#she queerbaits

[castielsprostate]

real people can't queerbait. taylor swift did not queerbait you because she can't queerbait. harry styles did not queerbait you because he can't queerbait. kit connor did not queerbait you because he can't queerbait. REAL PEOPLE CAN'T QUEERBAIT YOU

#sjonnie.text #REAL PEOPLE CAN'T QUEERBAIT #queer issues #lgbt #im so sick and tired of people saying real people are queerbaitjng #taylor swift did not queerbait you. she can't queerbait.

[herinsectreflection]

My friend is watching Buffy for the first time.

#she's just assuming it's queerbait and I'm gagging myself

[darklinaforever]

Fortunately Catradora exists to compensate for Supercorp...

#supercorp #supergirl #kara danvers #lena luthor #kara x lena #lena x kara #kara and lena #lena and kara #catradora #catra #adora #she ra adora #shera and the princesses of power #queerbaiting

[eddiezpaghetti]

It has come to my attention that SOME OF YOU who read my last Byler post remain UNCONVINCED. So I'm gonna tack onto it this:

I'm older than fucking God and air, and I've been out and proud since 2007. Yes, I know what homophobia is, and yes, I know what queerbaiting is. I know about Supernatural and Teen Wolf and Sherlock and blahdyblahdyblah. No new ground is being covered here. I thought I made that clear in the original post, but, clearly, I did not.

I am aware of queerbaiting and homophobia, and I'm still wholeheartedly certain in Byler being canon anyway.

Okay, so there are three types of relationship I want to discuss when it comes to queerbaiting. They're all, like, "queer relationships that could have happened, but didn't".

First off, queer-coding. This isn't really a thing so much anymore, but it still crops up every once in a while. I'd argue it probably happens most with male-male relationships in family shows these days. First example that comes to mind is Mr. Smiley and Mr. Frowny from Steven Universe. You can't make a relationship canon because some shitty overhead bastard overhead said no, so you get as close as you can without compromising the show. Can't make someone gay? Well, now their comedy routine is a blatant allegory for a romantic relationship. Boom-shaka-laka. This is something I don't see being a problem with regards to Stranger Things, but I want it to be there as contrast, a demonstration of one of many things queerbaiting is not. However, one could argue that, thus far, Will Byers is, canonically, queer-coded. It's pretty fucking heavily implied in the show, and the creators have confirmed it, and you're gonna be able to see it if you're not FUCKING BLIND, but word of god is not technically canon which means that interviews don't technically make something canon, blahdyblahdyblahdyblah, technicalities, Robin has been explicitly stated in the text to be queer while Will has, thus far, not, outside of good ol' Show-Don't-Tell. Of course, anyone with two brain cells to rub together can tell that that's going to change by the end of Season 5, but, hey, for what it's worth, I'm throwing this out there.

Alrighty, Thingamajingama Number Two: "Oops, I accidentally made the greatest love story known to man." AKA, a genuine, honest-to-goodness mistake. Unfortunately, we do live in a heteronormative society. Sometimes people who don't think about being gay much write a friendship that's incredibly compelling and don't even consider the possibility that it could have been read as romantic. Something something Top Gun something. This is, again, not queerbaiting. This is Steddie, this is Ronance, this is Elmax, this is your favorite flavor of non-canon ship this week, this is not Byler. The creators know DAMN well what they're doing. They've talked about it. We know this. Nothing new here.

Which brings us to the topic of discussion here. Actual queerbaiting. This usually starts out as an "accidental greatest love story", and then reacts to fan response. And when I say "reacts", I mean like a goddamn chemical reaction. Like bleach and ammonia, bitch. It's noxious and it's gonna kick your fucking ass without mercy. This is when a creator is like, "Hey, let's get our queer audience invested, but we're not actually going to give them what they want because our straight audience isn't here for that/we personally think it's gross/we don't give enough of a shit to want to research a goddamn thing to write a real gay character," blah blah blah whatever excuse they want to come up with this time.

And when you think "queerbaiting", I want you to think "bullying". Because that's what it is. It's lucrative bullying, like beating us up and taking our lunch money, but it's bullying all the same. And it's a real goddamn thing, even if people misuse the word a lot, often when they mean one of the two above, sometimes when they mean "bury your gays", which is another homophobic thing entirely that I'm not going to get into here. Queerbaiting is the thing we're focused on, and it's real, and it's bullying. And here's the reason I want you to think of it as bullying:

They

Think

It's

Funny.

