional maturity department, she is one of the worse, out there with Chloé, Lila and Gabriel.

Any minor problems she faces she tends to go to extreme lenghts to solve, despite many people telling her time and time again that she's really thinking way too much about it. Namely Tikki and Alya.

Her first responses are most of the time, lie, manipulate, steal, in the hopes she can undo her mistake before someone sees it, or to save face and prevent herself from being embarassed. Heck, a lot of the time, it doesn't have anything to do with being Ladybug, she just want to save face.

Honesty isn't her first answer a lot of the time.

Not being honest about making mistakes and just trying to avoid them by lying or fixing them before someone sees them is emotionally immature on her part.

Because she's a stupid 14 years old teen who does a lot of stupid 14 years old stuff.

Like Adrien is a 14 eyears old teen who also does a lot of stupid 14 years old stuff, mostly as Chat Noir, Adrien, a bit less, but sometimes too.

So to hell with Adrien not being emotionally mature to handle his dad being a villain and all that, Marinette is just as worse.

The fact she lies to him at the end about it all proves it.

She is not emotionally mature about him, she has never shaded her rose colored glasses that are glued to her face when it comes to him.

To her, Adrien is the perfect boy who needs protection from anyone and anything that could harm him or cause him grief.

She sees him more as an idol than a real person. Even when he confess his insecurities to her, she's more concerned about his safety rather than trying to learn more about why he feels that way and connect to him more than just drooling over him like the hardstuck fangirl that she is when around him.

She sniffed his pillow. Pulled hair and kissed what she thought was a statue of him. Stalked him to another country. Humiliated 2 girls who were interested in him. Makes tons of complicated schemes to woo a guy she can barely talk to because she was traumatized before by a prank and the lesson she learned from it was to learn everything about the next guy just to be sure she wouldn't be caught again, instead of just listening to her friend's advice, taking it to an extreme form of creepy.

Again, not the picture of emotional maturity here much. So do not ever tell me that Adrien is not mature enough to be able to take emotionally the bad news.

If Marinette's response to the bad news was to lie to the entire city about the villain and make him a hero instead, and lie to her partner, and boyfriend, because she listened to Gabriel's last wish, then seriously, it outright says in blinding lights neon that she was not emotionally mature for it either.

Especially since the villain was her boyfriend's dad, and we all know how she acts when it's about her beloved.

She didn't have to change her views on Adrien, never did, for that she would have needed to treat him like a person instead of an angel gracing the earth.

The shrine she saw him from was so high up in the sky she never saw what was really happening with him, even when told, she just went back to drooling over him as if nothing happened.

#ml season 5 spoilers #miraculous ladybug #ml s5 spoilers #adrien agreste #marinette dupain cheng #gabriel agreste #marinette salt #ml salt #miraculous salt #ml s5 leaks #ml season 5 leaks #sorry to say this but marinette is the emotionally immature one between her and adrien #by a large margin #seriously #i am almost not surprised that she does that #she never got character development for her adrien problem #adrien confessing to her instead of her doing it kind of robbed her of any progress she could have done in that regard

[miraculously-dedicated]

ML Discussion Project

I know I literally JUST started this side blog (none knows about my existence so far) BUT. I have an idea to change that. 

Since I would love to improve my analysis skills on characters and storytelling for this show, I was thinking...How about I come up with discussion ideas where anyone can chime in to share their thoughts and ideas, and we can create one big collaborative meta post? I would love to be able to exchange and communicate more with those who share the same interest as me!

The only rules are:

Please do your best to keep your post organized with proper grammar/spelling, so everyone can read it. Please also refrain from inappropriate slurs and behavior/language in general.

Don’t patronize anyone for anything you disagree with. Don’t bully them for “mistakes” either. We all start from somewhere and we all have different opinions. Please be respectful and open-minded. If anyone acts out and is harmful towards anyone( insults, threats, etc) they will immediately be blocked.

No unnecessary negativity. The whole point of this blog is to focus more positively and enjoy ourselves with Miraculous as much as we can. Of course you can still offer your own critique, I’m not trying to restrict you but there’s still a difference between critiquing and just plain hate. This is a salt-free zone. Insulting characters, staff members, writing, and/or creators are all banned and will result in blocking. I’m not being “sensitive”, I’m just trying to keep this blog a safe, non-toxic place.

Just have fun! Don’t strive to be perfect, I just want you to enjoy yourself. Go into as much detail as you want and don’t hesitate to speak your mind or ask questions. I WANT to hear them. Treat this as a learning experience if it’s your first time doing something like this. No need to feel shy or intimidated if you really consider joining.😊 

With that said let’s get right into the first discussion idea!

  Tough Love vs Tender Love❤

So while I was looking through @booabug ‘s meta posts (THEY’RE AMAZING), this particular post got me thinking about tough love and tender love. More specifically how Marinette and Adrien react differently to both kinds and how they are being used in the show to push our two protagonists forward.

Marinette: One of the sweetest girls you’ll ever meet right? Grew up surrounded by love and support. Has been exposed to a lot of tender love. Her friends and family are always extremely kind and patient, has always been given second chances when needed, always has someone to turn to when she feels down. Emotionally speaking, our little cutie pie is spoiled rotten. Not to say that she has never experienced bad days or deals with insecurities, no. But all the positive experiences she had growing up to this point help outweigh the bad, and is the main reason why she is so optimistic and has no trouble picking her self back up. It’s also because she was able to grow up like a normal girl experiencing both the good and the bad, along with a healthy living environment to learn from, she was able to mature so much and understand the bigger picture. 

