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feekins · 10 months

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kind of a short one today (...I say based only on the amount of pics I took and pages I downloaded for comparison...), so! on to my thoughts and things and whatever translation weirdness I find as I re-read ch 3 of Trigun Maximum vol 2 - the conclusion (maybe) of Vash's battle with roller derby nega-Samurai Jack I MEAN RAI-DEI THE BLADE!!!

(NOTE: I'm reading the Dark Horse [physical] and the Overhaul [online] translations side-by-side)

ok so right off the bat, I noticed that the Overhaul just straight-up doesn't have the first page of this chapter. there's no dead link or anything - it's just that the first page the Overhaul shows is the chapter title with Vash's gun crossing Rai-Dei's sword. here are the 2 pages that come right before that in the Dark Horse translation:

fortunately, y'all reading just the Overhaul aren't missing a lot! no speech bubbles on this "missing" page (on the left). it looks like it's dedicated to setting the scene, I imagine for when this chapter was first printed in Shounen Gahousha - like a little memory refresher of where the last chapter left off, rather than just jumping right in, which I think would've been jarring since the page AFTER the title page is mostly tight close-up shots.

now, our first context-altering translation discrepancy comes after Rai-Dei tells Wolfwood not to interfere with his and Vash's fight. it's a one-word difference, but an important one imo. in Dark Horse, Rai-Dei says this next: "That kind of killing is no longer of interest to me..." whereas in the Overhaul, he says "That kind of easy killing is no longer of interest to me."

(oh and there's discrepancies in what Rai-Dei says to Wolfwood right after that, too, but I don't think they change the context too much. Dark Horse has "You may not feel the same, but...this is a prime opportunity that will not come again." the Overhaul has "You may not see it the same way...but this is a prime opportunity that I will not let pass.")

that one word - "easy killing" - makes this next bit all the more chilling to me:

(Overhaul pictured above - the only difference between it and Dark Horse's translation is that Dark Horse says "taking down" instead of "hunting")

(Dark Horse on top, Overhaul on bottom)

and that leads us to this. little wording differences. the most important ones to me are "chosen by" VS "chosen for" the Gung-Ho Guns and "traded in" VS "gave up" but I'd say that overall, the Overhaul's wording is much more straightforward - which makes that last panel hit harder for me this read-through.

Catholic guilt much, Monsieur Le Wuwu???

Vash's mindset and his knack for reading people here... 🥺

(and maybe I'm being Captain Obvious, but notice how Vash's "one way" isn't to kill - that's not even an option in his mind!!!)

(Dark Horse on left, Overhaul on right)

subtle wording differences here

and I just wanna highlight this whole sequence bc it's the first "arm gun" reveal of Trigun Maximum! it's so awesome...oh, what I'd give to see someone who hasn't read Trigun vol 1-2 react to this for the first time!!

again, subtle wording differences - but I wanted to show both bc, either way, this is such a BADASS panel 😈

here, I was never 100% sure of what was happening due to the way Dark Horse's translation is bound - but in the Overhaul's spread, it's a lot more clear that Vash is catching Rai-Dei just as he's reaching for his blade.

this last panel is exactly the same in either translation and jztgjxjgxckh 🤣🤣🤣

#trigunbookclub #text postan 2k23 #lmao pls don't kill me #the mental image of roller derby nega-Samurai Jack was too funny for me to not share with the class #ilu guise 💕 ty as always for your comments in the tags 💕 I hope y'all are enjoying this week's volume

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hearteyes-for-killmonger · 5 years

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One Night Only 2, Part 4

Dedicated to @muse-of-mbaku it's finally winding down into a conclusion. Word Count: 2,084

Warnings: Softboi!Erik, Smut

Anthony was fed, your lyrics were coming along well, and Anaya was at peace outside.. enjoying the quiet serenity before it was time to leave and hit the recording studio. You really wanted her to see you at work and in your element, vibing with the team. You'd hyped it to the point of getting her excited now you really had to give it 120%. You were confident. The moment of emotional calm in the house should've been enough. Things had cooled down greatly. But you needed more than that. Much more. You craved clarity, closure, and to clear the muggy air between two of your very best friends. The miscommunication couldn't go on forever.

"Corey," you start once he picks up, "We really need to talk about you and Anaya and clear this whole mess up. If your love is real, you owe the relationship at least that much effort bro. Come on."

"Mane, I can talk to you about the shit. I just can't talk to her or look at her 'cause on God I'm a cry on some goofy shit. Nigga heart hurt."

