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#cis women and afab nb ppl
chrliekclly · 20 days
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if you ever want to talk about your thoughts on joyce .. Peeks over the corner of your blog. i love talking and hearing ppls thoughts on joyce sooo much even if they're different from my own!! and your analysis and stuff is always so well thought out
i hope u dont mind if i answer this publicly to take advantage of th request nd get my ideas out ther (also tyvm im happy u like my insane takes on these idiots, iv ben thinking abt them for almost 10 years)
i said a lot here so gnna 'read more' it
iv ben building trans charlie n my head fr, like i said, nearly 10 years. i used to view him as cis bcuz i always try to take as much frm th source material as i can wen i craft my HCs nd i had v personal (stupid) hangups insofar as him explicitly referring to his junk multiple times nd bottom surgery simply not being on my radar as a naive littl trans idiot deep in th sauce tht transmen oftn fall into w phallo being viewed so so poorly
evn still i leaned towards transmasc charlie nd always lovd moments tht let me imagine, for a moment, it being true, like his discomfort w taking off his shirt [hundred dollar baby, charlie kelly: king of the rats, the gang exploits the mortgage crisis, young charlie and mac deleted scenes, etc etc etc], or bonnie yelling abt ppl stealing her "charlie-girl" [the waitress is getting married] which i lovd to see as her accidentally misgendering him while drunk off her ass.
having grown out of my phallo issues (nd if ur reading this and u still view phallo super poorly, please do some research and grow too), ive in recent years fully subscribed to transmasc/nb charlie, and view his timeline something like this:
baby -> elementary: charlie refers to himself as a boy, doesnt "come out," simply has no idea he's afab. bonnie lets him dress however he wants and refers to him as asked. when charlie gets confused about his genitals, bonnie says his dick will grow in later lol, makes charlie wear a dress in public restrooms and tells him its just a game
middle: puberty hits and charlie gets confused and scared. bonnie puts him on blockers w.o explaining them ("my mom used to vaccinate me like every month" [the gang gets quarantined]) charlie goes on content and oblivious. STP acquired because hes "a late bloomer" and his dicks still not growing in?? weird. confides this in mac once, but he doesn't understand.
high: charlie finally registers that he's trans after forgetting theres a health class 1 day and not being able to skip it. throws him for a loop a bit but he becomes actively invested in his goals. he gets to start T and wants to have surgeries. "what guy hasnt done some extensive research on his own genitalia?" [mac is a serial killer]
college (aged): able to surgically transition (ty medicare) and continues on with life as we kno him now
joyce, imo, fits neatly into these views.
as a transmasc nb who came out young nd prefers to be seen as just A Guy by strangers, i grew up v vehemently against anything girly that might get me misgendered, but th more i began to 'pass,' th more @ home n my body i felt, th more and more comfortable i am w femininity, th more i wdnt mind putting on a dress, as long as th general public wd see me as "a man in women's clothes." n my mind, i prescribe something not exactly th same but v similar to charlie.
i see charlie "i dont really identify" kelly as afab and nb. i see joyce as a "character" he originally created to distance himself from the dysphoria of putting on a dress as a young trans boy, but that became part of him as the hard lines he drew in the sand as a child became blurry with age and self acceptance. charlie's comfort with himself allows joyce to evolve into a more solid persona, one he enjoys embodying and allowing to become a permanent facet of who he is. he's ok with being referred to as either. they're both him.
so maybe joyce comes out a bit more outside of the bathroom now.
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magicspeedwagon7 · 15 days
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what does 'transmasc' mean?
this resurgence of the 'border wars' (trans men v butch lesbians then, trans men v transmasc now) makes me wonder, "what does 'transmasc' even mean?"
the short answer is that transmasc is a term more inclusive that trans men since it includes:
some non-binary people
some gender non-conforming women who don't refer to themselves as trans or non-binary etc etc
but which nb ppl ? which gnc women?
so, is there a way to precise the definition without gender essentialism? no, there isn't.
assuming that transmasc people are more androgynous than trans men is exorsexist
assuming that trans men medically while transmasc don't is transmedicalist
assuming that transmasc means afab is intersexist
maybe we're trying to find an essence where there's none (Wittgenstein has entered the chat). let's look at the problem from another angle: why did we coin the word 'transmasc' to begin with? why did we invent the "inclusive version of 'trans man'"?