They are actively making fun of us.

That's why Dean had the "Cas, get out of my ass," line in Supernatural. It's why the "Do you like boys?" line happened in Teen Wolf. It's why "Lie with me, Watson," happened in the RDJ Sherlock Holmes movies. Because "It's just a joke, mate." "It was just a prank, bro." "You didn't really think it would happen, did you?" "You should see your face."

So here's probably the biggest reason I don't think it's specifically queerbaiting in this specific instance of Will Byers and Mike Wheeler.

Stranger Things has never, not once, made a gay joke. Ever.

Every single time queerness comes up, it's dead serious.

Lonnie calls Will a fag, and the show is not at all reluctant to show what a goddamn horrible person he is. And when Hopper latches onto that, it's not as "Hahah, is he gay, though?" It's because he's trying to determine a potential motive for Will's disappearance, and even if someone had interpreted it as a joke, Joyce immediately has a line that functions as snapping her fingers in front of the audience's face and yelling "FOCUS" when she says "He's MISSING." Basically outright saying "This isn't funny!"

Troy calls him a fairy, along with targeting Lucas and Dustin for their skin color and disability respectively, and Mike gets damn near murderous. Troy is portrayed as a goddamn monster and the show portrays it as justice when El makes him piss his pants and later breaks his arm.

Steve calls Jonathan "queer" as a slur and gets the shit beat out of him for it.

Billy's father is revealed to be homophobic and abusive in the same breath.

Mike says "It's not my fault you don't like girls!" and we're shown how devastated Will is and Mike immediately follows him to beg for forgiveness.

There is a joke in Robin's coming-out scene, but it's not at Robin's expense. It's at Steve's. Specifically for being heteronormative.

Jonathan has multiple scenes where he's trying so hard to tell Will that he's always going to love him as he is, whether he's gay or not, without pressuring him to come out before he's ready.

Even when there's a little bit of ribbing at Robin's expense, it's always because she's an awkward nerd who's nervous around pretty girls, just the same as Lucas and Dustin are teased when they both first develop crushes on Max, and even then, even then, it always comes as a package deal where they make fun of Steve's girl problems at the same time.

Stranger Things is an emphatically pro-gay show. It may not be the core point of the show the way it is in, say, Our Flag Means Death, but there is nothing less than respect for its queer characters. Its queer characters are always taken completely seriously. No one is making fun of us. They never have. That's why I have serious doubts that this is queerbaiting. It would come completely out of left field for the bullying to start in Stranger Things' final season.

So it's not at all likely to be queerbaiting because queerness is taken completely seriously. The creators have talked about Will's queerness, at least, so it's not an accident. And queer-coding would be silly to expect from this show when it's already on its final season. Like, what is Netflix gonna do? Cancel it? Not to mention all the explicit queerness that's in there already. And no one's gonna "What about the children?" a show that's had sex scenes in it since the first season.

There's no fakeout here. It's gonna happen. Breathe.

#byler #Part 2 I fucking guess. #Wasn't planning on making a Part 2 but here we are. #I seriously just want you guys to feel safe. #I'm not naive. I do not say any of this shit lightly. #But I've been around the block long enough to know what queerbaiting looks like and this ain't it. Promise. #Will's already been confirmed as in love with Mike for fuck's sake. You don't think the other half of the equation's gonna follow through? #There has only ever been one other situation where I've gone 'Okay this is going in gay places' with no doubt whatsoever without being told #And that was with Daja in Tamora Pierce's 'Will of the Empress' when I read it at like sixteen or whatever #and she wound up having whole-ass fuckin' gay sex. #I was right then and I'm right now. I swear.

[winnieinthemeadow]

there is no way in HELL enid wasn’t gay. i’m sorry they did not have her mom try to send her to “werewolf conversion therapy” and drop the fact that she’s from SAN FRANCISCO to have her not date wednesday

#wednesday #the addams family #enid sinclair #wenclair #be who you are #for your pride #queer coding #queer baiting #i mean not really but i FEEL queerbaited #lgbtq #idk what i was expecting from tim burton #wednesday addams #netflix #the whole show felt like riverdale #lowkey #spoilers #minor spoilers #she could be bi #i’m bisexual #i just headcanon her as lesbian

[n7punk]

what's the worst thing you watched and kept up with (at least for a while) because you were gay and begging for scraps? mine was probably pretty little liars

