centuriesoldmenace

[centuriesoldmenace]

There is only one contribution I will make about the discourse about sexuality and that is, time and time again Will and Hannibal has always defied boundaries. Even from the beginning as psychiatrist and patient, enemy or friends, hate or love [this is in regard to their feelings between each other]. Alana states this, that these two are paradoxes, the Shepard and lamb but which one is which? Alana also mentions that their relationship cannot be defined, she asks ‘what is your relationship?’ And they both look at each other and go ‘it doesn’t matter what anyone else thinks we know’.

That is why labelling I believe doesn’t apply to them, in any context, good and evil, heterosexual or homosexual, acceptance and revenge. These two are in a reality of their own, they are conjoined, fluid between boundaries but that’s for each other. Will views himself and is a character who has been heterosexual, he is comfortable in that ‘normality’ as much as he was comfortable to rid of the darker impulses. But Hannibal changed the latter, he let Will embrace this darkness, to be accepted and I believe that will be true to sexuality. If Will had been fully, unbending straight then I would of thought the confession of Hannibal being in love with him would of disgusted him, it would of been very different. Flat out distaste and denial at Bedrlia’s words and yet he’s silent to it. But Will with Bedelia as Bryan said were ‘bitching’ as if there were jealousy, catty remarks. But I see it as the same as Hannibal unearthing his darkness, he’s wary, admittedly hurt- these two have hurt and betrayed each other its not a far off idea that he pushes away any notion of his attraction because of it. Will needs time to accept himself, something that takes time and what he’s had to do throughout the entire story.

As it has also been spoken up about, finding your sexuality can happen throughout their lives. There’s no set time or age to find this, but to accept it in someone like Will who already views himself as abnormal, unnatural his upbringing likely never viewed homosexuals as good, they were outsiders as much as he was. For Will it would be difficult, he’s going to grasp any fraction of normality the best he can, he will convince himself he wants a wife, child- women in his life as that’s what it’s meant to be. However remember his behaviour, actions. He goes to Hannibal, he knows they can’t replace Hannibal, they can’t accept him for who he is. subconsciously he’s chosen the man who killed their adopted daughter, gutted him, manipulated and who is a cannibalistic murderer but to admit that out loud, to come to terms with what has occurred between them is going to make Will question everything and that’s where Bryan can explore the relationship, the idea of sexuality being fluid. As isn’t that what both Hannibal and Will have always been? Fluid with each other.

Bryan has not ripped anything apart, he wants to stay true and authentic to the characters and Will is that barrier to accept, to find himself but after killing a man, embracing in the moon covered in his blood and gazing into each other’s eyes? That Will inacted the hug, he wanted the warmth shows something deeper that Will cannot say with confidence like Hannibal. ‘Can’t live with him, can’t live without him’, Will doesn’t want to admit to what he actually feels as that will change everything he has tried to be, normal. So he will force himself in those boxes until he’s forced out and that is why I have full faith in whatever Bryan, the producers and cast chooses it will be right.

Also remember it’s harder to canon characters like that on shows however Bryan and just about everyone ships these two in their own Fanon, look at mads? He won’t shut up about the murder husbands. I believe they all want to make it possible but it has to be done right and organic.

These two will always defy boundaries. They do not fit in labels.

#hannibal #hannigram #writing #ideas #hannibal lecter #hannibal nbc #will graham #they have always defied the boundaries they have been placed in #this is no different #put faith in Bryan and the cast who has made an amazing show #Put trust in them because im certain they will do it spectacularly

[centuriesoldmenace]

Took a quick peek in the Hannibal tag and yeah there’s a lot of negative stuff, so just a few carefully measured, slightly more positive thoughts in no particular order. But I seriously do not wanna argue with anyone, or get involved in any drama, so if you disagree feel free to just skip this post, stop reading, go do your own thing, I’m just letting my thoughts out to breathe and then I’ll probs shut up about this for good because I am Too Old for discourse.

Keep reading

[centuriesoldmenace]

Without allowing an escape of thoughts, fantasies and scenario’s happen in a world of fiction, where it is safe, where only letters are the intent then I truly believe that’s where it becomes dangerous. Suppression and repression of fantasies can often force it to be relived in reality. I believe a safe place needs to be made, one where the moral compass and societies judgement does not have its iron grip.

