#why would someone want to harass people over a FICTIONAL ship
Its ironic that this person blocked me when... I would NEVER want anyone to be attacked over Stolitz.
Did they make this as a response to the people who dislike Stolitz? Because.... most of us never want to directly attack others in the first place. We are just saying our own thoughts on our own blogs with little to no discourse besides maybe a few direct responses. But thats it!! The fandom has ironically been MORE peaceful since episode 5.
Basically what im trying to say that if ANYONE attacked people over a ship with fictional characters then they’re the worst filth on this hellsite.
NO ONE SHOULD EVER HAVE TO TOLERATE WITCHHUNTING DOXXING NASTY REBLOGS RUDE ASKS NONE OF THAT SHIT. AND IF ANYONE DID DO THIS AT ONE POINT AFTER READING OUR POSTS FUCK EM!
THAT SHIT IS NEVER OK.
These fictional characters arent more valuable than the human lives behind the screen. So again, I find it to be very ironic that this person got pissed at me because in reality.... I actually agree with everything this post is saying! 🤦🏾♀️
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hey, so sorry you got attacked. it's good you didnt respond to them, that would of just made it 10x worse. it seems you were quickly introduced to what fandom is like nowadays, especially on twitter.
just wanted to let you know that shipping is taken really seriously, people have been sent death threats and severely bullied over shipping usuk and spamano, these are seen as unacceptable now (I'm not overexaggerating.) No matter how much you try to explain to people that you dont see them as family, they will never listen to your side of view. shipping these things will quickly get you labelled as extremely terrible stuff. these people water down words and make it seem like extremely immoral things can be compared to looking at drawings or shipping.
ive had people tell me that I was just as bad as my abuser for shipping usuk. that i was continuing the cycle of abuse.
They value the feelings of fictional characters over the feelings of real people. they assume the worst of you and think that whatever you like in fiction is what you want to see in real life.
Thank you for your message. I didn’t want to answer them because they just didn’t need my opinion on the matter. It really looked like they had their idea of me changed just because of something I ship as if shipping was the whole point of Hetalia.
I was watching this show when some of them were still in diapers, they think they know so much more than me, that their values are so much better. They don’t understand that people have a connection through certain ships that have been together with them for years. It seems crazy to me to attack someone over a ship, I mean we had ship wars, we had antis, but we never really had this mindset of sheep all following the same moral code and harassing people who don’t follow it. Imagine meeting a Hetalian IRL and just attacking them? No one would, it’s the power of the Internet and being anonymous. What would they parent think? Why are they even cyberbullying?
I don’t hold grudges against them that’s just not who I am. I use to spam their curious cats with happy messages to hopefully make them feel better so I hope someone will take over me to keep the love going.
I’m very sad people have to “hide” what they ship out of fear of being attacked by their so-called “friends”. I saw on my alt that a few people were being nice to me and I appreciate it very much.
I think I’ll go back to the French fandom for a bit, there are fewer people but they don’t shame people for your ships.
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Plastron Interviews SadoraNortica (Updated 3/23)
Updated 3/23/21 with a few follow-up questions! :)
The first in a series of interviews with writers/artists in the TMNT fandom. My intention with these interviews is to shine a spotlight on those whose work has had a positive influence both on myself and others in the fandom.
The opinions stated by the interviewees are theirs and YOU WILL RESPECT THEM, even if you do not share the same opinions/preferences, etc. If you harass the interviewee, expect to be reported. Please note that many if not all of the people I choose to interview are, like me, pro-ship and pro-tcest. If you don’t like that, please do not read it.
Plastron: What is your handle/username you are most commonly known as?
SadoraNortica: I've used both Applepye and SadoraNortica. I've dropped Applepye recently.
P: On which websites did you or do you post your work? Are there any active links new readers could follow to find your work?
SN: I used to post on Inkbunny and Deviant Art. I've deleted DA and only post new content on AO3.
P: What was your introduction to TMNT?
SN: I'm old. I saw the pilot episodes on the 87 series.
P: When did you begin participating in the fandom?
SN: I started writing in 2012, when I found other writers and artist on DA.
P: Do you find that you have a personal favorite or “definitive” version of TMNT?
SN: I find 2K3 easier to write but I love them all.
P: How has your view of the fandom changed over the years?
SN: It used to be more, live and let live, It's only recently been full of a lot of discord. There's always been complainers but it seems to be so much more now.
P: A specific work of yours (“First Day of Spring”) stands out to me and has really influenced me creatively. You established a dynamic between the four turtles that influenced my view of Donatello as fairly submissive. You showed how Mikey could also be dominant in some cases in a believable way due to animal mating instincts, but you made it so believable with his playful nature. Your writing seamlessly incorporates the emotional and psychological core of the characters’ interactions with one another, but you layer it with molten-hot smut of the kinky and dub-con variety.
P: Would you mind talking a little about how you approached those aspects of your writing?
SN: For First Day of Spring, I wanted to show that their hormonal minds were hard to control, it diminished their empathy a bit, and that it progressively has gotten worse as they got older. I had implied that Donny had been hurt the year before because of it. I like to think of Mikey as the Alpha sometimes. He's laid back because he doesn't have competition. He sees his brothers as his. In 2K3 we are shown many times that when pushed, Mikey can do great things. Even Splinter points out that if he simply applied himself, he would be the best fighter. He doesn't care to be the best so he allows Leo and Raph to fight over it.
P: Do you have any advice for any beginners who want to write fiction/draw?
SN: Advice? Block people you don't want to interact with. Don't be afraid to write or draw what you like. If you see something that inspires you, reach out to the creator. Most artists love fan fics based off their works and most writers love to see fan art.
P: How do you stay motivated, or cope with writers’/artists’ block?
SN: Motivation is hard lately. I still have ideas and want to share them but it's harder to do. I think it's because of the shift in the fandom. A lot of the artists and writers I considered friends have left. I used to see art every day and that helped to inspire me. I don't see it as much anymore. :( Taking some time off has helped. Getting wonderful comments on old fics helps too. :D
P: What character or characters do you enjoy writing the most?
SN: I love torturing Raph. I just do. I pile so much trauma on him. He is my favorite after all.
P: What character or characters do you identify with the most? Does that influence how you write them?
SN: I guess you could say that I connect with Raph the most. I was a temperamental child, quick to anger. I have it more under control now.
P: Do you have any of YOUR fics you'd like to shine a spotlight on? Maybe some that you'd welcome more comments on? (I think this would be good to ask, because it seems everyone has at least a few works they'd like to get more comments on but maybe it's older or somehow hasn't been as visible!)
SN: One favorite of my fics is What if...? I really liked doing a twist on the original story. It's an earlier one so it's full of mistakes but I love the story. Oroku Saki wasn't a jerk. Yoshi and Shen lived and were part of the Foot Clan. They raised Mikey, Leo, and Don. Raph was raised by the Jones family. Also T-cest. :D
Plastron's note: What If...? by SadoraNortica
P: If you were in full creative control, what's your idea of the ULTIMATE, perfect TMNT movie (and/or TV series)?
SN: Movie? I would use the Turtles from the Batman v TMNT movie. It would be a more mature, direct to DVD kind of thing. It would be an extended adaptation of Raphael Meets His Match from the original series, only a lot darker. The tickets for a costume party cruise would be a gift from Bruce for all 4 Turtles and the bad guy would be Stockman. I just really want a good canon Raph/Mona story. So, if given a chance, that's what I would make.
SN: If making a series, I would adapt Feud (sadly omitting the t-cest part) The Foot Clan would be an organization that hunts Yokai. Shredder and Splinter's names are earned from their hunting skills. Karai and Saki would be married. Lotus and Nagi would be their children. Yoshi was sent to New York after Shen's death. Saki blamed Yoshi for her death, Yoshi blamed Saki. The truth is a mystery that will run through the series. Another mystery is that one of the Turtles is Yoshi and Shen's biological son but Splinter (Yoshi) doesn't know which one. I would have Bishop, Hun, Garbage Man, Stockman, Draxum, Big Mama, to name a few.
P: Okay, let’s have a little fun. What do you find most sexy about the turtles?
SN: Their personalities. They are strong, yet kind. And you know those muscles are as hard as rock.
P: Which turtle do you think would be the best leader, if not Leo?
SN: It's hard to say who would best lead if Leo wasn't. Raph is too protective and would have a hard time delegating a dangerous task to one of his brothers even if they are better suited for it. Don over thinks things. Mikey is too impulsive.
P: Favorite Ships?
SN: T-cest: Raph/Don, Leo/Mikey
Slash: Don/Leatherhead, Leo/Usagi
P: Favorite Kinks or Themes in fics/art?
SN: I love first time stories. Not just first time together but first time ever.
SN: 2012 Raph has a scar between his eyes, and bad knees. Mikey is actually the best fighter but too laid back to care about it. After Splinter read them Beauty and the Beast as children, Raph got it in his head that they were cursed and that a kiss from a princess would break that curse. So he started watching princess movies for research and ended up really liking them.
Leo likes to give up control and be bound during sex. He's not in to pain, just bondage.
All the Turtles are good at cooking, they all just have different strengths so focus on different types of cooking. Leo follows the recipe to the letter. Mikey is a bit more experimental. Raph likes to grill. Don likes sweet.
P: Wrapping up: Anything you’d like to say to the fandom in general?
SN: Advice: Don't feel bad about blocking random people. If someone you enjoy following is liking and sharing from someone that stresses you out, simply block the one who stresses you out. Don't call out people who block you, they had their reasons. Do them a favor and block them back. Do what makes you happy in the fandom and it's okay to leave when your time in it has run its course. You can always come back if you miss it. ♡
UPDATED March 23 '21 with a few follow-up questions and responses from SadoraNortica! I hope you'll enjoy! :)
Follow up questions:
P: Since you grew up with the '87 show, do you prefer '87 Mona or 2k12 Mona? What did you think of the interpretation from 2k12? It would be awesome to see more mature direct to video DVDs like you mentioned.
SN: I like Mutated/Scientist Mona (’87) over Alien/Warrior Mona (2k12). I like the brain/brawn relationship dynamic over warriors/warrior. I did love 2012 Mona just not as much as 87. I’m still waiting for her to be done right.
P: With your answer about "loving to torture Raph," (hehe, I’m the same with Don) that would be a great opportunity to have a standalone darker Raph-centric story, or the Mona/Raph story you mentioned!
P: What kind of future do you imagine for Raph, if you had to pick a canon storyline, or one of your own?
SN: As much as I like to torture Raph, I still want him to have a happy ending. No matter what canon he’s in. It’s why I can’t read The Last Ronin. That story is the opposite of what I want to see for any of them.
Mikey’s True Potential…
P: That's an interesting point you make about Mikey being so laid back that he just doesn't care to compete for the position or title of "best" fighter. It's amusing in 2k3 when he seems to beat Raph easily.
P: Do you have any wishlist items for Mikey-centric storylines in a potential movie or standalone series?
SN: I would have loved to see the Mikey-centric sequel to the 2k7 movie*. To see him fight to save his family would have been great.
*Plastron’s Note: Directly copied from the TMNT (2007) film Wikipedia—
In 2007 Kevin Munroe stated that he would like to direct a possible sequel to TMNT, possibly involving the return of the Shredder. Munroe planned a trilogy. TMNT 2 would have loosely adapted the Turtles’ 13-part comic book saga "City At War". Michelangelo would have felt rejected and joined the Foot Clan, while the Turtles would have traveled to Japan and would have crossed paths with Karai and Shredder. TMNT 3 would have featured the Triceratons as well as the Technodrome’s arrival from Dimension X. Munroe wanted Michael Clarke Duncan to voice the Triceraton's leader, Commander Mozar. In an interview, Peter Laird stated he was interested in the idea of having the next film be a live-action and CGI hybrid film, with the Turtles rendered in CGI and Sarah Michelle Gellar and Chris Evans reprising their TMNT roles in live-action.
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alright, let me show you guys some perfectly Normal and Moral people from one (!) of the callout posts about me
may i remind you, this is all over some damn drawings of a baby minotaur drawing with chalk
above, people who are really telling on themselves by seeing something uncomfortable and suspicious in art that is just...not
you know what the “context” of the art is? sometimes i think “hmm, i wonder what my fave character looked like as a child? omg i wanna draw that”. i did it when i was in the naruto fandom, and i did it when i was in the undertale fandom. and especially in the case of asterius whose life was Fucking Garbage and who never had a chance at a good, happy life, i wanted to imagine what his childhood might’ve been like, if maybe he had at least some happy childhood moments, if maybe there was someone who loved him before it all went to shit (and also since he’s so big, i thought the idea of him having been a tiny babbu was fuckin’ adorable). also, kids put stuff in their mouth, animals put stuff in their mouth, so i figured a human/animal hybrid baby would try to taste stuff they’re unfamiliar with even more so. there’s your “gross” and “horrible” context. and you’re seeing sexualization in that. that’s literally all you, all in your own brains. your minds are so hopelessly fucking warped that it would be sad if you weren’t insistent on treating other people like shit because *you* saw something sexual in an entirely sfw, non-sexual, pure and wholesome drawings of a child doing child things
as someone with no interest in children, fictional or real, i find it immensely concerning that your mind jumps into imagining child rape with such ease, requiring literally no prompting. that is creepier and more concerning than anything i could ever draw
the usual from the Normal and Moral crowd
god do you guys have any idea what it’s like for someone with very bad self-esteem problems to see people who hate their guts and want them dead go “noooo why is their art so good”
pictured, me rolling in this validation like
“pedophilic ships”?? mf where? words just don’t mean anything to you guys anymore, do they
also cute hadesgame-related user name! thanatos and zagreus are adopted brothers, achilles and patroclus are cousins, and hades married his cousin’s daughter! you’re supporting a game with incest in it, based on greek myths that have even more incest in them!