"I get that. You know I do. Think of what you're throwing away if you're wrong about all this though. If she is telling the truth and it's a misunderstanding, where you gonna go from there? She don't trust you now!"

"ME?! I ain't fuckin do none. I ain't cheat not one time. Everyone know I'm in a relationship with her ass and if they don't, I tell em. I been real mothafuckin ass loyal. Still ain't fuckin nobody else bruh. My ass celibate. I'm horny as shit.."

"Ew, nigga, I ain't ask you that. Send me the picture Rasheeda sent you. Also, why you talking to Rasheeda in the first place? Hm?"

"I don't talk to her, she be there when I visit Anaya for lunch. Real cordial."

"Cordial my ass! Corey, she's a conniving bitch. Did you fuck her?"

"Did I fuck h--Did you ignore what the fuck I just said?" You hear him mutter away from the phone, "Got me fucked up.." When his voice comes back, he continues to deny it. "I just told yo deaf ass I ain't fuck noooobody!"

You sigh. You don't know what to think but you feel like he'd admit it if he had. He's too unapologetic and in your face to lie about something he did or didn't do. Way too much pride. He reminds you a lot of Erik in that way and you can see why they're cool. They're too similar not to be. A lightbulb flashes in your mind and you rush Corey off the phone reminding him to forward you the incriminating image. Immediately, you speed-text Erik.

Y/N: Whenever you get back I need a favor. It involves Corey and Anaya

It's about two minutes before he responds.

Erik: Ok

Erik: Speaking of

Your phone rings and it's his name on the screen which triggers your smile like you've been conditioned. "Baaabe," you sing happy to get even just a little of his time.

"Don't babe me. You out here acting up, twerking in random restaurants? Where was the energy this morning when I wanted some?" You sigh fighting the smile still tugging at your lips. He'd seen the video. It still shocks you how fast things spread.

"That's okay though," he continues calmly, "I'm glad you had fun.. all ratchet and shit. It's cute. Keep that same energy and be in the bedroom at 6. I want you naked and in position, no lingerie.. Naked."

"I'm supposed to be going to the studio to record," you remind him, laughing inside. You knew he would be like this when you left him this morning.

"Well then go to the studio, lil girl. I'll fuck you in the booth, I don't give a fuck," he says as if discussing dinner plans. His chill was enviable.

"Don't threaten me with a good time," you grin.

"Oh you bold. Okay, babygirl." He hangs up abruptly and you stare at the phone thinking about the check you just wrote... On second thought. You were kind of running your mouth, you weren't serious. Your team at the studio watching you get railed would be awkward. You'd have to ask them to step out then continue the session after like nothing happened. Shuffling to the deck, you find Anaya looking at the sky.

"Um," you grin awkwardly when she looks at you. "Would you be disappointed if we didn't hit the studio just yet?" She gapes and pouts, visibly disappointed.

"Come on, Y/N. You got me hyped to see a live recording session. Come through Cali hoe!"

Groaning, you shift on your feet. Cali Hoe. That would make a good song title. Tally ho, Cali hoe. "Anaya.. Girl.. You don't understand," you snicker.

"So explain it to me."

You sigh humored, "Erik... is threatening sex in the booth if I go in today."

There's a sputtering chuckle to the side at your expense and you nod sarcastically. You shouldn't have told her. "What's up with this negro and public escapades? Always doing something. Just wild for no reason.." she pauses before adopting a devilish grin. "Nahhh bitch, you going," she says looking you up and down. "I'm thoroughly in need of some entertainment and this is perfect."

"I don't think you understand," you laugh anxiously.

"No, it's very simple. Do you want that wild and reckless unpredictability you fell in love with or nah? He's been consistent. Be happy he's still the same person to you all this time later..," she pauses and you know Corey is still heavy in her thoughts. He was a part of her at this point that she couldn't shake off or detach from. "..And you know you love it! So don't think so much," she says with eyes as earnest as a child's. There was so much passion and care in her voice. It drops an octave as she stares at you. "Do you wanna get fucked at home, missionary with the lights out in your bedroom for the next however many years... or do you wanna get your guts jammed in that recording booth?"

"BRUH," you yell. Missionary with the lights off isn't even in your nigga's vocabulary.

"Judging by that balcony sex tape--"

"HUSH! ...DAMN!" You get the point though and the correlation. "Fine," you sigh. "This one's for you... Recording booth it is."