in her work, Julia Serano makes a great distinction between transphobia (i.e. repression of any 'gender deviance') and cissexism (i.e. deprecation of trans genders seen as none authentic compared to cis genders). thanks to this distinction, we realise that people who don't refer to themselves as trans can experience transphobia. in the same vein, people theorising about transandrophobia realised that, even if they put trans men in the heart of their thinking transandrophobia does not affect trans men exclusively.
that's why, i come to the conclusion than the word 'trans masc' is not supposed to describe a shared identity but is more of a political call to solidarity between marginalised people who share common struggles
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possibilistfanfiction · 11 months
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Genuine question, how did you figure out or realize the whole being butch thing? What does being butch mean to you?
idk if it was like… figure out? more so just putting a name to something i’ve always felt or known about myself. i came out as a lesbian, then i came out as nb, then i was like well i want gender affirming care so that must mean i am Trans™️, & it’s like… none of those words or kind of… vibes (lol sorry) quite fit? i don’t feel like a cis lesbian, & i actually kind of despise non-binary as a concept (don’t send asks abt this i won’t answer them lol, do ur own thing if u love it that’s cool); i think for me personally Transness is a little too serious & intense & limiting to how i feel. & im a white afab person in a smaller body, & honestly…….. we are often the wooooorst demographic of trans ppl lmao so i just didn’t even rly like some spaces i was in. i got the most important gender affirming care i wanted, i moved & i got married, i got to work remotely etc
& so just sitting with all of that it was like. ok well a lot of neoliberal queer spaces piss me the fuck off; i’m not cis, but i’m not TRANS in the way a lot of ppl (very validly) feel; i do Not like nb. i’d read stone butch blues before, i have a degree in critical theory where i worked a loooot w queer theory, obviously i’ve written abt queerness for ages lol. so then i was just like ah. butch. dyke. YAH! sweet. 100/10 feels amazing i love it
& i think for me i love those words most bc they’re rooted in really radical belief that i have. they carry an ethic with them that, at its best & most intersectional ofc, i want to act on, all the time. i want to show up for people & be protective & tough & strong but i also so deeply want to be nurturing & nourishing. i want to allow myself to be nourished & cared for. i think it feels rly wonderful to have a word for transgressive gender that sums it all up bc people lived it before me. they made that very specific & particular space to experience femininity in a way that doesn’t feel like a noose.
i think also butchness is so expansive! something that never sat right w me abt the way we talk abt transness in the west is that i don’t think there are ‘pre’ & ‘post’ transition selves. like… i’ve never been Not Me? like i came out of the womb a dyke. all i did my entire childhood is run around in the mountains, catalogue leaves, play w my dog, read nancy drew, & avidly watch + play any women’s soccer i could. i loved to fish & mountain bike, i grew up in the desert so gardening to me was a miracle. i never cared abt gender at all beyond like ‘well i guess i’m a girl & the women i admire just won a world cup, they’re badass’ & that was it. i liked boys clothes bc they were practical & felt better, but i just. didn’t think about it. ppl called me a tomboy which was fine, i liked scout in to kill a mockingbird so whatever. but i never felt “non-binary” & i certainly never felt like a boy.
& i am… still just like that lmao. i hated my boobs, point blank day 1 lol, but that doesn’t have to mean i’m trans, or that i’ve somehow changed in a way that requires separation from who i’ve been my whole life. i HATE the language of ‘dead/lived’ name; i hate the weird expectation that u should allow the state to have all of ur gender stuff on record (no fucking thank you, y’all can keep my legal name & i will be flying under the radar lol). so i think western transness rly just. irritates me. doesn’t fit. hasn’t ever fit.
so butchness is like. i am 8 year old jude, i’m just older now. if this makes sense ur butch lmao but. it’s this rly free space to play w masculinity in a way that doesn’t necessitate western transness, & also doesn’t necessitate a separation from maternalism, which i fundamentally believe in. i don’t even rly think of my own care as “gender affirming” & more just like… essence affirming. i didn’t want top surgery so my body could be read as male; i wanted it so i could look like me. i want my clothes to feel & fit in a Very particular way bc that’s how i like them. it’s abt practicality, efficiency, comfort.
