#so it's easier to just be like roy doesn't like me because he's an asshole. nate doesn't like me because he'd spineless and weak.

[lunar-years]

i'm still very sad they didn't do anything at all in season 3 with the Nate & Roy dynamic they'd been building off in the background for the first two seasons, because the layers there were really fascinating.

Starting with like, Roy being the only one to vocally and actively stand up for Nate in season one. At the time I think Nate was appreciative, but I think in hindsight, (rightly or wrongly) it quickly morphs into this mindset that Roy is sort of patronizing and has long viewed him as this weak thing in need of protecting. It feels (in Nate's mind), like Roy swept in to play the savior when it convinced him, but even that was based more around his hatred of Jamie than it was about liking Nate. And we see Nate later think himself proven correct in that thinking after he kisses Keeley and confesses and Roy...barely reacts. Roy, who is furious and angry about everything and everyone every day of his life, is suddenly like "Oh it's fine" when Nate has kissed his girlfriend. Nick Mohammed's commentary that Nate actively saw that as a micro-aggression was so fascinating and makes a lot of sense.

Then you have Roy, who did see season one Nate as someone to protect, but then was also driven to his best performance on the pitch during his final season by Nate's no-bullshit speech before the Everton game. That scene is so effective because it's such a jarring departure for the entire team from how they've previously viewed Nate, and it works for Roy especially because Roy respects people who don't give in to the intimidation he's constantly goading them with and instead tells it to him straight, no words minced (this is why Roy gets along so well with people like Rebecca, Keeley, and Ted, and why the breakthrough moment with Jamie is Jamie calling him out at the gala, etc.). I think there IS a part of Roy that doesn't respect Nate in season 1, which is why he later reacts how he does to Nate's kiss with Keeley, and it's a mindset he's vindicated by when Nate turns on Ted. But that also gets all mixed up with moments like the Everton, with the evidence of Nate being such a good strategist that Roy later finds himself deeply envious of after becoming a coach himself.

During the time they are both coaching together, there's a dynamic there where they both (I think) believe the other person doesn't take them seriously, and it's rooted in a little bit of truth (on both sides!!) that's then wildly exacerbated by their own insecurities. Like, Nate is intimated by the fact that Roy is this rich famous hotshot publicly beloved, so that it feels way out of Nate's league to even be interacting with him. At the same time, he also thinks Roy is a bit of an asshole who doesn't see him as a threat because he doesn't take him seriously, and is (fairly) offended by it. Meanwhile, Roy is intimated by Nate because Nate is so clearly so intelligent, which I think is something Roy is insecure about in general, given his own education being superseded early on by football. He sees Nate as being a more adequate coach than himself because of this. But he also thinks Nate is spineless and whatever respect he had for him (fairly) dissolves completely after Nate goes to the press about Ted.

So it's like, this messy mixture where they both have something the other desperately wants but they can't see at all why the other would possibly be envious of them due to their own insecurities. They are, imo, the two most insecure people on the show in completely different ways. They hate themselves far more than they hate each other, yet they displace the weight of that feeling onto each other; Roy by treating Nate with indifference and Nate by dismissing Roy in his head as an asshole hotshot whose had a great life handed to him and doesn't even appreciate it, whereas Nate has to fight tooth and nail to find success. And it all boils down to them not understanding one another while also having a lot in common under the surface.

Anyway, I think it would be super interesting to see how their friendship or even just their relationship as coworkers develops after season 3, as they both make active attempts at overcoming their insecurities and doing better by themselves and each other.

