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antianakin · 7 days

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Pong Krell. It’s universally agreed that he deserved worse than what he got and I get that. I just wished we got to see what he was like before he Fell. Did he always hate clones, was it gradual? Did he suspect something off and went over paranoid?

I’ll say this one and I’ll say this probably a thousand more times but I wished the creators focused on more details with characters. It’s absolutely fascinating that they created a Jedi that Fell but did nothing with it besides outright evil.

How other Jedi reacted to learning that a fellow Jedi betrayed everyone? How did the Republic?

I just wished they did more with him than just, yeah that dude was a dick and killed clones.

Yeah, it's one of the things I don't like as much about TCW, the extremely episodic nature of it means that there really is never any build-up to anything or lasting impact from anything. Unless it's happening within one of the 2-4 episode arcs, we RARELY get to see any kind of build-up or fallout. It's one of the major issues with Barriss, too, we see her ONCE in season 2 and she's calm, kind, methodical, and selfless. And then three seasons later in season 5 she's suddenly ruthless, selfish, doubting everything and everyone, merciless, etc. There is NO BUILD UP to that radical 180 to her character and there's no real exploration of how Ahsoka really feels about that particular betrayal afterwards, the focus in later episodes after the Wrong Jedi focuses only on Ahsoka feeling betrayed by the COUNCIL and her feelings about that. Nothing since TCW has ever touched it either (Rebels, Mandalorian, the Ahsoka show). Satine's death never really comes up again after it happens aside from Bo-Katan being an asshole. Obi-Wan goes from being totally fucked up about Maul coming back to being chill enough to take on Maul and Savage alone and winning without us getting to see him actually deal with those emotions.

Pong Krell and the Umbara arc IN GENERAL falls into this category easily (so do the Zyggeria and the Deception arc tbh). Krell is such a basic evil character, there's so little nuance to him and we never get to see the Jedi react to the revelation that one of their own turned at all. Dooku turned after he had already left the Order as far as any of them really know, but Krell was still IN the Order when he decided to betray them and it would've been really interesting to see the impact of that on them. It would've been ESPECIALLY interesting to explore that more during the Wrong Jedi arc in particular in how the Jedi feel like they can't trust their own people not to betray them anymore after Dooku and Krell.

Krell is presented with like. Zero nuance. He is just unequivocally evil and despite Anakin greeting him in a friendly way at the beginning, the visuals tell you this dude's no good right from his first appearance. There isn't really any chance that he's going to be a good guy at all. So all we are left with are headcanons.

And I remember discussing my Krell headcanons somewhere, but I think it might've been on a Discord server I've since left, so I unfortunately cannot find them again. So I'll try to remember them and immortalize them here, I guess.

Here's the thing about Krell. NO ONE suspects him. So he cannot be overtly acting like a bigoted asshole from the jump at any point, he HAS to be acting in such a way that it's not trickling out to the other clones and to the Jedi themselves that Krell is an absolute monster. Even Fives takes a moment to decide that Krell is suspicious and only brings up Krell's casualty numbers after he sees Krell's behavior for a minute and combines that knowledge with what he's now personally experiencing and is starting to come to conclusions based on that. He doesn't go into the relationship thinking Krell is worse than any other Jedi already.

And based on what we know of EVERY OTHER FALLEN JEDI (Dooku, Anakin, Barriss), they didn't start out as monsters. Dooku was a highly respected Jedi Master who seems to have had a really positive relationship with Yoda and Qui-Gon and simply became disillusioned with the Senate and his care for the people of the galaxy got twisted into something darker over time. Barriss was kind, selfless, compassionate, brave, and resourceful, and it was the war that caused her to start letting her fears and pain consume her into turning on the Jedi. Anakin was kind and spent years having his fears and doubts twisted into selfishness and greed and darkness that allowed him to justify murder and genocide for power. So it wouldn't make sense to me that Pong Krell wouldn't fall into the same pattern where he was once kind and good and selfless and brave, but that the circumstances surrounding the war caused him to lose faith and fall.

My headcanon is that he lost an entire battalion early in the war, much like we see happen to Plo Koon during the Malevolence arc and that that loss and failure just BROKE him. Krell DID care about the clones, he cared about his men, and he FAILED them all. And I think that he saw all of these clones dying by the dozens in all of the other battalions and instead of choosing to let go of his pain and fear and lean into his compassion, he chose to distance himself from them entirely to make it hurt less. If he didn't care about the clones, if he just saw them as the cannon fodder that the Senate treated them all as, then it would hurt less when they died. Maybe the Senate itself even dragged him over the coals for that initial loss. Or perhaps it was the opposite, maybe most of his battalion was killed, but it ultimately ended in a victory anyway because they were forced to just keep going despite the consequences. And so Krell decides to enter this mindset where he is disillusioned with the Senate and just CANNOT allow himself to care about the clones, because it won't change what the Senate is going to do to them anyway, so he may as well just treat them the same way.

And this wouldn't have happened overnight. It wouldn't have been a sudden 180 where he decided he was just going to treat them like shit. But he maybe decided to put some more professional distance between himself and his new battalion, not get close to them, not use their names (although he still knows them, still remembers them all). Maybe one day they're in a tricky situation and all of his options are bad, he HAS to sacrifice some of his men in order to salvage the situation at all, and it's a choice between a full retreat that he KNOWS the Senate won't take well, or sacrificing the men to achieve the victory. So he sacrifices the men. It's not an entire battalion, it's not even a whole company, but it's more than it would've been if he'd retreated. Maybe next time, there's a choice between going back to save some of the men even if it poses a risk to his own life or the mission or something, and he chooses not to go back for them because the mission is more important, or he rationalizes that his life is more important as the Jedi General. And it's just more and more little decisions like that that add up over time to being able to see the clones as nothing more than tools.

