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leupagus · 19 days

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Team Stark, Team Targaryen, Team Black, Team Green, whatever. I'm on Team Let Shireen Have Nice things

Sansa's horse's name was Ninny; he had one blue eye and one brown, which Northerners thought was lucky.

"More likely means he's deaf in one ear," Father remarked. Ninny's ears, which seemed to hear well enough, flattened and he nipped at Father's horse. (If it had a name, Father either hadn't asked or didn't want to tell her, since he'd ignored her question when they'd first mounted.)

"I think he feels insulted, Your Grace," Sansa remarked, pulling Ninny's head back around and settling her arms more comfortably around Shireen's waist. She'd been kind to let Shireen ride with her, since most of the Northern horses were needed to carry two or even three soldiers apiece, along with whatever equipment they could drag out of the snows. Mother and Lady Melisandre had chosen to ride two of the surviving Southern horses, but Mother had said there wasn't room on hers for both of them.

So instead of riding in the back of the train, Shireen was next to Father near the front, just behind the beautiful banners that snapped and curled in the breeze. It was still bitterly cold, but Sansa's cloak was warm wrapped round them both and she had even brought a pair of Northern boots for Shireen, with the fur thickly lined on the inside. Only the right side of her face was chilled, tears pricking at her eye. Sansa said they would make camp late tomorrow at this pace; her stormseer had promised them blue skies and clear nights. Shireen had hoped this would make Father — not happy, since she had only rarely seen him so, and never since Uncle Robert had died — but less unhappy.

Instead, it had turned him surly, the sort he only got when he had been frightened about something. He had been like this once when she had gone sailing with Devan in his little skiff and it had capsized, sending them laughing into the calm waters of the western bay. They had managed to swim toward land, pushing the hull of the boat before them, and had found Father and Ser Davos wading out to retrieve them. Davos helped Devan drag the boat in, laughing all the while, but Father had picked her up and carried her to shore, holding her so tightly she could feel her bones creak. "Get to your rooms and change," he'd ordered, all but dropping her to the stony beach, and for the rest of the day had scowled and muttered whenever she'd spoken.

She could not think why he was acting this way now, but she had long since given up trying to coax him out of his sulks the way she could Ser Davos. Instead she asked Sansa more questions — about the Wolfswood, where she and her army had hidden themselves, and about the Goldgrass Coldblood horses that Northerners rode.

"Not just Goldgrasses," said Sansa. "The mountain clans breed and ride their Breakstone Garrons, which are even better than the Coldbloods when it comes to surviving the winters. They're more like goats than horses — they eat like goats, too," she added with a wrinkle to her nose. "The other day, a Garron managed to open Lord Flint's saddlebags and ate his linen smallclothes."

Shireen covered her mouth to hold in her giggle, but Father had dropped behind them to speak with Davos a few lengths behind. "Was Lord Flint very cross?"

"Oh, yes, but you can't throw a horse into the stocks, even if he does eat your underthings."

#spoilers: stannis is surly because he was about two episodes away from murdering his own daughter #and he's having some Feelings about himself as a result #which: GOOD #honestly still cannot believe that anyone thought that character arc was a good idea #anyway I love the idea that sansa is to shireen as margaery was to sansa #ie someone she looks up to who is kind of terrifying #MORE WOMEN RELATIONSHIPS PLEASE #game of thrones motherfuckers #got: bitches get stuff done

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pinkykats-place · 9 months

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GoT DILF(s) x reader insert fics

Tumblr Recommendations

Disclaimers!

Stories are NOT mine.

Some contain mature content.

Readers are mostly female.

Note: if you read any of these stories and enjoy them pls let the author know by rebloggung, liking or commenting on original post

Alliance

Ned Stark x second wife! Reader

Four Part Series

Surviving || Series Masterlist

{Ned Stark x Reader}

Summary: It was a classic romance. You were barren, his wife had passed, and you’d met through your father. It was a wonder the minstrels weren’t already singing songs about you.

The Secret Wife

Ned Stark x Fem!Reader Imagine

A Quiet Morning

Tywin Lannister x Female Reader

Summary: You enjoy a quiet morning with your Lord Husband

Under his mane

Tywin Lannister x Baratheon!Fem!Reader

Series Masterlist

Imagine Tywin Lannister visiting your chambers to fulfill his son’s duty at his place (smut)

Baby Lion

Tywin Lannister x pregnant!wife!Reader

Tywin Lannister being possessive and having jealous sex would include:

Longing

Pairing: Tywin Lannister x reader

Request: good fluffy smut with Tywin Lannister… maybe him realizing that his feelings for the reader is more than just a political marriage

Warnings: political marriage/arranged marriage, older man x younger woman, soft smut, unprotected sex

Repeat of History

Tywin Lannister x wife!Reader

Summary: when you go into labour, Tywin worries for your safety, remembering the death of his first wife

Trouble

Tywin x Wife!Reader

Summary: Tywin takes a second wife for a purely political alliance, and ends up with far more than he expected.

Series: Tywin x Reader

Summary: Imagine finding out you are marry Tywin Lannister after the deaths of your brother and Mother, Robb and Catelyn Stark.

The Lady Lion

Tywin x Wife!Reader

Fluffy Fic

In Time, the Lion Loves

Tywin Lannister x fem!Reader

Blessed with youth

Tywin Lannister x Tyrell!Reader

https://www.tumblr.com/gotpineapple/186244280214/blessed-with-youth-tywin-lannister-x-tyrellreader?source=share

Betrothed to the Wrong Brother

Stannis Baratheon x Reader

Based on this request: reader is supposed to be set up with Robert, but while at Storms End falls for Stannis instead?

Confession

Stannis Baratheon x fem!Reader

Summary: Stannis finally confesses his love for his wife

Belonging

Stannis Baratheon x Wife!Reader

Summary: Takes place around the time Robert was crowned, when Stannis and the Reader are married for less than a year. Robert’s drunkenness results in some jealousy and misunderstandings (and making up).

Steady

Stannis x Wife!Reader

Setting: just a year or two after Robert was crowned

An Injustice

Stannis Baratheon x reader

Summary: A lil one shot from a visiting Davos’s pov after Robert’s Rebellion. There’s more but I like the characterisation in this the best.

Stannis x Arryn!Reader

Jealous kiss for our one true king, stannis

Stannis Baratheon x fem!Reader

headcanons on the relationship between Shireen Baratheon and stepmother!reader & on how the Baratheon household would change if the Reader was to marry Stannis

Headcanons for Stannis x Reader’s children

Playground (modern au)

Stannis Baratheon x fem!Reader

Summary: Reader is sister to Sandor, and meets Stannis at a playground. The reader has a toddler daughter, but the father has passed away. Shireen and the daughter start playing together, so Stannis and the reader start talking too. Soon they plan a play date and the things escalate.

Imagine threatening to leave Roose and him letting it slip that he loves you (smut)

Roose being touch starved would include

A Northern Arrangement || Series

Roose Bolton x Reader

Imagine making a deal with Roose Bolton so he wont betray Robb and will actually warn Robb and everyone of the Frey’s impending betrayal.

Roose Bolton x Reader || Series

Roose being gentle with you:

Losing your virginity to Roose Bolton would include:

Imagine being in a pitch-black castle with Roose Bolton.

NSFW Alphabet with Roose Bolton

My Innocent Snowdrop

Oberyn Martell x Stark!Reader

Summary: The eldest Stark girl is forced to marry Oberyn Martell as a political alliance made by Cersei, but what she does not know is that the Prince of Dorne is a very loving man who easily falls in love with her and cherishes her deeply.

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thelustybraavosimaid · 4 months

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I want to specifically talk about book!Jon here because I'm pretty sure this person doesn't know a goddamn thing about Jon in the books or his personality to even remotely reach this conclusion. I'm, quite frankly, confused at this response. So I'd like to provide some quotes:

I would need to steal her if I wanted her love, but she might give me children. I might someday hold a son of my own blood in my arms. A son was something Jon Snow had never dared dream of, since he decided to live his life on the Wall. I could name him Robb. (Jon XII, ASoS)

If a child was something Jon had always wanted, as is clearly stated here, why would he force Ygritte to get rid of his own kid?

Let's not pretend like he doesn't love her, either. Was the beginning of their relationship dubious? Absolutely. But he did love her:

"Yes." His voice was thick. "First we'll live."