---

"I think this is working so far. I like it, but run that last part back. I need to change the speed of the rhythm.. right here just a bit.. slow it down to fit my flow when I transition. It kinda jumps. Can we mix in a little something so that--"

"I got you," your producer says, immediately moving to tweak the sound. "I does this.. I got you." He knows your style choices by now and your sound. He's also very patient because you know what you want.

"Yeah, and then I'll go in and record the accents." You look at Anaya and wave her over. She's been feeling it so far so you put her in the booth and make her sing through a backing track. Her voice sounds amazing layered under yours and you feel like a musical virtuoso. A firm hand squeezing your asscheek makes you jump a little, developing a crazy look in your eye because how dare any crusty person in this booth touch you, but then you look and it's just Erik. He grips you up against his chest and as his lips smile into your neck, his hand works its way quickly into your panties.

"Wait," you whisper frantically, looking around. He's got everyone staring. You know it. You try to move, but he won't let you and he won't remove his damned hand from inside your panties. You look down and you can see the bulge in your pants moving around. It's super obvious and blatant. You kiss your teeth and he chuckles into your neck.

"You ain't mad, you wet... Talking all that shit," he whispers so only you hear. You are wet and incredibly horny, but the close-up audience is too much. You can look in everyone's eyes and it makes you nervous. His fingers climb inside of you causing you to clench as Anaya tries to contain the humor in her expression. You roll your eyes to camouflage your arousal, also ready to slap your producer for his wandering eye on your zipper. As your song plays forgotten in the background, Erik snickers silently, thoroughly entertained with himself, "I told you. You forget I let you think you're in control.. Who's in charge?"

"...You are," you whisper, distracted by this breath on your ear and neck. He's rubbing you down below and it sends a chill through you.

"And who am I? Put some base in your voice." He's going all out today. You shake your head and he bites your ear. "Say it."

"Daddy," you blurt.

"Show over. Everyone get the fuck out," he yells and people bounce immediately, Anaya being the last and walking out slowly. His fingers leave you and you yank your body away raring to light into him but he snatches you back by your arm and throws you over the equipment.

"ERIK! You better PRAY you d-didn't mess anything up," you stutter.

"I don't give a fuck." He yanks down your clothes and grips your hair firmly in his fist bringing your head back as he pushes slowly into your entrance, his lips at your ear. "You know what to do. Turn up."

It felt too good not to. Relenting to the feeling, you throw it back, working him as he tugs roughly on your hair. Without warning, he begins crashing into you and your legs buckle. Pressing his hand into your back, he proceeds to drive his hips into you. You've long been ruined for other dick. An image of a hotdog in a hallway comes to mind. "You better.. not.. ever die," you grunt through his thrusts.

"Fuck you talking bout?"

"Where.. I'm a find.. dick, uhh.. like thiss," you hiss. He collapses on top of you, his heavy body bouncing in wheezing laughter. "I'm serious," you breathe.

Once you're put back together, he checks you out to make sure you're presentable and invites the team back into the studio. They run through the song one more time with all of the improvements as if nothing had happened and he grabs your cheeks in one hand, smacking a loud kiss on your lips. "Good job," he says.

---

In your bedroom, he's changing into his dark grey workout gear on his way back out to meet his trainer. You know better than to stand between him and his workout session because his image is part of his fame and his money, but you have to talk to him.

"Hey Erik?"

"Sup," he says lifting from the bed and shifting you out of his path, "I gotta go baby."

"I know. Just wanted to tell you, I fired Raven. She was negligent toward Anthony and I caught her in here trying on my clothes. Then she wouldn't leave immediately, it was weird. Corey and Anaya are going through a potential breakup because he thinks she's cheating and she swears she isn't. She's basically been taking care of the baby alone and I feel like I have to fix it. Also, I still don't know who leaked my number because if it wasn't Armont, then who was it?"

He drops back onto the bed rubbing his face. Pulling out his phone, he makes a call and you stare at him confused.

"Yeah, Pers.. I can't make it today...."

"NO, I didn't mean--" you shake your head silently pantomiming for him to hang up and go ahead. You didn't mean for him to drop everything and handle it right on the spot. You just needed to vent and wanted him to know what was going on.

"Yeah, I know. I'll work out from here and meet you tomorrow.... Sumo squats, back squats, leg curls, and lunges.... and the treadmill, yep... aight."

Gaping, you stare in regret, but he stands slowly to hug you with seemingly no hard feelings.

"Fix your face. Don't feel bad, you're more important than my workout. I got a whole home gym, I can workout at home. You obviously need me right now."

