#but when the genocide is happening RIGHT NOW but the victims are the palestinians somehow we're expected to be... civil ?? and debate ?? | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

the-catboy-minyan · 3 months

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The way people are tokenising shoah survivors who they deem as their ‘good Jews’ is so vile and evil. As if going through atrocities somehow makes you more ethical, as if because of somebody’s suffering they’re somehow have some sort of ethereal judgment or whatever. Shoah survivors can, and do, have horrible morals. Shoah survivors can be wrong. Shoah survivors are people, they’re fucking people. I just— I can’t even properly write out a response to all of this stuff I’ve seen because it just fills me with rage

I completely agree, picking and choosing the voices of marginalised people to fit your narrative is wrong no matter how you twist it. because you know what?

rape survivors can still victim blaim.

birthing-people who needed abortion for life-saving reasons can still be anti-abortion.

POCs can still be racist.

trans people can still be terfs or just straight up transphobes.

ND people can still be ableist.

abuse survivors can still be abusers.

and the list fucking goes on!

because human beliefs and perspectives are as vast and different as there are humans on earth, of course there would be antizionist holocaust survivors! surviving the holocaust doesn't directly dictates your political beliefs on the creation of Israel, it would only greatly influence your desire for, you know, a country where you can defend yourself from future genocides?????

but if you were one of the lucky ones who found a home away from the Shoah and never felt the need for that space, and was then fed thr idea that those who did meed that state are (((evil colonisers))), then yeah, you'd be against it too.

do these people remember that most living holocaust survivors right now were CHILDREN during ww2? because it's been about 80 years since the holocaust happened? and there's still a majority of zionist holocaust survivors.

imagine we were like "look this Palestinian person thinks Israel should take over the Gaza strip and settle in the west bank more! that means all """good""" Palestinians think Palestine shouldn't exist, Palestine shouldn't be free checkmate antizionists :)", when it's very well known the majority of them don't fucking want that and for very good reasons. we point out that some of them are against Hamas, and want peace between Israelis and Palestinians, because that's completely different.

the amount of Jews, Israelis, and ZIONISTS who are against Netanyahu and his shitty government and are pro peace and against some of the IDF's actions is so high we're probably the majority, yet "activists" only highlight the voices of either the far-right zionists or the antizionist borderline antisemitic jews.

tldr: humans have opinions about things due to their life experiences, education, and personal morals. there would be people from every ethnicity with every opinion, even ones that are harmful for their own ethnicity. pointing at these people as a "gotcha" moment for those who actually advocate for peace is tone deaf and shitty.

#antisemitism #antizionist jews #israel #israel palestine #jumblr #jewish #leftist antisemitism #listen to marginalised voices but only if they agree with you :)#asks

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sabottori · 6 months

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This isn't a particularly active blog and I mostly just reblog cute pictures, but I don't want to be silent about what's going on around and in Gaza right now, so here you go. (CW: rape, murder)

If you can defend any of this as somehow justified under the rubric of anti-colonial struggle, or try to say it didn't happen despite all of the evidence, then you aren't a leftist, you aren't an anti-imperialist, you are an antisemite making apologia for rape as well as mass murder, including the killing of children and babies.

You would think it'd be easy to condemn atrocities. But for too many people I consider to be my peers, you have joined in a chorus of whitewashing and support for what happened. And whether you acknowledge it or not, it's because the victims are predominantly Jewish.

And I know some of you are going to say, 'what about Palestinian lives lost' or 'what about what Israel is doing'?

I condemn the actions of the Israeli government in the present as well as in the past leading up to this. I wholeheartedly condemn the Israeli military blocking food, water, and electricity. I condemn their use of white phosphorus. I condemn the far too many Palestinian civilians who have already died in this conflict and previous ones at the hands of the Israeli military. And I condemn the treatment of Palestinians within the region. I support the liberation of the Palestinian people from economic deprivation and oppression, I support them being integrated into a political and legal system that has for far too long discriminated against them, for them to have autonomy in their affairs and to be able to see the safe return home for their refugees abroad.

But I, too, condemn these terrorist attacks. Condemning these atrocities doesn't make you anti-Palestine or anti-Palestinians. Because unlike some, I'm capable of recognizing that a terrorist group does not represent Palestinians as a whole, especially when that group repeatedly use Palestinians as human shields. These were the actions of an evil fringe whose aims and actions can and should be recognized for what they are: genocidal.

