#ml fandom guillotine

[rjalker]

The Miraculous Ladybug fandom once again trying to argue that because I'm white, that means I'm not allowed to call out racism / don't know what I'm talking about to get me to stop calling out the blatant fucking anti-blackness in this fandom.

Except, the problem with that argument is that these people have already driven out dozens of people actually affected by this racism from the fandom because of the sheer level of harassment they faced for calling it out. Do you know why one of the reblogged posts in my Alya defense squad tag no longer works, so that the whole, massive post is gone forever because it was originally under a read-more because it was just that long?

Because the person who wrote that post was harassed out of the fandom by the racists and their stans.

If your stupid fucking argument is literally just that "well you're white so you're not allowed to tell people they're being racist" nope, sorry, not gonna fucking work! That's literally not how this works.

I am white. It's literally my responsibility to call out racism when I see it.

If you want to kid yourself and pretend that there's nothing racist at all about an entire fandom demonizing and hating the one Black girl in the show, while uplifting and praising the vicious white bully who's been abusing her best friend since they met to the ends of the earth, that's your fucking problem to work through, not mine.

I'm not going to stop calling out the racism and misogyny and other forms of bigotry in this fandom. You cannot drive me away. Any friends or stans you send to dogpile me will all be blocked and reported, and their names shared so that others can block them preemptively.

I'm not going to stop calling out the racism in this fandom just because you want to pretend it doesn't exist. That's your problem, not mine. You can go ahead and keep trying to say that since I'm while I should just be sitting here letting it go by without saying a word, but we both know you're full of shit. Just shut up and don't even try. It's not going to work.

Chloe Bougeois, Purposeful Crasher of Trains, Liar, Thief, Blackmailer, Bully, is not a better person than Alya Cesaire. She is not easier to forgive. You're just racist.

#ML fandom salt #ML fandom racism #ML fandom guillotine #Miraculous Ladybug #fandom racism #Alya Cesaire #Chloe Bourgeois #ml salt #Miraculous Ladybug salt #Miraculous Ladybug racism

[fandomsarebrainless]

I don't wanna hear anyone defend that pussy Andre or Anappymandy or whatever the fuck his real name is ever again.

#ml salt #ml writers salt #ml fandom salt #andre salt #andre bourgeois #the only thing he deserves is the guillotine #which even then is showing mercy

[miraculermarinette]

If Adrien was a POC and poor, do you think the fandom would have him guillotined for every he’d usually get away with because he’s white, rich, and attractive (to the fanbase at least)?

YES! I mean, all the proof that this will happen is right there.

Marinette, a girl of color, gets a lot of shit for doinh things Adrien is allowed to do. If Adrien was a boy of color, he would get a lot of flack for sexually harassing Ladybug from the mainstream fandom.

Ml fans try to replace Nino with Luka, especially after Wishmaker. They try to replace Marinette with Luka and Adrien, while reducing Kagami to Adrien’s love interest.

Many things prove that the fandom is racist and sexist so there is no reason for ppl to not treat Adrien badly if he was POC.

#ml sexism #ml racism #anon #thanks for the ask #ml salt #ml writer salt #ml fandom salt #marinette deserves better

[adriensaltprompts]

submit prompts where RPF is actually treated as horrible and violating and creepy like it fucking is.

EDIT: RPF stands for “real person fanficiton”, where real people, like celebrities, actors, youtubers, ect, are written about as though they are fictional characters. People write “fanfiction” about them like they’re nor real human beings.

This is what Marc and Nathaniel are doing in the show when they draw or write about Marinette, shipping themselves with her. They are treating her like a fictional character instead of a real human being. The writers of this show are encouraging people to treat real human beings like fictional characters, and iti s not okay. 

It is creepy, it is invasive, predatory, and is a form of sexual harassment, since most people writing it are using it for porn.

This has been a massive problem for decades now across any fandom you can think of, and not just for TV shows, but bands, youtubers, ect.