Humans aren’t saints, nor perfect and with this sudden scrutinising of being judged for your thoughts in fiction it paints, generalises innocent people that they are morally wrong. It forces many to think they are wrong, should be punished for what they read. Yes. Some content is disturbing, it has hard hitting themes but the argument can be made so are dreams, subconscious thoughts. What occurs in our dreams should we also be held accountable if in it disturbing themes show up? There should always be a clear distinction on fantasy and reality. Fiction and actions.

And the people who see this as against their moral compass, they don’t have to read/see the content, warnings and tags are usually put explicitly for that purpose.

@avcrs I remember the discussion you put up a while back and thought this thread would be helpful for you.

#i find this incredibly important #espeically in mature fandoms or fiction #what you write/read should not have your morality judged on #very similiar to intrusive thoughts #what you think does not make you wrong if its not acted on in reality #hannibal #fandoms #writing #content

[centuriesoldmenace]

If there is one thing that Hannibal ‘I-murder-people-who-do-the-smallest-things-like-breathe-in-my-space’ Lecter has done is provided me with a vocabulary I didn’t know existed. No wonder the Hannibal fandom has writing scholars and absolute God’s at writing these homoerotic bastards make ‘lying’ or ‘bending the truth’ in some Greek like poetry with this whole ‘omission of truth’.

Honestly. I didn’t think a show could make dismal day to day words sound as if I stepped back in time to watch a Greek tragedy. Also these two are actually really gay, there is no way you can bypass it. I’ve already had it with these two after rewatching finally, but still need more of them.

#hannibal nbc #hannibal #hannibal lecter #will graham #hannigram #this show cearly exceeds so many others #why do they have to make murder artistic #courting gift? unbelievable men #chivalry ain’t dead

[centuriesoldmenace]

I think about this scene a lot. This scene. Listen. I know Will and Hannibal are now one hundred and ten percent romantically canon, as confirmed within season three and since the show’s cancellation, but the fact that Bryan Fuller thought he was writing a platonic relationship during season one absolutely sends me through the fucking roof and right into outer space. Like, no wonder Mads Mikkelsen took one look at the scripts and went, “… Bryan, please.” I mean, look at the dialogue in this conversation! 

Hannibal: You often worry about being alone?

Franklin: I worry about hurting. Being alone comes with a dull ache. Doesn’t it?

Hannibal: It can.

They are discussing what it feels like to not have someone by their side who can provide relief from that “dull ache” Franklin speaks of; someone to enjoy life with, basically. Want to know what happens right after that moment? The most elegant and over-the-top dramatic music starts to play as Hannibal opens the door to his waiting room, expecting to see Will, a smile plastered on his face in utter anticipation. The direction and writing clearly sets Will up as the person who can bring Hannibal exactly what Franklin yearns for. 

What follows is something right out of a romantic fucking comedy. Hannibal looks at his watch, sits awkwardly in his chair, a bloody scowl on his face because the object of his desire never showed up, and then he proceeds to drive nearly two hours just to find out where Will is. We’re not even delving into the other scene where Will drives all the way up to Hannibal’s home to announce… that he won’t be attending Hannibal’s dinner gathering. Are you kidding me, Fuller? These motherfuckers were head over heels in love from day motherfucking one. Thank you for coming to my TED talk, y’all.

[centuriesoldmenace]

Hannibal saying "stay with me" and Will saying "where else would I go?" while Hannibal tenderly wraps up Will's bleeding hands, reblog if you agree

[centuriesoldmenace]

How do you deal with the abusive aspect of Hannigram relationship ? Despite everything, Hannibal is cold manipulative killer who gaslighted, brutalised Will more than once. Let his encephalitis almost kill him off, sent killers for him. Stole his lover (Alana. He attacked his wife and child. After the attack on Molly it would be very jarring if the producers show a cordial relationship between Hannibal and Will. I still find it hard that the show romanticises violence and abusive relationship

hmm well I mean I feel like while I agree with the statements you made about what happened in the show I disagree with every piece of analysis you’ve made except that hannigram is abusive: Hannibal is not cold, he did not steal Will’s lover (Will had absolutely no claim to Alana, who had specifically said she did not want to date him), and the show does not romanticize abuse

Hannibal has definitely done a lot of extremely fucked up stuff to Will, and I have no interest in suggesting otherwise. It’s definitely an abusive relationship that’s unhealthy for both of them. But the show doesn’t present this like it’s a good thing? The show in no way indicates that that’s desirable or even acceptable??