here’s your award for the dumbest goddamn take i have legit ever seen 🏆
huh, here i thought it was about protecting minors 🤔🤔🤔 (just kidding, i’ve never seen a single anti say deny that it’s about the harassment)
now why wouldn’t i want people like the previous person or the people a couple of screenshots up who are wishing for my death or the anon telling me that *checks notes* they hope my firstborn is raped and has their genitals sliced off interacting with me 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔 certainly seems sus
there’s a pandemic and some people are disabled, karen
imagine seeing a drawing made by someone who you think is a pedophile and going “i’m gonna trace and repost that :)” head empty, no values or morals, only thirst for clout
i haven’t drawn porn in like. two or three whole years
LADIES AND GENTLEMEN AND EVERYONE ELSE, IT’S TIME FOR SUS CHALK
hey, a familiar face! thing is, i never said i don’t want to incest shippers to interact me, what i said was that i don’t want my non-incest drawings of siblings be tagged as incest, because A) it makes me super uncomfortable, and B) it leads to people like *gestures to the entire post* to send me death threats for being a disgusting fontcest shipper when all i drew was brotherly pictures of skelebros. idgaf what people ship lmao, i just don’t want my art tagged incorrectly and to be harassed because of it. also i’ve been open and vocal about being proship for literal years
“oh i know them, they shipped [ship i have literally never shipped and which i am uncomfortable enough with to blacklist]” yeah you sure know me lmao
oh no, not an A-A-A-ADULT 😱😱😱 guess who else is an adult? toby fox, and everyone who worked on not only undertale but every single piece of entertainment you’re consuming. this site? made by adults. the internet? made by adults. the person who created that callout post? adult. and so will you be, too, and there’s not a goddamn thing you can do about it
awww hell yeah, i officially have a Proship Artstyle™ that makes antis uncomfortable 🤘
i have no idea what this person is trying to say ngl. is...being thirsty for asterius (have you seen him?) and liking theseus bad and cause of suspicion now? well shit, i have some very bad news for A LOT of people in the hades fandom
do you guys like...not understand the difference between children and adults? just because an adult is romantically or sexually interested in another adult does not mean they would fuck the child version of that person. if a person sees a photo of their crush or significant other as a child and goes “aw, cute”, does that make them a pedophile in your book?
i was here first, bud, you leave if you hate it here so much
i don’t even want to know what’s going on in the reblogs of that post. all this over a drawing of a baby minotaur playing with chalk
remember when being a pedophile required a sexual attraction to children? not anymore, these days pedophile is literally just anything and anyone you don’t like, and you don’t need any evidence to call people that! the more you know!
mmmm look at alllll that delicious ageism. i’ll never stop being amused by kids who think repeating information about myself i’ve freely chosen to display on my very public bio is some kinda “gotcha”. newsflash, buttercups - you too will be 30 and over one day. you’re not immune to aging, but sure, keep shitting in the pool you’ll eventually all be swimming. unless, of course, you’ve already decided to be absolutely miserable and joyless once you hit 30, to which all i can say is “couldn’t be me 💅“
also if you hate people over 30 so much, put your money where your mouths are and stop consuming content made by people over thirty. and i don’t mean just fan content, i mean everything: music, movies, comics, video games, cartoons, everything that was made by those gross 30+ year olds. create your own content, your own sites (ao3 is explicitly anti-censorship and anti-harassment, in other words pro-shipping and pro-fiction, so you guys better not be reading or posting any fics there), your own shows and games, see how that works out
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This week the writer being interviewed is April from @valeskamonaghan, known as MickeysTonic on AO3 and author of well over a hundred stories, including Boys Of Fall, Not Going Anywhere and Music In Me.
GT: Tell me about your usernames here on Tumblr and on AO3. How did you come up with them?
A: I’m a huge fan of Gotham and Jerome Valeska was my favorite. Only started watching it because of Cameron Monaghan and since Cam is one of my favorites I just added them together! My ao3 is MickeysTonic to represent my love of Mickey. Tonic means medicinal substance taken to give a feeling of vigor or well-being and Mickey just was like a tonic for me. He made me feel good because I really relate to him in a lot of ways. Just an incredible character.
GT: So it's one username for each half of Gallavich, pretty much.
A: Yes! They’re my two favorite characters and I just couldn’t choose.
GT: Can you tell us a bit about yourself?
A: I want to be a published author so writing any kind of fanfiction helps a lot with that. I was born April 2nd which is how I got my name. I’m the middle child, have an older brother and younger sister. The biggest item on my bucket list is traveling to London. I’m currently in the process of becoming a volunteer crisis counselor which I’m excited about because I love helping people. I was born and raised in VA and have lived in the same city all my life. I’ve knocked a few states off my travel list, been to the Bahamas and I hope to knock off every state one day. I consider Shameless my comfort show. Whenever life gets too tough I always go to that show and it really helps me a lot.
GT: You must really love writing, then! Is Shameless the first fandom you read / wrote fics for?
A: My first fandom I wrote for was One Direction! It was the first band that I really fell in love with. I still write in that fandom to this day. But writing for Shameless is so much more different and an incredible writing experience. So many characters to develop in your own way, so many lives you can change. You can make a poor south side family whatever you want them while sticking with their characters and I love it. It’s not my first fandom but it’s definitely been the most adventurous!
GT: Do you write for other Shameless characters as well? If not, would you someday?
A: The few stories I’ve written I have included other characters as side characters but I would definitely branch out and try other characters for sure!
GT: Who are your favorite characters on Shameless aside from Ian and Mickey?
A: Lip! Jeremy White is such an incredible actor. No one could play Lip the way he does. I adore Lip. He has his flaws like everyone does but he’s just an incredible character to me.
GT: What about Ian and Mickey, what do you like the most about them?
A: I relate to Mickey in the way that I hid my sexuality for a long time. I never wanted to admit it to anyone including myself. He has a wall built around him but he’s strong and he always lets the wall down to let the few people in he does care about. He has this image that other people see him as but he’s actually really soft and has a good heart. Ian, I relate to him on the mental illness level and sometimes feeling as if no one pays attention. I feel like an outcast sometimes. Throughout their struggles they both did what they had to in order to survive and I just admire them so much for it. I found pieces of myself in both of them.
GT: Is that what attracted you to them and made you ship them?
A: I fell in love with them individually at first and then just seeing them together made me think of the guy I wanted to be with but never really could be with because of certain situations. Ian’s constant attempts to have Mickey let him in and Mickey’s rare moments in the beginning when he let Ian in was just something I really connected with it. They’re definitely more than their looks. They’re beautiful on the inside and I loved them for that more than anything.
GT: When did you start watching Shameless?
A: 2017! I didn’t think I would like it but I spent day after day staying up to 6am watching! I started binge watching on Netflix after seeing people talking about it. Went from the first episode thinking it’s going to be just okay to not being able to stop watching.
GT: When did you start writing Gallavich fanfiction? What made you start?
A: I started not long after watching. I used AO3 for other fandoms so I was curious to see if anyone wrote for Gallavich and after reading some I really liked the idea of creating my own version of Gallavich and so I just went to work. I have a lot of fun creating different versions of them!
GT: What's the most fun thing about writing Gallavich? What's the most difficult thing?
A: I think the fun part is creating them into your own version, your own world, their own new and different lives while the difficult thing is keeping part of their character with the version you write.
GT: Do you prefer writing Ian or Mickey?
A: I feel like Ian is easier for me to write because of the whole mental illness thing. It’s easier to include my own on him and put a part of me into Ian with my own feelings, thoughts, etc. Ian is like a fictional version of me in a lot of ways.
GT: What kind of fics do you write the most?
A: I do a lot of smutty one shots because I do work on my own personal things as well! I have a chaptered story on AO3 and an old one from a long time ago but it’s mainly one shots, smut, fluff. I’m also a sucker for cliche romance so I include a lot of that too!
GT: What does your writing process look like?
A: Every single thing I write is written without a plan and it’s one of the things I enjoy the most. I don’t have to think. It all just comes together as I write. It’s one of the very few things I feel confident in my life. Sometimes I’ll write out a short plot and ideas before a chaptered or short story but even with a short plot the rest of the story is not outlined. I sit down at my laptop and just write. I let my fingers and brain do the talking!
GT: Do you ever do any research before or during writing? Or after, when editing?
A: If I have to write about Ian’s bipolar I definitely try to do some research so I do it justice or if I’m writing about closeted people I look up stories. My mental health topics or lgbtq topics I strongly research because they’re serious and I want to portray them the best way I can.
GT: What are your favorite type of comments to receive?
A When people tell me that I’m one of their favorite writers or that they look forward to anything I post. It makes me feel like I really did find the right passion in my life.
GT: I know, it feels amazing. That's why leaving comments is so important, because it's our reward and it makes us feel validated.
A: I completely agree. I love knowing that the smallest things I do can bring joy to others.
GT: What's your favorite Gallavich fic that you’ve written so far and why?
A: Um, it’s not on AO3 anymore but it was called One Fine Day! Basically Ian gets his crap together and goes to Mexico to try and win Mickey back! I always thought when Ian dyed his hair and almost left he was going there so that’s what I wrote about! :)
GT: Why did you delete it?
A: If I remember correctly I was informed that people were spreading it around and talking badly about it and badly about me. So i decided to delete it. That was before I realized that others peoples opinions shouldn’t matter.
GT: If you don't mind telling me, what were people saying?
A: I don’t think they liked how I was writing Ian and Mickey. A lot of people like it when characters are written as we see them but I’m the kind of person who loves creating her own versions of them. Different personalities, different lifestyles and all that. I don’t think they liked it!
GT: Would you ever consider reuploading it?
A: I would yes! I’ve read it over and over and thought about editing it a little bit so I could repost it! I focus only on positivity these days. As many people may not like my writings I know there are many more people who do! I’d rather bring joy to others and deal with the hate!
GT: Why is that fic your favorite?
A: Because a lot of Ian’s feelings were based on my own with situations I’ve been in and it was so easy to write. I’ve always been such a sucker for cliche romantic things and happy endings. Writing those kinds of things make me happy especially for characters that don’t really experience that a lot in life.
GT: Do you have any favorite fics written by other authors?
A: Sexual Harassment In The Workplace, LRPD, TIPDIG. They were all written so well and the characters seemed so life-like to me. I know them as tv Gallavich but these stories bring them to a new kind of life and it was just so much fun to read and experience them as different people. These authors are incredibly talented and did the fandom a great favor writing these!
GT: Who are your favorite authors in the fandom?
A: I actually don’t focus a lot on the authors a lot to be honest. Like, I’ll read the stories and fall in love with it but that’s it. A lot of people follow the authors on Twitter, keep updated on them and whatnot but I don’t. I’ll go back every now and then to see if people have written new things but for the most part I don’t really have a list of authors. But the stories that I told you were my favorites that I’ve read probably have my favorite authors for sure!
GT: What are your favorite tropes?
A: Honestly as long as it’s a happy ending I’ll love it. Like, friends to lovers is definitely one of my favorites. Two people realizing that the right person has been there all along is such a weakness of mine! The slow burn of enemies to lovers is something I enjoy as well!
GT: What about pet peeves? Do you have any pet peeves in fics, things that annoy or even make you stop reading something?
A: I think when one trait is put on a person and that’s all the character is known for. Like, someone constantly eating and that’s all they really do. If the characters don’t have personalities it is definitely annoying even if it’s just a small side character.
GT: What’s your favorite season of Shameless? Do you have a favorite episode?
After Liam finds Fiona’s coke the whole show just becomes insane for me. I love it. I love the way Lip takes care of everyone, how he puts fiona in her place. Jeremys acting really had me loving those seasons. And the wedding episode will forever be my favorite episode and the proposal scene will always be my favorite scene!
GT: If you could go back and change one thing in canon, what would it be?
A: I feel like so many things could be changed. Maybe when Frank met Mikey. A lot of Gallavich time was wasted with those two only for Mikey to leave in the end.
GT: What are your writing plans? Do you have anything in the works?
I just posted my first short one shot since May last year! Life got so busy and I lost myself but I do plan on continuing to write long after the show is over. I am trying to work on a new chapter story!
GT: Thank you so much for taking the time to do this. Do you have any parting words for the fandom?
A: Just to keep up the love of your favorite characters and an incredible show. It’s going to be hard to say goodbye but the south side and everyone we have come to know and love will continue on as long as we continue writing, drawing, etc.
Thank you for this!
GT: Thank you!
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Just a quick update
Probably should have put a trigger warning at the last post, but Mentions of pedophilia and r@pe. Reader digression is advised.
Thank you so much for everyone tho reblogged and liked the last post. I really don’t have time for the people being complete idiots when it comes to fandoms. I don’t generally let these kind of things bother me usually, but something about a character from a thing I really like being accused of a thing as serious as pedophilia, I just kinda snapped.
I’ve heard other things have been going on like people white-washing Mammon, Simeon and Diavolo. People sexualizing Luke...a LITERAL child. Calling Lucifer a rapist. Giving the voice actors shit for reasons I have no idea why. Shipping the brothers together which...look, I was expecting to happen eventually cus these kinda of people can't fuckin chill.
There is probably other stuff I’ve been missing. I didn't even hear that shit on here, by the way. I heard it on Tik Tok. Most of the things they’re doing are Just. Plain. Stupid. I feel like making posts on WHY what they’re doing is stupid and I feel like I shouldn't even have to explain. But you know, some people just don’t use or don't TRY to use their common sense that maybe...what they’re doing will cause them shit from other people. you posted shit, MOSTLY PROBLEMATIC SHIT, on the internet and are surprised to get hate for it...How...did you survive old enough to USE a computer with how stupid everything is. I dunno if I will make a post about why Lucifer is not a rapist, but it’s a pretty big phobia of mine, so it might take a bit to write. Also due to like 2 pieces of evidence as to why I could think people would say that about him, being the vampire event and the end of chapter 20 (If anyone else has reason to think that, do let me know. I’m only on lesson 26, but I will play through the game again and look at spoilers to get evidence. I don’t care about spoilers in this fandom.)
Fortunately, I believe the GOOD people of this fandom outweigh the dipshits. Because I don’t wanna make myself angry, I will make some bullet tips as to what we can do as a community and a fanbase to not let the toxicity spread.
If you are going to call a character a title THAT serious. USE. YOUR. BRAIN. There are fairly young people that play this game and they would never be allowed make a game like this if such titles were true. So maybe TRY to get some more information before you make accusations. If you’re not bothered, either face the music of looking stupid or say nothing. They’re FICTIONAL characters. Use that energy to get ACTUAL pedophiles and rapists arrested.
You can draw Luke as an adult FOR SPECULATION. That’s fine. If you;re just, in your own way, expression what Luke would look like at Simeon’s age, that’s fine. You just have an idea of what that would look like. But if you’re doing it to sexualize a minor...that is being WAY more pedo than anything people accused Levi of doing. Luke is canonically 10 in human years and is a canonical child among the other angels. I don’t care if he’s thousands of years older than the human. If the devs SAY he’s a child, regardless on if the years are different, then he’s a child and you treat him like a fucking child. If picturing sexual things about them is how you treat a child, that is pedophilia. You are disgusting and should be disgusted with yourself. I don’t care if he’s a fictional child, it’s still gross to do that to a child. I BET you there are people that call Levi a pedo and then sexualize Luke at a “Legal” age. Stupidity really just evolves, doesn’t it?