Several people who were the victim of these things have come out and literally told people it traumatized them and made them feel horrible and disgusting with their relationships with the people they were being “shipped” with, and the people who perpetrated these crimes still defend it and pretend they aren’t doing anything wrong.

If you don’t think it’s a big deal, just put yourself in Marinette’s shoes, or pretend you’re an actor.

How would you feel if someone came up to you and shoved papers into your face, and you found out that they were writing about you like you were a fictional character? How would you feel if you saw that they were writing about your relationships with others and twisting them and manipulating them into their own twisted fantasy?

I’m pretty sure everyone at this point has at least heard of Supernatural.

You might not be aware that many, many people in the fandom sent death threats to the wives of the main actors because these people thought these women were getting in the way of their “ship” of the two actors, who play brothers.

These people ship not only these fictional characters who are brothers, they ship the actors themselves, and sent death threats to the actors’ wives.

RPF is not okay. It’s not harmless. It is sexual harassment and worse. It is never okay.

And this show is encouraging it, and many people in this fandom are doing it themselves, and further encouraging it, all for the sake of writing porn about thirteen year olds.

Adrienette shippers have been writing “ship fics” where Adrien writes porn about Ladybug and she finds it and is flattered for a while now. And now people are writing the same thing, except Alya’s the one writing the porn about her and Ladybug. And it is not okay. Not only because these characters are children, but because writing porn about someone and posting it on the internet without their knowledge or consent is sexual harassment and is probably a crime all on its own.

Marc and Nathaniel are writing and drawing RPF of Marinette as Ladybug, and it is not okay.

Adrienette and now Alyanette shippers are writing things where Adrien or Alya are writing RPF of Ladybug, and it is not okay.

If you are reading this post and you think it’s okay for you to write about real live human beings like they’re fictional characters, block me, becacuse if you try to defend this horrible predatory behavior, I will block you and I will report you. Your behavior is fucked up and you need to stop.

#csem tw #sexualization of minors tw #ml fandom salt #ml fandom guillotine #miraculous ladybug #RPF TW #real person fiction #real person fanfiction #ask to tag #Show!Miraculous #Show!Marinette #Show!Adrien

[abearthatwrites]

Ah the wonderful feeling of being afraid that someone's gonna retaliate against me because I said "posting art advocating for the death of two 14-year-old fictional characters in the main tags of a kid's show just to make a political statement is probably too far, actually"

#ml fandom salt #yes this is about It Who Shall Not Be Named #the adrisalter #Adrien Guillotine Drama

[aconstantstateofbladerunner]

Saw your post asking about what’s happened in the miraculous ladybug fandom and thought I’ll explain though it might be missing a few things since it’s a general overview of what I’ve seen since I joined in 2018

Basically ever since season 3 started there’s been a divide between people who like all the characters (Adrien in particular) and those who criticise literally everything in the show, ‘salting’ and character bashing is common with this second group. This goes as far as totally trying to rewrite the show but they often forget that in the end it’s a show for young children that has made an effort towards acknowledging issues like propoganda and misleading advertising. But I’ve seen things like an artist drawing a guillotine with the threat of decapitation for Chloe Bougeois and the implication that it already happened to Adrien, because the OP of that post hates any rich character in any show

Maribat is also a thing for some reason. It started out as a spiteship because these ‘salters’ hate Adrien for being ‘a sexual harrasser’ to Marinette and think someone like Damian Wayne would be better for her but they fundamentally change his entire character for this. Somehow it’s gotten to the point that it’s appeared on Tumblrs top pairings thing twice over pairings from the actual show and Damian is tagged in more ML+DC crossovers than his own Comic series

Anyway, in conclusion it’s really enjoyable to watch this dumpsterfire of a fandom just to see the bad takes all around and all of the drama everywhere

I haven’t been in the fandom since 2016 and was thinking about getting back into it. Maybe not a good idea.

#answers

[rjalker]

Here's the post written by a man in his 50s telling children in the Miraculous Ladybug fandom that they're bad people if they get upset by people abusing them.