The disillusionment with the Senate leads to him sort-of agreeing with things Dooku and the Separatists have said and he can look at the war and realize that it's entirely possible that the Republic is going to LOSE, and he CANNOT be the one who loses again, so maybe he starts bouncing around the concept of maybe switching sides. And of course initially he rejects the idea. He's a Jedi, he won't just abandon the Republic, he can't be a traitor, who in the Separatist side would ever trust him anyway. But once that seed is planted, it doesn't go away and it keeps coming back up and he keeps finding ways to rationalize why it might be a good idea and then deciding not to do it over and over again. Until one day, he can't convince himself that it's a bad idea or that it wouldn't work. He tells himself it's the ONLY option, if he doesn't change sides then he's dead. But Dooku WON'T trust him unless he can prove that he's not on the Republic's side, so he has to come up with a plan to gain their trust. And what better way to earn that trust than to ensure a Separatist victory in an important campaign by double-crossing the Republic.

And once he's chosen to go down that path, it's even EASIER to stop caring about the clones because, well, they're all dead anyway. The Republic is going to lose, the clones are all dead men walking no matter what, so why bother caring about them or trying to keep them alive? He can't lose so often that the Jedi or the Senate become suspicious of him, of course, but it's REALLY easy then to get to Umbara and treat the clones like crap and turn them against each other and intentionally try to get them all killed. They're dead anyway, he's not the one killing them really, is he, the Senate is, the Jedi are, the war is. They were dead from the moment they were created in that test tube because they were created for this specific purpose. It's not his fault.

And much like Barriss turns against the Jedi in part because she did LOVE the Jedi and was devastated by what she saw happening to them and the pain of seeing her people forced to become something they were never supposed to be, as much as her actions were intended as some kind of message to try to sort-of save the Jedi from a course of action she saw as their downfall, I think that Krell turns on the clones because at some point he DID care about them. A lot. And that care became his downfall, the pain at what was being done to them just absolutely gutted him and it threw him down a path that ultimately led him to turn against the very people whose deaths had hurt him so badly just a few short years ago.

Krell might not have been the most effusive or emotional person prior to the war or anything, he might've been a more reserved person similar to Mace or Dooku or Luminara, but I think he probably was a perfectly good Jedi who was kind and selfless and compassionate once upon a time.

And none of the headcanons above have even touched what his relationships with other JEDI must have been like. It's just as possible that he did have friends and people he considered family among the Jedi. Maybe he had a padawan once at some point. And maybe all of those people had died by the time we get to Umbara. Maybe he had to watch a lot of the people he was closest to just fall like flies, and so it starts feeling like nothing matters. Maybe one of the Jedi who died on Geonosis was a former padawan of his, but Krell himself obviously wasn't there and the pain of THAT loss and the guilt he feels at not having been there (even though this padawan had been knighted for a while and there was a good reason Krell wasn't there that day) just sticks with him, too, and he never quite manages to let that go, either.

I think a lot of people choose to just headcanon Krell as having just always been kind-of an asshole even when he was a Jedi, but that doesn't work for me. If Krell was always an asshole, I feel like the Jedi would've stepped in at some point before the war even HAPPENED and tried to manage that situation. And it doesn't match up with the way pretty much every other fallen Jedi has ever been written, where they were GOOD PEOPLE once upon a time who saw awful things happen that they couldn't stop or had an awful thing happen TO them that they couldn't stop and the pain of that experience consumes them to the point that they spiral into darkness as a result. Krell should be the same way, which means he likely was a perfectly good normal Jedi before the war. He would've been kind, he might've been good with younglings (he's tall, maybe he was the one the younglings went to all the time for piggy back rides, maybe he often taught dual wielding to padawans who asked because of how clearly proficient he is at it), he might've taught a student of his own successfully, he would've been wise and selfless and compassionate, he would've loved the Jedi and the people of the galaxy.

Like, to be frank, if Tales of the Jedi HAD to explore a fallen Jedi story, they should've explored Krell instead of Dooku. Dooku has been explored before, we know quite a lot about him and his motivations and his backstory, but Krell, as you noted, is left a mystery and is stuck in the realm of being just purely evil for the sake of the story they were telling in this one arc. Krell needed more nuance in a way Dooku just did not.

#star wars #pong krell #tcw #the clone wars #umbara #umbara arc #krell

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talesfrommedinastation · 6 months

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My redneck neighbor Doug tries to cheer me up with 'The Clone Wars'

CW: Doug-isms. Y'all know it.

-----

(text message exchange today)

Doug: Hey Dr. MM! Can I borrow your rake today?

Me: Sure, ask my husband. I'm busy.

Doug: Everything ok kid?

Me: No, my uncle passed yesterday. I'm sad.

Doug: Aw I am so sorry. He's with Jesus now. Or other types of Jesus. Did he believe in Jesus?

Me: Thanks Doug.

Doug: Oh since I got you here, I need a refresher. What was the name of that guy everyone hated in Star Wars?

Me:....there's a few of those.

Doug: Naw, this one, everyone hated!

Me: Doesn't narrow it down. What did he look like?

Doug: He was on 'The Clone Wars'. He was a Jedi like that robot with all the arms that coughed all the time.

Me: General Grevious? Not a Jedi.

Doug: Okay, but this guy, what was his name? He was a giant frog with a lot of arms with a ball sack hanging from his face. He got fragged by his men after being a dick.

Me: Pong Krell?!

Doug: Yeah! That's it! Pong Krell!

Me: Can we just call him 'Frog with Ball Sack On Face'?

(unsee it. You can't.)

Doug: Works for me kid! Can I borrow that rake?

Doug's a national treasure. He made me smile after a very sad day.

#doug talks star wars #doug the neighbor #pong krell #the clone wars #star wars #star wars thoughts #star wars clone wars #redneck doug #umbara arc

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lilith-91 · 1 year

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I'm probably the only one who doesn't want a Trollhunters' sequel (actually, a remake). I would hate it.

It just takes ALL the character development that has happened across all the story and shoves it in the trash. It's simply terrible. Character development happens when a character fails at something. Bonds are formed when hardships occur. People become stronger after difficult situations. Not to mention, the good and unlikely events that happened will be altered or not happen at all. Jim going back in time might as well make things way worse than it already is. Having lost someone or something and learning to deal with that is an extremly powerful and relevant message that could've been a perfect way to end the story but no, they had to ruin it.

