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#i just write scenes and never give them a proper beggining or ending
mc-critical · 3 years
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Going off of your previous ask, I feel like a lot of what you said of Turhan’s character could be attributed to the character’s writing more so than the character herself? Like you had mentioned, Turhan was an interesting historical figure, and I think that’s the reason why her character’s portrayal and reception has been a point of interest for me. I feel that a part of what contributed to the fandom’s general distaste for Turhan was the time crunch. From the time-jump where Murad died to when Ibrahim took the throne, everything felt pretty rushed writing-wise. We never really had a proper introduction to any of the new characters or the new atmosphere, power dynamics etc. I think the writers may have been in a hurry to end the show and utilized Turhan to act fast and aggressively in her purpose of dethroning Ibrahim and putting her son on the throne in place of him and disposing of Kösem. No real character development, no story of her orgins, no chance to grow with Turhan like we did Hürrem or Kösem. From the jump we’re introduced to someone who is cold and distant and involved in political conspiracy, with no real chance to understand her intentions or how personal they are to her. What’s your take on that?
You're totally right. It's the mix of overall design, character qualities and writing that shapes the general perception of a character, but the writing seemed disturbingly prevailing for Turhan. It causes nearly all of the problems with her character and that's why I focused precisely on it. I feel that her writing always underlined her viciousness and defined her traits to the point these two aspects of her characterization couldn't be judged separately anymore. It's her writing that makes her so outrightly insufferable in the first place and only makes all her unsympathetic traits stick all the more. It's what primarily hurts everything there is about Turhan. Perhaps should've clarified that better last time.
The only things I come back to when it comes to her portrayal are only the themes surrounding her when contrasted with all of the SOW in the show and especially Hürrem, to be honest, as I elaborated in the other ask, but the reception her character got is definetly a high point of interest for me, too. It was to be expected for her to get a strong reaction, regardless of whatever the writers would do with her. She's such an important figure everyone was intrigued about and knowing the ways the franchise handles its characters overall and the level of the character writing of season 2 of MCK (at some points it was indeed less than stellar, but we have a bunch of other times where it was absolutely phenomenal - Kösem, Murat and Gülbahar, especially.), everyone was enthusiastic to find out what exactly would happen to her and what would her narrative role be. (that particular aspect was fairly predictable to guess honestly, with the narrative roles the other members of the SOW that weren't protagonists were given, but still.) The historical figure of Turhan Hatice Sultan only added salt to the wound, knowing what they could've chosen to work with. It influenced the general opinion for sure and if we begin comparing history and show, we could make the assumption that Turhan got probably the most disappointing outcome for many.
Oh yes, the time crunch is probably the biggest factor as to why MCK Turhan got the flack she did. And along with it all there was this big rumor that TIMS had expected a third season -if they got it, I just know all this would've been handled way better for sure. I don't think the beggining plan was for season 2 to cover Ibrahim's reign, given the subtitle that shows in the end of the intro and its primary conflict, so I suppose making the season that had to be about Murat the end of Kösem must've been a sudden unfortunate surprise for TIMS, showing that even the huge international sales wouldn't save MCK anymore. They really had so many episodes left and decided to cram in as much stuff as possible in them to try giving the audience at least a modicum of a satisfying conclusion, which, as you said, made everything feel so rushed as a result and Turhan is perhaps the biggest offender of said rushing. I've seen quite a few people blame Farya for this, too, claiming that she, "Mrs. her Fictional Highness (тм)", only ate up screentime that should've belonged to Turhan and Ibrahim's reign as a whole. But once again, I don't think S02 was planned to be about Ibrahim's reign at first and there's a definite sign that there was a massive change of plans behind the scenes, that's why Turhan got it bad, and it showed.
Perhaps if it didn't end up like that, her characterization would be different or at least a bit more detailed and nuanced and there wouldn't be so much grudge and ire. Even if they kept her as unsympathetic as she ended up being in concept, she would've probably been written better without these time constraints and I, for one, always respect a well-written character, no matter how vicious they might be.