She grinned at that, showing Jon the crooked teeth that he had somehow come to love. Wildling to the bone, he thought again, with a sick sad feeling in the pit of his stomach. He flexed the fingers of his sword hand, and wondered what Ygritte would do if she knew his heart. (Jon V, ASoS)

Ygritte was much in his thoughts as well. He remembered the smell of her hair, the warmth of her body...and the look on her face as she slit the old man's throat. You were wrong to love her, a voice whispered. You were wrong to leave her, a different voice insisted.

...

"Who is Ygritte?" Donal Noye asked pointedly.

"A woman of the free folk." How could he explain Ygritte to them? She's warm and smart and funny and she can kiss a man or slit his throat. "She's with Styr, but she's not...she's young, only a girl, in truth, wild, but she..." She killed an old man for building a fire. His tongue felt thick and clumsy. The milk of the poppy was clouding his wits. "I broke my vows with her. I never meant to, but..." It was wrong. Wrong to love her, wrong to leave her... (Jon VI, ASoS)

And he did mourn her.

Though Maester Aemon said his wound was healing well, Jon bore other scars, deeper than the ones around his eye. He grieves for his wildling girl, and for his brothers. (Samwell IV, ASoS)

She stood beneath the scorched stones of the Lord Commander's Tower, cloaked in darkness and in memory. The light of the moon was in her hair, her red hair kissed by fire. When he saw that, Jon's heart leapt into his mouth. "Ygritte," he said. (Jon VI, ADwD)

It goes without saying that Jon is one of the most progressive protagonists in the series. He:

•despises rape,

•advocates for those perceived "weaker" for not fitting the typical Westerosi gender standards (i.e. Sam and Satin),

•breaks the mould of Night's Watch traditions for hundreds of years by allowing freefolk men and women ages twelve and up to join.

Jon Snow values bodily autonomy.

Moreover:

Burning dead children had ceased to trouble Jon Snow; live ones were another matter. Two kings to wake the dragon. The father first and then the son, so both die kings. The words had been murmured by one of the queen's men as Maester Aemon had cleaned his wounds. Jon had tried to dismiss them as his fever talking. Aemon had demurred. "There is power in a king's blood," the old maester had warned, "and better men than Stannis have done worse things than this." The king can be harsh and unforgiving, aye, but a babe still on the breast? Only a monster would give a living child to the flames. (Jon I, ADwD)

Once outside and well away from the queen’s men, Val gave vent to her wroth. "You lied about her beard. That one has more hair on her chin than I have between my legs. And the daughter…her face…"

"Greyscale."

"The grey death is what we call it."

"It is not always mortal in children."

"North of the Wall it is. Hemlock is a sure cure, but a pillow or a blade will work as well. If I had given birth to that poor child, I would have given her the gift of mercy long ago."

This was a Val that Jon had never seen before. "Princess Shireen is the queen’s only child."

"I pity both of them. The child is not clean.”

"If Stannis wins his war, Shireen will stand as heir to the Iron Throne."

"Then I pity your Seven Kingdoms."

"The maesters say greyscale is not—"

"The maesters may believe what they wish. Ask a woods witch if you would know the truth. The grey death sleeps, only to wake again. The child is not clean!"

"She seems a sweet girl. You cannot know—"

"I can. You know nothing, Jon Snow.” Val seized his arm. “I want the monster out of there. Him and his wet nurses. You cannot leave them in that same tower as the dead girl.”

Jon shook her hand away. "She is not dead."

"She is. Her mother cannot see it. Nor you, it seems. Yet death is there." She walked away from him, stopped, turned back. "I brought you Tormund Giantsbane. Bring me my monster."

"If I can, I will.”

"Do. You owe me a debt, Jon Snow.”

Jon watched her stride away. She is wrong. She must be wrong. Greyscale is not so deadly as she claims, not in children. (Jon XI, ADwD)

Not to mention the conversation he has with Tormund:

"You are a free man now, and Ygritte is a free woman. What dishonor if you lay together?"

"I might get her with child."

"Aye, I'd hope so. A strong son or a lively laughing girl kissed by fire, and where's the harm in that?"

Words failed him for a moment. "The boy...the child would be a bastard."

"Are bastards weaker than other children? More sickly, more like to fail?"

"No, but—"

"You're bastard-born yourself. And if Ygritte does not want a child, she will go to some woods witch and drink a cup o' moon tea. You do not come into it, once the seed is planted."

"I will not father a bastard."

Tormund shook his shaggy head. "What fools you kneelers be. Why did you steal the girl if you don't want her?"

"Steal? I never..." (Jon II, ASoS)

So with that in mind, why would he force a woman of the freefolk — a group of people he had come to appreciate, and his first love — to drink moon tea? If she wanted to, she'd do it herself. But he would not force her. That is not how the freefolk work and Jon knows it.

#asoiaf #ramble

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esther-dot · 10 months

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Asha was horrified by seeing men burned alive by Mel and called it brutal. In the show Yara was team Dany. My main problem in show was those who has seen what Stannis and Mel capable of and disgusted by it somehow become team Dany or enarmed by hrr. Jon, Davos and Yara.

It was so annoying!!!! I wrote this a couple years ago about Davos:

I like Davos as much as anyone, but I have to say, Jon falling in love with Dany may be the tiniest bit less weird than Davos pushing that relationship even though he served a king who was entangled with a lady who burned people alive, resulting in Shireen's death (a girl he loved as his own), and then given a second chance at being hand of the king, encourages Jon to get romantically entangled with Dany, a woman who burns people alive. (link)

It was so strange that D&D knew the endgame and really went about achieving it in the most self-defeating way possible. Davos’ love for Shireen, his righteous rage at Mel, it was so compelling, and then they just throw it away, make him pro Dany immediately after. What a waste. It didn’t even make sense for Yara to remain team Dany, she wasn’t as attached to Dany as Tyrion or Greyworm, and she should have negotiated to get something she wanted in exchange for letting Jon’s stabbity stab slide. D&D's decision to try to act like Dany wasn’t as bad as they made her be will confound me forever. If they wanted her to be good, they shouldn’t have made her ruthlessly murder kids. If they wanted people to be loyal, they should have given them a reason to be. 🤦🏻‍♀️

#dot chat #anti got

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anxiousnerdwritings · 1 year

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Sorry you're still sick hope you get better! ❤️

I was wondering what would happen if Joanna!Lookalike!reader got greyscale like Shireen?

Thank you!💚

If Joanna!lookalike!Reader were to get greyscale similar to Shireen there would be an all out panic amongst the family. Cersei would be a complete mess. She’s terrified of what will become of her child, she’s furious that this ever happened to begin with especially to her beloved bby. Cersei would become even more overprotective and suffocating to the Reader, they need her more than ever and she has no plans of leaving them alone every again.

Joanna!lookalike!Reader would be kept away from everyone else and the outside world, only immediate family would be allowed to see and interact with them. Tywin would ensure that the Reader got the best possible treatment from the maesters. Cersei would have to be physically pried away from her child whenever the maesters do need to tend to the Reader. Similar to how Catelyn was when Bran was in his coma, Cersei would be by her child’s side every second possible. Even with the possibility of catching greyscale too, Cersei wouldn’t care. Joanna!lookalike!Reader would be of her utmost priority.

Given that the Reader probably contracted greyscale in a similar fashion to Shireen; through an object that was infected with it, Cersei and Tywin especially would no longer allow anything to be given to the Reader unless it was from their very own hands. Even if Jaime and Tyrion were to try and gift Joanna!lookalike!Reader something, Cersei and Tywin would immediately shut that shit down. Also, Cersei would totally accuse Tyrion of being the one to have given the Reader greyscale cause that’s just how she rolls.

There’s no doubt in my mind whether the Reader got greyscale completely accidentally or someone purposely infected them with it that Tywin and Cersei would wholeheartedly believe that it was a deliberate attack against their beloved Joanna!lookalike. They would have the Reader protected at all times. Cersei having multiple Kingsguards outside the Reader’s room at any and all times and Tywin commanding the Mountain to be attached to Joanna!lookalike’s hip no matter what.

I love the idea of Shireen hearing about what happened to Joanna!lookalike and wanting to reach out to them because of her own experience and the two being very close because of it. Especially given that the Reader would be locked away from the world for their own protection, a pen pal would be a breath of fresh air. But you can bet whatever letters the Reader does receive are thoroughly checked over before being given to them.

