Hello again <3
I sent you an anon that you replied to on April 1st, which was me asking how ex-TIFs are received back into womanhood. Your reply gave me a little foothold which ended up very comforting as I started coming out rapid-fire to all my friends as detrans. this is primarily a message for other people in my situation, who are afraid and might want a template of what you might expect will happen once you do come out with it.
Predictably, most of my friends dropped me; I've 3 friends left. Two of which continue to support trans people but can accept that i have different opinions (as long as i'm "not mean") and one of which has seen the gender critical arguments, accepted them, and agrees. So, heavy losses, but not total losses. My two siblings seemed to sigh in relief and reveal that they never believed in genderism at all, which is odd, because in my 10 years of being trans not one of them challenged me on it. my mom fell into heavy guilt over "letting me" do all this, although i was 18 when i took testo and 19 when i got surgery, so she really could not have stopped me, legally. i suppose she mainly grieves knowing that had she had the right arguments she could have saved her kid this, but i've told her she is not to blame and i hope she recognizes that.
i haven't received any real harassment, not from anyone that i PERSONALLY know, though my family has received... harassment targeted at me? my sister had a classmate begin sending her copious pro-trans propaganda (contrapoints videos) which she instructed should be sent onward to me (sis did not comply). hilarious how my 10 years of direct experience is suddenly null and void and i'm assumed to know nothing about transness.... 6 months ago i was helping people sensitivity-write trans characters. now, i'm told i can't speak for the trans experience at all, and that i do not know what it's like to be a transmasc person. told that i need to listen to the arguments more carefully, that i don't LISTEN, when i literally lived this for 10 whole years. girl, on god? they tell me i don't get it and need to educate myself. and have empathy of course.
but in general, detransing, i've discovered that there are PLENTY of people who do not actually believe in genderism but who will play along simply out of fear or social pressure. my friends aside, who i knew through "queer" circles, everyone in my family (expect my mom) has revealed they never actually believed in it. i think this might contribute to why trans people bully dissenters so badly. they know this is the truth, that no one really buys it. i think, subconsciously, i have known that too. i never downloaded grindr, i never went into the men's bathrooms. i knew that despite testo and surgery and pronouns i could never challenge men as an equal in their eyes.
interestingly, making new friends is not that hard. I lead with the fact i'm detrans and "don't believe in all that shit" and people are VERY eager to be able to, suddenly, voice their real opinions without being called transphobic. they begin with probing questions, uncontroversial statements like "i agree they shouldn't put males in women's sports..." but if you continue to agree and not punish this daring on their part, they will reveal, with much relief and enthusiasm, what they really think. most people, normal people, really do not believe it all? i'm a brash person and can take irl confrontations quite well, hence i feel safe putting myself up as a transphobe off the bat. and people are very into this. so. the old ass saying, just be yourself.... normal people will not volunteer anti-genderist opinions on their own but when i continue to state thing after thing they open up and agree and eventually feel safe enough to admit their own thoughts. making friends, especially with non-gendie women, hasn't been that hard.
i'm going to write another message about same-sex attraction in the genderverse, but it's also a can of worms so i will make it separate from this one. again, thank you so much, for having anon on and listening, and letting us listen to each other without fear. i would hug you. to be continued
Thanks for the follow up!
My only comment is that I think most people play along out of kindness, it's not all bullying and fear, but that does impose a silence on everyone so everyone feels quite alone with their doubts.
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(random, sorry) I agree it could be so much better on abc now than it could have been on fox. I'm so happy they already got renewed it almost makes up for the sadness over what could have been with the shooting and the will and all...I would have loved to see what they wanted to write. I am still worried though that because time is running out, they see them as just that now – endgame. That we might not get to see their relationship, just an ending?
I don't know... when I think about it, there's always this list of circumstances, you know? things that we have to account for when considering how it is most likely to go down.