The case of shipping the brothers together...Look, maybe I’ll make a separate post on this too, but the explanation is SO. PAINFULLY, OBVIOUS. That I really don’t wanna waste my breathe on common sense. I know the brothers are not directly related by blood. Doesn’t matter. It can apply with adoptive or step sibling logic. If someone has grow up with you or spent their lives with you as a sibling figure in your life, shipping them in still incest. Family doesn’t end in blood.The brothers all still share one father. They are siblings. I know some of the cards MIGHT seem sexual or something...but that is what fan service is. I think people shipping the siblings. I think they’ve stopped making those types of cards a while ago for this reason...but yeah. No...You’d feel weird if someone shipped you and your sibling or a friend close enough to BE your sibling. So don’t do it here.
STOP. WHITE WASHING. CHARACTERS OF COLOR! You don’t white wash actual people of color so why do this at all? “I wanna see what he would look like as a different race!” WHY?! Why in the wing, fluttering fuck does race even matter?! Can’t you just enjoy how they already look and look past that? In my mind, only one race exists...the HUMAN race....I dunno how this holds up with a game about demons, but still. If you are so insistent on making characters of color a different race, all that means is that you’re being racist. If you insist you’re not, you will have no problem cutting out the white washing and accepting how they look already. BLACK LIVES STILL MATTER!
In the case of the voice actors. If you see people harassing the voice actors on any form of media, the simplest solution is to give the voice actors your love and appreciation and reporting them to the app to get their comment or account removed. Simple. It’s online safety 101. If you’re worried about them getting hate in their DM’s, there’s not much we can do about it. It’s private messaging between the commenter and the voice actor. The voice actors are grown men with common sense and they will appreciate your love and support because it means you’re trying to help them however you can. They can block those people themselves if they are DM’d. Don’t feel terrible that you can;t do more. You can only do so much and the VA’s appreciate your love and support for the game.
Finally...don’t spread hate. That’s what these kinds of people WANT you to do. Don’t get angry. Don’t start text wars. It will just make people think this fandom is more toxic than before. I know you’re just trying to set the record straight and you can do that in a more polite way, but don’t waste your breath on people if they don’t want to listen. You can tell them politely because they MIGHT just be people that are misinformed, but if they push the point forward without listening and they still won’t pay attention, their loss. you were trying to stop them looking like a jackass. They had their chance. If they’re causing further harm, just report them. It’s as simple as that. These kinds of people are not worth getting angry at. Don’t stress yourself out over people being stupid and try to enjoy the fandom in your own way, alright?
Sorry for two serious posts in a row. I’ve had complex feelings since my last post over my recent loss and ranting like this did help a lot. I’m also playing Mystic Messenger on Jumin’s Route and Day 11 will be tomorrow, so I should be getting to the asks soon enough. I know I say that all the time, but I actually wanna get back into writing because I’m super passionate about it. It just...sucks when being depressed makes it tiring to do the thing you love the most. Seeing everyone enjoy my writing really makes my day and I want to try motivate myself to not take as long in between. I’ve never let other people being weird or toxic destroy how I feel about the things I love because life is short and all that. THESE recent things I’ve heard about the Obey Me fandom don’t even get under my skin, but it’s a fandom I’m really passionate about and that the Tik Tok community want to get across to others. So, I contributed the only way I knew how.
Thank you for listening and have a good one ❤
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The Order for the asks?
questions from here
Top 5 favourite characters: vera, rene, rene's unnamed twin sister, lilith, alyssa (listennn she had potentiallll and i forcibly sympathize with her s2 struggles)
Other characters you like: i found kepler v entertaining even though she was annoying as hell, and i liked salvador even though that could've all been done better. zecchia was kinda fun... i see the appeal in randall, and i love hamish. nicole also deserves the world and i'm definitely not on a list of characters rn bc i've forgotten half of them,,,,,,,,, OH MADDOX i wanted more with maddox
Least favourite characters: foley was so annoying oh my god. gabrielle took some time to warm up to but idk. weirdly i didn't rly hate edward but i also didn't like him as much as i could've. FUCKING PETE I FORGOT ABOUT PETE HE SUCKS MORE THAN EDWARD SOMEHOW
Otps: vera/hamish! honestly don't think i care about much else with shipping here, but i like alyssa/lilith and lilith/nicole from afar, and i also like poly-pack headcanons a lot
Notps: honestly i just don't care about 99% of the ships but i don't think anything elicits a visceral reaction from me
Favourite friendships: vera and jack!!! i wanted so much more with them. they probs go under family more than anything because the POTENTIAL but for now they will go here.
Favourite family: i count the wolves as a family so they're going here!! i also wanted more of jack n maddox bonding as brothers pwease?
Favourite episodes: THE ONE WHERE VERA DRANK THE EMOTIONAL AMPLIFIER THING FUCK ME UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Favourite season/book/movie: i think i liked s2 more because more vera ja;klskdjf
Favourite quotes: "NOW EVERY MOMENT OF PAIN IN MY LIFE IS SCREAMING INTO YOUR MIND" AND THAT WHOLE THING but also like, all of her insults... god tier
Best musical moment: tbh that duet alyssa and gabrielle did... A++
Moment that made you fangirl/boy the hardest: hamish catching vera when she fell ;u; and alSO HAMISH BEING LIKE "IT'S ALRIGHT TO LET PEOPLE CARE ABOUT YOU" TO VERA anD ALSOOOOOOOOOOOOOO THE ENDINGGGGGG WHEN SHE REACHES FOR HIMMMMMMMMM literally i hadn't cared a ton abt vermish until the final like 10 seconds when that happened then i was like whoops im retroactively in hell!!!
When it really disappointed you: the presumption that i ever had faith in this show when the trailer literally had alyssa talking about fake news... lol. OH WAIT LMAO ACTUALLY. the netflix thumbnail when season 1 came out showed alyssa with BLACK EYES and that NEVER FUCKING HAPPENED IN THE FUCKING SHOW
Saddest moment: vera yeeting her trauma at the hivemind cult or when she revealed she'd performed the fors factorummmmmm
Most well done character death: all i can think about is rene's because she was like "oh fuck-" but can i shoutout pete exploding like a ketchup packet because that was fucking hilarious
Favourite guest star: JEWEL STAITE
Favourite cast member: katie isabelle
Character you wish was still alive: rene!!!!! also kepler kinda, she was annoying but fun
One thing you hope really happens: lol it got cancelled :''') but i would've loved more about lilith's whole thing regaining her normalcy, vera regaining her powers, and more exploration of vera's daughter, wHY SHE PERFORMED THE FORS FACTORUM. kinda glad it got cancelled tho bc every other idea or theory i saw regarding her daughter made me wanna break a window ngl
Most shocking twist: BRUH THE SEASON 1 FINALE HOLY SHIT ;A; THAT REKT ME
When did you start watching/reading?: started thissssss when it was first released, idk when that was tho 2019?
Best animal/creature: i never rly retained much abt the wolves n how they differ but i love them.i also now realize man we could've had so many cool monster of the week kinds of things and never did..... :(
Favourite location: the temple!! also loved vera's house, wish we'd gotten more bc fun personal details
Trope you wish they would stop using: just... having to pair jack and alyssa... w/e the hell that is... i don't hate it but like, give us other things
One thing this show/book/film does better than others: being so bad it's good
Funniest moments: KILLING YOUR ETHICS PROFESSOR IS ONE THING, HARASSING YOUR ENGLISH PROFESSOR IS AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT ISSUE
Couple you would like to see: i would like,, ,, little more vera/hamish, ,, pweas,e,
Actor/Actress you want to join the cast: i mean it's over now but there's probs someone in the vein of canadian spec fiction actors from like, fuckin idk stargate or smth who could've reasonably shown up. i mean look at jewel staite
Favourite outfit: [gestures to vera's entire wardrobe but specifically the ones with low necklines]
Favourite item: the fors factorum!!! the art on it was so fucking cool
Do you own anything related to this show/book/film?: nope. i just like, save any prop pics that come up on ebay
What house/team/group/friendship group/family/race etc would you be in?: tbh i don't think i'd do well with any of them jskl;dlkjsdf. the wolves are frat bros and i dont drink, the order seems high standard but like... hngg vera... there's like, the new world order fuckers and that hivemind commune but idk if i'm THAT susceptible to cults... nah nvm i could see myself falling into the hivemind commune... we'll say the order itself though for now,,
Most boring plotline: cant say i rly cared a ton abt the stuff with foley
Most laughably bad moment: ALYSSA TALKING ABOUT FAKE NEWS
Best flashback/flashfoward if any: we were deprived of vera flashbacks and i demand SOMETHING
Most layered character: VERAAAA
Most one dimensional character: hmmmm i will say gabrielle comes off that way but i don't think she rly is
Scariest moment: maybe when the hide chose jack or when midnight came in and just fuckin killed alyssa out of nowhere jaklskdjf or maybe something from when alyssa was doing vade maecum dreamplane shit with edward
Grossest moment: there's a lot of gore and i think i blocked most of it out
Best looking male: ehhhh hamish?
Best looking female: vera is most my type but everyone is v pretty
Who you’re crushing on (if any): vera
Favourite cast moment: there were some good things in the blooper reels n i love that everyone seems to see katie as the cast mom
Favourite transportation: there were a lot of portals
Most beautiful scene (scenery/shot wise): not rly beautiful but i loved all the stuff with the ritual they did with rene... fucked up in an aesthetic way. the commune stuff had some pretty things tho i think
Unanswered question/continuity issue/plot error that bugs you: god there's so much,,, i just ignore them for the most part ngl but there's def a lot that doens't make sense
Best promo: THE FACT THEY DREW ME IN WITH BLACK EYED ALYSSA EVEN THOUGH THEY DDINT DELIVER
At what point did you fall in love with this show/book: when i saw vera and was like oh my god ginger from ginger snaps is a milf now
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Question. does your idea of being anti-callouts also include folks of different belief systems that would involve, say, a much narrower view of sexual morality, or are they fair game to be called out as homophobes and all that just because of their beliefs, even if they’ve never actually displayed any kind of discriminatory behavior? Or what about those who sided with or even remotely supported trump or are from MAGA groups? Are they outside the scope of your anti-callout mission too? Asking cuz imo it’s hypocritical to say you’re anti-callouts but then think its ok for these folks to be ostracized and bullied cuz “they need to be held accountable” for beliefs that you don’t agree with and more often than not, don’t fully understand what they believe or why. And I’m not talking about stuff they said decades ago, I’m talking about present day stuff.
First, I will direct you back to this post, specifically the ending paragraph:
One important thing to internalize is that ignorance doesn’t make you a bad person. This goes for judging your own actions as well as others’. It’s okay to constantly be learning and adapting your behavior based on new information. If you find out from discourse that you had been using hurtful language or promoting a hurtful idea, it doesn’t mean you were secretly a bad person all along. It just means you didn’t know. In an ideal world, we would all be patient and forgiving with people who weren’t acting in bad faith, but unfortunately this is Tumblr. Just try to do your best, and take breaks if you need them.
The key point here is ‘in bad faith’. This blog, and the general disagreement in fandom re: callout culture, usually stems from the idea that it is bad to hold people with taste in unpopular fictional ships to the same standard as unrepentant abusers, pedophiles, racists, and homophobes. The point is not that those categories of people aren’t in themselves problematic, just that shippers shouldn’t get tacked on to that list for liking anime boy 1 and anime boy 2, nor should ANYONE get tacked onto that list based on rumors or anon messages if there is actually no evidence of wrongdoing.
We can debate until the cows come home about what ‘counts’ as bigotry and the right way to deal with microaggressions, but for this post (and because you mentioned MAGA and homophobic Christianity) I’m going to assume you’re talking about standard, run-of-the-mill bigotry. The kind you can look at and easily understand exactly why it is hurtful.
Being against callout culture is not the same thing as being against all callouts, all the time, for any reason. (I did not name this blog, I inherited it. I am now considering a revised URL if that is the impression this one gives.)
I am never going to defend a homophobe. I am never going to defend a racist. If someone comes to me with a tweet from a homophobe’s twitter acct that says ‘God says all lesbians are abominations but I’m not homophobic tho it’s just what the Bible says’ I’m not going to assume they’re an infant who doesn’t understand logic or empathy or critical thinking. I’m gonna block them. If they’re famous, I’m gonna show my friends and my friends are also gonna block them and also possibly talk shit about them on Twitter because they’re bajillionares and it doesn’t matter.
(Except really I encourage people not to do this - not because it’s morally wrong, but because they can use their much larger platform to harass you if they feel like it. See John Boyega’s behavior towards the women who were hurt by his misogynistic language as an example.)
Now, on a smaller scale, if they’re just a regular old member of a fandom? If it turns out everyone blocks them because they won’t stop talking about how much they hate the gays and Jews and SJWs and the fandom is full of gays and Jews and SJWs who don’t want to listen to it, that’s not ostracization, that’s quality control. No one gets to complain that other people won’t listen to their opinions, and that’s not what this blog is advocating for.
I am extremely pro-block. I block people for ALL KINDS of things. I see a comment in the notes of a post I do not vibe with? Block. Don’t care if that user has never spoken to me in my life. I am the arbiter of my fandom experience, as is everyone else.
Furthermore, I want to address what seems to me to be the core of your complaint here:
“... even if they’ve never actually displayed any kind of discriminatory behavior?”
See, this is a bit logically inconsistent and it makes me wonder if this ask was not sent in good faith, but rather to try and catch me in a ‘gotcha, so much for the tolerant left’ type of way.
If someone is not displaying any kind of discriminatory behavior, then they fall under the ‘don’t make baseless callouts’ protection. There’s no evidence of any wrongdoing, no victim, no crime. Thinking gay people are horrible is, like, wrong, but as long as they keep that to themselves when engaging with others, fine. However, the fact that someone is being called out for open homophobia or racism means that... Hm... how do I put this... they kind of are displaying discriminatory behavior, my dude.
If they’re 12 years old and repeating what their racist dad said or homophobic pastor said, then yeah, don’t harass them. Don’t harass anyone, actually, but I am not Fandom God and I don’t control the whims or ways of the internet denizens so I can’t really do anything about that. Harassment doesn’t actually accomplish anything and is a waste of energy. Report them if they’re breaking the TOS and move on. (See my pro-block stance above for the acceptable alternative. Blocking! It’s like Herd Immunity, for fandoms.)
But everyone else in the fandom space has a right to warn each other ‘hey, there’s a 12 year old over there with no filter and they’re super racist, here’s their tweets.’
If they’re an adult and they’re doing that? As you said, present day stuff? It is completely fair game for their tweets or posts to be catalogued and shared as proof that they are a clear and present danger to other people in the fandom. Racists and homophobes have this nasty little habit of attempting to hurt people they hate, fandom needs ways to self-regulate and keep itself safe from actual harmful bigots.