@thehomierobbstark @wakanda-inspired @hidden-treasures21 @myboyfriendgiriboy @bubbly-nammu @killmvnger @phoenixxx1225 @ineffabl-y @supersizemeplz @magic-madness-heavensin @loosewindmill @purplehairgawdess @indigoxsummers @wawakanda-btch @ange-sensuel @princessstevens @whoramilaje @allhailnjadaka @amethyst1993 @marvelpotterlove @bakarisangel @almostpurelysmut @vikkidc @inlovewithmakeupcomicsanimelove @panthergoddessbast @mermaidchansons @destinio1 @trevantesbrat @scrumptiouslytenaciouscrusade @siriuslycollins @heyauntieeee @lovemekaycee @radi0active-thoughts @drsunshine97 @blackpantherismyish @tgigoldie @imaginewhoever @ash-moneyy @texasbama @thadelightfulone

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sagebodisattva · 5 years

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Epistemological Nihilism

So, next up on our explorative journey through the many forms of nihilism, we encounter epistemological nihilism. What is epistemological nihilism?

Epistemological nihilism is a form of skepticism in which all knowledge is accepted as possibly untrue or unable to be known.

And right away, you can be sure that this form of nihilism, perhaps more then any other, will make people agitated and uncomfortable. Why? Because people like certainty. People don't like the idea of not having their feet planted firmly on the ground. It helps solidify and highlight people's attachments to the known. It's a grounding stake, and a security blanket. A pacifier to help the desperate self sooth in the face of unfathomable universal mystery. It's the urge to seek the feeling of being in control, and to wield power and command by way of authoritative disambiguation, and dogmatic absolutism. This is what happens when knowledge becomes used and abused as a paraphernalia for the indulgences of certainty, safety and security.

Well, sorry Charlie. All the knowledge in the entire world compiled together into one great big expansive eclectic collection of complex intellectual understanding, is all still but a small rickety raft floating adrift, alone in the deep vast ocean of the great unknown, which is even further overshadowed by the profound and ineffable unknowable. Just as long as we keep in mind that any and all knowledge acquired only applies to the context of the little raft in the mighty sea, even, of which, is subject to constant debate, change, and perceptual reframing; then we are being more intellectually honest with ourselves. And even if there are certain truths established that could be called universal, or that have 100% consensus among all sentient life, this too is still only confined to the parameters of the little raft.

And this is why even true knowledge is untrue, because it is only true knowledge relative to the confines of a framework; even if such framework is the only framework that one has a frame of reference in, it is still only a framework nonetheless; and hence, the true knowledge is only applicable to these borders.

And this is also why even true knowledge cannot rightfully be said to be really known to be ultimately true, for one cannot say such for certain until they have made an assessment from the widest frame of reference possible, which may not even be reachable from the an individual perspective.

And also, let us not forget that, on top of all of this, and this is the sweet kicker, even the seemingly certain conclusion of uncertainty is also uncertain.

“But why?! That can't be. We already know everything there is to know about what we are and where we came from! Of course we can be certain!”

Really? C'mon now man. Really? You are looking at phenomenal content through the lens of externalizing colored glasses, and you actually think you stand some kind of chance at coming to some finalized conclusion based on your efforts of sifting through layers of appearances? All of this came from nothing; and you think you know something? This entire universe is just a grain of sand on a vast beach, and you think you have some kind of grasp of what's going on here? Well, the first thing you must come to understand, in order to understand that you really don't understand very much of anything; you are not dealing with things as they really are, but are only dealing with an appearances of things.

“How's that?”

I said, you are not dealing with things as they really are, but are really only dealing with an appearance of things. This is the minimum of what you can say you know with your acquired knowledge, if you have treated knowledge properly and examined the knowledge and the implications of the knowledge from all angles, including metaphysically. Obviously, things are not quite as they appear on the surface. If the insights of material science has shown us anything, it has shown us this. Materials are really just an assemblage of subatomic particles, which, in turn, are really just an assemblage of energy, which, in turn, is really just an assemblage of nothingness. So what knowledge to do you have, beyond a narrow sliver of information that just deals with the surface appearance?