All of this combined with the fact that the characters we love and grow attached to through their hardships have had all of those events stripped from their experience.

Nothing is gonna be the same. A remake would be terrible.

Let's be real. Why Blinky or Draal should care about Jim as they did in the old timeline? Toby is the Trollhunter now. Draal and Blinky cared about Toby and Claire, yes, but the relationship with Jim was far superior. Jim was literally Blinky's son. Draal was Jim's protector. Meh even Arrrghh's relationship with Toby is not gonna be the same.

Not even Steve and Eli, probably. In the new timeline Jim doesn’t help Eli by standing up to Steve like he did in Trollhunters. He just lets it happen. As i've said in another post, JIM PLANTED THE SEEDS FOR STEVE’S REDEMPTION. Steve's redemption was fueled by Steve’s obsession with Jim after he gets called out and punched. And the movie ending ignored this part -.-

I don't want a sequel because all this is gone

I'm not even sure if we are gonna see NotEnrique again...

And, sorry, i don't want a new series with Toby as the Trollhunter and Jim the "side kick". What Jim should be? The Warhammer? Ugh. The amulet belongs to him. And Claire? She's gonna get the shadow staff again? She's gonna have the same development? No.

Not even Douxie, Aja and Krell are gonna be the same.

Also Toby can't beat any villain and he's an awful leader but let's not talk about this

It's just so wrong. Years of character and story development wasted….

I will despise ROTT till the end of time. As such, the only way for me to get peace of mind is to ignore it and enjoy the parts of the series that made me fall in love with it in the first place.

#trollhunters #tales of arcardia #jim lake jr #wizards #douxie #claire nuñez #blinky galadrigal #draal #3below #aja tarron #krell tarron

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lifeofclonewars · 2 months

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I think some people forget or don’t realize that Rex never tells Kix he’s out of line. People like to point out the pulling rank on Saleucami and Umbara for having Kix as a sort of ‘stereotypical rude medic’ kind of guy. (Said stereotype makes 0 sense to me but whatever.)

But Rex never tells Kix he’s taking it too far -- he recognizes that Kix knows what he’s doing, that, overall, Kix is a medic who’s trying to do his job and care about his brothers and that he and Rex will have different point of views of missions and battles because of it.

Like, sure, he doesn’t like what happened on Saleucami but Rex just hates to be down with an injury and listens to what Kix has to say. Umbara was stress for all of them but most of all for the medics and Rex. And he doesn’t dismiss Kix’s concerns and attempts to do his job, exactly. Instead, he redirects it -- Kix, you need to keep yourself alive to save the others.

And sure, Kix compares him to Krell at the beginning but have you considered 1) Rex needed some perspective on how his choices were viewed by his troops and 2) it was long before they knew how truly horrible Krell was and how he treated the troops. All they knew was he didn't like clones and picked bad strategies on purpose because he didn't care. Which is bad, but not as bad as it ended up getting. (And, again, Kix was stressed and we all have moments where we say things to prod on purpose when emotional.)

There’s no doubt in my mind that Kix and Rex talked about it afterward and moved past it. They were both trying to save their brothers in that instance, Rex just had to, unfortunately but realistically, place some of the troops over the others to make sure he still had troops get out alive

#b talks #this has been in my drafts for a long while so. enjoy #captain rex #clone trooper kix #clone medic kix #medic kix #kix #umbara arc #anyway this is lowkey a response to fanon from 2-3 years ago #idk how prevalent it is now #but a lil reminder wouldn't hurt

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kotorkludd · 25 days

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I was watching the latest episodes of The Bad Batch, and I started thinking about the identity of the Shadow agent. If it isn’t Tech, who is it? I think it may be a clone we are familiar with, and his reveal will bring pain and nostalgia. I noticed that during one scene focusing of the Shadow, the first notes of the 501st anthem started playing. Perhaps this clone was part of the 501st? I then came to a realization. Which clone from the 501st was never truly confirmed dead? Which clone from the 501st was obsessed with loyalty? The answer: Dogma. It would make sense. He was loyal to Krell, even when he knew Krell’s plans were causing more harm than good. Yes, he killed Krell in the end. But would that completely erase his ideals of loyalty? He was never confirmed to be killed. He could have been taken back to Kamino, and we know the Kaminoans hate mistakes. They might have tried to “fix” him. If he was still alive when the Empire took over and saw an opportunity to use his undying loyalty, they could have taken him to Hemlock. If the Shadow is revealed to be Dogma, it would have a more emotional effect for the viewers than if it was a clone we didn’t know. It would also be more damaging to the other clones, especially Rex, who believed he failed Dogma. Rex is still haunted by Umbara, and Dogma would be a grim reminder. It could also be what finally breaks Rex and causes him to go into exile on Seelos with Gregor and Wolffe.

#the bad batch spoilers #tbb #the bad batch #the bad batch shadow #dogma #clone trooper dogma

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bedlemboy · 1 month

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More Incorrect Star Wars quotes, again!

Anakin to the Council: Where is all this hate coming from? You guys tell me I’m the best all the time!

<cut> Rex: You’re the best, General!

<cut> Rex: General Skywalker, you’re the best!

Anakin: . . . Y’know, that might just be Rex.

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Anakin: The doctor said all my bleeding was internal. That’s where blood is SUPPOSED to be!

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Anakin: Master, we just caught a serial killer! I’ve wanted to do that since I was four years old!

Kenobi: That’s troubling.

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Rex: Welcome to the 501st, General. I'm Captain Rex.

Pong Krell: And I'm not interested. I have no use for clones. I find clones weird and confusing. I live my life by numbers. You see this watch? It tells me how many calories I burn at any time. Question- how many calories do you think I burned walking from there to there? You, clone closest to me.

Dogma: Oh! Uh, three?

Pong Krell: Three?! Haaaa ha-ha-ha! Try 0.8, numbnuts! I made promises to my superiors that I most certainly cannot keep. That's why I need you idiots to work twice as hard- no, no! Strike that! Four times as hard! No, no no! Strike that! I NEED YOU MORONS TO WORK EIGHT TIMES HARDER THAN YOU'VE EVER WORKED, IN YOUR ENTIRE LIVES! I'm having a heart attack. Yep, I'm having a heart attack. . . Get back to work.