#ted lasso #roy kent #nate shelley #ted lasso meta #been thinking about this a lot this morning for some reason! #the juicy bit is. They are both RIGHT in thinking the other doesn't respect them. at least a little. #and part of the lack of respect IS because of Roy's ego and Nate thinking of himself as twice as smart as Roy with half the payoff for it #roy is full of himself nate is deeply bitter and it results in unfairly thinking of the other as lesser in some way #but there are also real and valid reasons they lack respect for the other too. rooted in their respective bad actions #ie. nate going to trent roy's microaggressions at nate #and acknowledging why the other might not like them for THOSE reasons gets a little too close to home #as to why they don't like /themselves #so it's easier to just be like roy doesn't like me because he's an asshole. nate doesn't like me because he'd spineless and weak. #idk if that makes sense of if i'm just rambling at this point but like. TRUST ME. #it's a fascinating dynamic. #Nate haters don’t interact this is coming from a place of love for two flawed imperfect characters <3

[ineffablecolors]

Visited the roykeeley tag and oh boy. People sure are angry at Roy...

Call me crazy but I think people still have the right to break up with their partners? No matter the reason?? Like... breaking up with someone doesn't make you a villain or an asshole? Since when are people obliged to stay in a relationship that isn't fulfilling them??

And you know what does make you an asshole? Complaining about your partner behind their back to all your mutual friends and coworkers, to their boss and someone they most definitely don't like... about something you never even complained to them about... and then screaming at them about it... I still can't believe they tried to sell that as no big deal and SUCCEEDED

Roy had one blunder of the same magnitude and that was how he reacted to the leak and he wrote a fucking apology letter about it (and about a bunch of other stuff he had no reason to apologise for)!

I love a lot of what Ted Lasso did with its female characters and I love how strong and independent they are but man, do I hate that, unlike Rebecca, Keeley suffered from an inability to see when she was wrong unless someone else spelled it out for her (like Roy had to at the gala) and never apologised for her blunders in their relationship after that, while they made Roy bent over backwards constantly to apologise for... *checks notes* not being able to read his girlfriend's mind and not staying with her when the relationship didn't feel right anymore...

This is why I went from shipping them so much to believing Keeley is completely wrong for Roy. He was simply always too low on her priority list and it makes me so mad when people say HE didn't deserve her? In what world?

The fandom seems to do what the show did - treat Keeley as if she could do no wrong and she's too good and pure for everyone, and I'm sorry but that's just not true. She's just as messy and cruel without meaning to sometimes and in massive need of therapy as everyone else.

I was rooting for her, I was rooting for them but the same way most shows fall into the horrible habit of demonising female characters, this show and fandom have fallen into the only somewhat less infuriating habit of acting as if Keeley could do no wrong and I've ignored it and a lot of fanfic she's in because a character who's always a saint ain't exactly fun but I draw the line at everyone and their grandma throwing Roy under the bus just because he had the misfortune of actually admitting his flaws and apologising for them and trying to work on being better (instead of using the much easier method of having the writers sweep every wrongdoing under the carpet).

#roy kent #anti roykeeley #not really. i shipped them so much but the discourse where keeley can do no wrong drives me insane #anti keeley jones #again not really. i love her as a character. i dont love her for roy #this is why i cant read much rjk fanfic #i hate how people paint keeley as a fucking saint

[powderblueblood]

HELLO?????? What a fucking gangbuster chapter jesusssss, deeply obsessed with the Machiavellian Logan Roy like presence Ray has like he really steps into a room and you know you can expect emotional terror 10/10 intro love it

Also i.e Lacey and Eddie I thought it was so good that her starting the story as the emotionally closed off and, well, bitchy one (said with a lot of love and light) was the one to actually crack first and actually vocalize her feelings (obsessed with the image of lacey lying in bed and sitting up suddenly when she remembered that she forgot to break up with her current boyfriend)

Loved the breakfast club rendition too and tbh lacey girl after my own heart I too would have let the fight play out because of the gossip (btw so many thoughts on post asshole Steve and how without the Dustin and the upside down his redemption manifestss like I'll run out of space)

