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systematicallycapricious · 3 months

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Ultimax English Volume 3, coming hot at'cha from me, who did the read-y thing!

Gonna repeat it for the folks who might be landing here for the first time: I've written up my initial impressions and observations below the cut, as well as sprinkled in some pictures comparing the three versions of the manga (OG-Jap, official-Eng translation, and fan-Eng translation). And if you don't see something there that you'd like to know more about, you can always hit me up with requests and I'll see what I can do for ya!

Oh– and of course, spoilers are no holds barred. So if you want to read the manga blind, then this is not the review post for you. Nor are my other ones.

So without further ado... The post!

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Main Opinions (5)

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[1]

Like the volumes before it, I continue to both agree and disagree with the various translation choices. Using the page above as an example: I think that translating 道化 as “cabbage cop” rather than the literal meaning of “jester/clown”, especially after using the latter translation before in Vol 1, wasn't the best choice. On the flipside, I think that choosing to retain the presence of the “俺が...!” by including “I still...!” in the translation was a good call, because the specific ways that characters speak are a quintessential window into who they are as people.

(Re: "cabbage cop"; the translation also just suddenly spikes in referring to Adachi as “cabbage” in the aforementioned chapter and the one immediately following it, lol. Sho says “I wanted to help even a loser like you have a good time... So I went outta my way... to keep your lame... cabbage ass alive...”, though nothing in the Jap text even makes mention of “cabbage”, much less Adachi's ring title.)

[2]

Though I don't think I mentioned it in my previous posts, I also retain my opinion that the onomatopoeia in this translation is on point. Much like the original Japanese version, the chosen sounds make sense for the actions they're supposed to be accompanying. And this has been consistent throughout all volumes, rather than having ups and downs of quality... at least from what I can recall.

[3]

However, in reading this volume, I have come across my first genuine critique of the translation: in all the volumes thus far, quotation marks that should be carried over from the Japanese text are often ignored, to the immense detriment of the English reading experience. Fortunately, this problem hasn't extended to text emphasis (e.g. bolded text and bōten) or the rest of the punctuation, as they have been relatively good at preserving and employing those. But, to exemplify what the lack of quotations does to the text...

...just read through the side-by-side page examples I edited above. The difference should be apparent, hopefully. (Btw, edits are in the middle and on the bottom, respectively. Jap text is also included for quotation placement reference.)

The thing that baffles me about the lack of quotations, though, is that the translation does use them on rare occasion. For example, when Minazuki says “Welcome to 'his' world.”, and “Oh yes. You call those shackles 'bonds', don't you.”, those quotations exist in the Japanese text as 「“彼”」 and 「”絆”」. But in the vast majority of cases, even sometimes when the usage in Japanese is back-to-back, they're just kinda... glossed over? I really don't get it. ^^;

[4]

Moving on to a semi-related topic... The 皆月・ミナヅキ naming differentiation... uh... yeah. That's a weird thing. The simple part is that both are continuously referred to as “Minazuki”. The weird part is that the translation seems to want to refer to them as a "single but plural" entity? For example;

“I sat back and let Minazuki do their thing and they just wasted time forever.”

“There's much to sympathize with in their past. And they're clearly a victim of the Kirijo Group's darker side.”

"But we're gonna get back at that jerk. Both of 'im!".

"We can't let Minazuki get what they want! Stop 'em, Narukami!"

Which, in all fairness, the Japanese version is partially responsible for. Since [plural nouns are implied more than said outright in Japanese], and there are some occasions of 「皆月達」 (Minazuki-tachi; look under "Plural Suffixes" in the linked article) interspersed within the writing, I can understand how the "single but plural entity" translation came about. I'm not knowledgeable enough to know if interpreting just "皆月" as plural is always correct or not, but I can see why it might be tricky to interpret, at the very least.

So personally, my gripe with it is just the lack of distinction between instances of ミナヅキ and 皆月, as when which one is used is extremely important for story context. The characters awkwardly referring to Sho and Minazuki as singular but plural (in a purely-Eng reading) seems logical enough, since none of them have experience with plurality up until this point, and it's not like they're getting the opportunity to ask the system in question what form of address they prefer.

[5]

Oh, and while we're within the topic of “things that could be better off if a guide of important pre-established terms was implemented”...

Y'all might think “holy heck, why did they turn Minazuki's edge factor up to 11 here?” with a slow cringe of disturbance or disgust. (Or maybe the laughter of vicious mockery. What do I know? Lol.) I concur! So I did what I do when I'm confounded by something: question everything about it. In doing so, I thought to myself; 'Hey, isn't that "hero" one one of Minazuki's VLs from Ultimax?' The answer was yes, it was, although it goes slightly differently. And what had the manga done back in previous volumes? Quote combat-VLs from the game during battle scenes.

So after transcribing the Japanese text of the lines in question into Jisho and Google Translate, as well as listening to the Jap versions of the EngVLs that I thought were similar enough, this is what I got:

“Writhe in pain!” = “Struggle. Suffer.” (「もがき　苦しめ」, [VL nb315a])

“Did you think you could become a hero?” = “Did you think you were some kind of hero? No. You're just the loser.” (「（君は敗者だ）英雄になれるとでも思ったか?」, VL nb342b)

(Note: The “No. You're just the loser.（君は敗者だ）” portion isn't a part of the VL in Ultimax, and aside from Adachi's Winner's Interview line for defeating Minazuki, I couldn't find anything similar in any of Mina's non-Story Mode Eng VLs. (I didn't check their Jap equivalents, as I still need to compile those lines into a searchable resource. >_>) So unless it's somewhere in Story Mode, it may have been ad-libbed in by the author.

“Let despair swallow you.” is less cut-and-dry. The Japanese text is 「絶望へ堕ちろ」; but when I listened to similar VLs (nb313a: “It's time to despair.”, nb317a: “Fall into darkness!”, nb320a: “Descend into the abyss!”), I only ever got partial matches. Nb313a has 「絶望」, while nb320a might have 「堕ちろ」, but my auditory comprehension of Japanese still needs a lot of work, so I may be mistaken. And nb317a matched nothing, from what I can hear. So unless this comes from a story VL, or a VL that isn't translated closely enough for me to sleuth back to the Jap VL... then I guess this might also be ad-libbed or frankensteined by the author?

Also, I'm not sure if it's coincidence or if there actually was some knowledge of the pre-existing translations, but the translator got “God and Demon Annihilation” correct, lol.