And here's my response.

as yet another reminder, block talvin-muircastle.

Literally a 50 year old man telling children they're horrible people if they don't allow themselves to be abused and make endless excuses for the people abusing them.

But sure, Adrien stans, pretend this is just ''stupid fandom drama'' when this entire time, this is exactly the shit we've been warning everyone about.

Fiction impacts reality. When you write a kids show and tell kids that boys abusing and sexually harassing girls is normal and cute and funny and romantic, you are grooming those children into accepting abuse. And this kind of shit attracts like-minded assholes like talvin-muircastle, who was according to himself, 45 at the time of writing that post.

a 45 year old man came into this fandom and told children that they're horrible people who should feel bad for being upset about someone treating them terribly.

And it fucking worked.

I watched at least a dozen kids be persuaded by this that they were bad people who should feel so horrible for criticizing the misogyny in this show, because poor little Adrien, the fictional white boy who exists only to be the self insert fantasy of the middle-aged white male writers, has a tragic backstory, so that means that if they have a problem with him sexually harassing Marinette, that means they're bad people who should be ashamed of themselves for victim blaming this poor sweet innocent child.

And it fucking worked. And these kids now think they have to accept abuse as long as the person abusing them has a good enough reason for being upset.

You know, the same exact same fucking way abusers trap their victims in relationships with them?

But sure, yeah, it's just a harmless kid's show, there's no harm in telling kids they're bad people if they stand up to people who are hurting them.../s

#shit adrien stans say #free blocklist #ML fandom guillotine #ML fandom salt #abuse #victim blaming #the cycle of abuse #free report list

[rjalker]

Giving it its own post because I'm pissed of.

Skylar36 said in response to this post:

You can ship it with your more romantic head canons and still acknowledge that the source material is fundamentally flawed here.

We do it all the time.

Sexual harassment is completely unacceptable. If these were real people, I would be calling Adrien a creep. Hell, when I watch the show, I cringe at Cat Noir’s behavior because she’s clearly not into it and it makes her uncomfortable.

I still ship them and read fanfic and whatnot.

These things are not mutually exclusive. You don’t have to defend the source material or justify why you like a ship even when the source material is “problematic” or whatever.

-

My response:

Why in the world would you feel the need to reblog a post about misogyny and the romantisization of sexual harassment to say that it’s still okay to ship it? Why would you reblog this post to defend shipping this abusive relationship. Are you aware that shipping is inherently romanticizing? You are admitting that this is an abusive relationship and you are still fine with romanticizing it and ignoring these problems.

-

This entire shows whole premise is built upon misogyny and the romanticization of sexual harassment.

The entire premise of the show is that it does not matter how much Marinette’s suffers, because the only one whose feelings matter is Adrien.

Adrian is allowed to sexually harass Marinette and stress her out and traumatize her and it’s fine because it doesn’t matter what Marinette thinks, the only thing that matters is that Adrien is happy and gets to do whatever he wants.

No, it is in fact not okay for you to be aware of all of this and then ignore all of it in favor of shipping them and continuing it to romanticize this abusive relationship. It is literally in fact not fucking okay for you to ignore the source material in favor of making shit up and letting people believe that that is the source material.

Every single facet of Marinette and Adrien’s relationship is misogynistic and built on the idea that Marinette literally only exists for Adrian’s pleasure. She exists so that he can date her. Her feelings on the matter do not fucking matter. She is literally just a trophy for Adrian to win and torment every second along the way because he like tormenting her.

Instead of shipping an abusive relationship that exists literally only to brainwash children into thinking that misogyny and sexual harassment are normal parts of romantic relationships, literally just come up with your own original characters because if you are writing this misogynistic trainwreck as a healthy relationship, you are not writing about Marinette Dupain-Cheng and Adrien Agreste, you are creating OCs that you’re just giving their names while you validate their cannon relationship which is 100% abusive and the entire fucking thing literally hinges on misogyny and sexual harassment.