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Ahsoka: Name one thing Rex can do that I can’t!

Anakin: Roller skate like an angel?

Ahsoka: Whore! I’m great at skating! Or have you forgotten Barris Offee’s fourth grade birthday party?

Anakin: I have definitely forgotten that. Can you look exactly like this Rex decoy I hired?

Cut-up: Sup?

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Ahsoka to Cut-up: If you’re going to pose as me, you need a little more Beyonce swagger. . . Alright, working with what you got, I guess.

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Ahsoka: On the bright side, you got Masters Kenobi and Skywalker off their hunger strike.

Mace Windu: I just threw a bunch of popcorn on the floor. It wasn’t that hard.

Ahsoka: Yeah, they’re animals.

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Kenobi: Normally, it’d be our word against theirs, but luckily the Clones were all wearing body cams!

Anakin: You see, Master, the thing about cameras is that they don’t really tell the whole objective truth. Images can be distorted. People can appear naked.

Kenobi: What are you talking about?

Rex: General Skywalker is completely nude in the footage, sir.

Kenobi: WHY?!

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Anakin: Baba-booie! Cornholio! . . . And that’s it for my prepared remarks. Any questions?

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Kenobi: I want to show you a picture from last night that really upset me.

Anakin: In my defense, Ahsoka bet me 5 credits that I couldn’t drink all that shampoo.

Kenobi: That’s not what. . . You drank shampoo?

Anakin: . . . No. You’re the one farting bubbles.

#star wars #incorrect quotes #kenobi #brooklyn 99 #ahsoka #anakin skywalker #the clone wars

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spacemagicandlaserswords · 9 months

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The Clone Wars 4.10 ‘Carnage of Krell’ Reaction Take 2

Rex still trying to do everything he can to save Fives and Jesse

I hate Krell so much. So fucking much.

Ugh Jesse, why are you so broad. Those shoulders. Hnnnnnnn

Oh Jesse’s face here. My emotions

That line from Fives is a really good example of how smart and perceptive he is. Firstly, he’s figured out what Krell is doing (using Rex’s loyalty against him to control the clones) and then telling Rex this, planting the seed to finally push Rex far enough to the point of going against everything he’s been told to do and mutiny against Krell. Rex knows what is happening is wrong but he’s been stuck between the ultimate rock and a hard place.

I really get the sense Jesse is decidedly unimpressed with how this has turned out. He knew there'd be consequences but a firing squad?!

Ok, I’m just going to copy and paste what I said in my first reaction post about Kix being in the firing squad because it still stands.

WHY THE FUCK DID THEY PUT A MEDIC IN A FIRING SQUAD?! WHAT WAS KIX DOING THERE?! WHY?! WHAT KIND OF MESSED UP NONSENSE IS THIS?!

You can even see his medic symbol on his shoulder! I know from a practical, logistical perspective that he’s there because they’re running out of recognisable clones that we know. Fives and Jesse are the ones in front of the firing squad. Hardcase is dead *sobs*. Dogma is running the execution, because of course he is. Rex is there because he has to be. We don’t really know what Appo looks like. The only ones left are Tup and Kix.

“Well, I’ve officially lost my sense of humour.” *more chest clutching and pained noises*

Oh Rex can’t look. He bows his head and closes his eyes when Dogma shouts “Aim.” He looks so sad and lost. AAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH

Omg Kix’s face during Fives’ speech. He’s so anguished. AAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH

Rex closed his eyes when they fired. AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH

This whole scene is just ALL OF THE EMOTIONS

When the whole firing squad throws down their weapons. YAAAAAAASSSSSS

“Good luck finding anyone to do it.” Rex with the badass one liners again

“It’s Captain, sir.” THE UNHOLY NOISE I LET OUT AT THIS. FUCKING GET HIM REX.

Omg Rex’s glare after this. Ugh.

Oh god, this scene. It’s so heartbreaking.

The first shot of the 212th clones in their gold getting shot and I just nooooooooo *more pained noises*

I watched this entire scene through tears while clutching my face and trying not to cry. It’s just so heartbreaking. It’s utterly emotionally devastating and one of the best scenes out of what I’ve watched in the TCW so far, and The Bad Batch as well. It was just as heart wrenching watching the second time and now I have to watch it again to try and catch all the moments that just rip out your heart one after the other.

Rex realising something’s not right

Oh, the shot of the dead 212th clone with his head tipped back and you can see his neck and chin and it’s not an Umbaran and *deeply pained noise*

Rex running through the battlefield desperately trying to get his brothers to stop firing on each other. He’s so desperate here.

The music here is fantastic and really hammering home how devastating this is.

Rex is running through an active battlefield, completely in the open, shots still flying and taking off his helmet. He’s completely exposed and that is so much guts and desperation. You can hear it in his voice too. Every time he says “clones” there’s so much urgent desperation in his voice.

Aaaaaaaah, the way Rex desperately dives and tackles that 212th clone, rips his helmet off, flips him around and basically hugs him to his chest to get everyone to see that they’re all clones *gross sobbing*. He’s holding a brother in the middle of them all trying to kill each other without realising it.

The utter look of shock and horror on that 212th clones face when Rex rips off his helmet is also just as heartbreaking.

Ok, I know this is an utterly heartbreaking scene but the shot where the 212th and 501st clones step up to face each other is so beautiful and so well done. The cinematography throughout this entire arc has been stunning and utterly gorgeous.

A lot of the 212th clones look like standard regulation clones whereas a lot of the 501st clones have personalised and individualised appearances, like tattoos and different hair. This is only something I noticed when all the 212th clones took off their helmets and stepped up opposite the 501st clones in the shot above. I’m curious as to why this is and, baring logistical animation reasons, I wonder if there’s a little bit of hero worship in there for their Marshal Commander. Apart from his very distinctive facial scar, Cody looks just like a standard regulation clone. I should imagine the 212th really look up to him and there might be a little bit of trying to emulate him in the way their appearance appears so standard. They all want to be like their ori’vod.