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legilimensims · 6 months

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i know i have been *very* vocal about my support of ukraine during the current russian invasion, and pretty much silent about what’s happening in palestine and israel. the reason being: i have ukrainian friends, my mother has ukrainians friends and colleagues, and i feel i am much more educated on the matter to comfortably have a strong opinion and a strong position to defend, no hesitation.

one thing i’ve noticed since october 7th being online most of my time, being a member of community notes on twitter (x…whatever) and fact-checking a hell of a lot of stuff, trying to educate myself, is…how quickly narrative spins. how quickly misinformation spreads. how quickly one nation is labelled the victim, then the aggressor, and vice versa. how quickly and promptly acts of immeasurable, atrocious violence were justified - some sort of perverse “well she was wearing a skirt so she brought it on herself, she deserved it” - and called it “resistance”. how quickly antisemitism escalated (like, don’t even deny this), jews around the world experiencing hate crimes, stuff we thought was left behind after ww2. how quickly palestinians as a whole are called terrorists, and actual terrorist supporters gleefully celebrate beheadings whilst in the comfort of the democratic countries in which they were born in or found refuge. how quickly a country can be accused of fabricating/staging video evidence of atrocities just because of its flag and preexisting hate.

i don’t think i’ve ever witnessed this much hate around the world, it’s…abhorrent. people (again, from the comfort and protection of their democratic, free countries) wishing others to experience pain and suffering and being remembered as murderers for stating an opinion and supporting a specific side? like what. the. hell. we’ve reached a new low as a collective.

i have a lot of opinions, but to comment on the latest happenings i think that the blame of this current escalation solely lies on israeli politicians currently in charge, they were just waiting for the opportunity to level gaza to the ground and no foreign government could’ve done a thing - i saw how fast some are pointing their fingers at the usa especially and, speaking as a staunch biden supporter, i firmly believe that, naively and stupidly, nobody expected that by following international law, the right of defence, the israeli president would commit genocide as a retaliation to a terrorist attack. i expect the usa and the rest of the world’s democratic governments to firmly condemn this.

speaking of, it is also my belief that the perpetrators of the attack against israeli civilians backed by other dictatorial countries, absolutely 100% knew what they were doing. they knew israel would retaliate, and they knew this situation would create disagreements among nations - look at the hate towards biden, only him as usual. somehow the decisions of other countries' presidents are always magically his fault, damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. you just have to thank your gods biden is in the white house right now and not puZZin's puppet the orange tangerine, elections are next year and you have to pray he wins 2024 and not only because he's the best, most succesful president the usa have had in fucking years and yet americans are too stupid and ungrateful to see it; if you are american and are like "nah i'm not voting him because blah blah" you ARE NOT in the position to have a 3rd party candidate, if you don't vote biden you ARE handing the victory to extreme far-right politicians - don't you dare come crying & blame the other side when republicans obliterate your rights, your medicare, your social security, they WILL impose a christian theocracy on you, if biden is not the democratic candidate or if he loses you are fucked. YOU. ARE. FUCKED. and the world's gonna be even more disastrous. i won't hear any arguments on this.

destabilizing and undermining global democracy is the point of the two most prominent current wars and in the end it’s always the innocents who pay the hardest price.

to conclude this world salad…idk. it’s all so overwhelming, and discouraging, and i feel in conflict with myself for “sympathizing” with both sides, to a degree.

i just want people to live in peace.

#pardon my american politics rant i get very passionate about it #i think 95% of my twitter posts and feed are about american politics..it's a hobby #personal #nonsims #saviorhide

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rhaenyras · 6 months

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you know what should really tip you off about israel's cause being oppressive and colonial in nature? the fact that so many fascists and right-wingers in the western world are voicing their support for israel. and that's just a fact. NOBODY but the true left dares to bring into question the legitimacy of israel as a settler colony. liberals and right-wingers alike are all aligned in their shared support of israel and that alone should speak volumes about the real essence of israel as an apartheid oppressive colonial regime. the very same people that 70-80 years ago would have put jewish people in a concentration camp to die in some sad forlorn corner of europe and think nothing of it, nowadays they support israel's right to replicate the very same abomination on another innocent helpless underrepresented persecuted population, every bit as unjustifiably oppressed as the jews were in ww2. like. apparently even being a "nazi" doesn't mean what it used to mean anymore, if fascists and racists worldwide will now side with zionism and what it stands for aka the military clearing of a "Lebensraum" for ethnic jews to live in as a privileged demographic majority at the expense of destitute preexisting populations, that have been since then either murdered or chased away or imprisoned, starved and tortured in many inhumane ways. like. we truly must reconsider what "nazi" means to us in this century, especially in light of the fact that zionists will hurl this name at people who are simply anti-zionism and therefore anti-colonialism. being a nazi used to mean being an antisemitic racist but nowadays the zionists will weaponize the stigma around this word and manipulate the weight it still carries to undermine any act of defiance against the power and methods of an illegitimate settler colony that has been actively practicing ethnic cleansing for over 70 years. this just adds another layer to the ruthless israeli filth machine that never stops exploiting the fresh wounds in our history to get a free pass and commit just about any horror you can think of with it, always in the name of that major persecution that we'll never fully atone for. it's so manipulative and cruel that I'll let you in on a little secret. not only you're shaming and spitting on the graves of the millions of palestinians that israel has killed or persecuted so far already, but you're also disrespecting the victims of the holocaust, who would be ashamed of the manipulation and convenient instrumentalization that israel has done of their own personal tragedies and warnings against the holocaust happening a second time. israel is literally replicating the holocaust victims' worst nightmare and somehow that's normalized and condoned now because history has apparently given israel a free pass to commit endless war crimes without repercussions AND because any disproportionate armed brutality or colonial genocidal agenda can be excused if you claim the overinflated threat of islamic terrorism as your alibi, nevermind that hamas didn't exist yet or that palestine was entirely non belligerent when the israeli occupation started in the aftermath of ww2