It is possible they planned very roughly for her to be a ready product of her environment despite of everything, because it is just, again, so perfectly aligned with the themes of the show!SOW, but if they got enough time, they would've given her the respect and care this persona deserved, I don't doubt that for a second. And maybe that's why her reception is so negative in general, the one-dimensional, very close to boring even, character we got because of time constraints and the writing thereof, that truly caught the whole fandom by surprise. I actually have encountered people who stan her in places like Instagram, but I see that these people mainly stan the SOW as a whole for how much they've accomplished and how powerful they all are. She is one of the few characters in the franchise, I feel, that doesn't possess any redeeming qualities, the whole deal with her is very unfortunate and sad and I guess it would take some more time for the fandom to get over it completely.
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You may try. But you cannot the truth that is your name, Ben.
So, first of all, it is my first tumblr post like ever. I’m pretty new in this, but I really enjoy lots of sites here ‘a lot’ and from a long time and I want to add my two cents here.
I ship couple of couples from movie/TV. I’m totally #philinda and #reylo.
I became a big Reylo fan after TFA. I agree with probably 99,99% Reylo meta (I probably don’t know it all) – don’t be afraid, I feel it too ;-)
I love the way how Ben and Rey are portrayed, even visually – opposites (colours) but also similarities (look at the layers of theirs sleeves), ‘same’ stories, different ways of resolving their problems... I was heartbroken ‘cause their separate ways at the end of TLJ and even scared that Disney gave (and will give) us kind of ‘Labirynth’ ending instead of our instant ‘Beauty and the Beast’, but now I hope that it’ll be for their benefit (they are so young and reckless, both of them, even ‘Snow White’ didn’t help for now). I must say that I have had very bad feelings about this when I saw Rey in that claustrophobic coffin just from my beloved CS Lewis imaginary. Offtopic: In CSL’s ‘Perelandra’ in coffin like this travelled to the Venus (planet named after goddess of love;-)) Ransom – kind of helper to save Venus’ first pair of ‘human’ citizens (Adam and Eve of this place) who were tempted by evil (Satan, in our Reylo case - Snoke, but they defeat evil just like Lewis’ heroes). So our beloved couple should now to figured it out alone and find a way to be what they should be and be themselves, to be together. You know that wisdom that ‘you can’t have healthy relationship with another person if you are ‘sick’’ – and they are so broken...
I can write a lot, like A LOT of them, and instead of that it I want to say that in TLJ not everything was for me ‘nice cinema working’, but in the end I like it as a whole. I have faith in JJ – I saw all his works, and I’m considering him as a director who make films and TV series about friendship, family, love and redemption. I was confused about TFA – I didn’t see most of these things in it, but then – enlighten – I know now that JJ did want to tell us story about loneliness (everyone are alone in TFA – it was horrible), now Rian’s story told us that’s tragedy that people didn’t speak with each other, but when they start... So JJ I guess will show us his usual film themes in our ‘Black Diamond’ (I saw some of ‘Fringe’ resolutions in TFA, so I’ll be waitin’ for another ‘Beauty and the Beast’ kind of form these in next film). Our beloved couple is in good hands. I can speak about Star Wars all day long... I’m not sure that anyone notice it (probably yes) – but I don’t see any meta about it, so I want to share it with you and ask you what do you think about these.
I want to say few words about name Ben. I’m studyin’ linguistic and I know how important names are/were in culture, why people give that specific name to their children – as a good wish for future, as a prophecy.
Name Ben in Hebrew means ‘son of the south’ or ‘son of the right hand’ – sounds very nice. Benjamin in the Old Testament was the twelfth and youngest son of Jacob – Israel, father of the Chosen Nation (sounds familiar?) – Jews. Interesting is fact, that he was originally named differently – ‘son of my sorrow’ by his mother Rachel, who died shortly after childbirth. His father changed this name later for what we know now. So - inspiring story about changing names, seeing person differently by different people (sorrow, right), making troubles (not his fault exactly) from his very childhood.
But we know that tradition wasn’t common ‘at galaxy far, far away...’ (but is common to us, viewers, 'cause we know other traditions and myths, tales).
It was difficult to accept for me that Kylo Ren is Solo Ben, but then I saw that he only change couple of letters so Ben is still there ;-) and one of it is ‘R’ (Rey ;-) we know they must know each other before). Pay also attention to fact, that that speaking Kylo Ren’s birth name is forbidden in First Order!