& lastly to me butchness has a remarkable space for tenderness that masculinity on its own just cannot hold. like. it’s abt being protective & strong, sure, but it’s in service of others. always always always. so sometimes that looks like communicating calmly, sometimes that looks like infinite small acts of service for ur friends or ur partner. when i think of settling into myself it’s more about returning to who i knew i was when i was a kid, when i was the only person my dog liked & how it felt to sit on the swings when the sun was setting after the monsoon; it’s allowing myself to love like that — caring, & quiet, & full.
ultimately to me butchness is about devotion, more than anything in the world. devoted to safety, devoted to community. no one is devoted the way dykes are bc it’s how we survive. it’s how we have always survived — the steadfastness, the faith, the joy, even thru suffering, to not be boxed in. to help each other. to be funny & kind & thoughtful & not reject the absolute best parts of womanhood for the sake of a western box. to demand care. it’s so beautiful. devotion.
tldr it’s the best
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genderkoolaid · 2 years
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they really go mask of in the tags saying "theyfabs" are "White women white womening but under inclusive language" (which honestly feels a bit like projection) and claiming we're the ones making things harder for other trans people
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ohhhh my god you did not fucking create the word theyfabs. you did not. i am not going to sit here and be told that this word that has been used to insult nonbinary people for years, a word which I am very well acquainted with as a nonbinary person who repressed my own identity because of exorsexism, is something that was created out of pure intentions RECENTLY. i know the word gaslighting gets used a lot but I can't describe in any other word how it feels to see people just erasing the history of "theyfab" to make it seem less exorsexist.
(also even if yall DID make it, it would still be exorsexist and bioessentialist? the word transmisogynist is right there.)
and yeah "it's just white women white womening" so you admit it? you admit that you see nonbinary people you call "theyfabs" as women?
"being trans is already hard and yall arent making it any easier by setting your sights on us when cis ppl want us Dead" but it's perfectly justified for you to misgender nonbinary people and use a term made by transphobes and transmeds to mock us? THAT doesn't count as pointless lateral violence? jfc.
And exorsexism/nbphobia isn't afab-specific??? the reason i've seen most people call nbs "theyfabs" is because they put "afab" in their bio, which others claim is to signal that they are safer than amab nbs. which if that is someone's reason, that would also be exorsexist??
unsurprising that people who use transmed terms also have the transmed belief that exorsexism isn't a real, unique form of transphobia.
[obligatory Do Not Harass This Person note, also i do not know linked ops pronouns]
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ramenheim · 4 months
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About prev reblogs: I have never seen TME used to complain about & demarcate cis men's behaviours.
Despite the term ostensibly lumping together *almost any gender configuration that isn't binarily trans woman*, the only times it's used recently is to complain about (trans) ppl that get lumped in with cis women (as intersex ppl trans or otherwise are *never* factored into this dichotomy anyways), including cis women themselves.
I have never once seen it used to delineate trans women from cis men, even as it gets used to delineate cis women's experiences from trans women's experiences. I have only seen /haphazard/ acknowledgement of non-binary experiences included in TMA, but only really as an afterthought or when it's framed as the precursor to 'fully realizing trans womanhood'. I've only seen intersex folks brought up if they elect to use the terms TME/TMA for themselves, with bizarro interrogations into 'how' they were raised/had their genitals 'corrected' only once they individually disagreed with the terminology or had a confounding opinion in a public discussion.
It is regularly used to delineate trans men from trans women; but its users almost uniformly deride any attempt by trans men to coin a term to describe their own unique combinatory transphobia that isn't TME; again despite TME literally just supposing to mean 'transmisogyny-exempt'.... so why would it be used to discuss trans men's *unique* experiences with hatred directed at the fact that they either "are/aren't (real) men" by anyone who wants them to suffer?
It's been *changed* into hastily recycled AGAB terminology bc of wider recognition of the flaws with /that/ but without the driving flaws of that **tool for analysis** ever being fully addressed; and therefore has gotten subsumed into the 'new euphemism' for the Innie vs Outie false dichotomy as its usage became more widespread.
I think it still is a useful discussion tool ONLY when it's viewed *as a tool* and not some inherent marker of identity. It is DEFINITELY just bigotry when used as a NOUN that has negative behaviours ascribed to it, esp in the context of complaining about trans men** as a whole homogenized group, instead of highlighting individual behaviours/belief systems for the harm they contribute to against TMA trans/nb ppl.
Young queers really need to stop swallowing the tradcath radfem juice of "Women Pure + Good & Men Bad + Evil" [**that tumblr feminism has always had a problem with] and acting like you aren't being a transphobic shitheel by adding the word Trans in front of it-- & This is ESPECIALLY a problem when non-trans "Allies" do this, as it sets up trans women for failure whenever they make a mistake/can be reframed as 'being a cause-traitor' since women are punished more harshly for any percieved failure of Righteousness, AND allows them further to enact their unbridled transphobia onto trans men (& enbys/genderqweirdos) and pass it off as 'being an ally to trans women'..... despite them just being extremely transphobic (+ misogynistic + homphobic + intersexist) & then hiding behind """"TMAs"""" as a negative PR meatshield.