Oh the utterly anguished faces on Rex and that 212th clone. And then the way he falls onto the floor in despair.

Rex falling to his knees and clutching his head. *DEEPLY PAINED WAILING*

I am still tearing up at this.

Omg Tup’s “What have we done?” is so full of pain, anguish and horror.

This is the start of Dogma realising everything’s gone wrong.

“He’s still alive.” Kix, delivering that line, in that manner, that’s not a good thing. Meaning he’s still alive, but he’s not going to be for much longer. Oh Waxer.

Waxer lying slumped there with a sticker of Numa on his bucket. *pained noises*

Rex is so gentle and caring and comforting here. You can tell just how much he cares.

I didn’t realise Waxer puts his hand on Rex’s shoulder.

Just realised these are literally Waxer’s dying breaths. Now I’ve made myself even more sad.

“But…it was…*tear falls*...you”

The way Waxer’s tear falls and the little almost sob he makes before he says “you” and the terrified and horrified expression on his face is just, I don’t have the words.

Rex has this really open, sad and devastated expression and then his face hardens and his jaw moves and sets. That man is out for justice and nothing is going to get in his way. Rex is on the warpath now.

That moment when all the 501st and 212th clones step forward as one after Rex basically asks them to commit treason. That was so badass. Yassssssss

This is where that gif of Rex and the clones marching and looking all badass as Rex puts his helmet comes from. I was kind of expecting it to be a bigger moment but this is something I’ve come to realise that a lot of these major moments for the clones that appear in gifs all the time are often really quick, blink and you’ll miss it moments in the show.

Dammit Dogma, you were so close to figuring it out!

Love the way the fancy sci-fi floor of the brig moves down and Rex comes right into view standing there looking all badass.

Rex standing there facing Krell, flanked by his men and backlit by the fancy sci-fi lighting. He just spends his entire time looking all badass.

“It’s treason, then.” Yes fuck face, time for you to die!

“Explain your actions.” Ahahahahahah yassssssss get him Rex.

One thing I don’t get is why some of the clones are running at Krell? You’re just going to get sliced in half with his lightsabers! There’s one shot of a 212th clone just running straight at Krell and that's exactly what happens. What did you think was going to happen?!

“...by creatures bred in some laboratory!” Fuck. Right. Off.

Ffs Dogma

I really get the sense there’s a lot of meaning and experiences behind Rex’s little speech here. Especially the references to not being droids. This is where that quote “You have to learn to make your own decisions.” comes from.

You can see Dogma doubting himself the entire time here but it’s Tup that finally gets through to him and makes him lower his weapon.

Lmao of course the evil baddie gets the disembodied monologue with the echoing voice and the maniacal laughter.

Holy fuck we just see a clone get impaled by a lightsaber. So much for being an “animated kids TV show”. That was brutal. Omg it happens 3 more times as well, fuck. And then Krell just breaks the spine of another clone over his knee. Flinching at this.

Oh, that is clever Tup.

Didn’t notice this before but that’s Kix next to Rex when he’s telling the troopers to lure Krell towards Tup. You can see the medic symbol on his shoulder.

Omg Krell just impaled another clone. Fuck me this is brutal.

When Krell is running towards Tup, just before he steps on the Umbaran sarlacc tentacle, you can see Tup lower his blaster and sort of slump and turn away.

Deeply enjoying seeing Krell getting thrown around by the Umbaran sarlacc.

Yaaaaaaaaasssss go Tup!

Also enjoying Rex roll Krell over with his boot. Kind of harks back to earlier in the arc when Krell did the same to a dead clone. Have some of your own medicine you bastard.

Yes yes, serious scene and all that, but Rex standing with his legs wide apart as the sci-fi floor in the brig descends is just uuuuuuugh. That is a stance.

“Because you’re inferior.” This is just fuelling my hatred for Krell at this point

Jesse’s concerned face and little nose scrunch listening to Krell saying the Jedi are going to lose the war :(

Oh Dogma, you poor thing. His little heartbroken and devastated face. He thought he was doing the right thing and he was just being manipulated the entire time.

It’s a really tiny moment but when we get the shot of Rex snarling in disgust at Krell, you can see Jesse and Fives over his shoulders. Jesse still looks concerned, worried and shocked at what he’s just heard about how the war is going to end. Fives just looks pissed and completely unimpressed.

I saw this earlier but forgot to note it. Rex has a little darker mark on the back of his head. It’s in the middle, just above his hairline.

Ah, so this is what Appo looks like. No wonder I can never recognise him. He’s got a standard regulation clone haircut and no tattoos. The only way I can tell it’s him is the white downwards pointing arrow on the forehead of his bucket. He does have blue pauldrons though and a slightly different blue marking on his chest plate that kind of looks like an abstract version of the Eiffel tower.

That’s the moment Rex realises he needs to kill Krell

Oh the utterly devastated look on Dogma’s face. You poor, poor thing.

I get the distinct impression Fives is pretty unimpressed with Dogma, which kind of makes sense seeing as they’re basically opposites. Fives believes in doing what is right, even if it means disobeying orders and especially if the orders are wrong. He said as much in his speech. Dogma’s entire existence up until this point has been about following orders, no matter what they are.

“On your knees.” Yes very serious scene and all that but also omg sir yes sir immediately sir

Jesse’s little nose scrunch as he angrily jabs the Umbaran control panel. I adore him so much.

Oh man, you can really see how much Rex is struggling already. It’s written plainly across his face.

“I said, On. Your. Knees.” The unholy noises that just came out of me. Omg sir I just hnnnnnnnnnn

Oh poor Rex. He’s struggling so much. He’s shaking. When have we ever seen Rex shake before? You can see how much he’s battling with himself. He’s going through so many emotions you can basically see his internal battle play out on his face.

I think there’s a moment where Rex realises he can’t follow through with it before…

FUCK YES DOGMA

That shot is definitely framed so it initially looks like Rex has shot Krell before he lowers his gun and we see Dogma holding Fives’ blaster. It's even smoking.