So yeah. "Edginess"? Not really more than normal when you have the context; but as a standalone experience, a great deal more than normal and would have realllllllly benefited from referencing the pre-established translations. The translator can take stylistic liberties with the whole rest of the translation, so I really don't think that employing such a small list would compromise their freedom?

(And if you want to see how the fan-Eng version handled it for comparison...)

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Additional Thoughts (6)

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Alright, let's see, what else do I have left to cover...

[1]

Labrys doesn't talk a ton in this manga, so her “Southern, not Brooklyn/Boston accent” issue, while still there, isn't too glaring or easy to spot in a lot of lines. However... Honestly, I think it's just the translator's style overall to use a more 'Southern USA dialect' in their wording. Please note that I'm not an expert on this matter what-so-ever! But that's just the vibe I've been getting from how all of the characters have been speaking across the official-English volumes (and which isn't present in the fan-Eng translations).

[2]

I referenced the line briefly before, but the translation of Minazuki saying “...Yu Narukami. How about you throw away those shackles you cling to? They're dead weight to you. You can hardly fight, or even run, while you carry them. […] Oh yes. You call those shackles 'bonds', don't you.” in reference to Chie and Yosuke being incapacitated is brutal and I love it.

[3]

Before learning Kagutsuchi's name, Adachi calls Kagutsuchi "Mr. Crazy-Pants", lol. ("That's why you set up your whole little plan to use the power inside me to control that. And that means you've only been pretending to be best buds with Mr. Crazy-Pants.")

(Or in Japanese: つまり　君らは凶悪なクマ君に従っているフリをしていたってワケか || Though, I'm not sure if 'vicious Bear-kun' has a similar vibe to "Mr. Crazy Pants" in Japanese or not?) (Also fun note: Adachi's 「君ら」 (kimi-ra) is another pluralized address of Minazuki and Sho, so it's not always just their direct name getting that treatment.)

[4]

Labrys is secretly Elvis confirmed. Also, the author comics are to be found on the inside covers for the Eng translation, versus being on the outside covers (and obscured by the book jacket) in the original Jap print. This is something that only Vol 3 and Vol 4 do, as Vol 1 & 2 had enough space left to print the author comics on actual pages.

[5]

I think some of the gikun nuance might've been glossed over, but I honestly still don't know whether it's the subtitles or main words of gikun that are supposed to be "spoken" in-story. I only just found out the proper name for them while making this post, and the things I've read about them so far contradict each other, lol. Also, the official-Eng translation takes the third example below and translates it as both "Minazuki"(Sho) and "this child" at different points in Vol 3, which doesn't help my confusion, lmao.

(Checking out an instance of the first example as well, it gets translated from "ジュネスでミナヅキ[あの男]に襲われもしたが" to "That man. Minazuki? He attacked me at Junes...", occurring when Labrys and Naoto save Chie and Yosuke from Minazuki's attack in the faux-Tartarus lobby.)

E.g. "ミナヅキ　[あの男]" ("Minazuki" subtitled with "that guy") - "皆月達　[あのコら]" ("Sho & Minazuki" subtitled with... my guess is "those kids", but the 'ko' is katakana and not kanji, soo...) - "皆月　[あの子]" ("Sho" subtitled with "that boy")

[6]

Take this with a huge grain of salt, because I don't know enough Japanese to certify that the official-Eng translation shouldn't be pluralized the way that it is, but, uh... the possibility that there's more than one hidden server and more than just Sho as attempted Plume-implantation subjects??

If the translator had been reliably sticking to the pre-established translations, I would give more weight to the possibility of it being a retcon of how the game presents the information. But since it doesn't seem like the translator is familiar with the original material... I'll personally just add this one onto the “fan-characterization fodder” pile and continue hoping that P3RE might give us more clarity on what exactly the experiments of 1995-1999 entailed, lest my fluency in Japanese reach the point that I can ascertain the answer. TuT

For anyone who wants the Japanese lines in transcribed form:

先日　エルゴ研の隔離サーバから　幾月修司のパーソナルファイルが発見された

その中に”人形使い計画”と名づけられたデータが隠されていた

それは皆月翔という少年が”黄昏の羽根”を使った人体実験の最年少被験者であったことを記したものだ

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Misc. Pics

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(If you wanna see the fan-Eng in higher quality than the screengrabs I used, you can find it on Mangadex [here].)

#Sho Minazuki #Yu Narukami #Mitsuru Kirijo #Tohru Adachi #(tagging Mitsuru mostly because of the cover art)#(tagging Adachi because he appears in about half the pages pictured here)#(Sorry everyone; I have no clue how it got wordier than the last review post. I tried to segment it for easier reading at least. >_>;)#(Fun fact: I don't usually describe things as “edgy” -- including Minazuki -- )#(-- but the 'dark' non sequitur dialog was exorbitant enough to defy other applicable descriptors lol.)#(Also if anyone has an enby Sho or Mina headcanon y'all might have fun with this translation lol.)#P4AU/P4U2 manga #Persona 4 Arena Ultimax #P4AU #P4U2 #Persona 4 The Ultimax Ultra Suplex Hold #ペルソナ4 ジ・アルティマックスウルトラス―プレックスホールド

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systematicallycapricious · 4 months

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Yeet— (and then their physical body stumbled into a wall because Sho was impatient and didn't give them time to stabilize it before switching)

For context, this doodle was like half to jot down a musing of "what if the moon key denoted the fronter, rather than only Sho", so that's Minazuki's neck it's flying off, not Sho's.

There's also a sillier version of the coloring below the cut for anyone who wants to see it. /o/

Shoved so hard that he dematerialized into little blobs, lol.

(AKA: I messed around with a lot of coloring styles before realizing that Sho and Minazuki (seem to) canonically have a crisp-view headspace, so trying to depict otherwise was gonna be inaccurate, haha.)

#Sho Minazuki #SystematicallyArtistic #Was Minazuki expecting Sho to suddenly shove him out of front? No. But he's not really surprised that Sho would do such a thing either lol.#(If anyone's wondering; I don't think the key is supposed to be exclusive to Sho; but we only have 2 IW scenes to ref so it's hard to say.)#(I (now) like to use it to denote the fronter personally; since there's a lot of ways you can differentiate Sho and Mina in IW scenes.)#(In the manga for example you've got the key and bandages as the differentiator in one scene -)#(- and clothes versus none in the other one. Of course there's also their expressions and postures; - )#(- but stuff like this can help to further clarify it at a glance I think.)#(The key doesn't even always have to be included; it's more a reflection of their phys body's appearance; at least how I'm interpreting it.#((Symbolic instances aside. Inner-symbolism isn't tied to physical appearance. But I digress.))