Do not fucking write fics where you ship Marinette and Adrian and act like their relationship is healthy and always has been. Literally all you are doing is helping it to contribute to the misogyny. You are helping to contribute to the fucking brainwashing of children into thinking this shit is normal and healthy and romantic.

If you actually understood how horrible Adrian’s cannon behavior is, if you actually understood how bad it is that this show is romanticizing sexual harassment, you would not be shipping them, because morals literally would not allow you to.

If you still think it’s okay to ship Marinette and Adrien, then no, you are not acknowledging that the source material is harmful. If you were actually fully aware of how fucking horrible this level of misogyny is, you would not even be able to imagine shipping these characters and putting Marinette through that.

Instead of contributing to misogyny and the glorification of sexual harassment while showing everyone around you, including children younger than you, that it’s okay for boys to sexually harass girls, literally just write your own fucking original characters. It is literally free. It cost nothing just open a new document and come up with some names and a random setting and just start writing about original characters instead.

But do not ship poor fucking Marinette with Adrian and try to claim that you care about misogyny and you care about fighting against it.

Shipping is not more important than fighting bigotry.

All you are doing by shipping this abusive relationship whose literal foundation is misogyny and treating women like objects is further teaching the children, especially the young girl in this fandom, that this is how they deserve to be treated.

-

If you see a post talking about how Adrien is sexually harassing Marinette and the writers are portraying it as romantic and normal and telling the audience that we should laugh at Marinette's every boundary being violated and we should laugh at her being upset by this, because they're misogynists who are setting their audience of kids up to be abused, and your immediate response is to defend your desire to ship this abusive relationship, you are in fact a bad person.

You are, in fact, a misogynist. You are, in fact, perpetuating the very fucking misogyny being discussed.

If your response to people saying, "this abusive relationship is being protrayed as romantic in order to groom children into accepting abuse"

is to say "well yeah that's true. Anyways I'm gonna pretend it's romantic anyways" then you're a bad fucking person!

#long post #shit adrien stans say #if you see a post about how Adrien is harasing Marinette and your takeaway #is that you need to defend shipping them...yeah you're a fucking Adrien stan #misogyny #ml fandom misogyny #things adrien stans say #adrien salt #ML fandom guillotine #ml fandom salt

[rjalker]

Making it its own post: Either you think you're responsible enough to interact with others without hurting people with your bigotry, or you don't.

If your immediate response to being told that something you did is racist, is to deny that you are racist because you are a child, you are racist.

It really is that simple.

Just because you are a child does not make your actions harmless. Just because you are a child does not mean you get a “get out of consequences free” card. Your racism is no different from the racism of an adult. It still reflects your morals, it still enforces racist views, and it’s still actively harming the people of color around you, and yes, that includes children of color.

You don’t get to be a bigot and then try to use the fact that you’re a child as a shield as though the other children being harmed by your bigotry don’t literally exist.

If you think you can’t be held accountable for your actions because you’re a child, then get off the internet until you learn what morals are and can trust yourself to be a good person.

Either you think it’s impossible for you to behave like a decent person who has morals because you’re a kid, or you think you’re responsible enough to interact with people responsible. You gotta pick one.

You cannot argue that it's impossible for you not to be a bigot because of your age and then insist on subjecting people to your bigotry by attacking them online.

Either you think you're responsible enough to interact with others, and you're willing to hold yourself accountable and take responsibility when people call you out for bigoted behavior so you can stop hurting people, or you don't.

If you think you're incapable of interacting with other people on the internet without being a bigot towards them, then you do not need to interact with people on the internet.

I didn't use my age to justify my shitty behavior online when I was a kid, and you don't get to do that either. If you think your age makes you incapable of not hurting people, then it's your responsibility not to hurt people and to stay offline.

Either you think you're mature enough to interact with others in a responsible and non-bigoted manner, or you don't.

You have to pick one, you really fucking do.