There’s also a lot to be said about expecting vulnerable members of the community to do all the work educating people who are actively being malicious towards them in the hope that one comment will break through their willful ignorance and show them the light of human decency and teach them how to be good people and decent fans. If someone feels bad that other people don’t like them because of their homophobic beliefs, it’s not the fandom’s job to take them under wing and teach them why homophobia is wrong. None of us came out the womb knowing how to treat people; if the majority of us could figure it out by cultural osmosis, so can our racist homophobic strawman here. Either by being told directly, or by seeing that bigots are not welcome and making the single necessary logical leap that maybe it’s because homophobia/racism/etc hurts people and no one else likes being hurt.
So, to break it down:
Private racists: not posting anything racist, not harassing poc in the fandom, how would you ever know? Gross, but ultimately harmless. Can’t do anything about them, hopefully they see enough posts about why racism is bad to finally change their ways.
Past racists: said some dumb racist shit in the past, apologized, aren’t currently doing anything racist? Leave them alone. Be thankful. Hope that other people look to them as an example in learning and humility and growth.
Active racists: do not deserve your pity or protection. Learn to treat other people with respect or get off the internet. Shed no tears when they end up blocked by 90% of the fandom and anyone else with a brain. Their ignorance does not supersede everyone else’s right to feel safe and welcome in a community. Much like with private racists, I hope they learn (with a more direct lesson) that no one likes racists or wants to hang out with them and if they want friends they should learn to treat others as human beings.
TW: For talks of mental illness as well as a mention of suicide.
This has actually been on my mind for quite a while but I was worried about how it would be taken. However this has actually come up several times in the Azula tag now so I might as well talk about it. And before I get to the point I just want to say that I’m very much open to respectful discussion. Please don’t rip me apart over this.
So here we go; Azula/Therapy makes me rather uncomfortable.
And it does so on a rather personal level and for several reasons. I can’t really get into my biggest reason because it’s very deeply personal and I don’t feel comfortable sharing it online. So I’m gonna start with the less personal reasons as to why I think that Azula/Therapy is kinda sketchy imo.
I feel as though most people who ship Azula/Therapy don’t really realize how it affects real people? For one thing I feel like it makes a joke of therapy. It’s kind of hard to explain but therapy isn’t some cute and quirky thing. It’s a very serious matter and to ship Azula/Therapy like it’s the next Drapple (Draco/Apple) just doesn’t sit right with me.
Now don’t get me wrong, I feel like most people who ship Azula/Therapy don’t particularly mean any offense. I feel like to a degree it comes from a place of innocence. But and its big but, I think that Azula/Therapy got its origins from a not so wholesome place. In fact I think that the ship was born from a place of hate. I think that the first time I encountered Azula/Therapy it was from a very notorious Azula anti. It gained traction with the anti crowd as a means to harass and guilt people for shipping Azula with anyone. And that’s not okay. I think that somewhere down the lines, the Azula fandom kind of reclaimed it but. I am damn near certain that this started as an Azula anti thing.
It’s one thing to ship Azula/Therapy because you don’t feel like Azula is sound enough to be in a relationship. But don’t try to guilt others for disagreeing. And this kind of leads me to my main problem with Azula/Therapy.
I think that it’s kind of, sort of (dare I say) ableist? Just because someone has a mental illness doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t be loved. I’ve been kind of keeping tabs on discussions on this and I came across one anon who literally say something about how “Azula would just be a burden to her lover.” NGL that had me floored because this is the exact line of thinking that puts depressed people in a bad place. Speaking from experience, people with depression feel like burdens/like they are bringing people down. And to see this line of thinking being affirmed in fandom spaces does not help real people who are experiencing the same thing. God forbid someone shares disorder traits with Azula and they see that.
I am 100% that there are some relationships where a person just isn’t stable enough to be in a relationship and it would be detrimental for them to have one. But for other people finding a lover can be instrumental to recovery! So by all means, this is definitely a matter of something being a case by case thing. Getting a littler personal (but without getting into too many details) I know two people who literally saved each other. And by this I mean, one was super depressed and the other was ready to kill themself. Finding each other was what rekindled their will to live again. That’s why it really bothers me to see Azula/Therapy being tossed around so carelessly. To me there’s this underlying implication that mentally ill people shouldn’t be allowed to date and get love. And that’s just not fair? I feel like people maybe don’t think about this when posting Azula/Therapy stuff.
“Well Azula specifically shouldn’t be in a relationship yet because she’s not in a good place for it.”
Okay fair but consider a few things; 1. some people specifically write post-redemption Azula ship fics 2. some people enjoy writing out fics where romance helps her heal.
I have seen it come up that someone (I won’t mention names because I’m not sure if this user would want that) mention that they ship Azula/Therapy because they aren’t up to writing a fic that involves an arc of Azula getting to a place where she can have romance. Which is totally fair. But, that doesn’t mean that other people can’t. And I feel like this fandom has been trying to guilt people for shipping Azula with anyone. As mentioned, this isn’t fine. (@ mentioned user, feel free to reply).
Another thing that I saw was an anon saying that being anti Azula/Therapy is aro/acephobic. I’m going to put my foot down as someone who has been very openly aro/ace and say, don’t try to speak for all of us. Yes romance isn’t the solution for everyone because romance isn’t what everyone is looking for. And I absolutely agree with this. However Azula is a fictional character and not everyone headcanons her as aro/ace. For some people, writing Azula in a romance as part of the healing process is what makes them happy. It doesn’t make them aro/acephobic.
One more thing that I saw come up regarding Azula specifically. And I think that they made a wonderful point; Azula’s breakdown (as I interpreted it) came from a lack of love. Azula craved genuine affection whether she realized it or not. So I would argue that Azula would be one of those people who could strongly benefit from being in a relationship as part of the healing processes. By all means, make therapy a part of that healing process! She can be in a relationship and she can still go to therapy. She can use that therapy to help her keep that relationship healthy. I guess what I’m trying to say is I could get on board with Azula/*Character*/Therapy as an OT3. 99.99% sure that this is really common in real life. Actually 100% sure because (again without sharing too much personal info) I have seen a rather unstable person get into a relationship and use therapy to help them make sure that said relationship stays healthy.
A person doesn’t have to be 100% mentally sound to be in a relationship. And having a mental illness while being in a relationship doesn’t automatically make it a toxic or dangerous relationship on principal. I think that (depending on the disorder) some long discussions need to be had and some boundaries need to be put in place. Speaking from experience, I have heard someone say something akin to, “alright, I have *disorder* if I ever do *bad habit* then take these steps and don’t let me push you around...” Things like that.
TL;DR: I feel like Azula/Therapy (even if it comes from a well meaning place) can be disheartening for people who relate to Azula & people who already feel like a burden in their real life relationships. Ship Azula/Therapy if you want and if it makes you comfortable but don’t try to shame people for shipping her with other characters. Also be weary of people who ship Azula/Therapy as a means to belittle others.
I think that’s it for now. If I think of anything else, I’ll add it. I’ll just end by saying that I don’t mean this to be antagonistic or yell at anyone but to offer a new POV.
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The Hawk X Demetri Manifesto
Okay, here is the thing. Despite being well past my teens, there's a particular ship of Cobra Kai that has drawn my attention, this ship being Hawk/Eli x Demetri. When I first watched the show, I was actually more invested in the adult characters storylines than the teens. I immediately rooted for Johnny and Carmen, and I was always hoping for more interactions between them. But then I saw episode 2x05, in which the atmosphere between the Binary Brothers becomes way more dense, and that's when I started to see some potential for them. Not because I'm a deranged person who fosters abusive relationships, but because I immediately caught the hurt/comfort dynamic of the duo, which is something that works really well when it comes to fictional relationships. However, it wasn't until 3x10 that I said, "Ok, that's official, I need to see more of these two! I totally support them!" And I was quite surprised to find a fairly large amount of people who are very committed to this pairing, to the point it's caught the attention of the screenwriters/producers as well. Honestly, I don't know if the showrunners will ever have the guts to make them an official couple, and chances are their supporters will have to keep reading between the lines of their bromance, but in any case, here is my take on why Hawk/Eli x Demetri is an option worth to be considered.
#1 - The Bromance
If there's something that many years of navigating the Internet taught me, is that the main driving factor for fan-made ships is the presence of either a solid relationship based on mutual brotherly love or a bitter rivalry that may or may not flow into hate/obsession. If you consider anime fandoms, there are thousand examples that fit into either of these categories: Yugi and Jonouchi from the Yu-Gi-Oh series (yes, that's how old I am), Yugi and Kaiba from Yu-Gi-Oh, Sakuragi and Rukawa from Slam Dunk, Light and L from Death Note, etc. And our Hawk and Demetri fit into both categories. When we first see them, they are the stereotypical nerdy friends (possibly childhood friends?) sitting at the losers' table, who have no one else but each other. When Eli is at his most sensitive and fragile, you can tell he feels comfortable being with Demetri by the genuine smile he has on his face as Demetri is joking with Miguel at the canteen table. Through his sarcasm, the mouthy kid acts as a catalyst to deviate the attention from Eli, speaking for him, reprimanding Johnny when he makes fun of his lip and trying to make him feel safe. Besides, you can see a certain degree of frustration in Demetri when Kyler and his gang are harassing Eli, and he's unable to do anything to defend him. And they even have a jingle for their friendship with a robot dance, I mean, how cute is that? But of course, a solid friendship between two helpless nerdy guys is not enough to spark a ship to be rooting for. In order for the magic to happen, another key ingredient is needed, i.e. a little bit of angst. Which brings us straight to the next point.
#2 - The Angst (aka the Hurt/Comfort Dynamic)
Even though I never liked the Twilight saga or any similar urban fantasy young adult works, I can easily see where the appeal comes from; the attraction to a charming, dangerous person who could either protect you from any harm or crush you like grape. Although with different franchises, I wasn't immune to the bad boy trope either (Yes, I'm looking at you, my teenage self drooling over Grimmjow from Bleach). If we can appreciate the genuine, brotherly friendship between nerdy Eli and Demetri, the shift that Eli makes as he transitions into Hawk and becomes more aggressive and dominant gives their relationship a totally different flavor. Attrition sparks a certain tension that, in the viewer's eyes, could either flow into a brawl or into passion.
During the mall fight, Demetri comes to the realization that his former best friend is actually someone who can crush him like grape. We see Hawk intentionally harming him for the first time, and Demetri's heartbreaking expression as he drops the line: "You'd actually hurt me?" And if that line gave us a pang in our hearts when we first watched Season 2, imagine rewatching it now that we know what happens in Season 3. Demetri is chased down the mall, running for his life, and then he's locked in a grip, as his best friend menacingly advances towards him. Demetri appears as the damsel in distress, however his friend is not the one who will fight to protect him, but rather his tormentor.
During the party at Moon's, Demetri manages to briefly go through Hawk's mask and reach out to Eli, thanks to a casual conversation about Dr Who. But then the beer incident happens, and Demetri defends himself with the only weapon he has – his loudmouth. The situation is reversed, and for a brief moment, he gets to be the dominant one as he discloses all Eli's most intimate secrets. Demetri is now actively contributing to the Hurt/Comfort dynamic; he's no longer just a target, but he's doing his part to enlarge that gaping hole that has formed between them. And Hawk didn't take it well.
From this moment on, Demetri becomes a sort of obsession to Hawk, who hunts him down the school, teasing him and taunting him sadistically, like a serial killer from a horror movie, during the big fight. Of course, in real life, this would be completely insane, and the police/a social assistant/psychiatrist should be called, but in ShipLand, these situations are pure gold. Okay, we get it, Hawk wants to get revenge for the humiliation at the party, and he wants to crush that nerd part of himself he sees in Demetri, but he does it with such an intensity that it borders on ridiculous. It's like this is his twisted way to acknowledge Demetri's presence. Eventually, Hawk ends up smashed into the trophy case, and I confess I felt a little disappointed when Demetri broke that hug to give Hawk a roundhouse kick. I mean, it was a great comeback, but I was sincerely hoping for a "No hard feelings man, let's get outta here!" scenario.
Getting back to the sick and twisted way Hawk acknowledges Demetri's presence, he destroys his science project after he got jealous due to him being confident in his nerd self and laughing around with his ex girlfriend (whom the writers insist he still has a crush on). Speaking of Moon, I have a feeling she likes Hawk mostly based on his badass appearance. Remember when she goes "I like this (mohawk) and I love these (muscles), but I'm not dating a bully"?
Then the football match happens. Okay, let's break this down. Demetri trips Hawk and acts all sassy, and a fellow Cobra Kai is immediately ready to take him down, but Hawk stops him. "Fight smart, he says". Too bad that literally 5 seconds earlier he had shoved a kid to the ground just because his ex girlfriend (again, duuuh~) ignored him when he winked at her. And then, as he's trying to intercept the ball, BANG, Hawk hits Demetri, sending him to the ground, pretending it was an accident. So, what does this tell us? That Hawk has some serious anger management issues? Yeah sure, but also that he cares about fighting smart only as long as it serves as an excuse to leave Demetri for him, because he's his designated target. Again, this is all but romantic, and it doesn't necessarily have to be interpreted as him lusting after his friend, but it's undeniable that this dynamic offers a lot of ship fuel.
The arm breaking thing is just too painful to even analyze. We see a completely helpless Demetri begging for mercy to his ex best friend, who has made No Mercy his life motto. And that scream, oh that scream. All I wanted to see was Hawk realizing what he had done and throwing himself on his knees while begging for forgiveness. But I'm glad that at least we get to see he feels awful for what he's done, and I like to think that, as he got home, Eli cried out all the tears he had in his body thinking about poor Demetri at the hospital, with a swollen broken arm, all because of him. Of all the situations, this is undoubtedly the most deranged and extreme, and if something like this happened in real life, the wrongdoer would deserve to be punished and would definitely need to be sent to therapy. But in ShipLand, this opens the road to many, many different scenarios, in which the bully understands his mistakes and shifts back to the good side, or the two share a tender moment after they reconcile, or the traumatized character has to to learn to trust the other one again, or the bully becomes overprotective of his former victim, etc.
#3 - A Rewarding Reconciliation
Finally, we come to the reconciliation, in which Hawk makes his heel-to-face turn. While we've seen him torn with doubt for an entire season about his sensei's teachings, his actions and the people he wants to surround himself with, the key factor that drives Hawk's redemption is the sight of his best friend being held down for him to beat. And with an epic stunt and his awesome KEEEH screech, Hawk jumps to the rescue of his friend. Like many of us, Demetri thought this was still part of the "Only I Can Torment Him" dynamic I discussed earlier, as he steps backwards a little concerned, but then he understands that action was actually meant to save him, and the two begin to fight side by side, in sync, watching each other's back. You can see Demetri's eyes sparkling at the thought of having his friend back.