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systematicallycapricious · 4 months

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Time for English P4AU manga volume 2! Like last time, shenanigans are below the cut and requests for page comparisons are always welcome.

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Overall Opinion

My initial read-through this time was done while I was sleep deprived, so take my impressions with a grain of salt, lmao.

I think the the three most memorable impressions I took away from the translation this time around were:

The syntax felt more markedly stilted to me than last time. As well, the writing was a bit awkward in some places, though I'm unsure if that's a trait of the original Jap writing or if it only arises from attempting to format it into Eng grammar and culture.

The fan-Eng translation took creative liberties with some words that I think were better served by the official-Eng's translation staying truer to the Jap text. Also, the official-Eng transl provided interesting insight into some things that the fan-Eng transl didn't, which I'll go into a bit below.

The scene where Minazuki ambushes Naoto was mistranslated as Sho being the speaker, despite the Japanese text clearly being Minazuki's language patterns. TuT

Overall, I had a positive impression of it and would say that it's worth reading for those who don't mind a few errors and awkward lingual choices.

As for the ミナヅキ・皆月 naming differentiation... Thus far, both Sho and Minazuki have been "Minazuki", as per adherence to the Jap naming scheme. No alternative font, font effects, subtext, special text bubbles, nor anything to clarify the distinction. However, I'm personally reserving judgment until I get my hands on Vol 3, as I have a sliver of hope that the protagonists knowing the difference is permission for the audience to know the difference. I'm not sure how much I actually believe in said sliver, but I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt at the very least. ^^;

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Illustrations and Author Comics

Vol 2 still has the illustration pages and end-of-volume author's comic! The exclusive edition also has the fold-out poster of the original cover, of course.

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The mistranslated ambush scene was, in fact, Minazuki

So y'all can see for yourself that the text in the Minazuki-Naoto ambush scene clearly uses 俺 and 君 rather than 僕 or テメエ. (Though to be fair, I've actually found an instance where Sho uses 俺 in Vol 2. The line is 「テメエこそ俺にカンショーすんじゃねえ!!」, towards the start of Ch14 when Kagu's mocking his Ikutsuki issues (so Sho's pretty irate). He then returns to using 僕 immediately after; and as there are no visual indications that he switched with Minazuki to say this, I'm pretty confident that this is an exception and not the rule, lol.)

(Said instance of Sho using 俺)

The non-pronoun words should be indicative of whether it's Sho or Minazuki speaking as well, but I'm not fluent enough in Japanese to be able to go into detail on those in this post. ^^;

Overall, I think the translator has been doing pretty good at nailing Sho and Minazuki's respective patterns of speech and employing them in the correct moments – and they go back to getting it correct for when Minazuki reveals himself at the end of Vol 2, too. This one scene just got goofed for some reason I guess. P:

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Translation Upsides

Translation Win 1: Ch15's name was translated properly! The Jap name is 「幻月」 (gengetsu), but the fan-Eng translated it as "Minazuki", which would be 「皆月」 if it was in kanji form. Which – I mean, it is the chapter that Minazuki first formally introduces himself as "Minazuki", so it makes sense? But I personally think that "Paraselene", aka the phenomenon called "moon dogs", is a much cooler and more fitting name for how the chapter goes, including Minazuki's reveal. (-v-)

Translation Win 2: At the start of Ch14, Sho says "Tch! Must've fallen asleep. Hate that dream.", which implies that he's had that dream before. I don't know enough Japanese to know if the original line of 「チッ　寝ちまったのか...　嫌な夢だぜ」 also means a recurrence specifically, but it's still interesting fanon-characterization fodder nonetheless.

Puppet-Ikutsuki's following dialog was also a pretty interesting translation, I think. For example: "The smarts to rule the mental battle. The strength to command the physical battle..! You excel in both! In fact, I'd say you're my greatest masterpiece! I'm proud!"

Translation Win 3: In Ch13, Kagutsuchi's first line of reaching out to Sho is translated correctly as "wings of death", versus the "Plume of Dusk" that the fan-Eng transl uses. Conceptually, they're probably the same thing, but literally the word used is 「死の羽根」 (shi no hane), not 「黄昏の羽根」 (tasogare no hane; which is typically "Plume of Dusk" in Japanese). And this isn't a mistake on the part of the Jap writer either, as far as I can tell, as 「黄昏の羽根」 is used in other places, such as when Labrys is explaining what Plumes are to the Investigation Team ([see here]).

Additionally, though the syntax was exceptionally awkward, I thought the essence of Kagu's dialog in this scene was translated pretty well. And honestly, it's fun to headcanon that Kagu could only communicate limited concepts or words before establishing a stronger connection, thus explaining why the syntax is stilted like: "Your suffering will continue. Eternally. End it."

Translation Win 4: It's a small detail, but Ikutsuki specifically saying "If this is all it takes to kill him... Then that's just how weak he was." is heckin' brutal. Switching to past-tense like Sho's already done and over with when he's still alive and listening, oof. (For comparison, the fan-Eng translated it as "If he dies here, it'll just mean he's worthless.")

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Translation Downsides

Typography Loss 1: Kagutsuchi's text still lacks a cool font like the Jap version has, and that reduces the artistic impact a bit, IMO. In the Jap version, it looks a bit like the text was scorched onto the writing surface – which, given Kagu is a kami of fire, is a pretty apt vibe. While in Eng, he's relegated to the font that all the other characters use while speaking. It's probably better like this for readability purposes, but from a stylistic perspective it's a bit sad.

(Also fun fact: In Jap, the Shadow-Kanji and Shadow-Chie puppets briefly use this burnt font in their speech bubbles. It's for about 1-2 bubbles each (S-Kanji calling forth a fighting ring, S-Chie being in disbelief that Naoto had been holding back against her), and the rest of their dialog is in various other fonts. I'm not sure if there are other instances of non-Kagu characters using it beyond that, nor what exactly it's intended to imply through these additional instances, but it's interesting to note.)

(Additionally; examining it more closely, the Japanese typography is really dynamic in general, which is pretty cool. I'm not sure if that dynamicness invalidates any literary significance to Kagu's burnt font though, lol.)

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Translation Intrigues and Amusements

Typography Intrigue 1: They left the page of fiery "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA"s as-is, rather than trying to turn the 「あ」 and 「ア」 into "a/A". Which, while I immensely respect the fan-Eng version for trying to transcribe that artistic text, I think the horrific vibe comes through a bit better with the original text and art preserved. (Maybe in part due to the wave effect on the text having 3 dimensions rather than just 2?)