They both have repeatedly tried to leave each other and to kill each other mostly because they know the relationship they have is bad for them and they wanted out of it. Even at the very end of the show when Will accepted that he enjoyed killing with Hannibal, he tried to kill the both of them so he wouldn’t have to face actually Being With the man who had tortured him and killed (and tried to kill) people he loved

The show goes out of its way to show us that Will finds the abusive parts about being with Hannibal horrible and exhausting and generally Not Desirable, and I think based on Hannibal’s actions it seems he’s also no longer interested in having an abusive relationship with Will, and perhaps even regrets some of the abuse he’s caused Will (if only bc he regrets that it’s distanced Will from him). It’s not romanticizing abuse to show two people in an abusive relationship?? It would only be romanticizing it if the narrative suggested that they were somehow a relationship to aspire to, which they are plainly not by any means

When I imagine what their relationship looks like going forward, I imagine that there are a lot of very difficult conversations that they’ll have to have if they have any hope of being anything like happy with each other, and I imagine that they will continue to hurt each other in various ways despite no longer particularly wanting to

I think it is an inherently abusive and violent relationship and that it will continue to be such, no matter how hard they try to be good to each other. They’ve both hurt each other too much for either of them to be able to simply set that aside and move on without psychological ramifications, and they are violent people—I imagine that most of the intent behind the violence against each other will become more friendly, but I do imagine that they will continue to be violent with each other forever. I don’t think either of them wants to actually abuse the other anymore, though: I’m sure they’ll still play their games, but they’ll just be games for the sake of playing, not intended to cause actual distress or harm

How do I deal with the abusive part? Well I mean I enjoy playing around with a couple that’s allowed to be pretty messy and horrible with each other, and I also enjoy writing them trying to work through the worst of the knots they’ve tied themselves in. There’s something I find particularly compelling about two people in an abusive relationship who are trying really hard to make the relationship as healthy as it can be, while still being incapable of pulling it entirely out of its abusive roots. That’s usually how I prefer to write them bc it’s neat to explore

The relationship is shitty. It sucks. They both know that it’s shitty and founded on even shittier foundations. They both also know that no matter how hard they try, they’re both going to keep coming back to this relationship until they die, and they might as well try to make it as not-shitty as they can since they’re stuck here and neither of them really wants to live without the other. It’s all they have, their only shot at anything approaching happiness, and they’re going to give it the best shot they can bc they’re both too tired to keep fighting it

#i love this analysis #hannibal #hannigram #hannibal lecter #will graham #hannibal nbc

[centuriesoldmenace]

Also if I can add an addition to this, from my interpretation after finally rewatching Hannibal again and seeing the dynamic between the two is that it’s animalistic, this relationship has never tried to appear as anything normal, the show runners and cast have never portrayed this as the ‘typical’ romance that you would expect to see in other shows. It is a relationship of blood and bone, of aggression and claim. They have never worked or kept in the boundaries of what is convential and deemed as ‘normal’. Which characters within the show had always highlighted the deadly courtship between the two.

A courtship which resembles less of an everyday love and more banal and animal. It’s spoken through dead bodies, killing/harming of suitors deemed weaker, lesser then what the other can provide. Example of this can be Hannibal getting the red dragon to attack Molly. Both are put up against each other to show they are worthy for the other, as In an animal world, one dictated by instincts they have to be the strongest, best in order to ‘mate’. This love is one of claws and teeth, no they aren’t perfect, they are each other’s destruction but its what their individual darkness craves. By the end of the show it is clear that this is no longer a ‘morally right’ character being coerced and abused by the ‘evil sadistic’ character. They have become as bad as each other, they manipulate, scar and challenge. But in my interpretation I have used about this being an animal love then that is what it entails, there is blood and cruelty but there is the knowledge that they are the only ones for each other, that will accept them in every aspect of who they are and who is worthy of them, both Will and Hannibal have become equals much as life long mates would.

It is not dealt with flowers and chocolate, yet it became a courtship both responded to nonetheless. What other characters clearly show as something which they don’t understand, the sudden dread of Alana recognising the body was in fact a courtship gift [typical in the animal kingdom] and then Dr Chilton making the comment that what Hannibal and Will are doing to each other are ‘tantamount to flirtation’. It is made clear that this courtship, love is abnormal but it is also recognised that it’s the dance that both Will and Hannibal partake in equally, it had started off admittedly being as any abusive relationship would but that all changed when both actively became apart of that courtship. Yes, Will did this to lure Hannibal but it had been clear that he had wanted to run away with Hannibal. As already reiterated it is a dangerous, toxic love but it is what both, on common grounds cannot live without and they may tear and harm each other, but they cannot live without or kill the other. It’s in all aspects a mutually assured destruction.