Also, not only Demetri stands up to alpha bitch Tory in defense of Eli, but he also speaks for his friend when he's faltering, just like he used to. So kudos for Demetri.
#4 - The Red Oni, Blue Oni Dynamic
Binary Brothers are two sides of the same coin and complete each other with opposite character traits, visually expressed by the color red and the color blue. Being the color red typically associated with violence, rage, passion and irrationality, as opposed to blue, which is associated with calmness, melancholy and rationality, red is clearly the dominant color. Again, this opens many interesting scenarios for shippers.
#5 - Body Language
Besides the situations I described above, which may or may not be read from a romantic/attraction standpoint, there are also a collection of small gestures I noticed when rewatching the series with a more attentive look on their relationship.
- Demetri's heart-broken expression when Eli shamefully covers his lip during the anti-bullying announcement.
- The smile Demetri gives when Hawk responds "Hell yeah!" after Aisha proposes to crash Yasmin's party, implying he's learning to embrace this new wild side of his best friend
- The astonished look with which Demetri watches Hawk at the tournament and the way he's pissed no one knows his real name.
- How deeply hurt Demetri is when Hawk belittles him by saying: "Five against three. More like two and a half." He even tries to reply, but he's caught so off guard that words die in his throat.
- How Demetri takes a step towards Hawk during the mall fight, before Sam makes him back off, and how sadly he looks at Hawk's nearly unconscious body after Robby defeated him.
- How Demetri smiles and nods when he briefly connects with Eli at Moon's party, despite the mall incident.
- How Hawk watches Demetri juggle with the cleaning product from behind his bike helmet (how did he stuff the mohawk in there by the way)?
- Hawk's psychotic/sadistic faces when he smells Demetri's blood, and how he likes to hunt him down like he's his prey.
- Hawk's secret impulse to comfort Demetri after the arm breaking (I hope you get nightmares of Demetri's howl of pain for the rest of your life, Hawk).
- The way Hawk twitches his upper lip when he sees his friend Demetri in danger.
- How Hawk and Demetri are so absorbed in their new-found friendship, that they're caught off guard, and Demetri swings Hawk to allow him to deliver a kick using their handshake as a lever. And how they keep fighting together, shaking each other's hands even when they're out of focus and the attention is on Miguel vs. Kyler.
- How they're standing so close at Miyagi Do, in comparison with the other Red/Blue partners.
In conclusion, this kind of relationships are engaging and entertaining to watch, and they make us wish the best for the characters. They make us hope that, in the end, as Miguel puts it, love really conquers all (and what is friendship if not a form of love?), despite all the hurt they did to each other.
So this is it. I hope you enjoyed my Ted Talk. Feel free to share it with whomever you want, especially if you need some solid reasons why this ship has got some good potential.
And remember: the ship is in the eye of the beholder.
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Ugh ok it’s late and I might regret writing this to someone in the morning but I’m genuinely upset now bc my brother just went on a tangent abt how shipping irl ppl is awful and disgusting but crankiplier (markiplier and crankgameplays) is right next tss for me rn and I almost told him yesterday and I’m really upset that he thinks something I enjoy is revolting. Is it actually that bad like should I actually stop? I don’t post anything abt it so I thought it would be fine and I know it’s not real and not gonna happen so it should be fine right? But then why does everything think it’s so awful. I know the real people don’t care for it but they don’t hate when people do it for funsies right? I just feel so bad now like am I actually a bad person? I always seem to have problematic ships and so I have no one to talk to about it but myself which is already kinda hard, but to think that I’m hated by ppl bc I think certain people can be cute together. Can you help me understand please, like should I stop? -🧸
Hi 🧸 Anon,
This is a very grey-zone question so I think it would help to go over a general range of all the kinds of IRL shipping that take place and talk about each one.
It’s also a hotly debated topic and you can find people for and against it all over the internet, so you might want to read through more opinions as well.
First off, the umbrella opinion seems to be that shipping real people together is not cool, because it can make those people very uncomfortable. Celebrities are already a lot more exposed than most people and their fans opinions can have a big sway on what content they produce and what directions their work takes. So, learning that huge numbers of their fans think they should be dating someone or other can be stressful, not matter how they actually feel about that person.
Some celebs take this information in different ways. Thomas Sanders and Jon Cozart apparently thought it was funny and leaned into their ship by making a video about their compatibility. But I recall a talented Loki cosplayer a while back who was very offended that fans were shipping him with another cosplayer and hated all the comments he got about it.
(There is also the side factor of people we see in media or online not necessarily showing their true personality, but actually a persona they create for their content. Deep analysis of those personas as if they were the real person can sometimes make those celebs feel incorrectly portrayed or misunderstood. For example, this is tied to why fanders, and Thomas himself, have made a point to clearly distinguish between the real Thomas and Character Thomas.)
So, what form does the shipping take anyway? If it’s just thoughts in your head - a headcanon - no harm no foul. It sounds like you’re in this category. The celebs can’t read your mind, there’s virtually no way anyone will ever become aware that this ship is taking place in your head. Your thoughts are your own and you shouldn’t feel bad for having them. This is like Level 1. But what if it went further?
Level 2 - innocent posts / chatter
From your example, Mark and Ethan do appear to have a very close friendship in their videos together. So it’s not a big jump to see a new video and comment on their friendship or closeness, and maybe you tag it “crankiplier”. Ships can be platonic, too, of course. Pretty innocent, just recognizing things they’ve actually done together, thinking it’s sweet, and chatting with other fans about it. It might not be the intended focus of the video, but their personalities and friendly chemistry is part of why they’re great to watch together.
Level 3 - fan-edits / art / fiction / and statements
This level is the ultimate grey-zone because of the broad sweeping range of content it encompasses. Redraws of scenes people have actually been in, edits or video compilations of people’s interactions are pretty safe. But art and fiction that are creating entirely new events get iffy. Those celebs didn’t really do those things. Now the fan is developing the relationship beyond what is really there, and should be reasonably cautious.
Special attention to the word “statements” - When fans say things in the comments section or directly at celebs like, “you two should ---” or, “when are you two gonna ---?”, it’s creating a clear potential for that person to feel pressured and uncomfortable.
Level 4 - NSFW /
NSFW suggestions, writing, and art are very questionable! People doing this should be prepared to highly curate who has access to their work, because hate will come out of the woodwork. And if the celebs in question found it, there’s a high chance they would be disturbed and offended, and it may cause them to speak out against it and the poster.
Level 5 - Toxic.
All the levels before now are still grey, albeit some more than others. But this level (that I just made up) represents the denial of facts. While shipping can often build off of what was already there, a toxic level of shipping denies all contradicting information and tries to force its own narrative. Think of celebrities who are actually in relationships already, but the ship is for a different pairing. Toxic shippers will hate the real relationship, sometimes even send hate to that S.O. and promote the failure of the person’s real life relationships in favor of the ship. That’s just wrong and it’s veering right into harassment.
(And coming back to the point about personas, a person might have a relationship that their fans don’t know about, because they keep their private life separate from the persona they present. Fans can’t know everything about a person, and therefore might cross the line without realizing it. The only way to prevent that is by not being so aggressive about a ship in the first place.)
Shipping IRL can stir up a lot of strife in a fandom, because everyone has different boundaries and because it has a high potential for going too far -because it has gone too far, too many times, and people, fans and celebs alike, remember dealing with the fallout of those events and how weird it made things for everyone. Some creators even leaving their work behind to get away from it. When a particular celeb has stated they are already in a monogamous relationship with someone else, or they don’t like being shipped in general, their decisions should be respected. Aggressive, pushy obsessions of IRL ships like in Level 5 should be avoided altogether just to be safe. The celeb’s life is not ours to control.
All that said, freedom of speech means you can say whatever you like, and if that means promoting an IRL ship in various forms, then you could do that. But other people can also tell you they don’t like it, or hate it even.
There will always be people who hate you, or hate groups you’re in, for all kinds of random reasons. People are just too diverse for it to be any other way. So long as you aren’t hurting anyone (e.g. actively and thoughtfully examining your actions to prevent hurting people) then you do you, friend.
How Luscious Lies
Word Count: 1331
Lavinia interrupts Emily's introspection for a late-night chat. Contemplating infidelity? #relatable
“Emily,” a voice hissed.
Emily’s head swirled with the smoke and fumes that were the toxic effluence of her creative efforts. The spirits sought her; her talent reached for her from an intangible plane, smothering and harassing her higher senses while resuscitating her passion. The words moved within her with the very abandon of a lover. Her prostration continued.
“Let the voices come,” she murmured, eyes roving the ceiling. “I am so, so close to becoming truly lost.”
Lost in the way Mr. Olmsted had meant. Lost within the process, not separated from it as though blocked by taxus baccata. The poisonous hedges of her mind had been razed—paths cleared, branches stripped—and though the clouds were thick and heady, the ground was fertile. Her poems were ready to be sown and ripe to be plucked in the same instant. Clearly, this was why her fantasy of Mr. Bowles had been so real, such a convincing fever directed her brain.
“I’m ready,” she swore. “I have paper here in my hand.”
Her heart raced.
Emily deflated. With her head hanging over the edge of the bed, she watched her sister enter the room upside-down.
“You still awake? I saw the light of your candle under the door,” Lavinia explained.
“Yes,” Emily grunted. “Why are you still up? I thought you would’ve gone to bed hours ago, since you couldn’t go to Sue’s salon.”
“Oh, um, yeah, I did go to bed…”
“Midnight snack?” Emily guessed.
“You know it,” Lavinia enthused, then sobered, stepping into the bedroom and shutting the door behind her. “I mean, no, I just wanted to hear about the party.”
Emily clambered upright to sit on the bed with her legs tucked to the side. About to answer, she paused and narrowed her eyes at her sister.
“You don’t normally sleep with your hair covered.”
Lavinia whisked the lace from the top of her head and hid it behind her back, clutched in both hands.
“Whoops, no, I still don’t,” she said. “But hey, does it make you think of a Spanish mantilla at all? Like, maybe if I got some black lace instead?”
“Yeah, they’re totally having a moment right now. I think Jane has something to do with it. Rich widows with their dead husbands and all the black lace they want. Lucky,” Lavinia grumbled, plopping down on the edge of the bed next to Emily and smoothing her own white lace in her lap. She shrugged. “Anyway, how was Sue’s thing?”
“Not… what I was expecting. It’s left me with a lot to think about.” She offered her sister a sheepish smile.
“Like what?” Lavinia dropped her elbows to her knees and cupped her face in her hands, waiting.
Emily sighed, contemplating how much to reveal. How no one takes me seriously as a poet, she considered saying. How, even if I do succeed, many people seem likely to attribute that success to a presumed intimate attachment to Mr. Bowles.
“Infidelity,” she found herself saying. She touched her chest, then slid her hand to her throat, testing the solidity of her recent illusion. The way her phantom editor had removed her necklace hung on her more palpably than the necklace itself had.
“Totally,” her sister gushed. “That was on my mind tonight too.”
Emily smiled at the chance of being understood.
“Yeah. Ship was reading The Scarlet Letter and one thing just led to another and I found myself mounting… um…” Lavinia’s voice choked off and Emily frowned at her, concerned, but her sister resumed with a reassuring flutter of her hand. “I found myself mounting an analysis of the text. You know, to really get into Hester Prynne’s character.”
“That sounds… stimulating,” Emily decided. Maybe she should’ve embraced the Dickinson way and stayed in with her family tonight. True, she may have had regrets about missing her chance to be shown off as a soon-to-be-published poet, but it certainly would have made for a less complicated evening. “For something that takes two people, affairs are so one-sided. The aftermath, I mean.”
“That is so true. They always blame the woman and it’s like, nobody even mentions if she had a good time. It’s just about scorning her and shaming her and treating her like a freak just because she wanted something.”
“Exactly! Aren’t women allowed to want anything?!” Emily exclaimed.
“Not in books written by men.”
“Men don’t want to accept that love can make women interesting. It inspires us. Sometimes it’s all we have,” she finished softly, thinking of all the poems she’d had Maggie carry over to the Evergreens, all addressed to Sue, some blatantly about Sue, if they found their way into the hands of an attentive reader.
“Or the not being in love,” Lavinia muttered, drawing Emily’s attention from memories full of the sound of paper squares shuffling together in a basket.
“What was that?”
“Not being in love,” her sister said. She raised her chin defiantly. “A woman might not even want to fall in love. Can’t she just have fun and see where things go? Maybe I don’t wanna novels-and-chill like an old married lady. Maybe I just wanna make out a lot and not wake up with a guy in my bed taking up the space that’s reserved for my cat.”
“And if the guy says he feels used, I think that’s just the misdiagnosis of a woman finally getting something out of the relationship.”
Emily nodded emphatically, boarding her sister’s train of thought at this station. She badly wanted the world to read her words and know that she was the one who had written them. She also wanted to respect Mary Bowles. And yet, with this evening’s fantasizing, Emily had realized how comfortable she was with a fictional alternative. If everyone assumed she was getting into Mr. Bowles’s paper because he had gotten into her bed, what was the harm in indulging? In her mind only, of course, though her heart still beat faster remembering her editor was spending the night at her brother’s house next door.
This might be the only way, ever. To always be someone who loved or lusted and was not taken seriously in return. She had loved Sue before Austin did and would love her all her life. How could that be disloyal? Or her fascination with Mr. Bowles, spurred on by the excitement of seeing her words printed in The Springfield Republican? Surely that demonstrated a fervent devotion to her craft? A desire adjacent to the accomplishment of one of her dreams? Real infidelity, Emily thought, could only be enacted against oneself. Anything else was simply… living.
Lavinia flopped onto her back.
“I don’t know how Ship can say he feels used when he literally wants to marry me so I can be his live-in servant.”
“That’s what I said.”
Emily sighed for herself and her sister. She turned her head to look down at her.
“Do you wanna hear more about the salon?”
“God yes. What did Sue wear? Did anybody try to suck up to you? Were there any famous people there? Have our horrible cousins dug any massive holes around their property? If you tell me one of the guests fell into a hole and I wasn’t there to see that, I may actually die.”
Breathing deeply, Emily set aside her pages and prepared a different recitation. Slowly, she unfolded the event to her sister in words. While Lavinia listened, she sat up to take down Emily’s hair and unfasten the back of her dress. Emily had looked the part for the salon—many people had said as much—but it was just a role, a disguise, not quite an infidelity, though something that had definitely provoked her innermost uncertainties and made her feel watched in every room, at every moment.
Her sister hmmed and awwed and Emily dictated the evening. She told it almost faithfully.