Translation Intrigue 2: In Ch13, one of the double page spreads is translated as "This world doesn't need anyone. There's no one in this world." Meanwhile, in the fan-Eng version, it's written as "I don't need anyone! I'm fine by myself!"; and the original Jap text is 「この世界には誰もいらない　この世界には誰もいない」 (the same line, just minus the ら).

I personally prefer the fan-Eng's take on it, as the official-Eng's version confused me for several weeks after the fact; but as I don't understand the nuance of the Jap version, I have no clue as to which Eng interpretation is more accurate. >_>;

Translation Amusement 3: Yu apparently has the word "welp" in his lexicon. And on the second page, the way that his dialog is worded makes it sound like he's smitten with Sho, lmao.

Translation Amusement 4: Yu's so used to his friends' antics at this point that he can just tune them out like that, lol. I also just appreciate Chie and Yosuke's dialog here in general.

Translation Intrigue 5: Ch13's title is translated as "Crimson Memories" in the official-Eng transl, versus fan-Eng's "Scarlet Memories". The original Japanese words are 「緋色の記憶」.

Translation Intrigue 6: What's typically translated as "the rules of this world" (regarding Adachi) is translated here as "reality's rules". The original Jap text (in this manga at least) is 「現実のルール」, not 「世界のルール」; so literally "reality", like "reality of the situation", and not 'reality' like "world/society".

Translation Intrigue 7: Ikutsuki's iconic "the death of everything... but also the beginning" speech is translated a bit differently compared to the fan-Eng, and drastically different compared to Ultimax's EpP3 Ch1. It keeps the same general concepts, but the cadence, word choices, and syntax are executed differently.

Translation Intrigue 8: Side-by-sides of the kendo/fencing pun because I think the differing translation choices, as well as the original context of the pun, are interesting.

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(If you wanna see the fan-Eng in higher quality than the screengrabs I used, you can find it on Mangadex [here].)

#Sho Minazuki #Yu Narukami #Chie Satonaka #(tagging Chie mostly because of the cover art; in case any fans of hers want to see it)#Shuji Ikutsuki #HinoKagutsuchi (Persona)#P4AU/P4U2 manga #Persona 4 Arena Ultimax #P4AU #P4U2 #Persona 4 The Ultimax Ultra Suplex Hold #ペルソナ4 ジ・アルティマックスウルトラス―プレックスホールド

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systematicallycapricious · 5 months

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I'm a bit late to the party, but I recently got the first volume of the English P4U2 manga!

I am absolutely geeking out over comparing the Jap, Eng, and fan-Eng versions, so if anyone has any pages or panels they want to see side-by-side across the three, let me know and I'll make a post for you! I can't do the entirety of the book of course, but I can do a few pages at least.

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(Below the cut is my initial opinion on the quality of the translation work, some comparisons between various details of the Jap volume and the Eng volume, and some more manga page side-by-sides.)

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As for my impression of the translation work so far... To me, it feels like the translator was trying to preserve more of the original Japanese language/culture than Eng-P4AU chose to? Not in every instance though, as there's definitely cases where vernacular translations are utilized instead of literal. But where more literal translations are favored, the wording can feel a little awkward or OOC in English.

Even still, it's a pretty cohesive reading experience, in my opinion.

Also, they translated "Plume of Dusk" correctly, which is a relief. I was worried that some of the technical lore terms might get bungled by literal translations, lol. Conversely, while I'm glad that they didn't preserve Jap-Teddie's "-kuma" habit, and happy that they included a few bear puns in accordance to Eng-Teddie's speech habits, I do lament the low quantity and diversity of bear puns in Teddie's speech overall. Maybe there just wasn't a lot of good places for those in this volume though, so I'll have to see going forth.

Oh- and I noticed that some of the background signs and text got translations as well, which I think is really neat. (I don't read enough manga to know if that's just a standard feature of manga translations though, lol.)

Granted, this is just my first-read first impression, and I don't know enough Japanese to know if some lines may be translated less accurately or not. Plus, I tend to be on the lenient side when judging the quality of creative works. So please refer to other opinions as well if you're trying to decide the quality of the translation for yourself!

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Fun fact: the Eng version was printed bigger than the Jap version (at least for the Jap volumes I have; no clue if they printed those at multiple sizes).

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Also something cool about the Eng version is that it comes with the same color illustrations as the Jap version had, just sized-up. The exclusive edition also comes with a bonus fold-out poster of the original volume cover!

The end-of-volume artist/editor comic was included as well! I'm personally very glad to finally know what this comic says. My respect for Rokuro-san and Sakamaguro-san (the fish) as creatives has grown even further.

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Here's a few other page comparisons too because I found them interesting. xP

(If you wanna see the fan-Eng in higher quality than the screengrabs I used, you can find it on Mangadex [here].)

#P4AU/P4U2 manga #Persona 4 Arena Ultimax #Sho Minazuki #Yu Narukami #(Honestly I kinda got used to reading slightly-OOC Persona content via fan creations -)#(- and fan-translations of other Jap Persona content; so the translation choices don't affect me all that much lol)#(Though Sho's “loser trash” makes me cackle because it's such an awkward way to translate “ゴミ”)#(Especially "Now to set up some fun surprises for you Investi-loser trash-Team goons.” lmao)#(Also still waiting to see how Labrys's dialect is handled; as well as the 皆月・ミナヅキ name difference)#(I've heard things about both already so that's going to be interesting lol)#P4AU #P4U2 #Persona 4 The Ultimax Ultra Suplex Hold #ペルソナ4 ジ・アルティマックスウルトラス―プレックスホールド

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systematicallycapricious · 7 months

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Doodles

#Sho Minazuki #Sophia Persona 5 #SystematicallyArtistic #Sho's disgruntled because an OC took up 90% of the paper and left him crammed in the corner #Minazuki achieved retribution by interrupting me while drawing that same OC more recently #right when I was ~80% done with the drawing too. I gotta go back and fix some of that OC's textures now... >_>#Sophia's is a lot older but I've been waffling on posting it #The power of adorable tilt wins out over the power of mundane doodle I guess lol

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systematicallycapricious · 7 months

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A few frameworks I've found helpful for writing structural dissociation systems in fiction (e.g. OSDD-1/P-DID, DID... can't vouch for complex DID because I'm still learning about that):

The BASK Model

The Action Systems Model

Triad of Dissociation (third paragraph in the post)

Note: I haven't yet tracked down the academic source for the "triad of dissociation", so I'm not sure how scientifically accurate that is. It makes sense to me subjectively though, so I've been utilizing it in my own regard.