But there is also another thing... So Ben was born at the day of end of war, when Rebellion defeat Empire in great battle of Jakku (interesting, don’t you think?). He has got name after Obi-Wan Kenobi, Jedi without whom his parents will never met, fall in love, defeat Empire, finally had him... Who, after Jedi purge exiled himself, had amazing powers, who defeat Anakin but had compassion for him and to didn't kill him. After Master who always know how and what to do, Knight in the shiny armour, devoted to Jedi Order but also to his friends and close his eyes for some of their decisions (he must know about Anakin and Padme, please), but he didn’t say a word of disapproval. So our sweet little boy had lots of expectations on his shoulders, not only fame of ‘freedom/victory child’, first baby born in the free galaxy but also parents, uncle, then grandpa and grandma (both: Organas and Skywalkers) and Obi-Wan, who change his name because his looses.  And then the meaning of this name: 'Obi-Wan Kenobi you’re my only hope' (I wasn’t only reminding of our beloved Princess or funny/memorable moment for Luke in TLJ) – for me this holo scene was also about Ben. Rey told us that! People around Ben want him to be theirs hope, ‘cause – as his name said - he was theirs hope form the very beggining (as children in general are, but also) theirs hope for peace, for happy family life, for end of all wars, for start a new Jedi (irony of the Force - Order).
And the irony/tragedy of these situation was that evil was there all the time to crush these hope, to change it to despair, to Kylo Ren. ‘Cause Ben means hope. Ben is HOPE. And I have hope that he still is. Force didn’t change mind ;-) Force wants balance. Anakin failed, Luke failed, but he saw enough power for accomplish it in Ben, but Ben (see how he strongly believe in Force) in way to balance dark and light tried to kill the light embracing dark – bad way. But we saw him ‘grey’ even in TFA (for example he didn’t kill Finn when he disobey him in that village). So he must accept that evil is inside everyone, and remind himself how good is to be on the right side of life (as in Snoke’s trone room). He can’t accomplish it alone, so Force ‘make a helper suitable for him’ (oh, Bible!) born at Jakku – the planet entwined with his birthday! There is darkness in her, but thanks for his actions, their connection (I don’t believe that its Snoke’s work) – he was her teacher, he really helped her to mature. Sad part of it is that she cannot help him the same way, but remember he was darksider many years and needs more time to heal, to see his mistakes to find his way, to fulfil the prophecy of his name and birthday in proper way! Ending of the TLJ was heartbroken ‘cause the lack of... hope. They lost hope, (‘cause) they lost Ben, lost faith in him, even his mother, even Rey. Everything was dark, instead of grey. But I believe he will figured it out, he is a smart boy, maybe with assistance of Force ghosts? We will see. But I believe that after ‘The IX’ we won’t be disappointed. He must believe in himself, believe his loved ones, he must see his heritage in proper way not the way that Snoke Has told him is the proper way (I believe that he started  see Snoke's lies), just like his father, who (irony of the Force!) didn’t believe in Force (an had the most powerful Force user as a son) before Ben turn away from the light, and then the same father tell everyone ‘all of it is true’. Firstly, it was confusing to me (back at December 2015) that we don’t have any Skywalker – but we have. We have Ben, and maybe his grandfather was suppose to be designed from Force (see the similarities, their personality) but he doesn’t fulfil this prophecy, so Force tried with Luke and Leia – but because their separate ways and paths of life didn’t succeed also. So – third time lucky – Force tried third time. Or maybe he form the beginning were destined to be ‘the chosen one’ and every event in SW lead us for this very moment when he will become Him (and all the events: Anakin turns to Vader, born of Leia, rise and fall of Empire, Han’s love for Leia was for the chosen one birth. ‘And who knows but that you have come to your [royal] position for such a time as this?’ To become the greatest Jedi, new Jedi ever. The chosen one. Connected two sides of force in a good way, for benefit of everyone? Not without ‘little help form his friend(s)’ but it’s still Skywalker story (this is they poetic;-)). He want to accomplish it ‘solo’, but we know that it isn't a way.
Ben is ideal Force user, extremely sensitive in the Force, have great power, amazing emotionality – perfect to use the Force, to connect to it, but –unfortunately - the same reasons caused his downfall. So Force learn and want a balance and that tried with two human beings to do it (It give us Luke and Leia - man and woman, knight and politic, servant and ruler - but it doesn’t work). So here’s Rey – to show him ‘you can do it differently, it works better this way, feelings aren’t bad, try combine it with Force,with power’. Power+love. Power of love.