Both Fives and Dogma’s faces here are utterly heartbreaking. Dogma looks so broken and Fives just looks so sad. I think in this moment he also realises he’s been wrong about Dogma. Or at least respects him for what he did.

So the last we see of Dogma is him being loaded onto a LAAT/i in binders. I wish we found out about what happens to him.

Rex looks so sad and resigned as Fives tells him that Umbara’s been taken.

Fives saying “We took Umbara.” immediately followed by a shot of a clone on a stretcher and other injured clones really hammers home the message of how pointless this all was.

“What’s the point of all this? I mean, why?” Rex saying what we’re all thinking.

“But I do know that someday this war is gonna end.” Oh Fives, if only you knew *sobs*

“Then what? We’re soldiers. What happens to us then?” Oh Rex, if only you knew *sobs harder*

In the group shot at the end, it’s Tup, Fives, Jesse and Rex. Out of all of them, only Rex makes it out alive. Tup, Fives and Jesse all die. And all of their deaths are caused by, or directly connected to, the inhibitor chips. Fuck that’s grim.

Ok I’m emotionally devastated all over again so I’m going to go curl up into a ball and sob about clones again.

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ahsoka-its-all-of-us · 1 year

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Possibly unpopular opinion: I think The Clone Wars missed a great opportunity by making Pong Krell evil.

Don’t get me wrong; I hate the man with an absolute, burning passion. He was a bastard, an asshole, the worst Jedi ever. But then in the end it’s revealed that’s because he isn’t, not anymore, he has willingly and openly fallen to the Dark Side and has committed his war crimes in hopes of getting Dooku’s attention. Which is a valid and interesting storyline, I guess.

But what if he hadn’t? What if he had remained a devoted Jedi?

One thing TCW tries to show occasionally is that even on the bad side not all people are actually bad — e.g. Mina Bonteri —, and similarly they try to show that on the good side not all people are good — e.g. Slick or Barriss. But they always stop shy of actually making that point; in the end, Mina’s son Lux decides to join the Republic, Slick was not just a defector but a traitor, and Barriss loses all humanity (Mirilianity?) betraying her own friend. In the end, the show keeps being about good and evil, and the Republic is good while the Separatists are evil. This becomes painfully obvious with systems that wish to remain neutral; in multiple instances they are eventually persuaded to aid or join the Republic, which is then framed as a good and honourable thing to do. As if choosing to stay out of a conflict they have no stakes in wasn’t.

Of course I have to make the comparison with Avatar: The Last Airbender, which very similarly has a good and a bad side of a conflict. But there we do get to see the opposite in both sides: the good side has people like Jet and the Earth Kingdom thugs, people who lose all humanity in their quest for vengeance or who abuse the situation for their own gain, while the bad side has people like the Fire Nation kids and Zuko and Iroh: people who have been drilled into supporting the system and don’t know any better, or who figured out that their side was in the wrong and decided to work against it for their own people as much as for the other side.

And I think Pong Krell could have been a great example of that. A great example of a Jedi who has lost sight of all things a Jedi should be; whose arrogance and racism (sort of; I don’t have a better word for it rip) actively undermines all we as an audience believe the Republic should stand for. By having him change sides, that conflict is reduced to a good/bad one, when it could be so much more.

Because imagine the consequences if he hadn’t done what he did because he wanted to join the Sith. Rex and the others had not just moral but legal backing in arresting him because he betrayed the Republic, and same with Dogma shooting him. But what if they hadn’t? What if Rex would have to choose between loyalty to the cause he was bred for and the General that stands for it, or loyalty to his men and therefore against the General? Would he have been able to make the arrest? Clones are meant to be expendable, after all, and while Krell’s actions are nothing but cruel disregard of his pawns, they weren’t necessarily illegal. It was more the contrast with the other Jedi generals who had developed a bond with their clones that made Krell’s behaviour jarring.

The Umbara arc is one of my favourite arcs because of the spotlight on the clones and their morality, and I think this would have made it even better (or worse, in terms of how my heart could have taken it)

#star wars #the clone wars #pong Krell #Captain rex #barriss offee #slick #atla #avatar: the last airbender #dogma #Mina bonteri #lux bonteri #dooku #star wars gifs

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the-stage-manager · 1 year

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Lieutenant Nolan Is a Better Written, More Emotionally-Impactful Villain Than Pong Krell, Here's Why:

(spoilers for TBB: The Outpost)

Krell is a worse villain in terms of how many clones died under his watch, atrocities, and war crimes. You really can't top forcing two battalions to shoot each other. However, I think that Lieutenant piss-face is a more emotionally impactful villain. People like Krell are hard to come by in real life. The grandiosity of his crimes are what makes him such a powerful, compelling villain. However, that same grandiosity is what makes him less believable, less relatable. When hate him because of what he does to the characters we love, but that doesn't mean that his behavior strikes a chord with us personally.

Piss-face is a far more believable villain. Despite being a lieutenant on his first mission, he's an entitled bigot with an inflated ego. A lot of us know people like that in real life, so it strikes a familiar, infuriating chord. What makes piss-face an even more terrifying villain, is how utterly powerless Crosshair is to save Mayday. He does everything in his power to save the commander, but ultimately fails because the Lt. can't be bothered.

There's also the emotional context of Crosshair's arc that contributes to the effectiveness of Nolan as a villain. Crosshair is known, literally, for being "severe and unyielding". He's rigid, inflexible, and absolutely obedient. And Nolan breaks him. Krell doesn't break Rex or Fives or Jesse. He hurts them, but he doesn't break their spirit. Not even Dogma is broken. His choice to shoot Krell isn't out of vengeance, it's a self-sacrificing choice, a choice to define that his loyalty belongs to the Republic and his brothers not just to his superiors.

Crosshair's choice to shoot Nolan appears to parallel Dogma's choice on the surface, but thematically, it's the exact opposite. His choice to shoot Nolan is, essentially, suicide. It's not for the greater good—Nolan is a nobody. He's just some lieutenant out in the back-ass of nowhere. Crosshair shoots out of vengeance. He knows exactly what's going to happen to him, especially now that he realizes just how little his life matters to the Empire. Nolan broke him.