The very senses, what we use to try to comprehend and organize our knowledge, don't even covey an accurate representation of what is actually there. What you supposedly “see”, only becomes a visual object by way of an eyeball converting energetic configurations into an apparent spatial manifestation. Same goes with what you hear, smell, taste, and touch. What you end up with, is merely an appearance of something that has much deeper hidden properties; the bottom, of which, we have not yet fully explored to understand; and yet you believe you are certain about something that is being brought to your attention via the perceptual senses? To believe as such is called naive realism. But don't misconstrue and jump to the conclusion that any of these statements are meaning to say that there is a complete impossibility of any knowledge; that isn't the point being emphasized here, but, rather, that knowledge is possible, but it is always relative, subjective, and contextual. And why is that? Well, let's look into it.

First, why relative? Well, if there would be anything considered an absolute aspect, then obviously it must be an aspect that differs from a relative aspect. If an absolute aspect isn't different then a relative aspect, then it is the same as a relative aspect, and hence relative. But if an absolute aspect is different from a relative aspect, then the absolute aspect must also be relative, for, any aspects that are different must be different in contrast to something else, and to be considered "different", means that the said aspect has to be relative to something. So there's no way around relativity. Simply put, a fact is only a fact relative to a context. And since a context has borders, anything absolute within those borders has no applicability outside the borders. And even if you wanna try and break down those borders and say they don't exist and that absolute aspects exist in infinity, you are gonna run into similar problems, for then where is infinity located? Anything that has no location surely cannot exist as we commonly know and define objectified existence. Facts surely have to have a solid context to be recognized, and to say that facts are absolute, yet have no location, which would seem to be a fundamental requirement for an object to exist, is still indicative of facts and absolutism being relative to infinity, despite its borderless configuration. But even if you chalk that up to an intentional oversight, wherein is this infinity even being recognized as an item of consideration? Ah yes. It is infinity relative to a subject. Which brings us to the second factor to look into: subjectivity.

Why subjective? Well, knowledge is only knowledge as it pertains to a subject, by both meanings of the word subject. By means of both the specific topic, and to the one who is considering the topic of knowledge. Indeed, knowledge cannot even have any meaningful existence without an existential agency to provide a foundation of such. And any such various agencies are full of their own unique perspectives regarding the information, with different degrees of perception and reasoning, which will vary from person to person, culture to culture, psychology to psychology, and position to position. And even when considering facts that subjects agree are facts, opinions and feelings about the implications of the facts can vary. Because subject A is depressed and pessimistic, he concludes that the fact that there is famine and poverty in the world means humanity should just set off a nuclear bomb and put an end to the misery, whereas be used subject B is happy and optimistic, he concludes that the fact that there is famine and poverty in the world means humanity needs to take active steps towards treating and curing these negative states. Who is right and who is wrong? Or are they both right, or both wrong? It depends on who you ask. This is the nature of subjectivity. A fact alone, which cannot be recognized without a subject, does not carry any inherent prescript concerning its handling, that is not also based in subjectivity. Even absolute laws or universal truths, if such a thing were even possible, are only so relative to a subject. So there's no way around subjectivity either. And lastly, of course, all knowledge is contextual.

So why contextual? Well, this is closely related to relativity and subjectivity, in that knowledge, or facts, or laws, or anything else, cannot be featured as such unless they have some kind of framework to sustain them. And just by being contextualized, they are limited to the settings of such contextualizations. So, this being the case, knowledge, at best, is an island. It is not all encompassing. It's utility is facilitated existentially, and not otherwise. And we can use knowledge existentially for communication, creativity and exploration, but there's no reason to try and seek certainty, unless our goals are really to try and pin down reality and control it. To try and pour concrete over an abstract medium. And I know why many of you want to do this, for we see a lot of negativity in our reality and often our impulses motivate us to try and fix it, or clean it up, but understand that messes and broken aspects are originally caused by this very same impulse and motivation: The desire to attach. The desire to attach. The desire to attach. The insatiable craving to want to control circumstances, to be either grasped at and sustained, or to be pushed away and avoided. And this is the primary reason people want certainty. Not really so much because they want knowledge, but because certainty deludes one into thinking they can control circumstances to fulfill their desires. But that's all it is, a delusion.

In all honesty you don't really know jack shit. You cannot be certain of anything. I know this is maddening. I know this is outrageous to the sensibilities of the average modern thinking mind, but it's the raw reality. Yet, this nagging intellectual irritant doesn't necessarily have to be as such. Again, this relates to the default conditioning of the persona, which fosters the tendency to seek familiarity, comfort and stability, aka attachments, which really only weaken and disempower us, for all of this really only fortifies the borders, which, in turn, crystallizes the margins into the towering walls of a self imposed prison. Is this where we really want to be? In the adventure of life, is not our eternal quest to explore, question and observe? And are these activities not the whole point of the trip?