#what was her name? emily? whatever it was i was a simp for the lesbian character on PLL #and put up with three seasons of fucking Nonsense for it #words and things #i say 'probably' because there are worse shows i watched for various girls that i had crushes on over the years #but thats a different kind of simping. i didnt watch them for girl kissing i watched them for a girl who i knew was probably straight #gay #lesbian #bisexual #<- yall got it the worst half of these things were subtly biphobic too #oh god does anyone remember that show where the MC was a succubi but didn't know about monsters #so she thought she was just a freak and was always on the run until the monster world finds one of her kills and hunts Her down #and she ends up. idk working at a monster bar and helping her Monster Cop boytoy hunt runaway monsters? or something? #listen what i remember from that is how badly i wanted her and her simp (female roommate maybe?) to fuck instead #and i swear they queerbaited me a little. but i might have just been delusional tbh

[whogirl42]

My very straight mum, completely unprompted, after watching the first episode of Loki S2:

“They're starting to give off an Ineffable Husbands feel.”

#AND THIS CAME FULLY FROM HER!!! #I hadn't said anything about shipping Lukius since s1 #All I said is that I love their dynamic #what a great double act they are #SHE'S the one who brought it up! #Guys I don't think we're being queerbated #Like I don't know if it's just cause Good Omens S2 recently came out #But for my very very straight mother to notice Lukius... #Guys what if we're not being queerbaited what if it's actually gonna happen #Cause s2 is being so so blatant about it in a way I'm not sure they were in s1 #Lokius #Mine #loki series #loki season 2 #loki laufeyson #loki odinson #mobius m mobius #ineffable husbands #Good omens

[julieverne]

Sasha really went ahead and said this in 2010 <2010 is in CAPS> and then served 7 season of whatever Rizzoli & Isles was.

#sasha alexander #house md #gay #lgbtqia+ #lgbt #queerbaiting #the queerbaiting queen on season 6 of the queerbaiting show #she then went on to headline the queerbaitingest show of the next decade #rizzoli and isles #my beloved #queer #also she touches her mouth a lot which is nice #a little treat #i was gay in 2010 #and people cared A LOT #still gay now #people still care A LOT #i love all the new gay rep #but sometimes i miss the subtleties of Xena and subtext and URST

[eraserheadadult]

mitsuki really poured her soul out to aya thru song and then was like lol anyway....

#woof #the guy she was interested in wasn't a guy at all #really had us going for a minute there not gonna lie #i feel like some ppl are pissed about this but im having a good time i love getting queerbaited by a lesbian webcomic

[trainflyhigh]

i played dgs it was good

#dgs #tgaa #tgaa fanart #tgaa chronicles #the great ace attorney #dgs1 #dgs2 #tgaa2 #dai gyatuken saiban #goulstrade #i felt like drawing goulstrade queerbait after i finished the game sorry #i think theyre so so funny #girls who have never canonically interacted but they actually kissed trust me #i feel like im the only person who would have maria in their top 5 dgs characters list #sorry shes just so funny for the 10 minutes of screen time she had #maria gorey #gina lestrade

[awakefor48hours]

Just saw someone complain that Taylor Swift spent over a decade queerbaiting people and I just want to remind you all for the millionth time that a real person can't queerbait you.

Taylor Swift is not a fictional character that is being used for marketing purposes. Taylor Swift is a pop artist who has a huge sapphic audience.

#i don't know too much about taylor swift #all i can really say about her is that #i remember when her career was first starting #and thinking “she seems kinda interesting” #and not doing too much past that #i do remember hearing from my classmates #about rumors that she might be a lesbian #but in hindsight #those rumors were probably made by people who were trying to ruin her career #but for the most part #real people can't queerbait and if they could #taylor swift has never really mentioned or hinted at being gay to begin with #so she doesn't even apply

[demadogs]

gonna say it again, REAL PEOPLE CANNOT BE QUEERBAIT. QUEERBAITING IS A SHITTY WRITING TACTIC FOR FICTION. SOMEONE JUST BEING THEMSELVES IS NOT BAIT FOR ANYONE.