Also, Myrcella and Tommen would always be visiting their sibling. Tommen would often bring Sir Pounce to keep Joanna!lookalike company throughout the day. Myrcella would tell the Reader absolutely everything happening outside the walls of their bedchambers; from the slightest chance in weather to all the different people coming and going from King’s Landing.

Depending on his relationship with the Reader, Joffrey may also be a constant visitor of theirs. I think he would particularly love to show off and brag about the things he has knowledge of in regards to going on around the Red Keep that they don’t given being confined to their room. If he’s especially close to the Reader he would be a crying, snotty mess whenever he sees them. Throwing himself at them and complaining about missing them and wishing they could watch him go about his bratty ways outside of the confines of their room. He would also totally lie about how he actually behaves when he’s not in their company. As far as they know he’s a gentleman and goes out of his way to be the best boy, bullshit.

#anxious answers #yandere house lannister #yandere cersei lannister #yandere tywin lannister #yandere game of thrones #yandere game of thrones concept #yandere concept

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garak · 1 year

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rare serious stannis post but i hate people being like “guys stannis would never do this clearly mel has done magic to him” especially in regards to his relationship with her mostly because 1. love potions/magic is such stupid cop out annoying bullshit and if it becomes relevant in any way to the story i will die rather than accept it, 2. stannis is his own man and makes bad decisions quite often, and 3. he is known to do things he personally dislikes or has mixed feelings on if he thinks they will help his cause or if he thinks it’s his duty. as we all know i’m a gay stannis truther but there is no denying his relationship with mel is physical even beyond when she was making evil shadow babies, which puts the onus of explanation on us homosexual crusaders for why that was happening. for the answer we have to go back to ned’s observation of him in book one, and the iconic line of him going to his wife’s bed twice or so a year like a man marching off to war. from this we know that even after shireen was born and it was known selyse was almost certainly not going to have another kid, they still tried despite his obvious dislike for it. i think he’s in a similar position with melisandre now, where at one point this endeavor did produce results in some way or another and now even after theyre not seeing the same effect there is still the hope and thus still the effort made. what we hear from stannis himself of mel at least early on is extremely unromantic which is a trend that seems to continue on afaicr, viewing her practice as a means to an end instead of a religious belief that he too holds. but of course stannis is desperate for recognition and having someone who views him as a religious figure (and is willing to say it to his face. sorry davos) after years of feeling spurned and unappreciated is probably pretty nice! complicated stuff happening in that guys head that cannot be simply waved away by saying the he has a spell on him or something

#living after midnight #stannisposting

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navree · 1 year

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How can you humanize Maegor , if you will make a show about him?

It depends on how far back you're willing to go in his life, because really up until he takes the crown, you can do quite a bit to humanize him and make him someone people want to engage with, without woobifying him or trying to excuse the truly heinous things he does. Starting backstory onwards, there are lot of ways to do this. There's a lot of room to play with in his childhood and the interpersonal relationships that should be his strongest tethers to humanity, but aren't: his relationship with his brother, his relationship with his mother, and his relationship with his father.

Aenys and Maegor are a relationship that was doomed to fail since birth. For one, while the age gap isn't huge, five years is still pretty significant in terms of differences in development as children, which definitely got in the way of any bonding. For two, they also appear to have largely grown up separately, with Aenys spending most of his time by Aegon's side in King's Landing, and Maegor being raised on Dragonstone with Visenya, before the two essentially switched places with Aegon at Dragonstone and Visenya overseeing the construction of the Red Keep in King's Landing. For three, there's also the external factors, such as their incredibly different personalities and viewpoints on basically everything, as well as the fact that, when Maegor was born, Aenys was only very recently removed from the complete breakdown he had due to his trauma over his mother's sudden death, and likely still wasn't in a state to be trying to forge new bonds with anyone who wasn't Quicksilver (and Aegon, but Aegon's grandfathered in by being his literal dad). So Maegor, who we know wasn't making friends on Dragonstone and just in general was probably really isolated from kids his own age due to it being Dragonstone (not unlike how we see with Shireen Baratheon) also isn't getting any kind of connection from anyone close to his own age throughout his entire childhood.

Really, the only person Maegor is close to in any capacity is his mother, Visenya. She's the parent he grew up with, his primary caregiver and his closest relationship not just in childhood, but likely throughout his entire life. In the nature vs nurture debate on childrearing, she's the one who was providing the nurture. Nearly everything about Maegor, his personality and his view of the world and his personal philosophies and his love map in his brain, among many other things, all of that was shaped by Visenya and her influence on him and her care and devotion for him. And with no one else really around to provide him any sort of companionship that he might have needed, and with his other parent being incredibly distant and barely a parent, Maegor likely latched onto her incredibly strongly. I think, if asked, Maegor would say that, should he be found capable of love, Visenya would be the person he loved the most in his life (I'm of the opinion that his relationship with Tyanna was him trying to find a significant other that most reminded him of his beloved mother, not entirely dissimilar to the way that Henry VIII felt that an ideal wife would be one who was almost identical to Elizabeth of York). And we know that this is something that persisted long after childhood, into his adulthood Visenya was his strongest supporter and Maegor relied on her a lot early in his reign, and was publicly devastated when he learned that she had died. His mother was the only parent he ever really knew as a parent, certainly the family member he loved most, adored even, especially in such sharp distinction with Aegon as a distant father. And speaking of that distant father...

I love Aegon, he's one of my absolute favorite Targs, but he was practically just a parent in name only to his second son. And that's going to do a number on someone, no matter who they are. Maegor's father doesn't much care for his mother, certainly doesn't seem to care for him at all personally, and despite the fact that Maegor is probably far more like Aegon, and a far worthier successor, than Aenys, Aegon still dotes on his eldest while barely spending any time with Maegor. And it's not because of anything Maegor's done, or even anything Aenys has done: it's entirely because of Aenys's mother. Aenys is Aegon's favorite, his precious son, not because of anything Aenys has done to earn that, but simply because he is the son of Aegon's beloved Rhaenys, and that his very existence is a way of having Rhaenys still with him after her disappearance/death. We know that Aegon was forever incredibly affected by what happened to Rhaenys and that he never stopped loving her, given that he openly wept when he held Rhaena and was informed that she was named after her grandmother. Meanwhile, there's Maegor, whose own mother's relationship with his father was never very good (marriage of duty for them vs the Aegon/Rhaenys marriage of desire) and had become incredibly cold and distant by the time that he was born, and you can very easily see how that might ultimately affect a kid. He's watching his mother be completely ignored by his dad just for being the wrong woman, he's dealing with himself being completely ignored and passed over in love and affection just because he's the son of the wrong woman, because his mother isn't the lost ghost that Aegon loved and won't ever be able to stop loving. How much of Maegor's prowess in fighting, not to mention the unchecked aggression he showed during training, was borne of trying to impress his martially skilled father and being upset when it didn't work? How much of his continued presence in tourneys and melées was to show Aegon that he was a much better son than Aenys, that he deserved the love Aegon was freely giving his brother just as much? Was there ever a time when he resented Visenya for being his mother when that was enough to make Aegon uninterested, and did he ever hate himself for blaming the wrong person, or blaming anyone at all? How much did he internalize his own feelings about it as the relationship never got any warmer? How did he feel when Aegon finally noticed him enough to knight him himself, and make him the youngest knight in the realm at that? Did Maegor ever want to talk to him about it once he was a young man, did he ever want to try and forge a stronger relationship on his own merits as an adult, did he ever even try?

There's also the matter of Balerion, which is as much its own relationship as a subset of anything that can be played with as it pertains to Aegon and Maegor. For one, we know that Maegor point blank refused to claim any dragon because he felt that Balerion was the only one worthy of him. And you can take that at face value, but you can also go deeper into it, into the ideas that Maegor might not be consciously aware of. Maybe he wants to try and connect with his father on some level through the dragon bond. Maybe he looks at how Aegon gives Aenys so much, his companionship and his throne and his sword and his love, Hell he even gives Aenys a Valyrian bride (Alyssa Velaryon) but demands that Maegor settle for a simple Westerosi, as if he's lesser than and not the blood of old Valyria. And still he waits to see if maybe Aegon will give him something. Maybe once Aegon is too old for dragonriding, he'll give Maegor Balerion, or at least give Maegor the opportunity to try, to prove himself as Aegon's son, to have that connection. And when Aegon doesn't, when it's still Aenys getting everything Maegor might not even realize he wants, that's just another disappointment for him.