We've often heard it said before, that life is a journey and not a destination, and that the spiritual path is the path itself, and not a matter of reaching anywhere. So the question then becomes: why are you not ok with this? What are your priorities and where did these priorities originate from? Are these inclinations your own, or were they just instilled in you by other people who wanted to shape and mold you to their own instilled standards? If you are here to make the most out of your existential exploration, then stop looking for outside approval, and stop looking externally for power and authority. You are not going to find existential truth in the libraries or in the hierarchies. You don't have to feel the need to emulate and identify with an archetype that you think reflects your self image. You will have not accomplished anything by finding some knowledge, or scripture, or philosophical ideology, and then preaching it atop a soap box, wagging your finger at the uninformed, using guilt as a weapon of conformity.

Take it easy, relax. Let go of the need to bend others to a purpose. Whenever we see an ideologue or a theologian who is adamantly imploring us to accept some kind of knowledge or world narrative as an irrefutable truth, it is always more indicative of a troubled psychology, then of a sound philosophy. You seem to be aware of an experience of phenomena. Beyond that, it's all narrative; of which, is then called knowledge.

#epistemology #nihilism

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uncloseted · 5 years

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1. I don't have a degree in psychology, but I have written a 4000 word essay about sociopathy a while back in high school (for the IB), and I used legitimate studies as much as possible from NCBI. And I know that making assumptions about someone's mental health is wrong, but I did once meet one who does meet the symptoms quiet closely. With that being said, "let's just jump into it!"