And ultimately, that's what makes Nolan a better villain. He's a nobody who breaks somebody just because he can. He doesn't have an agenda, he's just a narcissistic bigot. It's familiar, it's real, and it's terrifying because most of the time, the villains in our real lives aren't people who act maliciously because they're evil—they just can't be bothered to care about how their actions might affect somebody else.

#tbb spoilers #the bad batch #crosshair #tbb crosshair

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r-2-peepoo · 1 year

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Whenever I see someone insulting the Jedi Order for the way they express their emotions, I can’t help but think about how badly they missed the entire point of what the Jedi are but also about the real world parallels. That really is how so many people react to people who don’t emote in traditional ways (ie. how neurotypical people treat neurodivergent people).

Here is your reminder that the Jedi are not “cold” and “calculating”. A Jedi, by the simplest definition of what a Jedi actually is, cannot be like this. That Jedi you hate because they were mean to a character you like isn’t a sociopath. A Jedi cannot be a Jedi and not have empathy (also sociopath is an actual medical diagnosis, not an insult).

Krell is basically the only Jedi who would come anywhere close to matching this description and he had already fallen to the dark side by the time we get to his arc in Clone Wars. But dark side users are also emotional. They’re just generally self centred and destructive in the way they experience/express them. All force users experience emotions in a heightened way, whether it’s their own or someone else’s.

Not outwardly expressing emotions ≠ not having them.

The Jedi have a very efficient, advanced way of processing their heightened emotions because they have to. It’s probably an incredibly difficult thing to deal with and they have to work constantly to manage their emotions. It’s not that they shouldn’t be criticised but at least make sure the criticism is valid.

#clone wars #tcw #Star Wars #Jedi #pro jedi order #pro jedi #yes this is about mace and ki adi mundi and luminara #mainly ki adi mundi bc i cannot find one actual reason for him to get labelled as a sociopath as often as he does #he cared about the clones and his fellow jedi idk what else people want

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clownery-and-fuckery · 2 months

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Here's a little wip while I finish up the last few chapters of OOT- and by extension the fourth chapter of Project Failsafe, which has already reached around 10 thousand words.... I am going a little insane over it rn

Over the explosion, it was a miracle anyone heard anything.

Echo was panting, the sound loud in his hears while the muffled warfare raged around him. His helmet was the only reason he hadn't gone deaf yet.

"You still with me, Echo?" Fives yelled from beside him. "You're lagging!"

If Echo's free hand had not been replaced with a scomp, he would have jabbed his twin for that jibe. "Never better!" He responded easily. "Slowing down so you can keep up!"

Fives laughed, a manic sound as they skidded to a stop at a break in the corridor. "Whoever's flying this heap of junk needs a raise," He commented lowly as the ship jolted with another hit. "This things fallin' apart!"

If Echo knew anything, which he did, he could hazard a guess as to who was flying the remains of the ship.

Still, he reached for his comm. "Hunter?" He yelled into his comm. "What's the word? Have you and the others evacuated safely?"

"All accounted for." Hunter's voice replied, cool as ever. "We're just waiting for Tech to get us level to join us."

Of course they were. "I'll get him." He assured. "Don't wait for us."

He looked around, eyes settled on his twin before they were jolted roughly. The ship lost control for a moment, Echo could feel it as the twins were sent sprawling.

"Hold on!" Fives cried, grabbing Echo's arm. "I've got you!"

They levelled out again, much slower than they normally would have if Tech was really the one flying. Echo frowned.

"Tech!" He called into his comm once he had righted himself. "Tech, what's your status?"

There was no answer. "Tech!"

"Uhm.." A new voice answered, one that decidedly was not his younger brother. "Sorry, he's bus–"

"Who is this?!" Echo yelled. "Where's Tech!?"

The voice on the other end of the comm sounded panicked. "My name is Tup, sir–" He started. "We're trapped in the control room, sir. Tech isn't responding."

Echo's eyes were wide. "Stay put, Tup!" Fives had grabbed Echo's wrist. "We're on the way!"

"Fives?" Tup asked, before the comm cut to static. Fives was already running, dragging Echo with him.

"You know this Tup?" He asked. Fives nodded. "We met on Umbara," He explained. "Remember when I told you about Krell?"

Echo wouldn't soon forget. "He was the shiny that caught him," Fives continued. "Real brave kid. I've been watching him, since his brother Dogma got arrested."

Echo felt a pang of sympathy. "I'm assuming you're close?" He asked. Fives nodded firmly.

"As close as you and that techie kid you don't shut up about." He answered with a grin. Echo laughed, ducking his head.

"Pretty close, then." He said quietly. A string of regret shot through him, thinking about how much he had missed.

"Hey!" Fives called. "I need you here, Echo."

He shook his head. "Right," He answered shortly. "I'm here."

"–down.. wh- hey, hey! Wake up!"

Tech groaned, forcing his eyes open. He looked around, confused for a moment. He smelt fuel, felt the heat from a fire, and his ears were ringing.

"You with me?" A voice asked. "'Cause I really hate being here alone, flying isn't my strong suit."

"Hun'er doesn' let you fly 'nyway.." He slurred, assuming it was Wrecker shaking him awake. When he saw it wasn't, he shot up.

They were in space. They were rapidly approaching a planet. There was fighting all around them, and he was just laying there—

"Easy!" The voice that wasn't Wrecker yelped, helping him regain his balance. "You took a nasty hit to your head, I tried to keep it level like you had, but–"

They weren't stable, in a near free fall. Tech jumped to his feet.

"Move!" Tech didn't have the energy to be polite. He took over, trembling hands clutching the yoke as he pulled, keeping her stable as they cruised. "What happened?"

"We're meant to be sending aid down on the surface," The clone replied smoothly, pointing. "But we got ambushed. It's only because of your quick thinking this whole ship hasn't blown up."

Tech nodded shortly, missing the compliment. "And the other troopers?" He asked, glancing around for his brothers.