1) is Tim sticking around? was he really forcibly removed because of the buddie thing or was that just a coincidence? if someone else takes over the writing again, which way would that sway the story? also, would it be someone new or someone who worked on the show before?
2) the actors. Oliver especially has been very loud about how important it is for him to tell an authentic story for the character and for the people Buck represents; that comes with all sorts of bi and queer stereotypes they'd wanna avoid dipping into, which again would sway the story (of Buck and Eddie together at least) into specific directions. then there's Ryan, who has said many times over the years that he's open to wherever the road takes them with buddie, but he also emphasised truthfulness to the story and characters — we know Tim is interested in their input, we don't know how another writer would go about it.
3) ratings and reception. in many ways, bucktommy was a buddie soft-launch. don't get me wrong, I love bucktommy with all my heart and am very adamant on keeping their story separate from buddie because it isn't about buddie within the realms of the show, it is somewhat about buddie irl though.
making a lead (male) character canonically bisexual was a big leap of faith. yes, it is a Ryan Murphy show and yes, the show had a lot of queer rep already, but we never had a man-on-man on-camera kiss before on the show and we all know how differently general audiences react to two women kissing and two men kissing — which is, again, why this storyline on such a big primetime TV show is so so important. they calculated the risks, went for it and it all worked out; the ratings were great and the response was overwhelmingly positive. that's a great step one into the direction of canon buddie.
4) writing. buddie going canon however would make 3 of the 5 lead characters queer and not only that but all of them would be in relationships, bringing in outsider recurring or even guest star characters somewhat harder to write, unless they branched out and brought new people in to be part of the lead ensemble (Ravi main, abc, I'm begging!!). not to mention the people who'd call it pandering; and even though the story between Buck and Eddie is there to see for everyone already, it'd be harder to defend when the numbers would be 3:5 compared to the intial first season's 1:5.
all that being said, we are on a good path right now; we are renewed for season 8 and that, at least, gives us time to develop the story without rushing through it and I have my fingers crossed that the stars will align and the show will do justice to this beautiful love story that has been in the making for years.
until then, I'm just immensely grateful for abc and the budget and freedom they gave to the writers, cast and crew and I'm here for whatever they'll give us, because I know it'll be great.
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The [problematic]queer discourse is so unserious because I feel yall forget that it's. The internet. And nobody cares irl. There are like 10-ish people here max who use such labels (including post rqs which I think is just me and some1 else Idk if you still use it tho) and less who are explicitly pro rape, (which you all would know if you took advantage of the amazing ability of asking questions,) no where near enough to make this an actual problem. Thats all it took to turn the community into mini-antis? If we want to organize and make a change in the world we need to grow some skin and not fall apart at the slightest drama. Which means building a bridge over xenosatanism and basedwueer and lsdqueer and noxiqueer and post rq, and whatever else, and getting over it.
Thats not me saying you should support or id with these labels mind you. You have all the right to have your own beliefs and complain about others, as do I. I'm just saying that it doesn't matter in the real world, and you shouldn't be saying what anti (rqs but also anti Para and anti transid + queerphobes etc) say on the daily over it.
That being said, why r we dealing with drams caused by coining by... doing more coining? I mean people will just radicalize the new labels all over again? Thats,,, how most of us got here? From radicalizing? Like maybe I'm missing the point of it all or maybe the new labels are special idk.
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Introducing myself with any pronouns
People who keep using she/her: alright fine whatever, most common with cishet/non-queer folks, technically not doing anything wrong but gets annoying when it comes from everyone
People who switch to they/them: most common among queer folks, shows a level of care/attention and recognizes queerness if still defaulting to a strict set of pronouns.
People who use she/they: my favorite so far, mostly my theatre/sfx friends or others who understand deeper queer identities, recognizes that I use more than one set of pronouns though still strangely resistant to masculine terms
People who include he/him, masculine terms: THANK YOU THANK YOU LORD HAVE MERCY FINALLY
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i need 2 get to know queer ppl irl or im gonna start biting ppl. i miss youth theatre
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i am once again saying dont ship the actors irl!! its pretty weird!!!