#palestine

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swawesome-wow · 7 years

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If you wanted people to be informed, you'd have mentioned Palestinian terrorists and Hamas. You'd have mentioned the suicide bombings and hundreds of murdered innocent Israelis. You'd have mentioned the Palestinian leadership that first declined coexistence in 1948 and rejected every offer of peace since then. You'd have mentioned lies and propaganda and blood libel against Jews, thought in Palestinian schools. You care about playing the victim. But it's an old game. And you'll lose.

I wasn’t going to take the time to respond, but it’s summer break, and I refuse to let you hide behind anonymity and not learn a little something while you’re there.

1. “If you wanted people to be informed, you’d have mentioned Palestinian terrorists and Hamas. You’d have mentioned the suicide bombings and hundreds of murdered innocent Israelis.”

Oh yes, how could I forget to talk about Palestinian terrorists and Hamas. The thousands upon thousands of innocent Israelis killed. Wait, what’s that? 1,213 Israelis have been killed since September 29, 2000. 9,478 Palestinians have been killed since September 29, 2000. I have never claimed that Palestinians have not killed innocent Israelis. Those numbers are only since the year 2000. Israel has occupied Palestine for 50 years, give or take, as you yourself aptly admitted by bringing up the conference in 1948. There is immense loss on both sides, though one has lost nearly 9x as many lives. However, comparing it numerically is extremely reductive, not only are you wrong numerically, you’re ignoring why people have been slaughtered on both sides, and what brought everyone to this point. There is no “justifying” the murder of Israelis by Palestinians, there is only understanding why these killings happened, holistically, and understanding the context.

People refer to it now as the Israeli-Palestinian “Conflict, Divide, etc.” But before recent, heavy political and monetary support of Israel, it was called the Palestinian Genocide, for good reason.

2. “You’d have mentioned the Palestinian leadership that first declined coexistence in 1948 and rejected every offer of peace since then.”

Let me make this very, painfully clear.

Palestine does not owe coexistence to Israel. Israel is an occupying state, an oppressive state, and one that has committed genocide against the Palestinian people.

To bring it down to your level of understanding, the Palestinians were there first. Palestinians of EVERY religion, including Judaism, though I’ll touch on that later. The Palestinian leadership has been lamentable, no one is denying that. But let me put it this way:

Let’s say America was invaded today, by, say, Canada. (Sorry Canada, you were the first country to pop into my head, since I owe half my citizenship to you.) After things calm down enough for the leaders to meet, Trudeau says to *shudder* Trump (or even Obama, in this fake scenario, would make the same decision), “Hey man, I know you were here first and everything, and I know we bloodily invaded you, but like, let’s just coexist, like on that bumper sticker you guys are so fond of.” Do you honestly think the President of the United States of America, would EVER agree to something like that? Seriously? Of course not, that would be ridiculous. Even 50 years later, America would still be fighting for its freedom from its maple-drenched oppressors. So why are you holding Palestine to such ridiculous standards?

I am truly saddened by the violence that has stemmed from this entire situation, but until Israeli soldiers stop wrongfully arresting, imprisoning, and killing Palestinians, even children, I don’t think you can possibly hope for “peace.”

My grandmother, a few years back on a return visit to Palestine after she fled so many years ago to Canada, was stopped at the border wall (yes, there is a wall there, in case people were unaware) for eight hours, for no reason. She was not charged with anything, neither were her daughters, my aunts, that were with her. Her crime was being Palestinian. I wonder what that sounds like.