However this does have its drawbacks. We’ve seen Marinette act irrational and emotionally impulsive, especially during the first season, she had pretty heavy black and white views on good and bad, was easily prone to jealousy, and can be pretty sensitive. She is aware of how the world is realistically, but she tries hard to achieve the ideal standard, sometimes blinding her from the fact that the actions she takes to achieve said ideal is probably not the most ethical or even attainable if she proceeds to use said action. Tender love made her into the lovable, empathetic gem she is, but it also made her heavily emotionally prone. 

That’s why she reacts to tough love so well. Marinette understands that the best way to approach goals is with logic and realism but when you grew up where had emotional guidance to depend on, you gained little logical guidance to help you strengthen up and move through the emotional obstacles. That’s why in Frozer, Marinette acted on Kagami’s advice and not the girl squad. By landing the cold, harsh truth on her, Marinette was able to see the big picture again clearly without any tinted goggles. “You want to be with Adrien? Stop pitying yourself and take a chance. All you have to do is approach him.” The same thing in Origins too. Marinette felt too guilty making a mistake the first time being Ladybug, she gave up her miraculous in hopes of fixing her mess by entrusting it to someone better. But when she saw Alya in danger all that changed. Marinette  realized the real problem by not taking action the fist time. She realized she was the savior of Paris, if she did not do anything people will DIE. From then on she approched being Ladybug with “There is no time feeling sorry for yourself. Forgot about Marinette’s problems right now, focus doing Ladybug’s duty. SAVE YOUR PEOPLE.”

Adrien: A true cinnamon roll at heart but a truly tragic character. Grew up isolated from the rest of the world with one garbage dad and (morally questionable) mother who has now been missing for a year. Has been exposed to a lot of tough love (more like emotional abuse this point). While its suggested that Adrien did have affectionate parents before Emilie went missing, he still was confined in his own house with little to no interaction from the rest of the world. His only friend growing up was Chloe, and was always told that the outside world was dangerous for him to be in. He has high expectations to be “perfect” because he is not like “everyone” else, he is the son of a world famous fashion designer. There is a huge social pressure on him not to make a single mistake or he will literally screw both himself over and his dad. When he makes a mistake its never sugarcoated for him; “You have done this wrong”, “do better”, “why are you still making these mistakes?” “If you can’t improve, it will not end well for you.” There is literally none in the Agreste mansion Adrien feels comfortable enough talking to when he needs guidance and his feelings are not even taken seriously, just something he needs to “get over”. 

 Emotionally speaking, our cat son is pretty much deprived of any positive reassurance. What he lacks in TLC, it is made up in logical reassurance in; “My father is only hurting since he lost mom too. I should at least try to be there for him .” “Everyone is fond of the Agreste name. It’s only natural I live up to that”. “The world outside is not perfect, dad is just scared for me.” “If I can prove my skills then he won’t have to worry so much anymore.” Adrien learned his empathy in a different way. By observing all sides of the situation and using his own negative experience, he tries to place himself in the shoes of others and does his bets to understand why people act certain ways and what he could do to improve the situation.

However, without a healthy home environment to learn from, Adrien has serious trouble understanding his own emotions causing him to lash out, act immaturely, and have horrible self-worth in himself. He understands what he has done wrong, he always does the right thing in the end thanks to his logical reassurance, but he has trouble learning from his mistakes quicker because he always tries to bottle up all his negative emotions. 

That’s why he reacts to tender love so well. Adrien needs to learn that his own problems are important as well, that he needs to learn how to properly communicate with others if he truly wants to feel okay in the end. That’s why in Glaciator and Frozer, Adrien was able to calm down so quickly. Ladybug understood he was hurting but that he also needed to be reminded of what’s important. She knew she needed to be calm and patient with him to bring out that logical side of him again that is being hurdled by emotional struggles. By validating his feelings, Adrien was able to what the problem was. “What are you doing? You’re partner needs you right now. She may not love you back but she still values you as a person. That is more than enough right now. Forgot about Adrien’s problems right now. Focus on doing Chat Noir’s duty. HELP YOUR LADY.”

In Conclusion:

Both Marinette and Adrien have been exposed to opposite types of love throughout their life, thus their go-to response for supporting others is the kind they have been subjected to. This is another reason why they need each other as partners whenever romantic or platonic. They give each other the opposite spectrum of support they lack and need when times are desperate for them. Ex. Cat Noir reminds Ladybug to think logically when she gets to impulsive and Ladybug is also patient with Cat Noir, reminding him that he needs to balance his feelings.

This is my first time doing something like this, so naturally I already see A LOT of flaws but hopefully I was able to get my point across. With that said, I hope this is something I can get a lot of people involved in. If there is anyone you would to tag to join as well ,by all means! Here are some talented people I picked out. (If they see this, I hope you will consider.)

@booabug @familyagrestefanblog @kisilinramblings @akas-ladybug @adrienaline-rushed-art @karama9 @imaginemae

Have Fun!

#ml #ml discussion project #tough love vs tender love #marinette dupain cheng #adrien agreste #ml meta