Either you think you're ready to be on the internet interacting with people, or you think it's okay for you to be racist because you're a kid. Pick one.

Your age is not an excuse for your bigotry. It never was and it never will be. If you think being a kid means you're incapable of hurting others, then get off the internet until you trust yourself not to hurt people.

If someone tells you something you did was bigoted, and your immediate response is to say they can't criticize your behavior because you're a minor, then you are literally just not ready to be on the internet yet interacting with people and you need to log out until you learn what morals are.

I'm serious. Pick one. Either you think you're ready to interact with other people in the real world where your actions have consequences, or you think you're not. You can't have it both ways.

#repetition #because Im incapble of typing otherwise #discussion of racism #discussion of misogyny #discussion of bigotry #ml fandom racism #ml fandom misogyny #ml fandom salt #ml fandom guillotine

[rjalker]

anyways remember when that fuckwad tried to say that they just simply have to write racist fanfiction because someone sent them a writing prompt for it? So it's not their fault that they wrote a racist story, it's the prompter's fault, and even before it's the prompter's fault, it's the writers for the original show's fault, because they made it racist to begin with!!!

they were literally fucking arguing that it's okay to be racist as long as someone else was racist first, and that they have absolutely no control over what they write or which writing prompts they accept.

#ml fandom racism #fandom racism #ML fandom guillotine #ml fandom salt

[rjalker]

oh and the racist adrien stans are once again saying it's embarassing and cringey for me to call them out on their racism because I'm white, and they're claiming I'm "condemning people just for being white".

Like, okay racist, why don't you go yell into the void some more and learn how to be a decent person.

#fandom racism #ML fandom guillotine #Miraculous Ladybug #Shit adrien stans say

[rjalker]

People with critical thinking skills who aren't misogynists: Adrien is sexually harassing Marinette and that's not okay. He needs to face consequences for his behavior and the writers need to acknowledge that what he's doing is wrong.

Adrien stans: Oh my god you monster! You bitch! You [insert many ableist slurs here]! You're [insert ableist insults here]! You deserve to die! Why are you making Adrien seem like a monster?????

Adrien stans: *write fanfiction where Adrien literally threatens to rape Marinette to her face, where he stalks her and terrorizes her for months, where he kidnaps her and tortures her, where he traumatizes her and purposefully triggers her into panic attacks and mental breakdowns because it amuses him, where he murders her, where he murders her family to force her to be with him*

Adrien stans: oh my god this is so romantic!!! This is so hot!!!! I'm so in love with this story!!! I ship it so much!!! I love the way you've written the characters!!! I'm on the edge of my seat!!!! This relationship is so romantic!!!!

(I wish everyone who thinks this is an exaggeration a very I hope you never have the misfortune to read the fics I had to read before I gave up forever)

#misogyny #rape #shit adrien stans say #Miraculous Ladybug #Adrien salt #Chat Noir salt #Adrien Agreste #Chat Noir #marinette deserves better #ml fandom racism #ml fandom misogyny #ml fandom guillotine #ml fandom salt #ml salt #Adrien stans literally think abuse is hot. #they literally go out of their way to make their relationship even more horrifically and blatantly abusive than anything any person who #criticizes him would ever think to write.

[rjalker]

we need to talk about the fact that so many people who worship the ground Chloe walks on are viciously racist towards Alya.

#ml fandom racism #Miraculous Ladybug #I cannot count the number of '''alya salt''''' fics where Alya is a vicious fucking physically and emotionally abusive bully who Marinette #is terrified of. And Chloe is this poor cringing so sad and pitiable White Girl Victim of the Scary Aggressive Phyiscally Intimidating #Black GIirl #fandom racism #alya deserves better #alya cesaire #chloe bourgeois #ml fandom salt #ml fandom guillotine #Ml salt

[rjalker]

“I wish all Adrien salters a very please never meet a child abuse victim in real life”

okay cool let me just wipe myself from existance then, since I criticize Adrien and was abused as a child lol.