#god people are fucking dumb #this is about jenna ortega #if her way of coming out is just seeing a lesbian flag and smiling and pointing at herself then good for her she doesnt owe anyone anything #also like what is the bait if its a real person?? its not like queer people would stop liking her if she was straight #whereas in fiction a lot of queer people wouldnt watch a show that focuses just on a straight couple #so like HOW CAN A REAL LIFE PERSON BE QUEERBAIT??? ARE YOU FUCKING DUMB #jenna ortega #wednesday #gonna tag byler too im honestly surprised ive never seen people claim noahs baiting #and finn cuz all his characters are queer at this point #people on twitter probably do #mlvns probably do in an attempt to look like an ally #byler #i see this with taylor too god everyones chronically online

[allfortzu]

what if i EXPLODE

#the most basic and classic kpop queerbait pose but i still love it youre right #the lyrics during these scenes too this is a song for women and sapphics #they did this for the gay closeted church girls #i literally had a hand over my mouth gasping shocked shaken the entire mv GAOWD im giving the japan division a big kiss rn #momos wolfcut too IM GONNA GJRKDUWP38RBJ #the bridge was so good mina always serves she has given and she has never disappointed! #i LOVE the way sana sang the mmm humming part in the beginning it reminds me of her lines in wallflower and YEAH SHES STILL THE BEST AT IT! #and momos rapping OHHHHHH she has truly never not killed a rap her deep raspy voice is so perfect omg #them turning into paintings in the end YEAH POETIC CINEMA #so glad they made this a littke gay bc all art is inherently gay no im not elaborating #yes obv i saw minas back they had no business putting it there not even 30 secs into the song what if i actually combusted #having this AND oec air force one in one week if god hates the gays why do we always win 👩‍❤️‍💋‍👩

[eddiezpaghetti]

Okay, so my experience with Stranger Things is a weird one.

I didn't care when it first came out, started to watch it out of "might as well" in 2020, wasn't interested in it enough to make it past S2, forgot about it outside of going "oh, hey, cool, there's a lesbian in it now, I guess," in S3, got really annoyed when "Running Up That Hill" got popular from it because it was a song I listened to on fucking loop after one of my best friends died in high school and I fully expected its appearance in the show to ignore the whole survivor's guilt theme of the song (and was very happy to learn later that it did the exact opposite of ignoring the lyrics), saw people drawing Eddie, suddenly got a lot more interested, watched just the fourth season like a fucking psychopath because I was seriously only there for Eddie, then got interested enough to start the show over properly, having mostly forgotten what I did watch of the show before.

And let me tell you something from the perspective of someone who started with the complete fourth season, who wasn't there from the start, who wasn't tainted by ship goggles or this internal battle of hope and despair, who wasn't theorizing about what the painting could be or expecting Mike and Will to kiss when Volume 2 happened or rooting for Mike and Eleven's relationship to go down in flames or whatever the fuck. Just someone who went blind into Season 4.

It's really fucking obvious that Will and Mike are gonna be endgame.

Like holy fuck. It's so fucking blatant I don't even know why people are nervous.

No sane fucking person would shoot this scene this way if they wanted the audience to care about El and Mike as a couple. Despite being all blurry in the background, Will's reaction to what's happening here is smackdab in the fucking middle, clearly showing that the important part is what's going through his head here. What he's feeling. It's like the opposite of that scene from Kingdom Hearts II where Sora and Riku reunite and Kairi just fucking vanishes into the aether while it's happening because, despite the fact that she was standing between them when the scene began, she doesn't matter to the scene, so she's just kind of gone when the camera angle changes. Will could have been behind one of their heads, or so far in the distance he blends in with the background, but he's not. He's so obvious that despite being massively blurred out, he's still the first goddamn thing you look at. What, you think that's an accident? You think he's in the middle of this dramatic fucking scene because of a mistake? He basically has a big flashing neon arrow pointing at him with "THIS IS THE POINT" being screamed through a megaphone.

And then this?

They're paired up like they're taking fucking prom pictures. Each one of these pairs is so fucking close to one another and so fucking far from everyone else. It's not, "Oh, they're standing vaguely near each other in a group shot," it's fucking Noah's Ark out here. Again, there's no way to take this as an accident. It's not just a framing issue. If they wanted to make the shot look balanced while still not hiding anyone else behind El, they would have scattered people around much more naturally. Even if they wanted to keep Nancy with Jonathan and Hopper with Joyce, there's so much room on that hill for three people to stand on El's left and three on her right. But they didn't do that. They put Mike and Will together on purpose in the most obvious way possible.