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Jenny Nicholson and Racism
So Jenny Nicholson’s new Vampire Diaries video is making the rounds, and I saw some users in her tag saying that people only want to cancel her because she ships Reylo. I was gonna just mention to some friends what I remember happening with Jenny last year, but I couldn’t find posts that focused on her. All I found were mentions of her as part of a bigger pattern, which is absolutely fair (racism isn’t just one person!), but I wanted something a bit more specific.
I want to start this out by saying I used to really like her! Jenny is smart and charming, and her analyses are often pretty spot-on imo. As someone that majored in Film Studies, I liked her because her work seemed like stuff that would come from my courses. No clue on what her education or background is, but Jenny Nicholson clearly at least understands storytelling structure and how movies are made. Plus, she’s able to be brutal and funny at the same time, which isn’t exactly common, I feel like. That’s another reason why I’m posting this: I’m still disappointed that things went down this way!
-this isn’t about cancelling Jenny or calling her A Racist or anything like that: it’s about documenting behavior that hurt people of color (particularly Black people).
-this post is not about whether Reylo as a ship is good or bad or whether Reylo shippers are good or bad for shipping it.
-this post is long. I know it’ll look like a big anti-Jenny vendetta or something, but to be clear, the majority of this post is context + evidence of said context, just to show how much racism was going around. but people love receipts, or else i would have just put up a tl;dr.
-not all Reylos are white, and not all Reylos participated in harassing John Boyega.
-some of the pushback Reylos get is definitely rooted in misogyny. this post covers the pushback that is specifically about racist behavior.
-absolutely, under no circumstances, should anyone that reads this go after any of the users mentioned here. I don’t expect this post to get much attention because all this happened over a year ago, but this is for purposes of documenting and explaining. I’ve redacted the usernames of anyone that isn’t verified on Twitter. Do. Not. Go. After. Anyone.
the tl;dr: Jenny Nicholson repeated known lies about John Boyega harassing people and blocked people of color that tried to correct her. She doubled down by signal boosting a fandom study that considered PoC discussing racism the same as sexist, white supremacist segments of fandom. When that was pointed out, she continued blocking people of color.
The issue: John Boyega and Reylos.
I’m sure it’s no surprise that John Boyega was harassed pretty much constantly from the moment he showed up in Star Wars. The Fandom Menace (aka alt-right assholes in the Star Wars fandom) was responsible for a lot of it, especially at first. They’re the same people that harassed Kelly Marie Tran and Daisy Ridley off of social media, threw fits over The Last Jedi, and so on.
Reylos were also involved on and off with racism surrounding John Boyega. More on that as a whole here, better than I could put it.
In December 2019, Variety posted an interview with John Boyega. In it, the interviewer mentioned Kelly Marie Tran and how she left social media. Boyega’s response was not about Tran, but about social media and how he is impacted by it:
Interviewer: There’s a sort of double edged sword there. You can get really great engagement. But then there’s what happened with Kelly [Marie Tran] about the small subset people who are very vocal and very negative, and having to navigate that.
John Boyega: Being in this position, you just understand the masses, how the masses think, you know. Through social media, we get to engage, we get to have fun. But at the same time, for those who are not mentally strong, you are weak to believe in every single thing that you read. That’s, you know, it is what it is. I don’t know, for me anyway, when I see that [backlash], I’m like, well, that’s actually not true. But no, it is actually not true. So it’s kind of like [shrugs] it is what it is. But to engage, to connect with the fans who otherwise wouldn’t get a day to day experience, especially during things like the press tour, and behind the scenes stuff, is always good.
In response, a rather big-name fan in Star Wars fandom, Lindsay Romain (who also is published at The Nerdist, Hypebeast, and other places), tweeted about it:
Frankly, I think Boyega’s response wasn’t worded clearly. He did tweet shortly afterward to reaffirm that his words were NOT about Kelly Marie Tran. It’s also worth mentioning that Romain quickly apologized for this take/misinformation after seeing how much harassment was sent Boyega’s way after this. However, this tweet is still important for what’s to come, especially because the apology and recant were spread widely among Star Wars fandom that was aware of this.
On December 31, 2019, John Boyega posted a video of him dancing at a party on Instagram. Somebody commented on the video:
My boy after realizing Kylo died so he can date Rey
To which Boyega responded:
It’s not about who she kisses but who eventually lays the pipe. You are a genius.
That’s it. One joke.
A bit distasteful, sure. I didn’t think it was particularly funny, or something worth saying. It struck me as a typical straight-dude “hur hur boobs women” kind of comment. But it was one single joke.
And Reylos. went. ballistic.
I saw things like:
-someone claiming all men of color are trash (and making weird comments about John Boyega’s balls????)
-someone creating a fake Twitter with a stock photo of a Black woman specifically to call out John Boyega as “extremly disgusting and gross also fucking disrespectful" and claim he was jealous of adam driver (which was not a unique claim)
-someone saying that Rey is inseparable from Daisy Ridley, so any such comments are consequently disrespectful of his co-star
-someone calling John Boyega “one of the good ones,” which... do I really have to explain why calling a Black guy that is bad?
-people claiming that Boyega was objectifying Daisy Ridley, making up rumors that his role as Finn was reduced because he had attempted to hit on and harass Daisy Ridley on set
-someone wishing to shoot JJ Abrams and John Boyega
-someone photoshopping screenshots to make it look like Boyega was calling Reylos inbred
And plenty more. Boyega responded to some of the direct replies to him on Twitter, reminding people it’s a fictional franchise. He tweeted sarcastically about Star Wars romance, including 4 pictures of Kylo and Rey fighting (including the scene in TFA where Kylo tortures Rey). Basically, he seemed fed up with the harassment Reylos were sending him, so he clapped back.
The harassment went on for weeks. Over one joke and a sarcastic tweet.
Here’s where Jenny Nicholson comes into all of this the first time: she tweeted about cast/crew disappointing her, which is totally fine. Thing is, Nicholson continued, saying that Boyega was only trying to deflect attention away from his misogynistic comments. Notably, she repeated that he called people inbred, which had been already admitted as false (and that fact was being spread around quickly).
Nicholson also mentioned it on Tumblr, where she repeated the lie that Boyega called Kelly Marie Tran weak, even though Lindsey Romain had apologized several times on Twitter and elsewhere + retracted what she said, after Boyega had clarified what he had meant:
The post is now deleted, as best as I can tell.
I think it’s important to note that Nicholson is mischaracterizing not only why people were upset about the response to Boyega, but also what happened with Chewbacca’s new actor, Joonas Suotamo, and the feminist fan (”K”) mentioned in this post. K had responded to a Tumblr post, agreeing that queer Reylos sometimes use their queerness to claim they can’t be discriminatory, almost always in response to discussion of racism. She joked that Reylo was straight culture. Reylos took that and started claiming that K was biphobic. K is bisexual herself. Sure, there’s such a thing as internalized biphobia, but cracking a joke and discussing issues within a specific group is not inherently biphobic, and for Nicholson to characterize that as sending biphobic harassment is.... well, it’s not a good look. When K tweeted what happened and asked why Jenny was calling her biphobic (and as a result, sending harassment her way), Jenny blocked her.
Over the following week, Reylos continued to swarm Boyega’s mentions with harassment. Multiple Black Twitter users (and other users of color) critiqued what was going on, noting that the pile-on over a single joke seemed to be overreaction and that the lies that were being told about Boyega contributed to racist abuse.
We could give the benefit of the doubt and say that Jenny hadn’t seen Lindsey’s apology even though it was spread around quite a bit. We could say the same for the photoshopped Boyega insults.
Thing is, Jenny blocked multiple PoC that tried to inform her about the fake posts, as well as PoC who tried to point out the racism going around. Keep in mind, this wasn’t about Reylo as a ship, but specifically about the way that Reylos in particular were behaving at this time. At the time, I figured she was blocking people who were a bit more hostile (even if they were right, like how this could be read), but I later found that Jenny blocked people for much more polite corrections and explanations.
Like here (their Twitter handle has changed. The block was mentioned in this Tumblr post). Or here.
10 days in to all of this abuse, Boyega posted a video on Instagram of him laughing away and dancing away some of the abuse, including screenshots of some of the tweets he received. Those tweets were all public, but the video just made Reylos angrier, as Boyega did not black out the Twitter handles of the users he screenshotted.
The responses to Boyega continued. People of color--primarily Black people, but not exclusively--continued to discuss how lying about Boyega, making up rumors, and continuing to harass him for weeks over a single comment contributed to a racist response, especially when other Star Wars stars had made iffy comments without being brigaded in this manner.
On January 15, 2020, Twitter user and data analyst InFormalMajesty posted an analysis of Star Wars fandom with regard to Reylo. Their conclusion: Reylos were targeted specifically to shame women for liking things. InFormalMajesty’s analysis took responses to Reylos and tweets about Reylo, breaking them down to illustrate why so much hate was levied at Reylo shippers and how this was specifically sexist and discriminatory, from the alt right to antis and so on.
Some of the tweets included in this analysis came from well-known alt-right fandom personalities, absolutely. Looking at the ways that ~The Fandom Menace~ targets minorities is probably pretty valuable so we can understand how hatred works in digital spaces and galvanizes enthusiast communities.
There was just one problem: good-faith criticism was considered abuse. Whether you ship Reylo or not, whether you find it problematic or not, there was a significant subset of fans that were pointing out the racist actions of Reylos as a whole during this time (as well as earlier), and those fans were labeled the same as the alt right. (Princess Weekes did a video about the analysis that looks at it better than I, as a non-black PoC, could not, but it focused a bit more on the overall experience Black people have in fandom, which the analysis framed as “antis,” than the specific actions I’m referring to. An important discussion to be had, absolutely. Watch the video sometime.)
Pointing out racist actions and patterns of behavior is not the same thing as harassment or hatred. Black and brown people discussing their experiences in fandom and with Reylos is not and should not be compared to the alt right.
That analysis specifically included those discussions as part of harassment and hate. That analysis heavily implied that the only racism being levied at John Boyega was coming from The Fandom Menace, not from Reylos, even though this specific issue stemmed from Reylos harassing John Boyega for one joke, and later, expressions of frustration and disdain for Reylos due to that harassment.
To bring this back to Jenny Nicholson: Jenny shared that analysis on Twitter. Not just unquestioningly, but defending it, claiming that the majority of fanworks and good actions in fandom are done by Reylos.
She also continued to block users that mentioned her spreading fake screenshots and misinformation (block mentioned here). Also mentioned here. And here. This (and the above examples) is primarily what I could find as evidence through a cursory Twitter search; it doesn’t include blocks that may have taken place on Tumblr or other platforms, and it’s not a deep dive to find instances where names were censored.
Criticism can be tough to take. For non-black PoC and for white people, anti-black work is hard to do considering how our society functions. It’s something we have to constantly be aware of and working on, no matter how smart or socially savvy we are.
But that’s the thing: we have to keep working at it, not block people that point out problems. It’s disappointing to see someone who will even touch on racism, like in the Vampire Diaries video (from what I’ve heard), refuse to do that work.
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people really treating their feels about rpf as universal, if I was a famous youtuber or whatever and I found a horny fanfic shipping me and my friends not only would I read it, i would specifically read it out loud to my friends just to watch them lose their minds about it, hell ive had smaller creators read out my fanfic on stream (with my permission of course) before, it was hilarious and everyone had a good time! Including the creator because that fuck switched to a soos voice during it
+ Anon: Why is every anti-rpf person always talking about how they would feel if someone wrote about them? Makes me think of people in high school talking about how gross gay people are because ewwww, what if a gay person liked them?! The sooner (general) you resign yourself to the fact that you exist and cannot control how you are perceived, the happier you'll be.
+ Anon: Lmao RPF isn't the problem. The problem is shoving the non-fictional shipping down people's throats, in spaces they can easily see it (ex. CC's YT comments sections, main tags on twitter, twitch chat, etc.) - that's what makes things uncomfortable. Most of those that write/read RPF are actually respectful for people it's about, as they see the difference. But yeah, in general fandoms still have trouble keeping shit out of their favs' faces (at least in twitch streamers' fandoms I'm in)
+ Anon: I don't like RPF either and I don't get why people like it. HOWEVER, I still don't think the people who like it deserve to be harrassed and attacked for it. I will just avoid that content.
+ Anon: 'at anti-rpf anon' your knee-jerk reaction/disgust is not morality, like with everything fandom related. You can hate it, you can hate people who participate in it, you can go on and on how 'wrong', 'gross', or 'immoral' it is, it is still just your personal opinion and nothing more and you still don't get to tell people what to do in fandoms and don't get to get away with being an asshole about it, anti-rpf people, please learn what the word 'fiction' means in 'real person fiction', like please
+ Anon: Yo. I write rpf...and i have never stalked the people i write about. Personally, I would rather not know them, and only their online persona (they're gamer youtubers.) All the time, people think some fanfic rpf writers are crazy ass stalkers. The only time I've seen someone cross the line by hacking a youtuber and finding where they lived was an instagram artist who wanted attention from said youtuber. :/ So, idk...it's a subjective topic.
As I wrote already in the past on the subject:
Harassing real life people is something that plenty of generic fans do too, and that’s a behavior that is criticized and policed in the community, rightfully so. But “harassing” changes meaning in anti-RPF spaces from a direct action against someone to indirect behaviors that aren’t even aimed in the general direction of the real life people in question, but are still considered harmful even when no measurable direct harm has taken place.
“it would be a total lie if I said that we [RPSers] never or only rarely have people completely overstepping. It’s not always out of malicious intent; selfishness can do the job just fine. The community is not happy when it happens, and you’ll get another round of inside policing and ethical discourse, but it’s not really like non-RPS fandoms don’t have the same issues. RPS is just held on a higher standard because it’s easily something that creeps people out (despite it being very close to the absolutely generic concept of s/exual fantasy over someone you know –or maybe that’s exactly the point)”
“The arguments against RPF really go all over the place, and the one present here is that of preventing possible future harm. But boundaries are already in place**, and you can’t logically disprove a rule being written and claiming it’s preventing harm, because you can’t argue against something that isn’t there yet. It can never be disproved. It’s the same reasoning given for l0li/sh0ta content where it’s made illegal: since it’s illegal, there’s no related crime. But you can’t prove the law is useless, because they’re taking the absence of crime as confirmation that they’re right, ignoring the fact that said absence might have been there regardless. **Fair reminder that RPF is old as hell. It wasn’t born yesterday. If it’s so universally dangerous when left alone, why and how are we still here?”
“I don’t think I have to make a list of all the appalling things I’ve seen fandomentalists do to real people involved in the canon or fanon of their ship. If I put the incidents involving celebrities I’ve found in RPF circles (coming from RPSers, not generic rabid fans) compared to the ones about non-RPF ones, the latter overwhelmingly surpasses the former. We even made receipt blogs to list it all, because it was just never ending.