Oh yes, and because of that wall, the already pitiful economy of the Gaza Strip has crumbled, and they have no way of rebuilding it. Even if Palestinians find jobs in Israel, they’re backed up for hours each day just trying to get processed through the wall in either direction. They’ve been economically choked off from the rest of the world, yet Israel continues to receive monetary aid as if they’re in desperate need.

3. “You’d have mentioned lies and propaganda and blood libel against Jews, thought in Palestinian schools. You care about playing the victim. But it’s an old game. And you’ll lose.”

Once again, I need to make something crystal clear. So listen up. \

Palestinians do not hate Jews. They hate the Israeli government. Not Israelis, not Jews, the Israeli government, because that is the body that is responsible for Palestinian suffering.

Since I was in elementary school, any time someone found out I had Palestinian parents, they immediately made quips or even stated directly that I must hate Jewish people. I had someone say “oh, so you’re anti-Semitic.” I’ve had people ask me if myself or my parents are terrorists (and I used to be Christian, now I don’t practice anything, my point being that I can’t imagine how hard it is for any Muslims). This misconception is so widespread that it’s toxic, killing any reasonable discourse on the subject by people stamping me with the anti-Semite sticker. So, I’m sorry, I haven’t had the chance to play the victim. Let me know how that goes for you.

What I said earlier, about all religions coexisting? Let me elaborate.

For the thousands of years that Palestine has existed, Christians, Muslims, Jews, ~whatever~ lived side by side, happily and comfortably. Another misconception is that the Israeli movement came from within Palestine, which is just plain misinformation. This is a very, very reductive explanation of what actually happened, forgive me for not being more detailed:

When the second World War ended, there were thousands upon thousands of displaced European Jews (mostly German as you might imagine, but elsewhere as well). When Europe (and America) tried to figure out where to help these people relocate, no one wanted to take them in, deciding it would be too difficult to reintegrate. Palestine had the room and the kind heart needed to take them in, so that’s where many were relocated, en masse. But it was a finite time that Palestine agreed to host these refugees as refugees, they would eventually need to either integrate with the Palestinian people (gain citizenship, etc), or decide where they would want to move, if not stay there. But the relationship began to change, as some began to perpetuate the idea that they belonged there all along, and that the Palestinians were the ones that needed to leave or integrate elsewhere. As with most conflict, religion took a match and set it to kerosene, as suddenly Jerusalem was the center of the occupier’s claims to the land. While I won’t try to argue about it as I’m not informed enough on religious history, I will say that it is entirely possible to create a religious homeland without literally invading the country and creating a religious state. Church and state are separate for a reason, and have to cooperate, not override one another.

So there are plenty of Palestinian Jews that understand and are outraged at the Israeli government, though they have been left out of intentional eviction, arrests, torture, and killings.

COMIC RELIEF BREAK that is actually somewhat related but I promise it’s funny:

One time my mom was telling me about something that happened over in Palestine to friends of our family so word made it back to us. Like I said, the three major religions were living pretty happily together, especially where these friends lived. The IDF was evicting all the Palestinians from a neighborhood to allow Israeli settlers to take over. Our friends were one of the families kicked out, and they were best friends with the Jewish family next door! So when the IDF came knocking on the Jewish family’s door to offer them the keys to their best friends’ house, (they were Jews so they were allowed to stay with the new Israelis coming in), the husband of the family was FURIOUS. He started to back-talk, offended at the very thought, but his wife (the really clever one in this story) shut him up and took the keys. The husband couldn’t believe his wife would betray their best friends like that, but she just rolled her eyes in a “you idiot” fashion. They had the keys now, and they promptly gave them back to their best friends so they could reclaim their property! I always thought that story was hilarious :D

While I am disgusted at the thought that you could somehow compare this entire subject to a game, if that’s the only way you can comprehend such a vast discourse, I’m happy to oblige the metaphor: The only “loser” here is the one who can’t think for themselves and hasn’t done a little goddamn research, you soggy walnut.

Speaking of research! Here are a couple of resources for those who have been following along! I honestly can’t say that the second is an unbiased source, however if you’re looking for straight statistics and numbers, check out the first link! It’s where I got the exact numbers I used above. If you want the international law/human rights perspective, check out the third link. Thanks y’all!

http://ifamericaknew.org

http://www.globalresearch.ca/israels-genocide-towards-palestinian-arabs/5591341 (thanks canada)

https://ccrjustice.org/genocide-palestinian-people-international-law-and-human-rights-perspective (really good source explaining the international law and human rights perspective on the issue)

#palestine #israel #palestinian #palestinian genocide #israeli occupation #international law #human rights #anon #swawesome is pissed right off

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