TL;DR if you are using TME to mean (nc)AFAB in vent posts, just have the guts to fucking use that as the word & see how it reads then.
(**since transmasc & transfem do not imply either a 'starting' or 'finalized' gender state; they are personal adjectives in and of themselves. Please do not warp them into new innie vs outie binary divides).
[**see related: the raw ass treatment of 'AMAB enbys' on here and in similar online/irl "feminist" environments. (Which was one of the driving factors behind the original TMA/TME coinage & is where I still find useful inter-trans discussions utilizing it as a term; importantly I don't think the term should stop being used altogether!!)]
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Hi, so I'm NB and attracted to multiple genders and in terms of relationships (even just smth casual) I'm someone who is strictly queer 4 queer.
I don't have it in me to be in any kind of romantic and/or sexual relationships with someone who is not LGBTQIA+ in some way which in my case (I'm afab) means anyone who is a cis straight man.
I can't fathom being with someone who can't relate to me and share with me a level of understanding of the queer experience whether in terms of gender or sexuality, mind you of course even people with the exact same label have completely different experiences and feelings regarding to what it means/is to them going about the world and navigating life as a queer person but as queer ppl we can relate and understand one another in ways a cis straight person will never be able to even if they wanted to bc they will never know what it's like to be in our shoes.
I have a friend who is bi and she's currently dating a cishet guy who very clearly seems to have some kind of double standard given that they have a kind of open relationship type thing which he is okay with *as long as anyone else she's with is a woman* "bc then he doesn't have to worry that way" (I'm paraphrasing but wtf that's THAT mean!?)
Through the way he speaks on it in general it sounds to me (pls tell me if it looks like I'm wrong and interpreting things the wrong way🙏), that he doesn't truly see her and respects her as the *bisexual woman she is* (unlike the guy she was with before who from what I could tell definitely did so it's not like every cishet guy is like that, obvs they're not).
Idk, I look at them, at the way that he so easily disregards the fact that she's bi and that she's just as attracted to women as she is to men and both are *equally as valid* and I can't fathom how she's capable of being with someone who doesn't seem to truly see her as she is and as someone who is queer in terms of both gender and sexuality the mere thought of someone I'm with specifically seeing me for example as a tomboy looking kind of *woman* and not a *person who is truly a mix of both male and female (mainly male)* kind of breaks my heart (even if it was just a casual thing).
yh idk I just look at her and him and I'm just extremely reminded of why I'm exclusively queer for queer and also t4t and why it is that, that is smth so important to me as a queer person, specifically as a bi nb person.
Am I exaggerating with this q4q view and maybe projecting that onto his behavior and he's not actually doing/saying anything wrong?? (To be honest, more than anything, what I want is for her not to get hurt down the line with him)
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terfs upset someone mentioned "ppl with uteruses" when the ppl overturning roe vs wade do not care about afab trans men/nb people (and cis women's reproductive rights as well)'s rights at all. they are not overturning it because of trans people or terminology and its not worth being angry at people using gender neutral terminology. be angry for the fucking anti choice legistivess and politicians
And the fact they’re still putting their energy into complaining about that of all things is exactly the problem 💀
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buildacatboy · 1 year
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are u by chance into afabs at all 👀 like transmen, cis women, nb ppl? or is ur preferred partner of choice like a gay male dude? asking 4 a friend
i had a big thing written for this but i think i will just answer by saying i dont really like to refer to people as afab or amab and i know it can make some people uncomfortable. i am bisexual (potentially aromantic? And my definition of bi includes nb people, sometimes the definitions are different between bis so I wanna clarify) so it really doesn't matter to me though ive only had experience so far dating with afabs? once a strange oblivious lesbian in my youth to an awkwardly floundering bisexual trans man. You know how it goes
flattered your friend would wanna know about me though! 😸 hope they shoot their shot at some point, i try not to bite unless i'm setting a mood 😽💞
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aatroxskitten · 1 year
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my favorite thing is when cis male feminists tell me that coercive femininity isn't a thing.