I believed that Rey will call him his real name before I saw TLJ and she did (remember all the stories about real name of long lost Kings and Princess..., ‘bout name changes and so on). She said it because his real name, true name and identity is Ben. He can’t deny it, even if he will try (and he tried during two films, and he can’t! accomplish it, 'cause you can't kill the past, you must accepted it and just live). Without him there is no hope. His birth ends war, his re-birth will end another, end all star wars for good. He will end it, he did it once. I don’t know how, negotiations, from inside... history of my country tells me that is possible. Have hope, my friends.
That's ALL (and much more I guess) is in his name.
PS So that’s couple of my thoughts. Sending hugs love for all Reylo community. Sorry for my poor English, I’m not native, as you can - definitely and unfortunately - see.
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kashuan · 7 years
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In which I finally write a long ass post about all my grievances with the never ending shenanigans I see in the Iliad tag because I can’t take it anymore and needed to get it out tbh
Things y’all really need to stop doing, in no particular order: • Treating Clytemnestra like a Bad Bitch Feminist Icon #goals because she killed a character you don’t like. Know what she also was? Pretty hypocritical. Half her motive for killing Agamemnon is the mistreatment of their daughter, but guess what, Clytemnestra then goes on to treat 2/3 of her remaining children pretty much like shit. I suppose you could consider Electra to be an unreliable narrator in terms of her relating how coldly she was treated at home, but the facts don’t lie in that Cly let her new hubby Aegisthus pass Electra off to be married to some peasant so that she and her children would die without any power and wouldn’t be able to take revenge. It’s pretty indisputable though that her treatment of her son Orestes was flat out terrible. As a child, Orestes has to go into exile, as it’s implied Aegisthus would have had him killed otherwise. Cly just Lets This Happen. When Orestes returns to murder both her and Aegisthus as instructed by Apollo, Clytemnestra entreats him with a set of pretty flimsy excuses. Here’s a part from The Libation Bearers:
CLYTAEMESTRA Have you no regard for a parent's curse, my son?
ORESTES You brought me to birth and yet you cast me out to misery.
CLYTAEMESTRA No, surely I did not cast you out in sending you to the house of an ally.
ORESTES I was sold in disgrace, though I was born of a free father. CLYTAEMESTRA Then where is the price I got for you? ORESTES I am ashamed to reproach you with that outright.
Furthermore, she attempts to manipulate Orestes by entreating him to spare her because she is his mother, the one who nursed him, yet we know that this wasn’t actually done by her, and since a young age she has been completely absent in his life otherwise. When Orestes finally does kill her, this girl cannot even let it go at that but essentially makes sure he’s haunted by demons for the rest of his life. Talk about #petty, not even Agamemnon took it that far. So this character who's set up as like Badass Mama Bear is actually….not. Post Iphigenia at Aulis Clytemnestra is actually pretty self-serving, but not in the sort of way that should be admired. I think Clytemnestra is a great flawed character. Please no more ‘my perfect queen deserved better’ posts. I’m beggin’ ya. Read more than a summary of like 1/4th of her history and then let’s talk. • So I’m gonna follow this up with my long stewing Agamemnon Apologist rant (you: yikes me: Buckle Up). I’d like to begin this by saying we can all definitely agree that this man is a garbageboy stinkman. No arguing that. I love a good ‘Agamemnon is an asshole’ joke as much as the next guy. HOWEVER, when, when will I be free from posts that act like this character is honestly so completely one dimensional, that jokes about it comprise literally 98% of the tag. Where are the actually interesting meta posts that consider things about him beyond JUST being a dumpster of a man. For example, we know he was at least a half-decent bro. In book 4 of the Iliad, Menelaus basically scrapes his knee and Agamemnon essentially calls a T.O. on the entire war because HIS BROTHER, OK!!! Like yeah, he also includes a hilariously selfish line in that part that Menelaus can’t bite it because then he will be disgraced when he goes home, but the point stands. Further evidence of these having a tight relationship can be found in the Iphigenia at Aulis play. After the two of them have had a savage as hell argument about whether or not to sacrifice Iphigenia, taking some serious pot shots at each other, they have this exchange
MENELAUS I’ve changed, and I’ve changed because I love you, brother. I’ve changed because of my love for my mother’s son.  It’s a natural thing for men with decent hearts to do the decent thing. AGAMEMNON I praise you, Menelaus for these unexpected words, proper words, words truly worthy of you.  Brothers fight because of lust and because of greed in their inheritance. I hate such relationships; they bring bitter pain to all.