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[cws: non-detailed discussion of both fictional and irl SA/CSA/abuse dynamics, apologia for the previous, homophobia, fetishization of wlw, and anti rhetoric.]
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having a lot of thoughts about the wider fandom's treatment of the various abuse dynamics present in sdmi--supposedly in the name of being anti-abuse--and how instead it's propagated deeply anti-survivor/abuse apologist sentiment and behavior through where they choose to apply that rhetoric, and where they choose to look the other way.
(first off, if you're someone who does not and has not done this, thank you from the bottom of my heart. second, this is not at all exhaustive of my feelings on the subject and there will probably be more posts about these dynamics and people's behavior toward them in future. as you can imagine by the length of this post that is saying something lmao)
one of the reasons i feel as strongly as i do about the way both canon and fandom have historically been about pericles, pericky, and shitting on anyone who likes them because it Normalizes Abuse(tm), is that their fans are pretty open and emphatic about the fact that it's Fucked Up. it's why we find it compelling. it is vanishingly rare that we don't.
meanwhile, velma is the UwU Cute Sassy Lesbian Icon whose relationship with shaggy was Cringy and Immature (and mutually so 🙃) at worst, when it directly mirrored such visceral aspects of my experience with CSA that i almost threw up rewatching the second episode.
and that's not even getting into how normalized it is for women to abuse men in a relationship, in broad fucking daylight in front of other people, and how men are supposed to Always Want It and it's an insult if they don't, and how the vast majority of CSA--which it overtly is in shaggy's case, he is implied not to be an adult yet--is perpetrated by other kids.
and it's also not getting into the fact that the ~cute lesbian relationship~ is almost certainly going to end up with the other queer girl in the show also being abused, because abusers are not Magically Cured by True Queer Love's Kiss. how it is incredibly difficult for survivors of abuse in a wlw relationship to be acknowledged or get support because then they'd be a Traitor, or people would rather maintain the feel-good fuzzy feelings wlw exist to give them, or they're closeted and it's not safe to let people know they're in a relationship with a woman. how queer relationships, especially between women, are fetishized as cute pure healthy fairytale romances and not dynamics involving real people who might harm each other or be harmed and need help.
and that's not even getting into the fact that mlm are seen as inherently predatory to an extent that the majority of other queer identities are not. how older queer men grooming boys is a classic homophobic stereotype used to justify violence toward them, up to and including lynchings, and how that is the abuse dynamic everyone in the show and fandom latched onto to revile as the Disgusting Evil Predatory One while giving everything else a pass. how mlm have a long history of forced institutionalization and psychiatric torture and abuse, and the Predatory Gay Man is subjected to decades of--you guessed it!--forced institutionalization and psychiatric torture and abuse, which is framed as what he deserved and where he belonged. how he's supposed to be unattractive (and the majority of the people who do this shit lean hard on that), while people are way more likely to give Charming Attractive Aesthetically Pleasing abusers a pass.
this is just..... normal, to the fandom. it's treated as completely normal. and i think that's a whole lot more fucking harmful than finding emotional catharsis in exploring an abusive dynamic that would not fly in broad daylight irl in a million years.
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sick 2 my stomach for a plethora of reasons friday
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All of Dave's homophobic remarks in Homestuck are actually funny because he doesn't know he's bisexual
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accidentally browsing a (very niche) female-dominated gaming space and seeing people TEAR into people who want an option to change the player character's pronouns to he/him or they/them without changing anything else because it'd invite men to invade a safe space. For a game purely about dating men. Like, I've been through plenty of female-dominated spaces where queer people and similar-interest straight men are welcome (in this case it'd be bi men but yknow), so it's just this one community, but jeez. The amount of fear that anyone who isn't explicitly a femme female would come in and A. hit on the faceless women there or B. taint the game by making the devs add designs of men who they don't want to date?