To conclude and because I can't help myself I'm adding my two cents vis a vis taylor swift x edlacey: cowboy like me, the lakes, antihero (more so lacey), you're on your own kid (in bold because yeah), and the last great American dynasty

me fucking fistpumping YEAH IT'S GIVING LOGAN ROY IT'S GIVING

the act of hating ray is so much easier from a distance, the prospect of doing it up close is petrifying, lacy's no longer able to choke herself down, it's cooperation or betrayal with him there's no in between, UGH UGH I'M SICK

YES lacy coming out the gate with 'i miss you. fix that shit' because eddie's the one person she really really doesn't have to wear any kind of mask for, her old tricks don't work and she doesn't even want to use them with him and in his heart of hearts he's definitely like me! i melted her! me, the living butane torch, me! but he's not gloating as much as he's googly-eyed. the luckiest boy this side of hell.

SCREAMING TOO THE COLLEGE BOY WILL HAVE HIS USES....... LETS JUST. LETS SAY THAT

literally get in my dms with post asshole steve thoughts i always want to talk about it. always.

and wait now SINCE i'm bored and job hunting i made something vis a vis the swiftification of edlacy because you and everyone else in my inbox are so fucking right for this i swear

please stand by

#powder room talk #slowdancer #hai brainrot

[thevindicativevordan]

Who's your least favorite superhero?

Green Arrow. His brand of smug scumbag limousine liberal is very realistic, a little too realistic given he strongly reminds me of a relative of mine whom I'm on bad terms with. Doesn't prevent me from enjoying some of his stories every now and then, I greatly enjoyed Ben Percy's Rebirth run, but it also means I enjoy seeing Ollie suffer because boy oh boy can he be a real prick.

Of course that same prickish nature is why people like Ollie, reading him pontificate gives Green Arrow a very distinct personality, and it's tempered by him owning what he is. He's an asshole, a fuck up, and a spoiled rich kid by his own admission, with his marooning on the island being his "come to Karl Marx" moment. Give him an opening and he will rant for hours about the evils of capitalism, only pausing to acknowledge that yes he is aware that he's been a beneficiary of that same system. That self-awareness about his roots, even if he often lacks self-awareness about his current status, pushes him to be a better person than he used to be, to seek redemption for his original sin of being born into wealth. Everyone loves their hot takes about how Batman could just fix Gotham with his billions, while Ollie get's barely any attention despite frequently trying to do just that. His charm doesn't quite outweigh his asshole status for me personally, but clearly many others feel differently, and it helps that other characters in his orbit like Black Canary or Hal are quick to call him out when he slips morally.

Which frequently he does, chiefly in his personal life. Unfaithful to Dinah, a deadbeat father to Connor, and a failed mentor to Roy, Green Arrow is often the Justice Leaguer with the biggest clay feet despite all his moralizing. Yet that may very well be key to his popularity, very few of us can hope to match the moral example of the Trinity, but Green Arrow stands as an example of how even tremendously flawed individuals can have a seat at the table in the Watchtower or the Hall of Justice. The Justice League needs an anchor, and Green Arrow has good cause to fill that role give he so often needs anchors of his own.

Background aside I've always had an easer time buying Ollie in the "underdog" role compared to Batman. Making do with just his archery skills and will, he's out to fight the elite and the criminal elements alike, and it's easier to see him as the David in that fight when he's not being shilled as both a top ten world-class fighter and the second smartest man in the world. Stubbornness more than intellect or even skill are what carries Ollie to the finish line, he simply won't give up whether it's a physical or verbal battle he's engaged in, and that's a trait many can relate to. Of course having an arrow for every conceivable situation does help, especially when it's some ridiculously impractical arrow straight out of the Silver Age.

Don't know if there's a story out there that can help him rise in the ranks, but I have occasionally put my dislike of Green Arrow aside before, and likely will again. Would be nice if they stopped pitting him and Superman against each other since that doesn't help endear me to him, but I try to check out new stories he's in, and see if anyone can offer a take on him that will help him rise in my hero ranking.

#green arrow