But Maegor does get Balerion anyway, once Aegon dies. He finally gets a connection to Aegon that's his alone, and it's after Aegon is already dead and likely after Maegor was already hardening into the man he would ultimately be remembered as. Not to mention, even on its own, Balerion and Maegor's bond is a good way to show a human element to the man. I've always maintained that, when it comes to Targaryens, the most unconditionally loving and the most openly affection and emotional we should see them should really be with the dragons. With their magic and their Valyrian blood and old world roots and just everything about them, even if you don't subscribe to Targaryen exceptionalism, they are pretty far removed from the place they actually live; culturally and ethnically and socially, they are not Westerosi and certainly in Maegor's time, don't see themselves or are seen by others as Westerosi. The dragons, products of Valyria's heyday, are the closest living beings that Targaryens can relate to, and this is doubly important when it comes to Balerion, who was born during the reign of the Valyrian Freehold, who was alive before the Doom. Balerion is a living cultural heritage, and for someone as isolated as Maegor is (and, as we see in his actions re: his marriages and the Faith, as divorced from Westerosi customs and standards as he is), having that connection is probably the deepest one he'd have, bar maybe his mother, and even then, despite that closeness and love, their mutually cold personalities probably made it hard to be open in any deep affection once Maegor started growing up. Dragons and their riders are practically one being, they feel each other's pains and pleasures and angers and grudges and triumphs, and Maegor having something like that, along with the connection to a father he never really was connected to, adds a human element to the man that he was, despite the fact that he used Balerion to do terrible things.

You can also do a lot with Maegor's actions before his own kingship, specifically the reign of his half-brother Aenys. In spite of their differences and distances, in spite of the shadow of Aegon and the relationships he had with his sisters that affected his relationship with his own sons in turn, Aenys does embrace Maegor with open arms. He gives him Blackfyre, another possession of Aegon's that Maegor must have coveted, and he promises that they'll rule together. They're both adults now, and Aenys seems emotionally sensitive enough to have realized that Maegor probably has some deep rooted issues borne out of things that were set in motion before he was even conceived. And while Visenya might have scoffed at the gestures Aenys made for Maegor, Maegor appears to have taken them really seriously. He personally crushes a rebellion against Aenys in the Vale, and makes huge showings of his loyalty by fighting really hard for his brother against his foes. When Aenys makes him his Hand, Maegor takes that responsibility really seriously and is willing to obey Aenys as his Lord and King, as well as protect him. This seems to have been loyalty that was reciprocated, since it's noted that, when Aenys exiles Maegor for his bigamy, he does it because he felt he had no other option than to be mad at Maegor for what he did, due to the huge public outcry, and even then he still offers Maegor a way out. He only exiles him because Maegor refuses to set Alys aside (another way to humanize Maegor, he takes Alys as a wife despite it being a big taboo for most Westerosi and in spite of her being from a pretty minor noble House, and he refuses to leave her even at the cost of losing his home, he keeps her by his side and he refuses to give her up when there were likely a shitton of better options to deal with his childlessness, to say nothing of women from greater Houses with more potential for him politically, but he CHOSE Alys), since Aenys felt that this was the only choice left to him. And Maegor abides by the exile. Yeah, he takes Blackfyre even though Aenys asked him to leave it, but he still goes into exile, and he stays in exile. Aenys rides Quicksilver and Maegor rides Balerion, the two dragons literally go toe to toe with each other and it's so massively onesided because Quicksilver doesn't stand a chance. If Maegor wanted to, he could have very easily repudiated his exile and decimated Aenys if he tried to enforce it. But Aenys told him to go, so he did, and he stayed gone until Visenya came to fetch him back with the news that Aenys was dead. He respected Aenys's word as king, his sovereign authority as liege lord and as the elder brother, and even if he might not have entirely thought the man worthy of what he had, that does speak to a sort of deference in spite of the complexities of their upbringing, and a willingness to obey Aenys despite everything about their personalities.

So, by the time Maegor comes back from Pentos to usurp the throne, there's a lot that can be used to humanize him and make him a compelling protagonist. A close but somewhat stilted relationship with the only parent to have ever tried with him, an unfulfilled, desperate need for approval and affection from a parent who couldn't give that to him due to circumstances entirely outside his control, a brother he didn't know well in his youth and might not have thought worthy of what he had and certainly been jealous of but that he still respected as king and fought hard to defend and that he deferred to even when he didn't have to, at least one marriage that, in spite of what little it offered him and the clusterfuck it caused, he valued enough that he refused to set aside, and an intense bond with a fearsome dragon that you can make him value more than almost anything or anyone. All of that set up can then be used for an extraordinary fall from grace, to watch the potential and nuance slowly grow darker and darker and darker as Maegor does increasingly horrible things, treats the people in his life increasingly badly, descends further and further into the tyranny and madness that will utlimately kill him. There's bright spots that can be used as well, like the fact that he does have Jaehaerys as his heir and doesn't seem to have had him or Viserys treated that badly, even though they were prisoners, and that he didn't actually set out to kill Aegon the Uncrowned at all until Aegon decided to take back his throne and amass an army. Then, as we've watched Maegor slide further and further down, we can watch with a sinking dread as he annihilates Aegon beneath God's Eye, as he turns on Alys and extinguishes her family, as he has Viserys literally tortured to death to punish Alyssa and Jaehaerys and Alysanne for their escape from Dragonstone. So that, by the time we get to shit like the completion of the Red Keep and the Black Brides, we see that Maegor is incredibly far gone, and we can only watch as all the complexities within him are swept aside by the monster he's become, so foul and loathsome that the eldritch abomination that is the Iron Throne finally kills him to stop the madness.

It's not about woobifying Maegor or excusing him. It's about providing a reason for the audience to look back on who he was as he becomes what he was always going to be, to give explanations for why he does the things that he does (how much of his initial militarism and violence and heavy-handedness, before he went doolally, was borne out of not just his martial prowess as a kid but also watching Aenys's version of ruling not work, for instance), and to get people to understand and feel his initial motivations so that the later stuff also makes sense, and so that you're watching something akin to a doomed fall when he becomes Maegor the Cruel. These are, at least to me, some of the most important and influential ways you can humanize Maegor as a character if you're planning to center him in a proper narrative story, without filing down his edges and keeping him as the kind of person he is. Extrapolate on why he is the way he is, and then show him how he is throughout his lifetime and what he does, along with the how and why of what he does.

#personal #answered #anonymous #maegor targaryen #maegor the cruel #yeah i've got a lot of thoughts about the conquerors and the dragon's peace and the sons of the dragon #anyway remember what i said about rhaenys being the glue that held the family together?#rhaenys's death being the reason that everything starts to fall apart?#rhaenys being the figure that looms large over the early reigns of the targaryens?#rhaenys being the ghost that haunts this entire family and won't ever leave them until all the people that both knew her #and were affected by her are dead? yeah i stand by all of that #it's why i'd want a sons of the dragon show to be preceded by a conquest show #so that the intense shift in dynamics and characters once she's gone makes sense #so that the very essence of the story changes when she dies #but anyway i've got Feelings #@ hbo come on guys!!!!!!#i'm right here i'm willing to work for very little money on this!!!!#(and then once i get y'all raking in cash through my correct opinions about the conquest and the sons of the dragon)#(you let me make the augustus show)#hope some of this makes sense i've been thinking about these characters a lot #so sometimes it's hard to organize it all into a cohesive essay

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cdragons · 2 months

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Back in my GOT Era, because my ADHD brain won't shut the fuck up 凸(^-^)凸

Let’s pretend Yi Ti and Westeros have an okay trading relationship with each other, and merchants from Yi Ti are always treated with celebrity status in the Seven Kingdoms. Let's also pretend that the GOT writers haven't completely fucked up all of Stannis' fantastic characterization and complexity.

I love Shireen Baratheon so goddamn much, and the fact she died in the show is such an insult to both her's and Stannis' characters. I decided to blast D & D's canon with a bazooka and make Selyse die when Shireen was a baby. Because Stannis needs to make sure she has a mother figure, he marries a childhood friend, OC, who hails from Yi Ti and owns one of the largest sea merchant companies in the Golden Empire. Oh, and she'll have her own kid, too.