"They're safe," The other clone assured. "They jumped ship once the shields failed, the rest of the cargo went with them, now we're just trying not to crash into Republic ships."

Tech nodded again. "I'm Tup, by the way." The clone said, sheepish. He glanced over, eyebrow raised. "Tech." He responded slowly. His tongue felt oddly heavy in his mouth.

"Sorry," He muttered. "You just- you look tired. I'm trying to keep you awake after you hit your head."

Tech paused. "I hit my head?"

Tup nodded furiously. "Real hard, you've got a shiner, and it's gushing. Mind if I take a look?"

Tech shrugged minutely, not enjoying the sensation of hands that he knew weren't his brothers pulling his helmet off his head. He hissed when Tup cleaned the wound, apologising quietly.

The patch was cool as it was pressed to his head. "There." He said softly. "That should do for now, let me know if you get a headache or anything."

Tech nodded. "Thank you," He mumbled. Tup waved him away with a grin.

They watched the chaos outside, Tup wincing whenever the fighters got too close. Thankfully, from the destruction the ship had already suffered, they seemed to be ignored as they were slowly inching towards the planet.

"Once we are caught in the gravitational pull," Tech told him quietly. "You should leave, as well. I can control the direction as best as I can and buy you time."

"Buy me time?" Tup echoed, shaking his head. "I'm not leaving without you, Tech."

"You don't have much choice," Tech said simply. "I will not be far behind you."

Tup didn't look convinced, a frown on his face. "We should stick together." He said quietly, occasionally glancing over his shoulder to the entrance.

The entrance that had been sealed off, preemptively upon word that separatist battle droids had boarded.

He frowned, noticing something. "Tech," He called over his shoulder. "Are we alone?"

"For the most part," Tech replied easily, attention focused on something else. "On the assumption that the battle droids have all been delt with, why?"

"Well–" Tup squinted at the monitors that still worked. "–those don't look like normal clankers to me."

Tech glanced over and froze. "That is because they aren't." He said. "Those are assassin droids."

"Assassin droids that are headed right for us!" Tup whirled around. "There's like ten of them, Tech. And one of us is concussed."

Tech seemed to realise their situation, as well. They watched the droids get closer as Tech scrambled his muddled head to find a solution.

Definitely uploading a pt. 2 to this, might even add it into that other wip I have about shuk'yc..... hmm lmk what you think!!!!

#sw the bad batch #tbb tech #tbb echo #sw tcw #arc trooper fives #clone trooper tup #i love them all <3

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antianakin · 2 months

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One of the saddest patterns to notice is how often Jedi who fall to darkness (whatever the reason) often turn against the Jedi themselves and use the Jedi as a scapegoat, with or without any real outside manipulation leading them there.

Anakin is obviously directly manipulated by Palpatine, as is Dooku, and the Inquisitors are specifically tortured and broken into turning on the Jedi, but characters like Krell and Barriss are not, we don't even have any indication either of them ever spoke to Palpatine once in their entire lives. But when push came to shove, when they lost hope and faith, both of them turned on the Jedi. Krell dismisses the Jedi as "naive" and weak, and Barriss explicitly bombs their home to try to send a message about the corruption she believes exists in the Jedi Council and then frames her own friend.

And then you have characters like Bode Akuna and Taron Malicos who seem to last through Order 66 and turn on the Jedi seemingly as a result of that particular trauma and the resulting struggle for survival afterwards. The immense loss and the confusion about why it had even happened, what had caused it, keeps leading Jedi survivors to blame the Jedi themselves rather than turning their anger at the Senate or the Republic or even just Palpatine.

Some of this is due to out-of-universe beliefs by the writers that the Jedi WERE in fact arrogant and corrupt, but if we take that away and just look at it from a slightly different perspective, as just a trauma response that has no real basis in reality, it becomes SO SO SAD.

The galaxy turned on them, the galaxy cheered when they were killed, the clones they all trusted betrayed them, and they're constantly being hunted by former friends and colleagues who have been tortured and broken into killing their own. And maybe, maybe they start to look at all of this hatred, all of this anger directed at them simply for being a Jedi at all, and start wondering if perhaps the galaxy was right. If so many people believe it, maybe there's a grain of truth there, maybe the Jedi WERE at fault for all the problems in the galaxy, maybe they caused their own destruction. They don't have any other answers, so it's easier to just... take the one the galaxy is forcing down their throats than live with the uncertainty.

And it's bad enough that the galaxy blames them, that the galaxy sees the Jedi as little more than tools to be used up and tossed away afterward, that the galaxy refuses to mourn them.

It's INFINITELY WORSE that the Jedi themselves can be made to believe they were at fault for what happened, that they're surrounded by this vitriol for long enough that they just... decide to accept that it's true. It's just yet another layer of injustice done to them and yet another way of killing the Jedi, but perhaps the most insidious one of all. Palpatine creates a galaxy so toxic to the Jedi that the Jedi would rather strip away what makes them Jedi than be associated with the people the galaxy has come to hate so much. And one by one, as their hope is sapped from them, they start to fall to selfishness and greed because it's so much easier than sticking to the Jedi path.

And maybe that's part of why Reva feels so unique and refreshing as a character. She falls, yes, but not ONCE does she ever blame the Jedi for their own downfall. The closest she gets is blaming Obi-Wan for being unable to stop Anakin, but she is still aiming her anger at an INDIVIDUAL, not the entire culture. She's pretty explicit that her motivation is justice for her fallen family. When she DOES hunt down the Jedi, there's no real indication that she's doing it because she believes they deserve it. She's doing it because she believes she has to in order to kill Anakin, and she's obviously lost sight of herself in the process, she's killing the very people she claims to be getting justice for, but there's no real hatred towards the Jedi in her. Reva has let the pain of her loss become an attachment that eats away at her, but not once has she allowed it to bring her to the point of blaming the Jedi for what was done to them. Not once does she blame the Jedi for the loss of the people she loved. It might be one of my favorite things about her.

#star wars #reva sevander #jedi #pro jedi

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