So, personally, I worry about harm coming someone’s way from shippers way more in SU and VLD fandoms (to name two), then hockey, movie, or kpop RPF.”
“I’ve seen non-RPF fandoms harass and torment celebrities (staff, producers, actors, voice actors, etc) all the time, and this self-awareness of all the ways a fan can cross boundaries has not been as loud [compared to RPF], in the fandoms I’ve been. I feel like (I might just be biased) RPF groups are more careful and sensitive about it than non-RPF ones where they really seem to forget that they’re directly interacting (not talking of fictional content correctly tagged and put in fandom spaces) with real people.”
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I've been a proshipper for awhile now but I don't think I want to be anymore? I'm not an anti either though. Maybe I just need a fresh online start? I know it all comes down to not bullying others, which I would never do but there's so much casual racism in the community and whenever I bring it up I get told it's just fiction. As a poc seeing people with blm in their bio creating media that exists solely on race, whitewashing, or stereotypes feels bad. My friends also screenshot teenagers that say they don't like problematic content (not being violent, just complaining in their circle) and then make a whole thread mocking them and it makes me feel sick. Idc that "that's what antis do", two wrongs don't make a right. Idk, I just feel too old for discourse posting (I'm only 22) and I realized that I want to enjoy my problematic content on my own I guess. Barely any of these issues exist off the internet. I like all the characters I want without judgement AND I can also freely say "fictional 18+ content of a 5 year old is weird" and not get an essay about how I'm trying to commit mass censorship. I don't want to be harassed by people for what I like, but I don't want to be called a cop for saying "maybe writing the N word in this fic as a white person is bad." I ESPECIALLY don't want to be gaslit and told that the people doing it aren't "real" proshippers. Sorry for ranting, I just feel alone on this I guess.
I’m glad you feel comfortable getting this off your chest, and I appreciate your honesty. Perhaps I can provide some comfort ot advice?
First and foremost, ship whoever the fuck you want. As long as it’s legal, go for it. Frankly, I ship characters because there’s nice pieces of art/writings? Also, it’s a fictional character and there’s worse things in the world to worry about?
Anyway, the internet is a shit place. While there’s incredible things out here, people strive for negativity to the point where it isn’t even funny. Since things are “anonymous” or not face-to-face, people act like cowards and target others since they “can’t get in trouble.” In my opinion, people tend to lack maturity when it comes to the internet and it’s disgusting. This is a big reason why I don’t have many social media accounts, and by god it’s one of the best decisions of my life. I’d rather spend my time worrying about my frail grandmother who has Alzheimers rather than argue with some stranger over an issue that neither of us can control.
As for the race issue, I try to keep things neutral as possible in my works. Unless somebody specifically asks for something, that’s how I try to do it. I myself am white, and I know a lot of works cater to lighter skin people. It’s unfair, yes, but there’s nothing I can do personally about the issue. (This is where my POC writers come and serve justice, to kudos to you 👏👏👏)
What I’m trying to say is that the internet is not a good place. While there IS some safe spaces, overall it’s shit. People do get sensitive for the wrong reasons, and it completely blows my mind for their arguments. Maybe I sound like an asshole about this, but I truly do think people are wasting their time and energy on trying to bring others down. If someone randomly left a message in my inbox saying something along the lines of “you suck, fuck off,” like... Who cares? They’re probably gonna be on anon anyway? Whatever I write and post is not affecting your life whatsoever, besides the point of you “not liking it.”
And that’s what it boils down to. If people don’t agree with each other, they tear the other down. And it’s like hey, if you wanna act like a damn monkey, go to a zoo. I understand that people don’t share the same ideology as me, but come on. It’s not hard to not treat others like shit. Then again, common decency is too hard to understand nowadays, at least at a majority level.
I probably sound like I’m preaching or I’m saying I’m better than others. And you know what? That’s okay. Why? Because I respect others, especially online. If I don’t like what I see, I click away rather than target them and try to make them feel like shit. Like what RuPaul said, it is NOT your business what other people think of you. If they don’t like you, who cares? If they don’t like what you’re into, who cares? As far as I’m concerned, it’s your own life and you can do as you please.
I realized I’m rambling, wow. I may have gotten off topic >.> Either way, I’m trying to say is “do what you want.” Granted, I’m not saying you should do illegal shit, but just... enjoy what you want? I don’t think I can convey this through text, and I apologize. Being online means you have to walk on eggshells constantly, and that’s what sucks about it. I mean, aren’t most things out there for our enjoyment? Who decided it would be a good idea to knock that idea and turn communities into such toxic places?
If I could rewrite the world, I would. I personally apologize if my words seem “typical” in any sort of way. I know people tend to write with their familiar with, and maybe of caution? Like, they don’t want to screw something up? I dunno. This is a big rant, yada yada, and I don’t know if it makes sense or even helps. I’ve said numerous times that I want this blog to be an open place, so I thank you for being honest.
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U know I don't really hate barchie if they give us reasons for them to be together but what I really hate is barchies .they are the most ones in taking things out of context and then complain about it when someone do this in their mind only .... but what triggered me the most that they now are pretending to be fans of Betty and lili when they really never liked her .only recognize her when she is with Archie and always talking about how she is lucky to have his hotness lol . And I am sure the minute bughead will return they will trash her again claiming to be the reason for it . And sadly some bugheads do the same with her after lili's break up .sorry for my English
I am very tired today so pls excuse me if this doesn’t make sense. Also, never apologize for your English, it’s fine! English is hard enough for native speakers to keep track of, I can’t imagine what it’s like for others.💜
I am fairly indifferent to b/archie. I think most of us knew they were going to do it badly at some point so I’m meh about it. I also think if they were always going to, they should have done it earlier (early to mid s2 was a good opportunity tbh) and if they had to wait, they really did have a chance to build it up and make it part of the narrative instead of a plot twist for shock in s4.
Shock plots, when they stir negative emotions, almost always have negative repercussions for the shows that utilize them (the walking dead comes to mind, they really managed to lose an insane amount of viewers over the course of one episode a few years ago).
And yes, b/archies like to take everything out of context. I’ve noticed that. Or they put too much emphasis on stuff that they had to go frame by frame to see. Sometimes, hard as it is to believe, things just are what they are. Maybe it’s a byproduct of always being baited only to be let down. Which, for them, why are they still hanging gospel on the words of people they know lie to them? If they get b/archie and it ends badly, what then? Will they not ship it? Will they harass the writers? The actors? This is the environment that RAS and Ted have created for themselves so my sympathy will be in short supply for them.
And the shippers themselves have absolutely harassed me and others. They may not like to call it that but it is harassment. I can’t keep my anon on because of the way b/archie shippers treat me. I hope when they read this they see that for what it is. It’s not j/eronica or j/archie or b/eronica shippers. It’s them.
Also, yes. They don’t particularly seem to care about Betty or even like Lili. Which I don’t get because I’m a big fan of liking both parts of whatever ship I’m into. This thing where we have, generally very young or very dedicated, fans shipping something because of a “hot” guy is one of those things I don’t get. They want viewers, the female characters, and the actresses who play them to all carry water for some guy.
Because they’re projecting or living in a fantasy or whatever (i don’t judge, not my place) they often end up showing the very worst of themselves online to people over a person who doesn’t even know they exist. Or they harass very real people over a fictional character. I’m not saying people shouldn’t enjoy celebs or be fans, etc, but I would like some of these people to ask themselves why they think they know an actor better than his co-worker and friend and why they really dislike her because of it.
Sounds like jealousy to me but whatever, that’s just my personal opinion.
And yeah. I’ve seen the Lili hate. I’ve seen the speculation and the judgment of how she’s living her life, like her relationship was somehow beholden to total strangers on the internet. I’ve seen her get attacked and blamed for things she has nothing to do with.
As an aside, in general, grown men don’t need coddling. I wish people would stop looking for women to blame because they don’t know what to do with disappointment. We’re not actually society’s punching bags and the expectation that we should be is something I’m never going to be good with.
The way people treat others is, to me, the clearest picture of who they are as a person. I really don’t think we need more to know who the b/archies (the ones who harass strangers) or the people who love to hate Lili are; they’ve already shown us.
Thanks for the ask, lovely!💜
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i am so sorry you gotten your safespace taken away from you i don’t even have one really if i had to choose it would literally be sleep haha nothing can judge me there and i’m so sorry your getting harassed for an opinion people are so ignorant i swear i don’t think i’ll ever know why people judge others opinions it’s literally not doing any harm to anyone in the fandom for cm they are literally fictional characters they aren’t real (which i cry everyday when i get reminded that😭) and for harry he’s a celebrity people talk for him saying what he’s comfortable and uncomfortable about like he can speak for himself if a ship was making him uncomfortable i’m sure he’d have no problem speaking up about it, let others live, shipping people are fun and not at all harmful its fun doing deep dives and finding the littlest things that may or may not hint to whatever lmaoo again i’m sorry your being harassed it’s literally not that deep but people get so offended over nothing
People just want to create dramas over nothing, they want their 5 minutes of fame and see if they can humiliate someone for their own pleasure. It's not even about the ship, it's just about showing their friends that they can humiliate a person on the internet.
What makes me laugh the most is that I have "LARRIE" in mio twitter bio and this person didn't see it, got mad at me for tweeting about larry and suggested that I stop stanning Matthew. Like.... sis, you knew that I was a larrie and followed me anyway, so? That is your fault.
For example: I don't think Shawmila is real. I don't like her for a bunch of different reasons. Do you see me following Camila stan accs? No, because I don't care about her and I don't want to see her on my TL; non-larries should do the same. If talking about Larry makes them uncomfortable, they shouldn't follow larries in the first place.
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I have a concern about Dramione fandom, which has been slightly troubling me lately. I am not saying that this is something that is going to happen, or is happening already. Naturally, I don’t think this is entirely unfounded either (hence why I am writing this), but I am just one Dramione shipper. If this doesn’t resonate at all, that’s totally fine!
We are all aware of extremely boorish and fatuous anti-Dramione people, who troll, defame and accuse Dramione of being all sort of things. We are also probably all quite familiar with their claims about the ship and its shippers. You know, Dramione promotes racism, sexism, classism, unhealthy and abusive relationships, it’s all about bashing Ron, it’s just cuz actors are hot, we should all pay homage and tribute to canon relationships (and their shippers naturally), and offer respect and fawn over everything “canonical” for gracing us with all this HP bounty, and so on. This time I am not going to try to offer rebuttals, or deconstruct their arguments, or even psychoanalyze them more than absolutely necessarily. I am not even particularly upset about them (anymore). They are categorically wrong, their arguments are never insightful or thoughtful. Most importantly, they are disingenuous in their argumentation and especially about their own motives. I believe, the best course is ignore them totally.
What I am afraid, that these endless arguments, relentless belittling, and even harassment of which they never seem to grow tired off actually might change Dramione shippers and community as well. Not in a conscious way, but constantly being on a defense can make people internalize some of these arguments. Or rather their premises and assumptions on which they are based upon. I don’t mean it, that Dramione shippers will suddenly wake up, and shout out that Dramione was actually all about abusing women all along, or anything like that. What I mean is, that people rather internalize certain assumptions, framing and logic chains, which are build into those arguments. In a defense, they start define what Dramione really means, what is ideal Dramione, what is acceptable or desirable in Dramione fics, in accordance of these attacks, by unconsciously defending their ship from slander.
As an example, Romione people constantly accuse that Dramione is either all about mindless “Ron bashing”, and Dramione shippers rightly say that it’s not what Dramione is about at all. What I am afraid, that people might internalize the point, that “Ronbashing” is something truly heinous, and what should be avoided at all cost. And as a corollary to that, ideal Dramione fics are those in which there’s no conflicts between Ron, Draco and Hermione. Or the very least they are resolved in a conciliatory and harmonious manner. Or it is lazy Dramione writing, when Ron is “villainized”.
Or another thing they say is, that Dramione just about glorifying and eroticizing abusive relationships. This might lead that some of us accept the framing, that describing or narrating something is totally same as promoting and celebrating it. If they accept it, then it’s quite easy to logically infer, that if Dramione is not defined by Draco abusing Hermione (it’s not), then it must be defined negatively as its opposite. Meaning that something cannot be genuine or accepted Dramione, if it contains an abusive Draco. Or as an induction from that, if a fic has an abusive Draco, it also must contain a redemption arc, and Draco has to change and make amends, and redeem himself as a person. That we start to define Dramione being really about redemption or redeeming, forgiveness, changing oneself for the better, etc (as contrary to their claim that its about abuse). Don’t get me wrong, I’d say the majority of Dramione fics contain a redemption story arc, and Draco either has changed or actively changes his views and behavior. It’s a common and wonderful theme, and almost all my favorite Dramione fics have those, and I like just for its own skae. Yet it’s not something what either makes or unmakes Dramione. There’s a minority of fics, in which Draco is never truly redeemed (usually a lust-filled obsession, with many many cognitive dissonances, which he never solves), and they are as Dramione as anything else, and some people enjoy writing them and some people reading them (or at least some of them). Also, a lot of gray areas, which can be quite delightful, thought inspiring and invigorating (and hot!).
Speaking for myself, I’d say maybe 1/20 of my favorite fics have this dynamic or something close to it. Maybe 33% are more in that gray area. It doesn’t do any harm, there’s nothing ethnically wrong about it, I never idolize that behavior. If Romione stans have problem with that, they can go away, cry and tell that Rupert Grint body pillow all their troubles, because I don’t give a damn. People don’t emulate or model their behavior or preferences from YA fanfics or smut in that sense in any significant numbers. If someone does, I am sorry to say, but you probably weren’t going to make it anyway. It’s the irl version of getting a comedy death in a video game, like if a smarter-than-average mushroom hypnotizes you and makes you walk into a bottomless pit, or something like that. Your problems are deep seated and numerous, which unless dealt with, will be triggered by just about anything. Its pure happenstance whether it will be Harlequin novels, Dramione fanfiction, urban legend your cousin told you, or whatever.
This could go on, but seriously, Dramione shippers have nothing to prove or even argue with those antis. It’s just bottomless pit of resentment, what they twist into moral arguments, which they think will signify us as the worst kind of people, and they themselves as the most virtuous. Their antipathies are petty and personal concerns, in which they feel like the universe and the abominable cabal of Dramione shippers have cheated them out of all that attention, writers, fans, fics, and deference they feel entitled to. It’s natural for humans to cloak often even most pettiest and nonsensical slights and resentments into whatever moral or ethical language and arguments the society they live holds sacred. If we would be living in the 1600s, they’d be scouring the Bible for anti-Dramione arguments, and denouncing Dramione as unchristian and sinful. By their stated “moral standards”, there are a lot more “vile” and “harmful” ships out there, but they aren’t functionally bothered by them at all. So, unless really prompted, they don’t even bother to denounce them, little alone wage this never-ending crusade against them. That’s because they aren’t popular enough to trigger that envy and resentment (Hermione with basically any of the worst Death Eaters). Or they feel that they don’t compete in the same niche as their ship does (Drarry as an example).
