#GIVE ME KOSEM & TURHAN NOW

[fymagnificentwomcn]

If you were the writer or season 2 and if "Farya" didn't exist .. How would've you portrayed Ayşe's character and her relationship with murad and with kosem ? (Sorry for my horrible English)

Hello! That’s such a good question, thank you.

I remember how the fandom was divided by “ship wars” when MYK s2 went on air, but personally I wanted to see more of a partnership than an epic love story. That’s way more realistic and interesting to me as a viewer; I think the rivalry and the unnecessary romance was one of the reasons why the plot for season 2 ended up getting wrong in a lot of ways. They had a good show and a rich account of past events, it didn’t make sense to do the ‘history-repeats-itself’ they decided to go for. I mean, when you watch episode 1 you see all the wasted potential in Ayse’s arc, it’s just sad. 

So with this in mind, I still stand by what Margot and I talked about a while ago and she decided to make this amazing post. In details this represents everything that could have been in Ayse’s storyline. Hope it helps. :)

- Mai

 I agree with Mai - Farya brought nothing of importance to the show despite all the screentime she occupied and all efforts of screenwriters to make us love her.

The fact that we know so little about Ayse and Ayse/Murad relations offered writers a lot of creative license and as such opportunity to bring something fresh to the table.

Getting rid of Farya and all her nonsensical plots would be the first step, of course. Show me a Farya-related plot that made sense and had actual meaning for overall storyline - there is none. 

Second, now it is time for small digression - I find the repeated romantisation of slave/master relationships that often includes fairytale elements to be the biggest flaw of both shows. The shows did well in being critical about many aspects of pathologies of that system to the extent that is hard to find in other shows on the Ottoman Empire and which even made Erdogan angry (compare with MBCF with all its super!Mehmed stuff, and I don’t even want to mention TRT propaganda shows), but when it comes to (especially long-term) trauma of women who suddenly lost everything and became slaves used for reproduction and sexually pleasing a man for whom they were captured, they did very badly. They even portrayed the trauma of male slaves better thanks to a complex portrayal of Ibrahim’s character in the original MY, with the lingering trauma contributing heavily to his downfall.

Instead of trauma, we have too many master-slave romances. I can only recall Sadika crying after Suleyman forced her to sleep with him back in MY S1. Usually after a night spent with THE GUY concubines are shown to be on cloud nine. And in some cases it turns into love and if life’s not perfect that’s not because of any long-term trauma, but only because of power struggles. Sometimes they even portray what pretty much has a lot of out-of-textbook elements of Stockholm syndrome to later not acknowledge it properly  because of rushing though the plot and messy execution, see Nasya going quickly from “I’m not anyone’s property” to “I belong to him” because she needed to stay because of pure motives. I get it now more what they wanted to convey, especially in contrast with what we’ve seen later and the darkness of the ending, but still.. you could have done it better. Man, even Christian princesses want nothing more but to become the Sultan’s mistress (lbr Murad wouldn’t have married Farya without the attack). A lot of salt, yes, but this issue bothers me a lot and I had an Anon on fatihdaily expressing such worries too (thank you for an excellent ask, Anon!).

Back on track a bit - even if some of those women eventually developed affection for their masters because it was their only chance for some love or due to Stockholm syndrome (remember Safiye’s “only love may make living in this palace bearable” - if this does not clearly point to Stockholm syndrome than IDK, BUT ACKNOWLEDGE THIS BETTER.

And Murad’s harem is perfect for that because he truly wasn’t the romantic type or one for romantic bonds with women. He was truly the guy who used harem for reproduction and sexual satisfaction, if he managed to even grace it with his presence. Give me Ayse and Murad who aren’t in love with each other, but she’s the one who manages to earn his respect as perhaps the only woman after his mother. Give me Ayse, who in her loneliness tries to get close to Murad because he’s the only person she can truly get close to. He does sleep with her after all, kisses her, perhaps gives her some presents? Who is to quench her loneliness if not this man? Show me Ayse who partners with Murad because she tries to find purpose in this new life, at least for their kids. Show me Ayse who’s aware that she could be much happier elsewhere, but must try to build a good future for herself where she is; who would love to abandon this life if it was possible. But do not show me woman a bitter woman scorned because dude rejects her  first .

Now for character development: give me Ayse who grows bold enough to form her own network of relationships completely independently of Murad. Who, while at first scared of her mother-in-law, actually realises that she has much more in common with this woman than with her “partner”, a “shadow of God on Earth”, who has a lot given to him on a silver platter just because he bears the title of a padisah. And yes, we have practically next to none positive mother-in-law and daughter-in-law relationships in MY/K, and since Kosem/Turhan has to be antagonistic eventually, why don’t give Kosem a nice relationship with Ayse that would be more than just “we tolerate each other” and that would never have anything hidden, like Turhan becoming close to Kosem to eventually use it against her mother-in-law? Give us something totally genuine, like Mahidevran/Mihrunnisa in original MY, just this time between two historical characters. 

At the same time, Ayse’s relationship with Murad would deteriorate due to his increasing cruelty and alcohol addiction. This guy is definitely not a romantic hero out of every girl’s dreams. Bah, he’s not even a nice guy. And if you show abuse, again acknowledge it properly, without dumb lines like Madame Marguerite, who usually tried to knock some sense into Farya, telling her that “Forgive him he tried to kill you for what was mainly his fault, poor Murad has so many things to worry about”(WTF???). Make her drift away from him as much as she can OUT OF HER OWN WILL, not because he rejects her. I love Margot’s idea about Ayse realising he is trash before other big rival comes along. Since Murad likely had more than one concubine and one more haseki - bring them, but show Ayse not giving a fuck at all at this point. More - why not make them bond over their own misery? Murad descends into alcohol downward spiral that makes him spend much more time on long drinking parties with buds and killing or hurting people sometimes just because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time, so USE THIS OPPORTUNITY to show scared and disappointed women teaming up to survive his jackass behaviour. 

We all know Ayse would eventually lose her sons, but I would love for her to also have daughters, so that she wouldn’t be so  alone because historically she lived really long. And yeah I wouldn’t mind to see her being happy to leave Topkapi eventually, I don’t mean here being happy upon a death of man who after all was the father of her kids, but relieved to be free of this palace at last. Challenge the “Palace of Tears” concept.

As for her personality… pretty much what Margot described. I would love her to be more quietly strong, to contrast nicely with the imposing presence of the powerhouse that Kosem is. Clever and perceptive, but not a schemer. I’d love to see her use more emotional intelligence than pure cunningness. And I honestly feel Leyla Feray would be good to reflect such personality.

Oh, all the dreams *sighs*

Thank you once more for a great question :)

- Joanna

#haseki ayse sultan #muhteşem yüzyıl kösem #magnificent century kosem #answered #sorry for wait mai wrote her answer two days ago but i was busy