Like I get that coming up with crackpot theories is fun in and of itself and I'm not blaming anyone for having fun. I totally get the appeal of arguing a point and reaching for every stupid little thing to pull into it because it's like a game, okay? I've done that. But if you're trying to actually convince someone (whether it's someone who wants to believe or someone who's pissed at the very idea that Mike and Will could be in love), stay away from blue and yellow lights, stay away from costume design, stay away from the existence of closets in backgrounds. And don't worry about whether Mike's gay or bi when he's in love with Will either way. I'll give you a little tip about persuasion: You're only as strong as your weakest argument. Even if you've got strong stuff in there, too, the person you're trying to convince is going to dismiss anything you say as complete insanity the second you start going on an entire tangent about the shape of a character's fucking pocket.

Sometimes, clothes are just clothes. Sometimes, there's a closet in the background because it helps establish that a character is in a bedroom. Sometimes, blue and yellow are just a couple of colors that look nice together. And sure, it might be set designers and costume designers and cinematographers smirking and winking at the audience from behind the camera. But if the show was just those things, instead of those things in the context of everything else, they wouldn't be saying anything of note.

But this?

This tells a story all on its own. Someone with no context can look at this and automatically assume that each paired person is standing with someone they care about deeply, seeking comfort as they watch some sort of disaster unfold. And yeah, romantic couples usually come in twos, and we live in an amatonormative society, so that's going to be the first association anyone makes seeing a bunch of people paired off.

It's the same reason you look at this

And go, "Oh..."

"Those two are probably a couple."

And I genuinely don't understand how people could have watched S4 Vol. 2 and gotten scared. Because as someone who went in with no investment whatsoever, I just looked at these two--

--and went, "Oh, those two are a couple. Good for them." And I moved on. Shut up about the trees for five seconds and just see the forest for what it is.

Oh, and if you're still nervous? Little thing from a storyteller here: You don't leave a hanging thread like "Will confessed his romantic feelings for Mike by projecting them onto El, but Mike either didn't understand or at least didn't say he understood," without coming back to that later. That's Chekov's gun hanging on the wall, babes. It's gonna fire at some point. If Mike was going to reject Will's feelings, if they weren't relevant, they would have had that discussion in Argyle's van. There'd be no reason to leave you in suspense.

#byler #meta #stranger things #theory #I mean I fucking guess #in the same way gravity is a fuckin' theory. #It feels silly that I even have to say this honestly. #Watching people freak out over these two feels like I'm being pranked. #Like you guys aren't pulling a Goncharov are you? Just making believe there's any chance these two aren't gonna be endgame? #Like completely ironically? And I'm too autistic to catch it? #It genuinely feels like I'm explaining that red and blue make purple here. As if you guys should have learned this in kindergarten. #Or like watching whole-ass adults watch Cinderella for the first time and being on the edge of their seat #wondering if she's going to live happily ever after with the prince or not. #It feels like I'm talking DOWN to people and I don't WANT it to feel like that but it's so obvious and I don't want people to be like #anxious for no reason you know? #Like I get that we're all scarred from queerbaiting and I know you guys are biased from years of shipping these kids. #But like. These guys? The most obvious 'there's only one way this could go' couple I've ever seen? You're scared about THEM?

[lostintherealmsofthefandoms]

I feel that see destiel fandom reacting to 911 canon bi character is like, when you are in a toxic relationship for years and think that's normal and suddenly you see a health relationship, and you're like "wait, is this how it supposed to be being in a healthy relationship? They look so happy and wow just wow"

#destiel #911 abc #911 spoilers #spn #spn and destiel is our toxic relationship #I'm really happy to see queer characters winning more spaces #my mom stopped watch 911 cause of the queerbait lol #she said she will be back watching now

[sugaredoleander]

the funniest part about 6x11 to me is that nora is played by sasha alexander - the same sasha alexander who would go on to play dr. maura isles (the pilot of rizzoli & isles aired 5 months later)

what would you call that, foreshadowing?

this era of proto-queerbait needs to be studied btw

#house md #rizzoli and isles #hilson #rizzles #also i think maura isles is technically an MD? it's been So long since i watched that show and i know the US doesn't require an MD #for like. coroners but she's Chief Medical Examiner which - i think that requires training in forensic pathology which is a medical #specialty like she would've had to get an MD for that #did a little queerbaity side quest before committing to a queerbaity main quest #rizzoli and isles has the bigger problem of being copaganda #i probably wouldn't actually call either of these shows intentional queerbait but yk. it's a bit funny