Anonymous said to effys-closet: 2. First of all, I did feel like Kati's handling of sociopathy was unprofessional. And more so her response to the backlash. She has had credentials, maybe she did cover ASPD briefly but she wasn't qualified in Abnormal Psychology to comment on it. I mean, neither am I, but let's move on. I know that sociopathy isn't a term used for diagnosis, people are diagnosed with ASPD, but I have seen a thing called Hare's Psychopathy Checklist, which does determine whether someone is a psychopath or not. Anonymous said to effys-closet: 3. Most people use the terms psychopath and sociopath interchangeably. Others however think that there is a difference, psychopaths are the ones who are cooler, calmer and more meticulous in their planning, whereas sociopaths can get angry easily and act more impulsively. There is also a thing going around that psychopaths are "born" whereas sociopaths are "made". My essay was based around how much of it is genetic and environmental, and like most things in psychology, it is both. Anonymous said to effys-closet: 4. That being said, it is absolutely possible for cases to be more genetic based or more environmental based, and that is what people would like to differentiate between psychopath and sociopath. Psychopathy and sociopathy fall under the umbrella of ASPD, and until now I used to feel like they were virtually the same thing, but there are people saying that it is still possible for ASPD people to have emotions and empathy and can be cured, idk about that, I personally doubt the cure claim. Anonymous said to effys-closet: 5. The reason being, that people with ASPD have huge underdevelopments in their brains, caused genetically and/or cuz of shitty childhood, and that leaves them with huge deficits in grey matter. I think at reaching adulthood these gaps can't be regrown or filled, cuz there are certain brain developments that only happen in childhood. Compare it with the effects of depression where that does affect the brain but once you're cured of depression you can still reverse those effects. Anonymous said to effys-closet: 6. I think in the case of the Paul brothers, the main person is Greg Paul. You didn't watch the rest of the series, but basically at one point Shane drops the sociopath label and works with Jake to talk about his problems, meaning the thing with Alissa, the Martinez Twins, and all of the complaints people have had against him. He also talks to the people that have beef with him. In the end it's concluded by most people watching that he isn't a sociopath, but more emotionally stunted, cuz of Greg Anonymous said to effys-closet: 7. Jake and Logan's parents were divorced early on, and they had to live with their mom and dad interchangeably from time to time. Their dad had them play football, turn tires and basically attempt to make them "tough" men. From the very beginning they were taught that you shouldn't show your emotions cuz that makes you weak. Even today Greg is pretty controlling of Jake's whole team 10 thing. Jake hasn't been taught how to deal with emotions from the very beginning. He has never known what is Anonymous said to effys-closet: 8. right and wrong, he has always made offensive jokes around his friends and has never known the line. This is why the Martinez Twins felt bullied while he didn't even realise it. His relationship with Erika is currently nice, she seems to be a stabilising force in his life, and is a good influence for him. With her he can be vulnerable, and he trusts her. The reason why it was so hard for him is cuz his trust has been broken time and time again. In Shane's series it seems he wants to change. Anonymous said to effys-closet: 9. I recommend you finish the series cuz it gets better from the one episode with Kati. Now, in the case with Logan, it seems different. I read a book called Confessions of a Sociopath, written by an actual sociopath using a pseudonym. She has several siblings, one of who was a "weak" brother according to her. She had abusive parents, and he was emotionally scarred by it whereas she was indifferent, she never cried during her lashes, occasionally her and her siblings beat the weak brother. Anonymous said to effys-closet: 10. My point is that it is possible for people to have the same parenting (or lack there of) and turn out completely different. One ends up a sociopath the other doesn't. This is probably where the genetics thing comes to play, cuz one sibling has more of a tendency to become a sociopath than the other genetically. When Alissa talked to Shane about how she once slept with Logan, she recalls how he was completely indifferent to betraying his brother, in fact he was proud of it, saying... Anonymous said to effys-closet: 11. "I'm a maverick, I'm savage". He didn't give a damn about breaking his brother's trust. When Alissa came on a song with him and said she didn't want it to be uploaded later, he said that she signed the contract so she can't get out of it, and he will upload it anyway. The suicide forest video, the way he treated the tasered rat and took a fish out of water to give CPR, he threw a prank on his fans of him being shot in his house, with fake blood and everything. Ik we're not supposed to assume Anonymous said to effys-closet: 12. but my brain can't help but reach to the conclusion that Logan is the sociopath, or has ASPD. There's also a thing called conduct disorder, which applies to kids and teens, basically the symptoms include manipulative behaviour, rage, impulsiveness, similar to sociopathy, but not necessarily. Kids with conduct disorder can have other disorders when they grow up, they don't have to have a lack of empathy, they can have ADHD. But diagnostically, in the US, you can only be diagnosed with ASPD if Anonymous said to effys-closet: 13. they have a diagnosis of conduct disorder in childhood. That's not necessary in Europe. So, a sociopath could not be diagnosed with ASPD in Europe, move to America and not be diagnosed with ASPD in adulthood, cuz they don't have a conduct disorder diagnosis. Now, about the whole controversy of kati vilifying sociopathy, I kinda disagree with most people. I do think that the whole idea of sociopaths being all serial killers needs to be debunked, most sociopaths actually function in society. Anonymous said to effys-closet: 14. Psychopaths even do well in business and politics cuz they have the manipulation skills, and the willingness to exploit. I myself have had issues with mental health, I hate the stigma, but to say that "not all sociopaths and ASPD people are bad" kind of goes against the definition. I have even seen someone say that some sociopaths they've met want to cure themselves and one had even succeeded. Well, again I doubt the cure claim cuz it's a significant amount of brain damage to be reversed... Anonymous said to effys-closet: 15. And also, why would you want to get cured if you're a sociopath? They tend to see emotions and empathy as a weakness, and they get the most ahead with their manipulation in life, they have fun in exploiting people. Why would they wanna cure themselves? Now, I do feel some empathy for sociopaths cuz it's not their fault they are the way they are, but still, they are bad people, why would we wanna be around them and have things to lose? Again, I do still feel Kati's approach was unprofessional Anonymous said to effys-closet: 16. But I'm just not on board with the whole mental health stigma thing being applied to sociopaths. I don't want there to be a stigma that all sociopaths are criminals or serial killers, but if the key of sociopathy is to lack empathy, and if you do have empathy then you're not a sociopath. That being said, I'm in no way an expert, I took psych in high school, and am in my 2nd gap year with no direction in life. I wrote an essay and that's where my credentials end. That's it from me. Bye!

Okay so this is maybe the longest ask I’ve ever gotten which is super exciting for me. But also bear with me if my answer is a bit disjointed to try and respond to it all.

Before I get into the meat of my answer, I think I should say two things. First, I really don’t care all that much about this series or about Jake Paul. I’m happy to answer questions about it but I think the entire thing boils down to nonsense and we shouldn’t be giving Jake Paul our attention.

I also think this entire conversation is the blind leading the blind. You with your 4000 word essay one time in high school, me with my master’s degree, Kati Morton with her MFT degree… none of us are really qualified to talk about this since we don’t work in the field of ASPD research, diagnosis, or treatment. So I don’t know how productive this conversation can really be. Like much of medicine and especially psychiatry, the research moves so quickly that what we thought was true two months ago may not be true now, and so it becomes a lot of “well in my understanding…” and “when I researched this once…” instead of people who can really make definitive statements about this topic. A lot of the conversation around this has been based on pop-psychology, and I think that benefits no one. I’ve been doing my best to correct those pop-psychology misconceptions about ASPD on here, but my knowledge is really limited in this area.