(I also don't think that it's inherently the "theory of structural dissociation" because it talks about the formation of single dissociated parts, not ANP vs EP and how many ANP are present.)

Additional note: the "BASK" and "action system" models can be used for trauma more broadly, so they're not limited to just SD-systems. Character with PTSD or C-PTSD? Applicable. Character with magic- or soul-based plurality but still experiences trauma at somepoint? Applicable. Obviously if you have world-lore or character-lore that denotes that their responses to trauma aren't like a human's, then these may not be as applicable, but you get the point.

Lastly, these three frameworks aren't the only things you should reference while writing a SD-system character, but they certainly help a lot with organizing character information and demystifying some of the underlying mechanisms for SD-system characters.

---------Capri rambling on applications of those frameworks--------

Also something helpful that I've been doing is combining the "Behavior" part of BASK with the "fight, flight, freeze, shutdown, etc." of action systems. As far as I understand, "Behavior" isn't limited to just those, but when I'm creating notes on what trauma features have ended up where and how they manifest among a system, making notes like "Trauma X: fight-Behavior is held by Y alter; shutdown-Behavior and Affect are held by Z alter" is very useful.

In that same regard, denoting what fragments of a particular BASK category are held where can also be helpful. E.g. one alter holds a fear-Affect, another holds an anger-Affect; one alter holds the Knowledge leading up to the traumatic situation while another holds the Knowledge of the traumatic situation itself; etc.

This also can apply to complex and longer-term traumatic situations, as opposed to just one-off events. In those cases, alters might collect those particular types or categories of experiences over time (e.g. an anger and fight-response holder, or an alter with Knowledge of multiple traumas), or they may have different kinds of traumatic content from different experiences within that timeframe (e.g. an alter with Knowledge from one, Sensory from another, Knowledge and Affect from a third...).

Furthermore, adding the triad of dissociation into that lets you figure out what degree of dissociation is being utilized to handle those traumatic memories, and at what points. You character can start off with a stage 1 dissociative part from a trauma at age 3, then have it gain more content (traumatic or not) and develop into a stage 2 by age 7, for example. I personally assign stage 1 parts to my stage 3 alters as well, as it helps me to track their individual trauma triggers and responses when needed, but I don't remember how academically or practically accurate that is to IRL.

Combining the three frameworks together, I can write notes something like this:

Age 3, 'Makami' is a non-structurally dissociative self-soothing measure when [chara] is sent to live with their neglectful grandparents.

Age 3-5, due to [chara being put into a different chronic trauma situation without support], Makami becomes a structurally dissociated response. Spared all aspects of BASK from their prior trauma, but retaining Knowledge of their current trauma, Makami soon develops into a stage 2 part who accesses energy management, exploration, caretaking, and social interaction action systems.

Age 15+, due to [a combination of a one-off trauma and chronic stressful situation], Makami develops enough to become a stage 3 part, retaining the recuperation-Behavior and some Sensory aspects of [the one-off trauma]. Makami continues to operate within the priorly ascribed action systems when the trauma is not triggered.

#Capri's Writing Resources

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systematicallycapricious · 9 months

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Capri’s Guide to Sho Minazuki Content — Masterpost

Disclaimer: I don’t know, nor care to hunt down, every last piece of official content for him, as especially with the merch stuff can be really obscure. But I’ll list anything I do know or other people inform me of here.

This will also be updated if I get around to making new posts, new content comes out, or I learn of content I haven’t listed here before.

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Games:

Persona 4 Arena — (indirect appearance)

Persona 4 Arena Ultimax — (the game all about him)

Persona 3: Dancing in Moonlight / Persona 5: Dancing in Starlight — (DLC dance & limited character interaction voicelines)

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Art Books:

[P4U2 Official Design Works]

[P4U & P4U2 Super Official Design Works]

P3D & P5D Official Visual Book — (character graphic & screenshots, Japanese VL transcript, potentially mentioned in the interview but I haven’t checked yet. No concept art or art pieces)

Shigenori Soejima & P-Studio Art Unit: Art Works 2 — (art pieces)

P4U2 Persona 4 The Ultimax Ultra Suplex Hold Stage Project Visual Book — (seems like a photoshoot of the actors in costume?)

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Manga:

[P4U2 manga adaptation by Rokuro Saito] — (Eng fan-translation)

Udon Entertainment publication of the P4AU manga adaptation — (official Eng translation; will finish releasing by February 6th, 2024; has an exclusive edition with new cover art and a standard edition with the original cover art)

Persona 4 Arena Ultimax Comic Anthology (published by DNA Media Comics) — [Eng fan-translation of a couple comics here] — (~4 non-comic art pieces, 1 koma, 5 multi-page comics, and small cameos in 2 multi-page comics)

「タルタロス劇場」 Vol 3, 「ワイルド」 Vol 1 & 2 — (AKA “Tartarus Theater”; a couple to a few komas in each volume, appears on the cover of Vol 3)

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Theater:

Persona 4: The Ultimax Ultra Suplex Hold Stageplay — (prominently featured. For a list of screentime timestamps, see [here])

Persona Super Live P-Sound Wish 2022 (concert) — (Day 2 I think, but I haven’t watched it yet. There’s also photos of the actors in costume online, for example [here], [here], [here], and [here])

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Merch:

To be honest, I don’t particularly seek out merch, nor do I always remember to document it when I come across it, so if anyone has information on this, I would be very grateful!

As well, if any of the active shop links are discontinued, let me know and I’ll add their screenshots to the merch documentation folder.

Folder of documented merch [here]

Ultimax Stageplay list of merch [here]

“Rule Smashing Pun Machine” embroidered cap [here]

P4AU box art poster (normal version) [here]

P4AU box art poster (Shadow version) [here]

A Tumblr user’s keychain & pin collection [here] — (note: no clue how much is official and how much is unofficial)

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Etc.:

Persona 4: The Ultimax Ultra Suplex Hold The Complete Guide — (an official game guide from the original release, going into mechanics for each fighter, from what I can tell. I don’t own a copy though, so this is just estimations from internet pictures)

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Additional Resources:

For resources uploaded to the internet like VL files (Jap&Eng), sprites, understanding the Cyrillic script on Sho’s armband, etc., see my page [here].