I wouldn’t be writing this, if this discourse with Antis hadn’t affected me as well. There was a time, I wanted to understand what they were about, and I read a lot of their grievances and internal discussions. While reading I couldn’t help but to be on a defense all the time. Sort of refuting and counter-arguing against their points in my mind, while reading their diatribes (I tried to start a dialog couple of times, but I was always totally ignored, which I am thankful for them in retrospect). Conditioning myself with that for long enough, I did notice that I started to feel a bit hesitant about certain tropes and Dramione fics I hadn’t before. I was thinking about Dramione like a defense attorney, excepting to be attacked from all directions. It actually took me quite long to figure this out, and how the bile of HP fandom had in subtle ways affected my sense and tastes without my really noticing.
Anonymous submitted: P.S. I wrote that previous submission, and I have to add, that I am not trying to say this is happening or pointing any fingers at anybody. There’s perfectly good reasons to not like any Dramione fic, as a Dramione shipper, in which Draco is irredeemable or evil. There’s perfectly legitimate reasons to prefer fics, which Ron is portrayed as a positive influence for Dramione. People can arrive to same conclusions or tastes from countless different routes and reasons. The negativity that the HP fandom and Romione shippers especially grace us just got to me in a way, that I wasn’t even cognizant about. It might be the case for others as well, if their own self-reflection so deems (or not).
I agree with every point you’ve made. While it’s obviously okay to discuss why you like Dramione (or any other pairing), people also need to remember that they don’t have to justify why they ship Draco and Hermione together or prove (especially to haters as they’re not worth anyone’s time) that their OTP makes sense because even if it makes no sense whatsoever, it’s still fine to ship it as long as you can differentiate between fantasy and reality. I don’t know about you, but when I started shipping Dramione, it was like love at first sight. I didn’t think if they made sense, didn’t spend hours trying to make a list of arguments for Dramione, I just suddenly loved the idea of them together, believed they belonged together, and that was and still is enough. I don’t need to justify why I ship them, and neither does anyone.
It’s true that in most Dramione fics, Draco gets redeemed. It’s also true that most shippers prefer fics in which Draco gets a redemption arc, but we have to remember that there’s nothing wrong with enjoying fics in which Draco’s irredeemable or his relationship with Hermione is toxic. I myself read such stories from time to time. I like a good Ron bashing fic every now and then as well, and there’s nothing wrong with that either because it’s all fantasy, it’s all fiction, which, I believe, most Dramione shippers are aware of and accept. Hopefully, it won’t change, and no one will ever try to tell others what should and shouldn’t be written or what is and what’s not allowed in a Dramione fic.
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TRIGGERS - I tag any sensitive topics (suicide, selfharm, abuse, gaslighting, etc.) with #____ tw. As for things I need tagged, I need any mentions of rape, pedophilia, grooming, and incest tagged, and I will follow your tag format for censoring. By default I have #rape tw, #pedophilia tw, #grooming tw, and #incest tw censored. I don't follow people who use fancy fonts to tag triggers.
🔞 BLOGS - If your blog doesn't allow interaction from anyone below the age of 18, you're getting hardblocked if you interact, and you'll probably get hardblocked on sight tbh. I'm 17 years old, get the fuck off my blogs, hypocrite.
SELECTIVITY - My blogs are selective, mutuals only, and they are not associated with any RP group in any way. Don't try to have interactions with me if we're not mutuals. Don't drop in my DMs to plot if we're not mutuals. If we're mutuals and you unfollow me, hardblock me so I'm forced to unfollow you and I don't see your stuff on my dash anymore. I do not usually care about the age of a mun as long as you aren't a predator or on Tumblr illegally. If you repeatedly follow when I've soft-blocked you, I will hardblock you.
CALLOUT POSTS - I am only pro-callout for matters such as pedophilia, extreme bigotry, extreme harassment, suicide baiting, abuse or abuse apologism, and other gross shit. I only ever reblog callout posts on my hub (this blog) unless I am specifically involved. I never reblog callout posts about minors- especially if they're made by adults. "This person annoyed me" is not a valid reason to make a callout post.
DRAMA - If you had a falling out with someone over something that is petty, such as you finding the other person annoying, and you have an issue with me interacting with that person, block me or blacklist their URL. Unless I really, really want you to be my RP partner, I'm not going to change who I RP with just because you don't like them. Just blacklist their tag if you really wanna keep following me that much.
I'M NOT A MEME SOURCE - I don't care if you reblog my PSAs since I do make those occasionally. But please reblog memes from the source, unless the source is deactivated. If you do this excessively then I will block you. I'm not going to sit here and message you over and over again. I have made SEVERAL posts about this in the past and people still do it.
RULES + ABOUT PAGES - If you want me to follow you, you MUST have at least a rules page somewhere on your blog. If you're RPing as an OC or a multimuse, you must have an about page somewhere as well. If I can't find a rules page, I'm not following.
I'M NOT A MIND READER - If you have a big issue with me, my muses, or my behavior (ESPECIALLY this one), either tell me or block me. If it's something that multiple people have done and you're making a PSA about it or something, I don't care. But if it's just something that I've done, I'd appreciate if you'd just message me.
DNI - Do not interact if you don't support the LGBTQ+ community. Do not interact if you are associated with rushifaas. Do not interact if you think that shipping pedophilia, incest, etc. is okay or that fiction doesn't affect reality by normalizing those disgusting things online. Do not follow my blogs if you are a personal that doesn't have an RP sideblog attached. Do not interact if you support genderbends. And, obviously, don't follow if your blog doesn't allow interaction from minors.
SELF-INSERTS - I'm highly selective with self-inserts, sonas, and people who kin their muse. My comfort with those things is usually pretty low, but occasionally I'll be willing to RP with them.
CROSSOVERS - Most crossovers are fair game as long as I can see it working out. I don't RP with Hazbin Hotel, Homestuck, Kingdom Hearts (have really bad memories with that fandom tbh), Creepypasta, FNAF, Hetalia, Attack on Titan/SNK, South Park, Made in Abyss, or Killing Stalking, so if you're a single muse from one of those fandoms, don't even bother trying to follow. I'm not going to completely bar off MLP, Steven Universe, Future Diary/Mirai Nikki, or Overwatch RPs, but I'll be highly selective with them.
WRITING - I rarely do one-liners anymore since they give me very little to work with- I only do one-liners with friends. I do not mix one-liners with para/multipara.
GODMODDING - I'm no longer being nice about godmodding. If you godmod, I'll drop the thread without warning. I've made a PSA about this in the past when I was being more lenient about it but I'm just fed up now.
PRESSURING - Another thing that I'm not being nice about anymore. If you pressure me to respond to a thread, I'll block you. If you constantly ask when I'm going to respond, I'll block you. I may not have a full-time job, but I still have a lot of shit on my plate, especially at the age I'm currently at where I have to worry about graduating, university classes, getting a job, and moving out. RPing is strictly a hobby and I refuse to let it take up my entire life.
MUN =/= MUSE - I'm not my muses. I'm not here to agree or disagree with their actions. I'm here to write as them. If you think that the way that one of my muses acts reflects badly on me, then you have a problem.
SHIPPING - I'm highly selective with shipping. I expect our muses to have had some IC chemistry. I'm not very comfortable with shipping our muses when we haven't even have a thread. I prefer to write ships with muns in the 16-25 age range, though this rule is loose and I'm willing to bend it in some circumstances. I won't ship my human muses with Pokemon or vice versa. I won't ship my underage muses with adults, and I'll be HIGHLY selective with shipping them in general. Gjinkas are a 50/50 when it comes to shipping.
NSFW PART 1 - To get the big one out of the way here will be no sexual content on my blogs. Most of my muses are of age, however, I am not. Don't try to send in sexual asks or start sexual roleplays with me. You will be fucking blocked. If your NSFW is untagged or it's tagged with a fancy font, I won't follow you.
NSFW PART 2 - I do delve into other sensitive topics and I may or may not write violent scenes due to the nature of some of my muses, though that mostly takes place on etherealdestinies. Topics that may or may not appear on the blogs under a tag and cut are suicide, selfharm, other violence/gore, abuse (emotional and physical), torture, and experimentation. Just because I write about these topics doesn't mean I condone them. If you have a problem with me writing these things as a 17 year old, get off my blogs and block me instead of being a whiny asshole about it.
DUPLICATES - I'm very open to RPing with duplicates as long as things are plotted. Us using the same muse is not a competition to see who has the "better" portrayal and if you treat it as such I won't RP with you.
NOTE - I WOULD HIGHLY PREFER TYAT YOU LIKE THIS POST IF YOU HAVE READ THE RULES. These rules are subject to change in the future for my own comfort. If major changes are made, I will make a post about it. I can tell when people haven't read my rules, so please just do it.
If you consistently violate my rules then it will result in a permanent hardblock. Do not use an alt to evade the block and ask why. Do not get your friends or my friends to ask me why I blocked you. Just accept it and find someone else to RP with. Bye.
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You and your fake wokeness
So there's this guy.
He starts work on your favorite TV show in season two, and in maybe two scenes it's obvious he has great chemistry with one of his co-stars. So you ship it; they're cute, they're oblivious, they'll do anything for one another. And the actors seem to get along; when there are interviews they laugh a lot and are always smiling. You probably even write RPF about them.
But it's not enough for you. Is it?
Because the ship doesn't go canon, and even though you know this is all transformative fiction and a ship doesn't have to be canon for it to be a ship, you are entitled to have your ship canon, right? Plenty of people have good reasons why they want this ship to go canon, but you? You just like to be right, to rub it in the faces of those whose ships aren't canon, because you're that kind of lowlife.
So what happens when the ship doesn't go canon? You harass the showrunner who has no time for your shit. You overwhelm the network's social media complaining. But mostly what you do is blame the actors. Mainly this new actor. Because the other man in this ship, the perfect white boy who can do no wrong, you can't touch him, right? He's your perfect blue eyed boy. Despite his attitude with fans, despite comparing milking a cow to raping a human, he's untouchable, and fuck anyone who says a word about him.
But this other guy. This Latino man. You hate him, right? Maybe it's because he's attractive. Maybe it's because he has a great life and you don't. Maybe it's because he's happily in love and you in your own patheticness have nothing and no one. Who knows? But really why you hate him is because your ship isn't canon, and according to you, it's all his fault. You have no evidence for this. Videos of him and this other actor are tolerant, if not enthusiastic about the ship. But hey. This Latino man is in the wrong anyway, according to you. You and your fake wokeness who always defends a white boy over a Latino man. The hilarity of you.
So what do you do?
You go digging for dirt so you have reasons to hate him and can make other people hate him too. You post sneaky shit on Twitter making it sound like you know shit about him. You do the same on Tumblr, and Instagram, and in a server whose mods wouldn't know how to mod a server if their lives depended on it. You imagine him being recast. You imagine his character dying. You still have no shit on him.
So what do you do?
You go back to Twitter. You go through ten years of his fiancee's tweets, find some from when she was sixteen and said words to her friends that were not her words to say. There it is. There's your evidence this Latino man is wrong. You now have your evidence. It's his fault that she said those words years before he even met her.
Bearing in mind this fiancee is secretly pregnant at the time!! You bitch on her social media, call her every slur and bad word under the sun, as well as racist. You send her, this pregnant woman you don't even know and only follow or stalk her accounts or hate her because of HIM, you send her and her toddler son death threats. Then he comes online and you start cursing out at him, demanding, what; a time machine so he can go back and make her not say these words? To leave her for it? What? What do you want? Nothing would have been enough and you know it. Startled, he fucks up his words, explains what he means, apologizes a bunch of times, but it's far, far too late.
Already, because of people like you, he's canceled. You go running to Perfect White Boy for his take on things and of course, instead of stopping and listening he goes and makes a social media statement saying 'i don't endorse my castmate'. Castmate. Not the probable-friend he's made working with the guy for two years, just someone he works with. Just fucking kicks him to the curb, just like that. What a fucking guy. Best human specimen. Must be special being one of friends if they can be dropped just like that.
Other castmates - whose actual, personal experiences with racism are far more valid to listen to than some token white boy who runs his mouth whenever he likes with his own fake wokeness and 'activism', also have things to say. Though their takes are far more solid, valid, and thoughtful than the white boy and you have to say. And you take those words as further evidence on why this Latino man should be canceled. Aren't you fucking woke.
What else do you do? You go back to the server-without-mods and imagine him being recast again. Imagine his character being killed off and perfect white boy getting custody of his son. Imagine his character being deported - at the height of Trump's presidency and all the horrific things ICE is doing. Aren’t you special? You never stop canceling him, or talking shit about him, or ‘i just the feeling he’s leaving’ every other post because you what, want to manifest it into life with your bitterness? You harass the network on social media - a social media account also obsessed with Perfect White Boy so suddenly the show is now not an ensemble cast, it's the All About Him show.
Network social media acts like this Latino actor doesn't even exist, instead of addressing the issue. You still aren't satisfied and keep throwing shit. You have nothing else to say, so you 'just get a feeling about him', 'don't like the way he calls his fiance girl', and whatever other shit that comes tumbling out of your mouth. Even when his outburst on Instagram is transcripted and it's blatant he never said the word you accused him of and only misspoke about racial stereotypes - many of which he's had thrown at him for being Latino - you still cancel him. You're personally offended that he even exists.
And on the day his daughter is born and he announces it to the world, you call him out for unfollowing the Perfect White Boy and starting drama about your ship. You cry about how HE ruined the show, how HE ruined the ship, and how HE ruined your day. Perfect White Boy is there on social media 'sob I don't get to say what clips I talk over for previous seasons' 'sob my morning started off bad (quick delete to stir shit because I do it all the time)' 'sob i can't live tweet MY special episode because I worked hard and if you don't like it I'll cry because I'm sensitive' What a guy. What a fucking guy. The network doesn’t congratulate this Latino actor on the birth of his daughter. The social media account for the show doesn’t congratulate him. Barely any of the cast and crew even acknowledge his post. And somehow HE is still the one in the wrong.
And after all this
You think you're woke.
You think you have the moral high ground.
You threw a Latino man under the bus in favor of a white man who can't stop running his mouth.
And you're a better human, somehow.
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