Adrien stans don’t actually give a single shit about victims of abuse, because if they did, they would know by now that many, if not the majority, of people calling out Adrien for his misogyny and horrible behavior, are literally real life victims of child abuse and/or sexual harassment.

if these people actually cared about real life victims of abuse, they would listen to us when we tell them that arguing that Adrien is a horrible person because he’s abused--the way they do, the way the person who made this post was--will always be more harmful to victims of abuse than it ever helps.

Saying that victims of abuse are guarenteed to be horrible people, and there’s nothing they can do about it, is demonizing victims of abuse and harms real life people who are victims of abuse. and I have been saying this for fucking years now, but Adrien stans just keep insisting that the only reason Adrien treats people like shit is because he’s abused, and therefore we aren’t allowed to call him out.

Even though one of the most blatant people who abused me as a child was my stepfather, whose abuse of me and my siblings was excused because he was abused as a kid.

Adrien stans are literally spouting abuse apologism and simultaneously demonizing victims of abuse, while pretending that they support us and want to help. And then they turn around and pretend like anyone who disagrees with them wasn’t ever actually abused or ever a victim, because that doesn’t fit their narrative.

how many times to people who call out this show’s blatant racism and misogyny have to give persoanl anecdotes of the abuse they havesuffered before adrien stans stop fucking pretending that they’re the good guys by telling victims of abuse that they are destined to be horrible people and there’s no use fighting it because their abuse has permenantly tainted them and made it impossible for them to be good people???

#shit adrien stans say #things adrien stans say #ml fandom guillotine #ml fandom salt #adrien agreste #chat noir #adrien salt #chat noir salt #chat salt #ml salt #miraculous ladybug

[rjalker]

Adrien Agreste is the epitome of not only male entilement, but wealthy white male mediocrity.

He does nothing except literally make things more dangerous, but he doesn’t have to do anything.

Because he’s a billionaire, blond, cis allohet white boy who has a Tragic Backstory™.

He doesn’t need to do anything. He doesn’t need to have morals, he doesn’t need to have intelligence, he doesn’t need to have kindness or compassion or even a sense of humor.

He’s straight, he’s cis, he’s white, he’s blond, and he’s rich.

That’s the only thing people care about.

He’s white, he’s blond, he’s rich, he’s pretty, and he can look like a kicked puppy whenever things aren’t going his way.

And for the racists and misogynists, that’s all they need. He’s perfect, and he can’t possibly get any more perfect.

He doesn’t even have to do literally anything, and he is praised to the moon and back.

He can literally fucking kill a black girl on screen, and he receives nothing but praise and pity.

He can literally attempt to kill another black girl on screen, and once again, he receives nothing but praise and pity. People will literally cheer him on.

He has been sexually harassing the protagonist of this show for over four seasons now, and he receives nothing but praise.

Because he’s white, and rich, and pretty, and that’s perfection in their eyes, no matter what else he is or does.

He is literally the epitome of white privelege. He is the epitome of male privelege. He is the epitome of why we should eat the gods damned rich.

Adrien Agreste is the poster child for everything wrong with our society, but too many people have no problem with that, because they’re too busy worshipping him to give a shit about anything else.

#Adrien salt #miraculous ladybug #ML salt #Adrien Agreste #Chat Noir #Chat Noir salt #ML fandom racism #ml fandom misogyny #ml fandom guillotine

[rjalker]

I can literally guarentee you that if you found the worst possible Adrien salt fic where Adrien is portrayed as the worst he could possibly get, I can literally guarentee you that it doesn't even come close to the levels of horrific abuse that people who like him write him inflicting on Marinette, which they portray as tragic and romantic and hot and Beauty and the Beast 2022™. I fucking guarentee you.

#Adrien salt #Adrien Agreste #Chat Noir #Chat Noir salt #Miraculous Ladybug #ML fandom salt #ml fandom misogyny #ml fandom racism #ml fandom guillotine