#Sho Minazuki #Capri's guide to finding Sho Minazuki content #(If the formatting is wonky or hard to read for any reason let me know and I'll see what I can do!)#Persona 4 Arena Ultimax #P4AU #P4U2 #ミナヅキショウ #皆月翔 #Persona 4 The Ultimax Ultra Suplex Hold

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systematicallycapricious · 10 months

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Concept — “For you to remember, for you to forget...”

Contextual breakdown below the cut, for those who want it.

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Papaver rhoeas, the red poppies, are representative of remembrance poppies, which supposedly honor fallen soldiers, sometimes all war casualties, and call for future peace.

Papaver somniferum, the white poppies, are representative of both sedation and bandages (even if somniferum-sedatives are probably not accurate for this situation from a technical standpoint >_>).

Meconopsis betonicifolia(?), the blue poppy, is representative of the Plume of Dusk. Himalayan species are supposedly difficult to cultivate outside of their native environment; which similar could be posited about Plumes of Dusk. The blue poppies in the vertical concept are probably still some species of meconopsis and have basically the same meaning, just applied differently.

The poppy stems, as you can sort of see in the first image, are intended to be IV tubes. The colorful connector ports are also reminiscent of the wallpaper you can find in the kids’ areas of some medical facilities.

The “sun” is a surgical lamp, specifically the one depicted in the manga (ch.30).

The white clothes are the same ones as depicted in the manga, though if you wanted to you could also ascribe them the meaning of “something untainted/pure”, as there isn’t any viscera staining them.

The flower crown I was kinda interpreting as being symbolic of children, innocence, and beauty. Obviously, nothing about this situation is any of those, though I wouldn’t be surprised if Ikutsuki saw it that way.

The color palette and perspective are supposed to invoke a dreamy/surreal state. Reality is the bright and sterile whites and grays of the surgical room, hazily blending into less “real” elements such as the poppies. The borders between the two are weak, and so you get stuff such as flowers and IV tubing merging. Perspective-wise, I tried to make it look like one was seeing the lamp overhead as if they were the one on the table, and then tried to invoke a feeling of distance with the size/perspective of Sho and the poppies, as if they’re disconnected from reality.

The epithet I have for this concept is mostly based on “remembrance” from the red poppies and “sleep/sedative” from the name of the white poppies, “somniferum”. Though, it could be applied to other aspects of this concept/situation as well.

Overall, it’s just an artistic/symbolic take on the Plume-implantation surgery and lowkey the beginning of Minazuki’s existence, haha.

#medical themes #Sho Minazuki #SystematicallyArtistic #ignore the incorrect petal arrangements; they'll be fixed if I ever illustrate these properly >_>#also indecisive on if I want the poppies to go further off into the distance or not so they're a little flat meanwhile

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systematicallycapricious · 10 months

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Blacklight-inspired doodles!

Sho’s having an existential crisis over why his hair has suddenly turned cyan

Minazuki’s being unintentionally spooky but otherwise is just chilling

And Labrys has doubts about this strange optical trickery (and maybe confusion over why her hair is glowing, since, in using UV-reactive materials for her hair, Ergo would’ve been going out of their way to implement something with no testing or combat benefits...)

#SystematicallyArtistic #Sho Minazuki #Labrys #if I did one for Shabrys she'd probably have bright eyes like Mina's - just gold not blue #I don't really have any ideas for her right now though so alas #fun fact: Sho originally had Sophia-scarlet hair. It was eye-searing

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systematicallycapricious · 11 months

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Some plushie concepts that I’ve been working on recently! I still need to do the back and side profiles for Sho and Minazuki’s outfits, but I have to rest my drawing arm first, so I might add those in a reblog later.

Anyways, bullet list of lil’ details:

I’ll be making the Minazuki plush in full size (about 12in IIRC), while the Sho plushie will be roughly the size of a large keychain, because then I can bring Sho many places and make all the post-Ultimax world-travel references that I want. And maybe inevitably drop him off a cliff by accident, but I’ll try my best not to. xP

The sclera and teeth are gray instead of white because the white blended into the skin too much to be visible.

Yes, the hair will be that fluffy on the actual plushies.

Ideally, all the clothes will be removable, and the sheathes actually functional, but I’m not sure if that’ll be feasible and/or secure enough at a smaller scale intended for travel, so we’ll see.

They’ll probably have little crescent moon charms instead of recreations of the moon key, but I have to see what I can find materials-wise on that front.

Random circle-star on the sneaker tongues because I have no idea what’s actually supposed to be there. I looked through all the art and live-action costumes that I could think of, to no avail. >_>

Conversely, I can say with confidence that the Yaso High 3rd year pin is canon in some form. If you look carefully in Ch28, Vol4 of the P4AU manga, it’s distinctly a 3rd year pin on the jacket Minazuki nicks.

I’m undecided on if I’ll use the gray-eyed version or the blue-glow version for Sho’s face yet. Minazuki’s will keep the slate blue irises though, because imagining that the Plume affects the color of their body’s eyes the more active or energetic it is is fun.

Both of them will have the scars on their bodies though. I just drew them on a separate iteration for referential ease. :P

A lot of Tsukibat’s design here won’t match up with the final plush because fabric and pattern differences. For example, Tsukibat-back #2 is not at all how the fabric I have is going to work, alas. Also, I still need to finish wrangling a helmet reference for Tsukiyomi so I can better translate that to the plush... <_<;;

Tsukibat’s lil’ sun and moon charms are there to represent his two Persona-users.

I didn’t give Tsukibat Tsukiyomi’s crescent-mohawk because I thought it would be a bit much with the giant ears also being present. I think it looks alright with the design though.

I’ll be using [this pattern] and [this pattern] with some modifications for the plushies, respectively. (The latter was what inspired Tsukibat in the first place, actually. Galaxy bat x Tsukiyomi = this.)

I don’t currently have plans to make some to sell, but I might consider it in the future if it’s not too much of a hassle to create them. I’m not a professional or anything though, so IDK if they’ll even be sale-quality, lol.

Read all the way down here? Cool. Your reward is getting to see the derpy little embroidery color tests I’ve done for these so far:

(This second/third one was supposed to be a Minazuki expression version, but I botched it by doing the outline before the fill and then pushing the fill too close to the outlines, so it took on a much derpier form, lol.)