I got such a strong terf-y rhetoric from that community, like we can't have anything in common with people who aren't like us going on. All about taking 'our' things. And a lot of people contradicting one other but not trying to find out what the truth is because they have the same conclusion. Like two people saying A>B or B>A and no argument arises and no one shows interest in which is true because both people conclude C.
A lot of people even saying that, likewise, things that appeal to female or queer audiences should NOT be added to mainstream media just like queer content should not be added to female-oriented media. These hard walls around what belongs to who is like...they were raised by toy companies or something.
Like what is (paraphrasing so it isnt searchble) "I would never come into a male dominated community because I feel like I would be invading their safe space, so I don't get why men would want to come here and talk about liking men." At least the people who are scared of sexual abuse are warranted, I've seen tons of abusive language towards people they think are women in male dominated online spaces, but what is this fear of even...sharing interests with men? I know we've been in a new era of gender role enforcement with the tradfem movement, but jeez. And as for these last two points, they both are ones that were contradicted. People also said they do believe in diversity BUT just *this* shouldn't count.
Some people even said it's not fair that they get pushed to be more inclusive when mainstream media never does. Which makes me wonder if they're so deep in their niche 'I only experience content made by and for exclusively straight women' content that they haven't noticed any of the movements in media going on over the last 1.5 decades. Like it's true that we haven't made that much progress, but how do they think that no media gets pressed to increase diversity? The more rigid/right-leaning male audiences of tons of media have been complaining about forced diversity for years in exactly the same way (and sometimes, when it really WAS forced diversity, everyone complains because it's not representing anyone really but yknow). But I guess they wouldn't know that if all of them avoid mainstream media?
Also...what is the fear that gay men like men in a 'wrong' way...(and again, the unargued contradiction being plenty of people saying that they also like media about gay characters, but just they shouldn't make these characters gay)
And like I do get it, in the sense that being marginalized makes you skeptical and fearful of things you don't understand in its own separate way from how being in a privileged class makes you skeptical and fearful of things you don't understand. There's a lot more fear of exploring things different and new because the possible retribution feels/has been higher.
Honestly, this post isn't actually about a couple hundred to low-thousand women in a small community for niche games. Not like, I think it's important, I want to actively make them change. It's not that big a deal, not that surprising in the grand scheme. It's similar rhetoric to things i've seen before (Tradfem/terf). I've seen screenshots of, like, facebook mom groups before. And I've seen way bigger communities be way more open and welcoming, it's just a little outlier.
I'm just writing this because I'm a bit shellshocked because I forget how much that those kinds of people are not just the older, tech-illiterate generations, and not just shallow influencers who will say anything for the clicks (or because someone behind the scenes is funding it), their views behind the camera up in the air. Like I think I cultivate the people I interact with a bit too well. Too many of the people I actually interact with or witness the thoughts of regularly are queer and have flitting relationships with gender and then I remember the other side of the coin has people who think they're being progressive by suggesting that everyone who is different be segregated and therefore safe from each other with no room for intersectionality.
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I still think about the name I came up with when I was unsure if I liked my legal name and like jeioebe could the world be super cool about having 2 names or that using a different name at all than legal wasnt nerve wracking please
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hey i'm sorry this is going to sound incredibly parasocial but I always get so happy whenever you post about how happy you are or how much you love your gf idk maybe it's because seeing other queer people being happy just gives me a little hope for my future? idk lol but anyway that's all hope you have a nice day :)
STOPPP that’s so cute wait stop i’ll cry :( i totally understand you on that, seeing queer people happy and talking about their partners has alwaysss made me go !!!!! so i get you!! i’m really glad <333
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not going to a catholic church for several years now allowed me to forget the way people can be so comfortable saying the most intensely guilt tripping things without a second thought
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