Why am I doing this? Don't I have a shitload of other fanfic ideas to write out? Yes, as a fanfic writer, having incomplete ideas is part of the job.

Do I still have an incomplete Robb Stark x YI Ti!OC story? Also, yes, but I replaced my laptop and forgot to save Chapter 4 in the iCloud Drive. The file is on my old laptop, but that's currently across the Atlantic Ocean in Shanghai while I'm in Boston right now 🤷🏻‍♀️.

🔆Backstory Time🔆

OC’s Name: Xu Mei-Ling & Face Claim: Michelle Yeoh

Mei-Ling's family was on good terms with the Baratheon House, and she was actually staying with Stannis during the Siege of Storms End. She is a few years older than Robert and Ned but is good friends with both boys. Stannis grows a major crush on her because of her support during the siege, and Mei-Ling thinks highly of his stubbornness to hold down Storms End for Robert. After the blockade, she ends up marrying someone in Yi Ti. She ended up giving birth to a daughter in the middle of a major storm.

I'll go into more details when I make the first official post about it, but long story short, Mei's husband dies, and so does Selyse. Mei eventually learns about Stannis' daughter and decides, "Fuck it."

They get married, and Mei moves to Dragonstone. She oversees his daughter's education and prepares her to be an heir worthy of the Baratheon name. She also makes sure Shireen interacts with other kids her age. Shireen gets a badass older sister and a mother who isn't the worst. Hooray!

Also, Mei's daughter will end up knowing Ned's kids and Theon for a good fucking portion of her life. She's Med's and Luwin's favorite because if someone pisses her off, she'll yell out profanities while chasing after them with a broom twice her size. One time, Robb tried to pull her hair, and the next thing he knew, he was pinned face down with his face eating mud and Mei's daughter's knee on his back. Another time, she called Ned a fat idiot for not knowing a basic Yi Tish term, and Ned swore it was being scolded by Mei all over again.

In the end, Stannis and the North will be saved from D&D's shitty writing because two WOC immigrants decided to take matters into their own hands.

I'm still having trouble deciding on a title, so if anyone has any ideas, let me know in the comments!

Tagging: @a-libra-writes, @aphroditesmoon, @asa-do-your-thing, @arcielee, @valeskafics, anyone else who is a fan of Stannis the Mannis, Shireen, the North, etc.

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asongofstarkandtargaryen · 10 months

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Any friendships you're hoping for besides obvious ones like dany + any stark

Bran developing a friendship with Devan seaworth would be cool if Davos sticks with the Starks after Stannis and Shireen's death, also maybe edric storm, rollam westerling and dickon tarly

Arya with one of the mormonts also Meera given the similarities

Sansa with Wylla

Edmure and Willas

Brynden Tully and Wyman Manderly

I'm hoping that Dany will form a bond with every girl who had a tough time and is around her age. Aside from Arya & Sansa, I'd like to see her interact with Brienne, Asha, Jeyne Poole, Meera etc. Please Martin give us all the positive female relationship you haven't shown us so far. And ofc I really want to see her meeting and teaming up with Tyrion.

Bran Stark and Devan Seaworth could be introduced and become friends since both are sweet kids. Can we also throw Lyanna Mormont here? In her letter she showed respect and loyalty towards the Starks so I'm sure she would be thrilled to be friends with future head of House Stark. Also, I hope sweet Robin survives and meets his youngest cousins ( Bran and Rickon) because poor kid seems in need of some friends.

Sansa and Arya need to meet the Manderly sisters and their sister of law, Jeyne, as well.

For Sansa, I'd be interested to see her interacting with her uncle Edmure and his wife Roslyn.

As for Arya, she needs to meet Meera, Alys and the Sand Snakes. And while I know that Ironborn don't get along with Northerners, I need Arya and Asha to interact. She should also meet her uncle Brynden Tully and let him be the one to train her in order to be ready for the The last Battle. That would be an ideal mentorship, imo.

As for Jon, he should meet JonCon and Young Griff ( unlikely to happen but still) because I want to see those three interact. Bonus points if that happens before the Jon's lineage revelation. Also, Jon should meet Meera and Brienne because they are exactly the type of girls he admires. Both have different love interests but still they deserve to meet a nice young man who would admire them for those reasons westerosi society looks down on them.

#asoiaf ask #asoiaf headcanons #valyrianscolls #daenerys targaryen #bran Stark #sansa stark #Arya stark #jon snow

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buttertheflame · 5 months

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A List of Things To Come

*a long post*

I was on hiatus for about 5 years, but I think it's worth the risk of coming back. These are some thoughts and hot takes I've had since then up to now. My professional life is busy, but when I have the time, I'll share. Anyone interested?

Here's a preview, categorized by fandom:

A Song of Ice and Fire:

For asoiaf canon, I’ll speculate on what Jon and Val could have been, and what they could have had together, if he had not kicked the bucket. I’ll also contrast it with Jon's dreams of a life with her, and why he put the torch to it. :( Because of the root of her dislike of Mel and Shireen, I figure she will not be pleased with un-Jon.

Game of Thrones:

In GoT canon, Jon did not love Dany as much as the script suggested he would. In fact, they both failed to take responsibility for the other person. I haven't seen anyone make a statement like this before. (The PTSD is real.) But fic writers did pick up on this and tried to fix it in canon compliant stories, with a lot of success.

Supernatural:

In Supernatural s12-s14, Mary should have found her sons to be way more weird, specifically with each other. But given what we see of her in s6, her characterization is consistent. She would have, and did, ignore the red flags for an idea of family.

I’ll share approving thoughts on Sam and Dean's relationship in the final seasons, disapproving thoughts on the final season of Supernatural, and how I speculated it would either go Gencest or Destiel. We know what happened. No one walked away happy and I think the fandom was all the better for it.

Destiel is not canon. It only became a one-sided love confession. (I know there's a lot of speculation on what happened b/w the studio, the writer's room and the post-production team. Idc. Not gonna touch it.) Thoughts on how I think SPN could have made Destiel go 100% canon involve tweaking the execution and balancing out the themes of Sam and Eileen's love story, the big bad plot, and Dean and Cas's 'love' story.

Outlander:

Outlander (show-only) thoughts, foremost on Roger Mackenzie. He has vexed me from the first time he appeared on screen. I love him dearly, but he vexes me, for how he consistently affects the plot and how that defines his role among the main cast. Later on, I'll run through my favorite moments, episodes and narrative arcs.

Miscellaneous:

I'll share a list of favorite ship-centric fics I've collected over many, many, many years. (Gotta be over 10 years' worth). Along with blurbs that explain my recommendation in a non-spoilery way. Fandoms include: Harry Potter, LOTR, Supernatural, The Walking Dead, ASOIAF, Game of Thrones, Star Wars (Sequel Trilogy), The Flash, Shadowhunters [look away book fans <3], Hannibal (show-only).

I'll also post drafts of fics I never got right and never finished. Mostly GoT-canon divergent Jon/Dany fics.

Most importantly, some very dear friends have encouraged me to vent and hype up my Jonerys fic series "We Could Live Together" as I write it. It's GoT-canon divergent, but I alter some of what occurred before 6x09. Then the story re-enters book territory and moves toward ADOS conclusions. I'd also love to break down and discuss songs from the playlists when it strikes me.

This is the summary of Part 1, "A Long Way Home" (published):

After the Battle for Winterfell, Jon was captured by Bolton men then later found by Daenerys not far from Dragonstone. Their meeting blossoms into the most honest love--until Jon suddenly leaves for Winterfell, only to return to Dragonstone months later with more terrifying tales of dead men and Winter storms. When Daenerys chooses to send her armies north to fight the dead, all is certain but the matter of their bond. After the pain they'd endured, can they come together again? Or will separation be too powerful to overcome? *or* A romantic tale of choice and second chances.