#Sho Minazuki #ミナヅキショウ #Tsukiyomi (Persona)#CapriciouslyPlushified #(hooray I finally got out of writing-brain enough to do plushcraft work)#(they say; jinxing these to not get done for another 2 years)#(TBH I'd love to do ones for Labby and Shabrys too but 3 is already a lot to get done flskdfs)#(ditto for a proper Tsukiyomi plushie on the humanoid pattern; or even a beta-Tsuki design-)#(also super-grateful to Rokuro Saito for being such a detailed manga artist)#(would be bereft of some crucial details without the P4U2 manga)

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systematicallycapricious · 1 year

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Just musing about a couple small oddities I noticed while going through the Japanese version of Ultimax. Disclaimer: I still don’t know a super-ton about the Japanese language, so these observations might not actually mean anything of importance. >_>

(And if anyone with better Japanese knowledge than I comes across this post and wants to help elucidate things, I’m always down to learn more.)

[1]

In Labrys’s arcade mode, Minazuki introduces himself as purely “ミナヅキ”, while in every other instance I can find in both story mode and arcade mode, he always introduces himself fully as “ミナヅキショウ” (like shown below with Chie).

The closest thing I can find to the contrary of his usual pattern is how he introduces himself to Adachi in “Episode Adachi” (pictured below), but even then he still gives his full name after a moment.

Meanwhile, in the English translation of Labrys’ arcade mode story, this discrepancy is entirely glossed over as Minazuki just introduces himself in his English-typical “Minazuki. Sho Minazuki”.

I haven’t checked through the manga to see if this pattern holds there too, ‘cause I’m not as familiar with its sequence of events as I am with the game and so would have to comb through it more meticulously. So there might be something there that affirms or breaks this pattern?

So yeah. I don’t really have enough sociocultural knowledge to know if him doing that is indicative of a closer relational position, of him being more disrespectful, or of it being some purely grammatical variation with little characterization meaning, though I do find it interesting from a “well, it’s an oddity of behavioral pattern if nothing else” perspective.

(Oh- and for additional context, in that scene in Labrys’ arcade story, Minazuki makes mention of how he and Labrys are the same, something that’s reiterated in one of his “spectating Labrys’ dance” voice lines in P3:DiM. Thus why it seems plausible to me that he might consider himself relationally closer to her. Though on the other hand, he might still see her as an inanimate tool as well, so not treating her with the same formality as he would a person could give credence to it being a more disrespectful form of regard instead? There’s not really enough context to tell, as even his Labrys-specific battle lines and DiM lines could be read either or both ways. :P)

[2]

In EpP4, when Minazuki stabs General Kagutsuchi and demands to know what he’s planning to do with Sho, he seemingly goes to refer to Sho as “this child(この子を)”, then pauses for a moment before changing his address to “Minazuki(��月を)”, with “を” being a grammatical marker for the “direct object” of a conversation or sentence I think..? If there are more nuances to it than that, I haven’t learned them yet, haha. Anyways, after changing the direct object that he’s referring to, he then goes on to say the rest of the sentence.

Meanwhile, in the English translation, this is just simplified into “this boy” with no further distinction between the two apparent forms of address that the Japanese version has.

As for the manga, he just outright uses “皆月を” from the start, though, aside from dropping Kagutsuchi’s name from the dialogue boundaries, says the line exactly the same (どうするつもりだ). The English fan-scanlation on Mangadex follows in the footsteps of the English game translation in writing the line as “Just what do you intend to do with this boy?”.

Also, just for context, I think usually any other time that any character uses “皆月”, it’s translated as “Sho” rather than “that boy”? (With the exception of the manga ‘pronunciation subtitles inform you that the spoken word is entirely different than the written word’ thing where sometimes “皆月” is written but “この子” is spoken, I think.)

So yeah. I’m not sure if this is supposed to be an important characterization detail on Minazuki’s part, since this happens right after Yu gets him to realize that he's a person supporting Sho rather than Sho being totally alone, or if it’s just a negligible grammatical thing. Though, since I don’t think Minazuki ever calls Sho “皆月” outright outside of explaining Sho’s past to other characters, in which even then I think he uses “皆月翔” specifically, it kind of makes me think that him using a more direct form of address for Sho rather than an indirect one might hold some significance?

Although, as a counterpoint to that, we also don’t ever really see him directly conversing or interacting with Sho outside of a couple scenes in the manga and a couple lines in P3:DiM, so maybe he does call Sho by name more regularly and we just don’t get to see it. For example, in the P4U2 DNA Comics anthology, there’s quite a few times where Minazuki directly addresses Sho by his family name, but the anthology is non-canon as far as I know, so I can’t really count it. :T

Also, I haven’t extensively combed through every last instance for this point, so you may want to take it with a grain of salt, as some things may have fallen through the cracks. ^^;

Addendum: P4U2 Stageplay

I’m putting the stageplay in a separate section here mostly because 1) I don’t know how “canon” it’s considered and 2) my phonetic Japanese comprehension still needs a lot of work and I don’t have subtitles like I do with the game. Also I kind of wrote-up everything above before remembering that it existed. <_<;

Anyways, going through it with my limited comprehension, I can say that Minazuki sticks with his “ミナヅキショウ” full introduction and sticks to referring to Sho as “彼(him)” and “この子(this child)” throughout his appearances... with a single exception. In a flashback to when Minazuki confronts Ikutsuki with Tsukiyomi, Minazuki at one point says “翔(Shou)” specifically. However, as I don’t know the rest of the words preceding it, I don’t really know if he’s referring to Sho, of whom he kind of yeeted out of the body a bit beforehand, or if he’s referring to himself since he shares a name with Sho.

And as for what he says to Kagutsuchi just before he gets possessed, he actually seems to say just “どうするつもりだ、カグツチ？”, bringing the three variations full-circle by keeping Kagu’s name but nixing any direct reference to Sho.

#Capri's theories and queries #SystematicRambles #ミナヅキショウ #Sho Minazuki

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systematicallycapricious · 1 year

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[AoN] PxDN Lore Snippet: R-00 + R-01 Reactivation

Yep, I read Persona x Detective Naoto, and yep, I'm incorporating it into this story. Why? ‘Cause it’s not a bad read, and more importantly it’s got a lot of feasible world lore I can use to enrich the setting, of which I can do all sorts of fun stuff with. Also, Sousei and Sho share a lot of similarities in terms of circumstances and behaviors, so any chance for him and Sholar to cross paths has lots of fun potential as well, even if it's only once.