like no, dude, i'm afab and expected to be feminine in really subtle, coercive ways. this is my experience. if u wanna be a good feminist, shut the fuck up and let me talk about how heterofemininity is an expected default and is just as toxic and coercive as masculinity can be.
shit, dude, it's not just an afab experience. you ever see an amab nb person who isn't feminine reduced to "just a cis man"? you ever see how trans women who aren't stereotypically feminine have a harder time getting estrogen? the way ppl talk abt butch trans women is absolutely disgusting, and it shows that femininity is absolutely an expected cultural norm.
and if u wanna really get into the nitty gritty, women who perform expected femininity earn more in their jobs, are more likely to be hired, and are perceived as more intelligent and trustworthy. isn't that your baseline for why men are privileged?
hm, it's almost like being GNC doesn't really come with benefits and acquiring male privilege is more than just putting pants and a button-down on!
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theyenvymarleyyy · 2 years
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As a afab nb Person my private parts Always make me feel uncomfortable especially If it's specifically Abt my period
So I was very afraid and nervous Abt going to the Lady doctor the First time
It Made me feel dysphoric and Just the thought gave me such an ew Feeling that I felt terrible
I have to say before I continue: fear bc of the Lady doctor is so valid bc the whole Idea of some random Lady seeing you Like that is weird and uncomfortable especially as a trans person
So
When I eventually got there for my First appointment I was still in a very very terrible mood
BUT
It was all good in the end
The doctor gave me privacy to Put Off my pants and let me Go onto the weird Chair by myself
The Perspective from that Chair is also very nice bc you don't See Shit that actually happens
She was nice and asked me questions kinda explained stuff to me of what she's going to do but it was never uncomfortable in any way
My nervous Feelings rlly died down after Like two Minutes in bc it somehow didn't feel weird in the end
What I Want to say is:
Go to the doctor for your private parts pls
I See so Many ppl being afraid of that all the time even cis women and I rlly understand their Feelings but it's rlly Important that you Go there bc of your health
If your First experience sucks? Change Ur doctor bc There's No Other way to Go around it
Find a doctor that you feel comfortable with bc you can actually be comfortable even in such a Situation I promise
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A few things about me!!
I'm bi
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I'm non binary
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[but I *personally*don't care how you address me: guy,girl,pal (queen,king,majesty lmao)whatever...about pronouns I don't care either, I'm really chill about it *in my case*I don't mean this to hurt trans/nb people who really do care about them, I appreciate,love and support y'all♡!!)
I yearn for equality and justice :)
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Racial and gender equality, I'm a intersectional feminist :)
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[so you'll see me maybe referring to women (cis and trans) mainly when I talk about it, I tend to forget to include about Afab ppl (binary or not)but it really also belongs to it, I'm just so used to the gender binary 💀(ironic ik 😭)at least not so much about heteronormativity can with me 😬 with the way I've been taught/grew up]
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I'm Spanish and American/ USA citizen.
I'm better at Spanish but since English gets more across to more people I use it despite some slips 😅
I'm currently living in Spain, I've spent most of my life in here but visit/have been some time to there, so that's why I feel closer to Spain in culture.
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I've been raised catholic but liberally so my parents have no problem with my brother being agnostic or me being currently atheist. :D
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I'm not only liberal, I'm leftist.
Both socially and economically :)
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And finally random fact about me : I love goofy ass memes xddd
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roseprlnce · 2 years
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Random thought but every person who reblogged that post saying transmascs have no good music should go listen to Rae Spoon
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mangender5000 · 3 years
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Hmmm becoming increasingly obvious ppl r seeing being nonbinary as "trans-man lite" and i do not like it
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anyway...so like...how do i know if i’m nonbinary? like...how did any of y’all figure that out?
(sorry about the novel in the tags)
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spoonass69 · 3 years
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me trying to explain the “queerest website” thing tumblr did yesterday to my siblings, who are both very gay and very trans and was trying to figure out with them if it was weird to say “the q slur” or if straight people are allowed to say queer and i just. i forgot i like all genders. and my genders all weird.
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Yk theres been a lot of good posts critizing how trans men are seen as barely oppressed and people think its ok to mock and harass them and how alienating and harmful that is but when it comes to afab nonbinary people i rarely see anyone bring that up and its really fucking frustrating
Nonbinary people know that when you arent trying to paint us as privileged predators and acceptable targets you just think of us as Women 2.0 and it shows by how you treat all nonbinary people as less good women, and for afab nb ppl specifically that means you just see them as a lesser class of cis women trying to id out of their privilege
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