This is the summary of Part 2, "Awake For Ever In Sweet Unrest" (in-progress and unpublished):

Winter has come and further fractured the realm. Yet Jon and Daenerys's betrothal and alliance is well known throughout the Seven Kingdoms. The secret that threatened to break them has made their love stronger, casting a fragrance of hope that draws to the last Targaryens all who seek refuge from political turmoil. Cersei Lannister has fled King's Landing in favor of establishing a bank in Lannisport, to guard against her deposition by the Iron Bank. Euron Greyjoy has set up a naval blockade at Oldtown, yet manages to beguile the Hightowers. And Walder Frey's sundown years threaten to pull his House into a civil war. From the Wall, Jon and Daenerys begin to wage war on the Others. Yet the age of wonder and terror, of gods and heroes, leads them and their enemies in the least expected ways. It begs the question: does all happen the way it must? *or* A romantic telling of the new War for the Dawn.

This is what I've been doing the past few years: working, (dating lol), re-reading the books and joining theory discussions on other sites. What touched my heart was readers asking for me to continue the fic series. Even as I considered it, I was conflicted. Since the show and book canon are so enmeshed, I think we were really vulnerable to being whipped and scored by D&D. But we all found ways to lick our wounds. I'm grateful we were able to become closer and stronger. I'm glad to be a part of it.

So that's my preview. If you've read this far, thank you. <3

There's more to come.

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hamliet · 1 year

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Rereading A Game of Thrones

In light of my recent Fire & Blood reread, I decided to reread the whole ASOIAF series because, well, why not. Below are some general observations/musings on the themes, character arcs, alchemy, and foreshadowing of book 1. I'll do this for the others as well. It's not really a meta so much as observations and thoughts.

Themes

Good Intentions Pave the Way to Tragedy

The most basic storytelling in existence tells us that protagonists have plans work out for them, just because they're good people with good intentions. Martin's whole schtick with A Game of Thrones is turning this on its head.

So many POV character's arc ends with their best intentions blowing up in their faces.

Ned tries to do the right thing and appoint the rightful heir. Robert's will was given to him, after all. He then even confesses to treason to save his daughter. He's still executed.

Catelyn leaves Winterfell as a mother to get justice for her child who was almost murdered. As a result of lies, she ends up unjustly arresting Tyrion and unwittingly helps set in motion a chain of events that results in the loss of her husband, risks to her daughters, and the potential loss of her eldest son, who crowns himself king in the north.

Daenerys saves Mirri Maz Duur and Eroeh and uses MMD to save Drogo. It just results in more death; the khalasar consumes itself, she loses Drogo and her child, and learns how little a life is worth when everything else is gone. Eroeh even faces a worser fate.

Sansa only wanted a happy ending like in the romantic songs she listens to; she accidentally gives Cersei the warning she needs to arrest her father. She then pleads for mercy and is rewarded with her father's head. Sansa had no bad intentions, but she lost her family and her freedom for this.

Arya intends to be a strong warrior and hates when others are bullied. She kills a boy at the end out of fear. She just wants to save herself. She didn't do anything wrong per se, but it will haunt her and influence her negatively down the line.

Good intentions, even righteous actions, guarantee nothing. But that doesn't mean they are pointless, either. Why? Because, Daenerys's arc shows us what you can do when only the dead and stone remain, when she arises from the ashes like a phoenix. Jon's arc shows us that others can pull us back, make loss bearable.

Duty vs Love

Duty vs. love is one of the main elements of a Romantic story, and Martin's identified himself as a Romantic. Guinevere and Lancelot, anyone? The love that cannot be, the love that is doomed because of duty--there's conflict. Courtly love is a key piece of this, and it's literally defined as:

a highly conventionalized medieval tradition of love between a knight and a married noblewoman, first developed by the troubadours of southern France and extensively employed in European literature of the time. The love of the knight for his lady was regarded as an ennobling passion and the relationship was typically unconsummated.

(Also yes the Romantics drew heavily on medieval tradition.)

It ties into the motif of the human heart against itself. Ned, the most honorable man, in the end chooses love over duty (Sansa's life over his honor). Arguably, he chose both, because his duty as a father is to protect his child first and foremost.

Yet those who eschew duty for love completely aren't framed positively either: see, Cersei and Jaime, Robert over Lyanna, etc. Neither, of course, is eschewing love for duty. Stannis, we know from the show, will in the end choose duty over love (burning Shireen), and it will be for nothing.

Instead of "duty or love," what Martin seems to be trying to do is explore the nuances of individual situations and choices, and to suggest that duty to others' wellbeing can't so easily be separated from love.

Jon, after all, ends up trying to choose between duty (the Night's Watch) and love (helping Robb become King of the North). In the end, though, it's the love of his friends on the Night's Watch that brings him back. It's not just because he said some words. It's their love, and it's the reality of the Others' threats--since the Others threaten them all, including every person Jon loves.

Justice and Mercy

It's a tale as old as time (or at least as old as the Bible): justice vs. mercy. Can true justice exist without mercy? Or is that just abuse itself? Is mercy really the exclusion of justice?

Stannis, for example, is said to be the full embodiment of justice. And notably? That's not a good thing:

Lord Stannis in particular. His claim is the true one, he is known for his prowess as a battle commander, and he is utterly without mercy. There is no creature on earth half so terrifying as a truly just man.

Just as we in the real world struggle with this question of when mercy becomes injustice, and when justice becomes injustice without mercy, so the characters struggle. Even Ned's honorable justice--executing Garen at the start of the book--turns out to have been wrong, and he's executed in a similar fashion at the end of the book. But it's not ironic justice; it's just sad.

Ned is caught precisely because of both, just like love and duty: justice, in that he refused to act in time to get Joffrey under his wing, but would have saved his life if he had. But it wasn't just to put Joffrey on the throne, so he doesn't.

He also tries to show mercy to Cersei by encouraging her to leave with her kids. He just misunderstands Cersei and assumes that, as a mother, she will prioritize her kids' lives first and foremost. Except, the tragedy is that Cersei has never had her father prioritize her life as anything more than a pawn to be used, and so Cersei calls Ned's bluff: "what of my wrath, Lord Stark?" It'd be easy to say Ned underestimated Cersei because he saw her as a role and not as a person, but I don't think that's quite true either. The reality is... Ned had good intentions. It just didn't work out, because injustice is the opposite of justice and of mercy, and injustice isn't a force of mindless orcs from a foreign land to be brought down. It's among us and it's within each of us.

The Outsiders

The real heroes of the story, the ones I'll call the Big Six, are Jon, Daenerys, Tyrion, Arya, Bran, and Sansa. Interestingly, all of them are outsiders--except Sansa. Jon is a bastard. Daenerys is an exile. Tyrion is a dwarf. Bran is crippled. Arya is a girl who doesn't like society's rules--and Jon directly compares her situation to his: "Arya never seemed to fit, no more than he had."

But just in case we were tempted to brush off Arya and especially Sansa as being not truly outsiders, we have Daenerys' chapter where she eats the horse heart which tells us exactly why Sansa is also an outsider to a degree:

If she choked on the blood or retched up the flesh, the omens were less favorable; the child might be stillborn, or come forth weak, deformed, or female.

Yep, female is seen as weak and a poor omen.

If I Look Back, I Am Lost

This is the line Dany repeats to herself after Drogo's death. She can't bring herself to look back at what she could have done differently. In the moment she says this, it makes sense: she can't bring Drogo back, and she can't undo what she's done already. She can only look forward. However... she's going to have to look back at some point, probably in TWOW, and that should provide a wake-up.

The most notable other character doing this at this point (don't worry, everyone will end up here by book 5!) is Tyrion. His proposal to Shae--that she act like his lover with romance--is essentially him reenacting his trauma with Tysha. A whore pretended to be your wife, so now you're asking Shae to pretend to love you. It should be clear from the start that this isn't going to end anywhere good.

Alchemy

Dismemberment of a "good man" is usually a symbol in alchemy for what needs to happen in order for the process to go. The man's parts are scattered. and he is killed, but from that scattering, everything will be purified and then brought back together. Pretty clearly the Starks (and also Tyrion and Daenerys, whom Ned tried to save).

The Process

When Jon says his vows in the godswood, it's clear that the weirwood trees are designed after the three stages of the alchemical process: "The forest floor was carpeted with fallen leaves, bloodred on top, black rot beneath. The wide smooth trunks were bone pale, and nine faces stared inward." The black stage is associated with death and decay, the white with skeletons (rinsing away of impurities). Red is the final stage.