How do you deal with the abusive aspect of Hannigram relationship ? Despite everything, Hannibal is cold manipulative killer who gaslighted, brutalised Will more than once. Let his encephalitis almost kill him off, sent killers for him. Stole his lover (Alana. He attacked his wife and child. After the attack on Molly it would be very jarring if the producers show a cordial relationship between Hannibal and Will. I still find it hard that the show romanticises violence and abusive relationship

hmm well I mean I feel like while I agree with the statements you made about what happened in the show I disagree with every piece of analysis you’ve made except that hannigram is abusive: Hannibal is not cold, he did not steal Will’s lover (Will had absolutely no claim to Alana, who had specifically said she did not want to date him), and the show does not romanticize abuse

Hannibal has definitely done a lot of extremely fucked up stuff to Will, and I have no interest in suggesting otherwise. It’s definitely an abusive relationship that’s unhealthy for both of them. But the show doesn’t present this like it’s a good thing? The show in no way indicates that that’s desirable or even acceptable??

They both have repeatedly tried to leave each other and to kill each other mostly because they know the relationship they have is bad for them and they wanted out of it. Even at the very end of the show when Will accepted that he enjoyed killing with Hannibal, he tried to kill the both of them so he wouldn’t have to face actually Being With the man who had tortured him and killed (and tried to kill) people he loved

The show goes out of its way to show us that Will finds the abusive parts about being with Hannibal horrible and exhausting and generally Not Desirable, and I think based on Hannibal’s actions it seems he’s also no longer interested in having an abusive relationship with Will, and perhaps even regrets some of the abuse he’s caused Will (if only bc he regrets that it’s distanced Will from him). It’s not romanticizing abuse to show two people in an abusive relationship?? It would only be romanticizing it if the narrative suggested that they were somehow a relationship to aspire to, which they are plainly not by any means

When I imagine what their relationship looks like going forward, I imagine that there are a lot of very difficult conversations that they’ll have to have if they have any hope of being anything like happy with each other, and I imagine that they will continue to hurt each other in various ways despite no longer particularly wanting to

I think it is an inherently abusive and violent relationship and that it will continue to be such, no matter how hard they try to be good to each other. They’ve both hurt each other too much for either of them to be able to simply set that aside and move on without psychological ramifications, and they are violent people—I imagine that most of the intent behind the violence against each other will become more friendly, but I do imagine that they will continue to be violent with each other forever. I don’t think either of them wants to actually abuse the other anymore, though: I’m sure they’ll still play their games, but they’ll just be games for the sake of playing, not intended to cause actual distress or harm

How do I deal with the abusive part? Well I mean I enjoy playing around with a couple that’s allowed to be pretty messy and horrible with each other, and I also enjoy writing them trying to work through the worst of the knots they’ve tied themselves in. There’s something I find particularly compelling about two people in an abusive relationship who are trying really hard to make the relationship as healthy as it can be, while still being incapable of pulling it entirely out of its abusive roots. That’s usually how I prefer to write them bc it’s neat to explore

The relationship is shitty. It sucks. They both know that it’s shitty and founded on even shittier foundations. They both also know that no matter how hard they try, they’re both going to keep coming back to this relationship until they die, and they might as well try to make it as not-shitty as they can since they’re stuck here and neither of them really wants to live without the other. It’s all they have, their only shot at anything approaching happiness, and they’re going to give it the best shot they can bc they’re both too tired to keep fighting it

#hannibal #hannigram #hannibal lecter #will graham #hannibal nbc #it’s such a complex relationship that cant be viewed through the lens of convential society #because the show is not the place to be if you are looking for that #they court like animals

[centuriesoldmenace]

I have not only risen from the dead but decided to post to finally make my way back into the world of Hannibal. My god did I forget how great it is and I am so glad it’s trending again. Let the murder gays commence, I need more content.

#hannibal #hannibal lecter #will graham #fannibals #hannibal season 4 #hannigram #please for the love of all stop these gays #murder husbands #i came out of my dwelling to post only this