Anyway, this is just a little snippet from the full AoN-PxDN lore doc that I'm getting straightened-up, 'cause I'm excited about how nicely I got it to fit together. \o/

Spoilers for: Persona x Detective Naoto, Persona 3, Persona 4 Arena/Ultimax, and my fic "Apropos of Nothing" (very mildly though, otherwise I wouldn't be posting it xP)

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(For quick reference, the R-series ASSW project spanned from roughly 2006 to 2009, with Sousei's run being from 2007-2008, Ai's spanning 2008-2009, and their endings being Yūri's death and Aigis's reactivation respectively. SEES is first founded in Spring 2006 (being Mit/Aki/Shinji), and P3 happens as normal from 2009-2010. The 7th Gen ASSW project also ended with the explosion & creation of the Dark Hour on Sept 10th, 1999.)

So, several times throughout 2011, Minazuki accesses Ikutsuki's isolated server + the Ergo database server in general, with the first instance of the latter catching the ShadOps/KJG's attention. A bit spooked by the unauthorized access, everything related to Ergo (both current and old) is given a thorough security check, resulting in the discovery of 3 ASSWs sitting around in storage, among other things.

(Note: the database server access happens differently in this AU, so up until now, Minazuki had been accessing the isolated server legitimately via Ikutsuki's whitelisted computer with admin credentials, and then attempted to access the general server with an unregistered device. I still have to learn how databases work though, so I might have to adjust that in the future.)

Pretty much no one seems to know much about this mysterious 5th Gen and two R-series androids, despite there actually being a decent bit on information on-file for the latter once they decrypted it, and so, alongside a bunch of other old Ergo artifacts, the three are shipped out to the Yakushima Ergo quarantine facility for inspection and threat assessment. Some of the staff who were cited to work on the R-series are also contacted by Mitsuru to get further information.

(Note: unlike OG, the transport goes smoothly, because canon-divergence. /o/)

Mr. Tsuge Tetsuma has been employed as a researcher in the Kirijo Ergonomics Robotics Division for a long time now, but more importantly since the R-Series project was abruptly halted and its products stuffed away into storage. Now, he was nowhere near happy about having to leave Sousei and Ai in there for all this time, mind you, but he didn't have the authority nor the opportunity to get them back out of storage on his own, and so it was all he could do to stick with the company until an opportunity might arise. Getting a phone call from Mitsuru provided one such opportunity.

With the aid of Tsuge, the three ASSWs are reactivated and inspected, and once Mitsuru learns that they're not threats and are sentient beings with "hearts" of their own, they're given official rank as auxiliary members in the ShadOps to keep Public Safety from trying to confiscate them on the grounds of being "highly dangerous weapons". And… I guess I haven't figured out the specifics beyond that point yet, like if they actually help out the ShadOps or not. I feel like they might given Sousei’s determination to prove his usefulness and Ai’s desire to help out overall, but Sousei’s determination to have a combat-type Persona might also undermine that? Anyway, Tsuge is also brought into the fold as an official ShadOps researcher and tasked with being the supervisor of the Kurogamis due to his past experiences and relations with them and their creator.

(Fun fact: the reactivation order goes Ai, Sousei, Labrys because they have more information on, and familiarity with, the R-series units than the 5th Gen unit, so there's less risk involved with activating the Kurogamis than there is with Labrys. (Plus, in the event that Labrys ends up being hostile or out of control, the Kurogamis could be called in to help suppress her.) Also, Tsuge knows that Sousei will be rowdier than Ai, so as one of the chief specialists on the team, he's making the executive decision to give the team the ‘easier’ one to start with, lol.)

A year passes (which is what makes up a lot of Sousei's impression of "smoldering away at a lab, not yet fulfilling his mission as a suppression weapon"), and in late 2012 the National Police Agency entreats the KJG for technological aid in civilian safety and law enforcement measures. With the Kurogamis’ robotic physique and Sousei’s Past Reading in mind, this opportunity gets presented to Tsuge and the Kurogamis, of which Tsuge eventually gets Sousei on board with when he learns that they can be stationed at Yagokoro's PD, where Aoi Touko works. Ai didn't really need a ton of convincing, being content to be wherever Tsuge and Sousei are and determined to help out where she can.

(Note: part of the "last year's brutal crimes" is influenced by the Inaba kidnapping and murder cases, as it caused quite a stir across the nation, though the other part is probably more mundane, non-magical crime. Also, other technology and robotics were implemented in other PD's across Japan, but Yagokoro was the only one to make use of ASSWs specifically.)

And from there, PxDN happens more-or-less as normal, although certain events may or may not have Naoto meet the Kurogamis and/or Tsuge before PxDN occurs. It depends on if they end up staying on Yakushima for the whole time or if they go to an Ergo or ShadOps facility on mainland Japan, and furthermore if it happens to be the one Naoto visits or not. Most likely, if they do cross paths at all, it'll be brief, or else an off-handed mention of them by someone else, but I'll have to see as I solidify more of that part of the timeline. P:

Also, Tsuge’s employment with the ShadOps lets him distribute Evokers to Touko and Naoto during PxDN’s events, perhaps special models more recently designed for use outside of the Dark Hour/CoUn, because they really shouldn’t be able to summon their Personas so casually in the conscious world. It’s somewhat believable for when Naoto Awakens to Amatsu Mikaboshi and when she’s trying to save Touko, given the circumstances, but outside of that. :P

#Sholar System AU #Persona x Detective Naoto #Persona series #Lorecrafting: Capricious Style #if something doesn't make sense or is hard to read lmk and I'll see what I can do #The past year solid of research is finally actualizing into cool stuff #I went through so many Persona IPs because there's like no substantial info on Ergo #At least that I can find/access #But at least I can do interesting stuff with all of that info now #Also I guess to clarify; the reason this 'nicely fits' is because the general events were already going to happen to Labby #Of the server discovery and resulting security inspection; plus some other Ergo timeline factors unrelated to Labby #And then I realized that I could apply it to the Kurogamis too given it's not well-clarified what happened to them post-Yuri death #(Or like how Ai was made and fits into this at all...)#And the ShadOps are meant to work with the legal police so the Yagokoro collab could be right up their alley?#So then I started connecting it to other given canon details and hence //gestures #Labby has her own arc to undergo so that'd be why she stopped being mentioned after a certain point #She does work with the ShadOps though but it's in a more passive position?#She's (planned to be - still working on it) stationed in Inaba to keep an eye on things after the lv4 Shadow Activity reading #But it's also kinda Mitsuru being sneaky in giving her a job that lets her live a somewhat more human-style life #Especially because Labby has only been reactivated for a few months #And then later down the line she might take on a more active role but that's super-WIP

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