The city of King's Landing also emphasizes these three colors: the Sept on Visenya's hill is white and crystal; the Dragonpit on Rhaenys' hill is black, and the Red Keep on Aegon's is, of course, red.

When Sansa finally gives up on her delusions of Joffrey, she "g[ives] herself to the darkness," which could be read as giving herself over to the black stage, to being transformed.

Green is the color of the prima materia, or the substances that will be made into the philosopher's stone. Tyrion fights at the Greek Fork. Bran is referred to as a "only a green boy with the smell of summer still on you." When Daenerys sets out on the Dothraki see, she has the following conversation:

"It's so green," she said.

"Here and now," Ser Jorah agreed. "You ought to see it when it blooms, all dark red flowers from horizon to horizon, like a sea of blood.

To me, this seems to indicate where Daenerys's arc will go: red completion.

The Wind

Again as @argentvive has pointed out, Dany being born in the middle of a terrible storm is likely a reference to the line from the Emerald Tablet about the Philosopher's Stone being "carried by wind". But there are actually a lot of references to wind in AGOT, like this Bran conversation:

Bran listened. "It's only the wind," he said after a moment, uncertain. "The leaves are rustling."

"Who do you think sends the wind, if not the gods?"

Maybe Bran will be an alchemist for Daenerys? Because her association with wind is strong in this story. When Khal Drogo gives her the silver horse, she says "Tell Khal Drogo that he has given me the wind." Indeed, he's given Dany what she needs to start her journey, and he will give her even more. When she tries to convince her husband to go to Westeros, she tells him ships are "Wooden horses with a hundred legs, that fly across the sea on wings full of wind." Drogo never takes Dany to Westeros, but this is how sailing works. Dany will arrive in Westeros carried by wind.

Also of note: the sea in alchemy can be representative of the mercurial waters, the substance that the stone is dissolved in before being coagulated. The Dothraki fear the sea, but Dany needs it.

Markings

The philosopher's stone, and most romantic couples, in alchemical stories, are made of characters with opposite "markings." These alchemical opposites are:

Male: Sun, sulphur, fire and air, hot and dry, red, gold, heart. Female: Moon, mercury, earth and water, cool and moist, white, silver, mind.

Arya is heavily marked as water and earth. Syrio Forel tells her she must become a "water dancer," and that's precisely what she does.

Pretty much all of the Starks of import are white. Sansa wears white silk. Bran wears silver pins. Jon is also water (snow). However:

Bran often dreams of wings and flying, which might indicate a future air marking for him. Daenerys has a similar dream about wings and flying. Yes, crows vs dragons, whatever. I genuinely wonder if Bran might switch markings at some point like Dany does.

"A dragon was air and fire."<--actual quote.

Daenerys's Rebirth

So as mentioned above, Dany undergoes a switch in her markings. This is also something argentvive has covered extensively. Drogo rides a red horse; Dany silver. Drogo is the "sun and stars," while Dany is the "moon of [his] life." But, as the story tells us through this myth, a moon can become a sun:

Once there were two moons in the sky, but one wandered too close to the sun and cracked from the heat. A thousand thousand dragons poured forth, and drank the fire of the sun. That is why dragons breathe flame. One day the other moon will kiss the sun too, and then it will crack and the dragons will return.

Towards the end of the story, Dany becomes red, sulfur, the sun, fire, and air; she even becomes heart via literally eating a heart. During the Mirri Maz Duur scene, it's noted that Drogo is forced to soak in a tub, and:

Her handmaids filled the tub with tepid water that stank of sulfur,

After this, Drogo's red horse is killed, because he will no longer be red; Dany will. The entire tent becomes bathed in red, and just in case we weren't aware this was a rebirth scene, Daenerys literally gives birth.

The blood had gone everywhere. Even the sandsilk walls were spotted with red, and the rugs underfoot were black and wet.

But her birth is not finished. No, it's dissolved, but not coagulated. Hence, the fire.

She climbed the pyre herself to place the eggs around her sun-and-stars. The black beside his heart, under his arm. The green beside his head, his braid coiled around it. The cream-and-gold down between his legs.

The eggs are interestingly placed by the three principles of alchemy: heart, mind (head), and body (since body characters can be, um, lusty). When Dany is reborn through the fire, she is naked like a baby, both child and mother (she's noted to be lactating, which she will use to feed her dragons).

Ser Jorah Mormont found her amidst the ashes, surrounded by blackened logs and bits of glowing ember and the burnt bones of man and woman and stallion. She was naked, covered with soot, her clothes turned to ash, her beautiful hair all crisped away . . . yet she was unhurt.

The Show That Shall Not Be Named (Mixing references here I know)

In regards to that dreadful show citing Viserys' death as an example of Dany being "cold" to her enemies... whew. So not true. When Viserys is executed, Daenerys does exactly what Ned Stark says anyone who executes another should: look him in the eye. She's asked to turn away, and she refuses. In other words, there's zero framing that we should be disturbed by her reaction--in fact, we should see her as honorable for it. It's also noted that Dany's handmaidens note that Daenerys's grief is real: "You have not laughed since your brother the Khal Rhaggat was crowned by Drogo," said Irri. "It is good to see, Khaleesi."

Rather than Dany's reaction being a sign of her nonexistent coldness, I think it's more another example of the main theme mentioned above: Dany kept trying to protect her brother by not telling him the truth about how the khals viewed him ("Khal Rhaggat"), even though 1) if she had, he'd have hurt her, and 2) he really should have been able to open his eyes and see the truth, but he willingly blinded himself not unlike Robert Baratheon. She had good intentions. It just didn't mean that there weren't extremely negative consequences. That also doesn't mean she should have told him, either.

Insofar as Bran ending up as some kind of king, Tyrion's line in the show was something about how Bran had the best story. A joke in the show, but possibly something like this will be said in the books (and, y'know, make sense). Bran is told by Old Nan: "My stories? No, my little lord, not mine. The stories are, before me and after me, before you too." Stories matter.

Foreshadowing:

It's hard to know what is accurate foreshadowing. There are some elements of George's original plans in this book that have clearly been scrapped. It's a retcon, but also not, because the retconning is less about changing the endgame and more about changing the steps along the journey. For example, the line about Jaime looking "like a king" at Winterfell, Jaime being appointed Warden of the East, etc, all seem to line up with Martin's original plan to make Jaime a villain to take the throne.

That said, for stuff that does pay off:

Jon wondering about his mother is followed up within three short paragraphs with a switch to the line "They said it was Donal Noye who'd forged King Robert's warhammer, the one that crushed the life from Rhaegar Targaryen on the Trident." He's your daddy, Jon.

Varys is associated with the scent of lilacs from his very first scene. Lilacs are only else used to describe... the color of Dany and Viserys's eyes. He had Targaryen (or Blackfyre) connections from the start.

Jon and Dany have an interesting parallel that may or may not be alchemical: both are associated with bears. Jon is mentored by Jeor Mormont, and Dany inspires Jorah Mormont.

#agot #a game of thrones #agot meta #asoiaf meta #kinda #a song of ice and fire #daenerys targeryan #jon snow #tyrion lannister #sansa stark #cersei lannister #arya stark #bran stark #varys

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queenaryastark · 2 years

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Many Arya fan have written in great detail about her possible meeting and friendship with Dany, but do you have headcannons for what the meetings/friendship with other female (Meera, Brienne, one of the Mormont siblings, Shireen etc) would be like ? Even if you don't think they will actually meet.

Hi there! I really like the idea of Arya continuing to form positive relationships with other girls and women. There's probably so much content about Arya/Dany because they're the two female leads of the series and will likely have to work together on some level during the Battle for the Dawn. But yes, there are lots of other women Arya can befirend:

Arya/Meera: If they meet, they'll be besties. Arya and Meera have a lot in common as both of them served as leaders and protectors of their traveling groups. Seeing a confident lady who doesn't change herself to fit into the patriarchal ideal of femininity and whose feminine expression is closer to Arya's own will help Arya see that there is nothing wrong with who she is. If they meet, Meera will definitely be a great role model and cool big sister type for Arya. And it goes without saying that she’ll adore Meera for how well she has protected Bran all this time.