 I think Agamemnon’s relationship with Menelaus is actually one of the more interesting ones among the cast because he is both in a way protective yet also very controlling of his brother. Here and Here are a couple of fantastic essays on their dynamic and the way it differs from source to source. While on the subject of the play Iphigenia at Aulis and my favorite problematic fav getting the short end of the stick from fandom, can I just say that the majority of retellings, posts, and so on about this particular event ARE TERRIBLE? I’m so tired of seeing it depicted as though Agamemnon just killed his daughter like some afterthought, possibly while twirling his mustache like a cartoon villain. There is so, SO much more nuance to that scene and it kills the man when I see how no one ever discusses it in favor of just saying lol Agamemnon’s a dick, so anyway. Iphigenia herself is actually one of the best sources we have for the fact Agamemnon probably had more than a grand total of zero good traits. The relationship between the two is obviously a very close one and on the whole we get the sense that, aside from the whole killing his daughter thing (ya) he was actually a good dad. Like an inverse Clytemnestra :,). The scene where Iphigenia first speaks with Agamemnon is particularly telling of what was probably their normal relationship. IPHIGENIA What’s wrong, daddy?  You say you’re happy to see me but your face looks worried! AGAMEMNON A king, darling, a General is always worried. IPHIGENIA Make your worries go away, daddy. From now on, think only of me. AGAMEMNON Yes, my darling. I shall think of nothing else but you from now on IPHIGENIA Well then, get rid of this ugly frown from the face that I love so much! AGAMEMNON There! Oh, what a joy it is to see you, Iphigeneia! IPHIGENIA But… but look at you, father! Full of joy and yet tears flow from your eyes…AGAMEMNON Yes, dear… because our separation will be a long one.
Is he still a completly awful man for having sacrificed her? Yes. Completely. But here’s a few factors that play into this decision that I never see anyone, ever, mention: -It is Agamemnon’s intention to send Iphigenia away, to save herself, at the last minute, but Menelaus intercepts the letter meant to warn her of her fate. -Charismatic Odysseus has a good deal of control over the soldiers at this point and was probably looking to further increase his popularity among them (a consistent theme-- see: when he’s ready to shank his bff Diomedes just to be the only one to bring home a trophy from Troy instead of both of them). One can imply that if Agamemnon didn’t go through it, he would have done it himself -- and Agamemnon knew that (he mentions as much). -Gods are terrifying, my dudes. Treating it as though he could have just said ‘naw’ to Artemis’ order for Iphigenia’s death and gone home expresses a pretty fundamental lack of understanding how the Greeks feared the gods and just what the stakes likely already were by that point. Artemis was already pissed that he killed one of her sacred deer so it wasn’t as though she was just like ‘you can either sacrifice your daughter or go home unscathed’. I’ve only seen one other retelling accurately capture what very likely would have happened if Agamemnon didn’t go through with it: Artemis likely would have retaliated at the disrespect against the men and probably his family. Furthermore, the soldiers had already been stranded at Aulis for months on end-- a mutiny was exceedingly likely if they found out what was going on, one in which where they probably would have harmed not only him but also Clytemnestra and baby Orestes who came with Iphigenia. These two facts are more conjecture, but it’s a pretty plausible estimate and I’ve seen several scholarly essays arrive at the same conclusion.  If you’d actually like to see a depiction of Agamemnon that is both incredibly sympathetic yet does not shy away either from showing how terrible what he did was, please watch the 1977 Iphigenia movie. One of my favorite movies in general. Honestly I feel I could make a giant essay out of My Feelings on this particular subject alone so I’ll wrap it now because I have a lot of other stuff I want to get to, though I’ll include one final pet peeve: the amount of people who call Agamemnon trash because he was Sexist. You know who else was a Meninist? Every single goddamn man in ancient Greece. Okay, I’ll give a pass to characters like Patroclus and Hector when it comes to the women front because all we see is them being pretty decent. But like. Otherwise??? Sure, just because everyone is that way doesn’t make it any less shitty-- I’m not arguing that. But it’s also like reading a novel focused on an entire group of mobsters, but calling out only one of them as Problematic for being a criminal. Like, my dudes...  