Like I said in my response when we talked about this before, sociopathy and psychopathy are not diagnosable conditions and so using them as terms is functionally useless because there’s no agreed-upon criteria for what those words actually mean. ASPD is a clinically separate diagnosis and takes a more nuanced approach to the types of behaviors that one sees in so-called psychopaths and sociopaths. The Hare’s checklist exists, and that’s about all you can say for it. There’s a lot of criticism around its usage and again, it’s been rejected by the psychiatric community as a whole and isn’t really used clinically, so it can’t be considered a consensus for how we define “psychopathy”. The checklist sometimes used in prisons in the US to try and assess how likely it is for a felon to reoffend, but if you know anything about the US prison system, you’ll know it’s not really up to date with the latest and greatest in medical science. And even within the prison community, it’s efficacy is being questioned.

There are distinctions that people have made between “psychopaths” and “sociopaths”, but again, those words don’t really mean anything from a clinical standpoint and so any distinctions or definitions people assign to them are useless from a practical standpoint because there’s no agreed upon definition for those words. There isn’t really research focused on those terms and so to draw distinctions like “one is born and the other is made” is, in my opinion, silly. There is ASPD and the research behind it, and as we learn more about ASPD we learn about the genetic basis for it and how environment impacts peoples’ likelihood of developing it.

As with many things, ASPD is a spectrum. It has come out through the research that some people with ASPD do indeed have empathy and emotions, others respond to treatment, and others don’t seem to exhibit empathy, emotions, or respond to intervention. Many neurological, biological, and psychiatric conditions are like that, so I’m not surprised that it’s like that in this case as well. Depending on the severity of the case, people with ASPD may not have the ability to recover. Depression is similar; in mild to moderate depression, you can sometimes see reversal of neurological changes, but in severe depression, those neurological changes are permanent to the brain structure.

It is not true that a diagnosis of ASPD requires a diagnosis of conduct disorder in childhood. It requires that the individual have exhibited conduct problems by the age of 15, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that all individuals with ASPD were diagnosed with Conduct Disorder or vice versa. Conduct Disorder is a diagnosable condition with its own set of criteria; “conduct problems” is a generalized symptom. Statistics are hard to come by, but it seems that only 25-40% of children with conduct disorder are later diagnosed with ASPD.The idea that “psychopaths do well in business” is pop psychology more than anything else, but I think it’s correct that not all people with ASPD are bad. They’re people who were predisposed to an illness who had the bad luck of being put in an environment that brought it out in them. I think there’s a limit to how culpable they are, and I think that some people with ASPD do realize that there’s something wrong and seek treatment. The idea that “some sociopaths want to cure themselves and one even succeeded!” is again pop psychology and taking a very un-nuanced approach to the disorder. ASPD is a spectrum. It’s not as cut and dry as “no emotions/empathy” or “emotions!”, and that’s not part of the clinical criteria for having ASPD. In fact, criteria that included remorse, guilt, or empathy have been removed from the DSM in the fifth edition because it was felt that that criteria was too subjective; now it focuses primarily on observable behaviors. Some patients do find ways to lessen the severity of their symptoms. Because it’s a small population to begin with and many of the population who are studied are in prison, it’s hard to make generalizations about what percentage of the population with ASPD that might be, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.

As far as the Jake Paul series goes, I didn’t watch the rest of the series and I don’t plan to. As I said before, I’m uninterested in the Paul brothers and don’t think they deserve my time or attention. I think it does sound likely that Jake’s upbringing and environment contributed to making him who he is today. But that is true for everyone, and true for people who grew up in much worse situations than he did. The divorce of parents and being forced to play football and encouraged to be “more of a man” is not exactly trauma inducing for the average person. It seems that there are genetic factors involved in ASPD and other psychiatric diagnoses, so it makes sense that some people in a particular environment develop psychiatric conditions and others do not. But that ultimately doesn’t excuse his behavior nor does it make him a particularly sympathetic character in my eyes. There is always an opportunity for people to seek help and better themselves, and he seems profoundly uninterested in doing either.

TL;DR: The terms “psychopath” and “sociopath” are functionally useless and we should stop using them, and everyone who doesn’t know what they’re talking about (myself included) should stop feeding this discussion.

#Anonymous

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