Arya/Brienne: Their dynamic would be very similar to Arya/Meera with another lady being an example of a different type of lady from the one Arya grew up being pressured to be. Though Brienne would have the added layer of being a knight. While Arya doesn't want to be a knight, she idealizes them like her siblings do: "Hot Pie was being silly; it wouldn't be ghosts at Harrenhal, it would be knights. Arya could reveal herself to Lady Whent, and the knights would escort her home and keep her safe. That was what knights did; they kept you safe, especially women. -- Arya IV, ACOK. So while Arya has seen several knights who have been monsters, Brienne would be the type of knight that fits the ideal Arya was raised to believe in and just might help her get home. I always found it interesting that Brienne is on Arya’s trail and doesn’t fully realize it. I've also thought of an AU where Brienne tries to help Arya get home after AGOT instead of her traveling with the NW. Brienne/Arya would basically be a female Dunk & Egg, which would be fun.

Arya/Arianne: The Short Queens. Throughout her chapters, Arya has befriended and admired all types of women. If they were to meet, she would easily admire Arianne despite how different they are. As a woman who seeks to wield power in her own right and takes assertive action through her intelligence, she is absolutely someone Arya would like and respect. She also happens to be the descendant of one of Arya’s heroines, Nymeria of Ny Sar. I could see an AU where Arya stays in KL and escapes with the Dornish party at the end of ASOS, bringing her to Sunspear where she can bond with Arianne and learn a great deal from her. As it stands now, both have similarities in how they have to out think their opponents given their lack of physical strength and use their ability to make friends to achieve their goals.

Arya/Sand Snakes: Even more descendants of Arya’s favorite heroine, she would absolutely love the Sand Snakes. Each of them is a different example of womanhood, with their own strengths, weaknesses, and different personalities. Arya is currently learning poisons and knows how to put on a performance like Tyene, keeps hidden weapons like Lady Nym, is a horse girl like Elia, disguises herself as a boy to get around gendered restrictions and is intelligent like Sarella, and wishes for justice like Obara. There’s definitely something in each of the ones we know about that Arya would connect with.

Arya/Missandei: These two kids have gone through so much tragedy and continue to persevere. Missandei is one of the most intelligent character in the series, knowing several languages and being able to recite customs and laws from various cultures. She’s also able to apply that knowledge and a guileless persona in government meetings and in war strategies. As another kid dealing with adult situations, I don’t see how Arya can do anything but admire her. I hope they meet and bond in the coming books. If Dany stops by Braavos on her way to the Wall, Arya can join them and befriend Missandei.

Arya/Mormont Women: Arya was pressured to conform to patriarchal standards by misogynistic women and girls who uphold the patriarchy, which resulted in her developing a negative self-image. Had she been fostered on Bear Island with the Mormont ladies, she would have been able to be who she is and develop a healthier self-image. We see how the Mormont women handle themselves confident in who they are as women and capable of wielding administrative, political, and military power. They could be great role models and friends for Arya in the coming books. The women who survive are actively involved in the Norther political plots, which Arya is at the center of -- though she doesn’t know it yet. I can see them supporting her and being a great influence on how she gains confidence in her own femininity.

Basically, Arya developing positive female relationships is a must. I already appreciate that GRRM has given her girlfriends in Braavos, but it definitely needs to continue beyond her training montage in that city.

#arya stark #meera reed #brienne of tarth #arianne martell #missandei of naath #house martell #house mormont

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goodqueenaly · 1 year

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We see in the Dunk and Egg books what Egg's relationships with his older brothers was like, but what do you think his relationships with Daella and Rhae were like given what (very) little we know about them?

Virtually impossible to say, given the almost total lack of information we have on them, much less Egg's relationship with them. We know that in their childhood, Rhae tried to give Egg a love potion so that he would marry her instead of their sister Daella, but we get no sense from Egg on how this incident made him feel about either of his sisters (only Dunk's reflection on his, Egg's, casual approach to Targaryen incest and Egg's own youthful insistence on joining the Kingsguard). I think it's possible if not probable that Egg was educated alongside his sisters: we don’t see much in terms of Westerosi children's education in the books, but there is direct precedent both for mixed-gender classes, so to speak (when Shireen is taught alongside Edric Storm and Devan Seaworth on Dragonstone), as well as what I would consider indirect precedent (Sansa's ability to compare her reading and writing skills to those of her brothers, for example, suggests to me that all of them were taught these skills together, to give her a more immediate means of comparison). However, given both his official, and to some extent gender-dependent, roles (as a page for two years to the royal court in King's Landing and a would-be squire to his brother Daeron), it's also possible that Egg did not spend as much time with either or both of his sisters growing up. None of the above precludes Egg having a relationship with Rhae and/or Daella while young and/or in their adulthood, of course; these are simply points to consider.

It is worth pointing out the possibility (which I like to consider true) that Egg was from a young age betrothed to his sister Daella. If that was the case, then I might hope that in future Tales of Dunk and Egg our young co-protagonist will discuss his relationship with his sister and sometime fiancee. Indeed, given the strong possibility, I think, that a future entry in the Tales will describe the romance of Dunk and Daella, we could just as easily (and not mutually exclusively) hear from Daella about her relationship with Egg. (Where that leaves Rhae is unclear, although as I've noted so little can be speculated about Rhae's marital, much less personal, future.)

Again, however, this all remains to be seen. I certainly hope that GRRM will make Rhae and Daella interesting, full-fledged characters with unique and developed relationships with each other and their other family members (not to mention those outside their family), but I also can't pretend that I've not been disappointed in depictions of other Targaryen princesses (*cough* Fire and Blood *cough*)

#asoiaf meta #rhae targaryen #daella daughter of maekar #aegon v targaryen

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selfproclaimedunicorn · 8 months

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THIS.

This is exactly why I stan Rhea Royce. I love her.

(Also, Daemon pushing away Yorick when he tried to help him up was such peak cunt behavior. I wish we’d know more about what exactly went down between them when Daemon presented him with that “birthday present” aka paid sexual assault. Love the hostility between them this chapter. I am a bit worried though because with Yorick betrothed to Shireen both of the twins are now pretty much useless to him and their usefulness was the only reason he paid his family with Rhea any mind at all)

In a better world, Criston would have given Rhea Daemon's head. Alas, she's still stuck with her shitty husband since Westeros doesn't believe in divorce. 😔

Daemon is, first & foremost, a cunty man-baby who's acting the same now (29) as he did in chapter 2 (23). He will not change, that is a promise no one wanted him to make but Baelon didn't raise a quitter so he can't go back now (Baelon probably didn't raise him much anyway given How He Got after Alyssa died, but that's only kind of here or there).

Maybe if I can formulate enough concrete thoughts around the situation besides "Daemon wanted to make sure his son who hangs out exclusively with girls (& Laenor) but isn't being a disrespectful horndog about it actually got interested in women & Yorick was (rightfully) horrified enough to willingly pull the 'projection card'" I may write a little Chapter 8.5 drabble thing about the inciting incident for Daemon's 4 month exile & Yorick getting to go back to Runestone for the duration. That really depends on me being able to write something brief though, lol. I mean you're reading the fic, you're aware I am bad at being concise.

And yeah. This is definitely the beginning of the end for things. Daemon is gonna try to ring out the last few drops of "project our dad onto my son" he can & try to maintain some level of "keep my daughter on my side bc she rides Vermithor (this is her only use)," but it doesn't go well for any of them. I'm not sure if everything Daemon does surrounding his kids in the coming chapters that fully poisons the relationships is necessarily self-destruction since he can't get what he wants anymore, but Daemon is definitely self-destructive & probably revels in how south it goes for a while. If he could just appreciate things for maybe 5 minutes he'd realize he has it pretty good: powerful wife, no responsibility, son set to marry the daughter of an even more powerful Lord...but everything he said about Otto Hightower was very Pot Meet Kettle, so he is incapable of being pleased with what he has.

#asks #fic: sins of the father #if given enough time or specific prompting i could probably write a whole fucking essay on sotf!daemon like i did for rhea #i can put the thought in for him its just writing his scenes that gives me psychic damage #there's SO much wrong with that man #and YEAH literally he's just upset that he has a boydaughter who hangs out with the girls & the gays #my brother in the seven if you'd pay attention to your girlson you'd realize she's you in a dress & with morals #anyway au where criston kills daemon in the heir's tourney & then rhea is so impressed that he becomes her trophy second husband #her 3 kids stop taking psychic damage & aemon never gets traumatized #he still becomes huge though #sotf commentary

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