TL;DR: Agamemnon is a dick jokes are funny and completely deserved but throw in a few posts here and there that actually suggest you might have read more than just Book 1 of the Iliad and nothing else. Character depth is your friend. • That said, for the love of god, stop writing Menelaus like he’s just Agamemnon 2.0. A lot of adaptions do this because they don’t seem to know what to do with his character (I’m lookin’ @ u most of all Troy though he suffers some form of this in almost all film adaptions...) Which is a shame because Menelaus as a character is a lot more (and better) than that. From what we do know, Menelaus was actually (relatively speaking) a pretty chill guy and one of the least problematic out of these assholes (y’know, minus that scene I mentioned above with Iphigenia, but hey...at least he admits he fucked up?). We know that Helen voluntarily chose him to be her husband. We know that Helen wanted to return home to him by the time the Iliad takes place. We know they got back together after the war and more or less lived happily ever after. So why do I keep seein’ all these posts about Helen hating him or about him being another warmonger like Agamemnon. Menelaus was a Decent Dude. Leave him alone :,| • Speaking of Helen, how many times am I going to read “feminist” retellings where she either is totally indifferent to or even wanted the war to happen, where she enjoys watching men die, where she ~reclaims~ her demigoddess power and is A Figure To Be Feared. What Helen is this??? Because in the Iliad, Helen is remorseful af about all the people she’s indirectly responsible for the deaths of. There are more ways to build up and strengthen female characters than to make them just like the men they despise. Just. Saying. I get that people want to free her from the damsel in distress role she’s essentially relegated to, me too, but that is NOT the way to do it. Girl can be strong willed but still have a great amount of empathy. As with essentially every other bullet point above, please just give these characters more than one dimension. • Also, how many times am I gonna have to read about The One Fellow Female (Helen or Clytemnestra usually) who believes Cassandra’s prophecies in order to emphasize like, girl power, or that the author feels sorry for Cass and want to project that onto some other character or something. Dude, she was cursed not to be believed. PERIOD. BY ANYONE. There was no clause in the curse for like “except someone who really thinks you’re swell”. It’s tragic because there are no exceptions. No one believes her. NO ONE. THE END. • Achilles was bi. Bi af (by modern standards, of course). See: Iphigenia, Deidamia, Briseis, Polyxena, Penthesilea… I totally get this movement of wanting to call Achilles gay because for so long he and Patroclus have gotten the ‘just guys bein’ dudes’ treatment from scholars. I think it’s absolutely fantastic that potential element of his character is more widely recognized and accepted now. However, I can’t help but get these really uncomfy biphobia feels when I read all the posts about how gay he is, as if liking women makes his relationship with Patroclus less legitimate. That was one thing about TSOA which also really disappointed me-- it had to pull that yaoi fanfic trope of ‘girls are so icky and gross’ in order to further sell how convinced you should be of the same sex relationship. It’s just, Bad And Not Good. Finally, I feel like y’all are so busy hating Agamemnon and shoving off every single bad character trait into existence onto him, that Achilles is always ultimately depicted as this #relatable teen who did nothing wrong except get a little too upset when his bf died. May I remind you of just a few things Achilles also did: -Indirectly got a lot of men killed by refusing to fight during his quarrel with Agamemnon -Had 12 innocent children killed when Patroclus died -Basically everything involving Troilus. From wikipedia: [Achilles] is struck by the beauty of both [Polyxena and Troilus] and is filled with lust. It is the fleeing Troilus whom swift-footed Achilles catches, dragging him by the hair from his horse. The young prince refuses to yield to Achilles' sexual attentions and somehow escapes, taking refuge in the nearby temple. But the warrior follows him in, and beheads him at the altar before help can arrive. The murderer then mutilates the boy's body. Some pottery shows Achilles, already having killed Troilus, using his victim's severed head as a weapon as Hector and his companions arrive too late to save him. The mourning of the Trojans at Troilus' death is great. -Just straight up fucking murders a guy for making fun of him after he just murdered someone else. "Achilles, who fell in love with the Amazon [Penthesilea] after her death, slew Thersites for jeering at him" I’m sure there’s more receipts like this. So like. Can we throw in a couple posts now and then among the Agamemnon ones about Achilles, who was Problematic for far more reasons than just sulking in his tent :,) ...Okay. I think that’s it. FOR NOW. I guess I’ll end this by saying half of this is just my own opinion and I recognize that people can interpret and retell these stories and characters however they want to. It’s when it becomes so consistent however that people treat it like it is The One True Canon when it’s actually not that my jimmies get a bit rustled. [/END RANT]
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