#but turned into lokius meta lol

[inevitably-johnlocked]

Loki S2 Pre-E6 Thoughts

So I know that this is totally random content to give to y'all this morning, but I wanted to post up my thoughts about the series before its final episode airs tomorrow. I have, in the past, talked about my thoughts on S1 and how I really did like it until the last 5 minutes of Episode 6 and how out-of-nowhere-forced the Sylvie/Loki kiss felt (I was physically cringing about it).

Given how S1 ended, I was a bit wary about S2, but decided to watch it anyway, and holy hell I think Season Two is KNOCKING it out of the park. I'm loving it as much as I loved Moon Knight, and it's right up there now in my top 5. The episodes are SO cinematically beautiful, well written and flow nicely, the characters are all so charming, and the Mobius/Loki relationship is being built up so much that it COULD lead to more or canonization in the final episode. During the past 5 weeks, I've been lurking on the meta spaces for Loki on Twitter and Tumblr, and wow the nostalgia I feel for it, it SO reminds me of the hey-day of my Johnlock meta-ing before S4.

I think my only gripe right now with this season is that they wasted Sophia DiMartino... her character Sylvie feels like such a... filler character (like they just put her in there because she was in the first season and they didn't know what to do with her this season)? But I think ALSO she's meant to be a counter-mirror to Loki, to show that he ISN'T like her anymore, that he grew and changed for the better with the positive influences in his life, and unlike her he doesn't WANT to be alone and such. And they're REALLY making her so unlikeable this season for me... I'm glad that it's looking like they're pretty much not going the Sylvie/Loki route (and I honestly don't see how people who ship it think it will canonically turn around at this point), but the showrunners are having her have every interaction between her and Loki rather hostile, demoralizing, or toxic. And rather that, they're countering it by showing a more positive alternative for Loki with Mobius as his potential romantic partner. Which is fantastic because I've shipped Lokius since Mobius came on the screen in S1, LOL. I just think they could have done that in S2 without making Sylvie an unlikeable character (like have her be a cheerleader for them instead?) I dunno. It's a shame because I did like her in S1. Don't like her at all in S2. She's so MEAN to EVERYONE. To Mobius especially, like CHILL girl, let a man stress-eat, JEEZ.

And here's the rant I actually wanted to write this post about because I didn't want to clutter up other people's threads with it: So, every week, I usually watch breakdowns and review videos so I can understand the characters and their comic counter parts a bit better, and usually the breakdowns are really good because they show the nods to comic-canon things and such. But OMG these past two weeks, I had to stop watching the reviews because LITERALLY all of them ship Sylvie/Loki and are trying SO hard to prove that it's canon when the past few weeks it's only been more and more likely that it's not happening.

NONE of Big Name Reviewers (NRS and SC specifically, if ya know you know) acknowledged AT ALL the RIDICULOUS amount of romantic tropes and dopey staring that Episodes 4 and 5 had (Loki watches Mobius through a window the first time he finds him, and the second time before going to talk to Mobius again Loki LITERALLY groomed himself and then stutters like a lovesick teenager. It was very rom-com; and they're skirting around the fact that all the empty places in the TVA that Loki kept slipping to were ALL places that Loki tshared time with Mobius in... I CAN GO ON FOREVER HERE, AND AND AND that Loki is constantly panicking if he can't find Mobius). LIKE. NONE OF THE REVIEWERS, who literally break down all the episodes and point out shit like All That for het-ships, just won't acknowledge any of it!! They glossed over both Loki's and Sylvie's bisexuality confirmations in S1, and only briefly mentioned their genderfluidity in the comics and in actual mythology. I usually watch the breakdowns because I'm not familiar with comic lore so I find it interesting to learn about those backstories, as well as little details they find, but they've been dropping the ball ALL season, and EVERY one of them mention EVERY single breakdown that Loki just wants to get back to "his one true love Sylvie!!", like what are you smoking?!?!? I was getting SO FRUSTRATED because they skipped over LARGE chunks of E5, especially, just pointing out the surface level stuff instead. I literally turned it off after all that.

THAT ALL SAID, since episode one it's been clear that Sylvie wants NOTHING to do with Loki – she just wants to live a quiet simple life. Then when shit goes bad, she blames Loki for all the problems SHE caused, shits on Mobius every chance she gets, and then in that bar scene when Loki's bearing his soul to her, telling her that he wants his friends back and DOESN'T want to be alone, she basically is like "tough titties" and leaves him ALONE, showing she's not a friend at all.

But the reviewers literally just gloss over all of this. ANYWAY.

Ugh, sorry about that, that's been eating at me for like 3 weeks and last week's reviews finally just pissed me off so much because even casually watching the show I could see all this shit. I only REALLY started believing Lokius could happen after Episode 4 aired, and then Episode 5 had me reeling.

I am DYING to write meta about every episode as it comes out... I just feel that other people are writing better stuff than I could, and much faster than I have time for, and really it's nice to be on the reader side of things for a change. I just... don't want to add in my own two cents to their posts because I'd feel I'm intruding, is all.

I have lots of hope about where Episode 6 will go... like I'm feeling pretty good about them canonizing Lokius... However... I'm not gonna be disappointed if it doesn't get canonized simply because this is Disney and I am REALLY not thinking they're going to explore Loki's comic-canon genderfluidity and sexuality on a surface level.

Good thing I eat subtext for breakfast LOL. I lived through BBC Sherlock, hahah. BUT... can I get a third ship canonized in one year??? Is it wishful thinking? Oh, for sure. I hope so. I would be so happy if Disney even ACKNOWLEDGED that they love each other But I'm not expecting it. I'll be happy with another hug at least, or a forehead touch or hand holding. I'm a simple gal.

Honestly though, I do inevitably want the last episode to have Loki as the ruler with his friends, because they built up to this for 12 episodes, I DON'T want an unhappy ending for the sake of a twist or whatever. Truly let him be the Loki Who Remains (a callback to Episode One) as the Keeper of Time with Bea, O.B., Casey, and Mobius at his side <3

I LOVE the character development of Loki in this series, too. I legit didn't really care for Loki all that much in the MCU, but this series did the same to him for me that FatWS did to Bucky for me: Make me want to see MORE of them and their adventures with their new friends.

Anyway, thanks for reading and indulging me, I mostly just needed to get that rant out about reviewers and wtf people still think Sy!ki is happening. Feel free to discuss in the notes, I plan on posting a reblog with final thoughts after it airs on Thursday <3

#my ramblings #loki spoilers #loki s2 #not sherlock #my thoughts #marvel #lokius #long post #i love writing meta #just don't think people like reading it anymore #shitposting steph #some negativity in this post too sorry

[charcubed]

Hey so honest question. Do you think they will actually make Lokius canon? Or do you think they will stick with Sylki? Idk I want to believe that lokius will be canon but idk I feel like there’s not a chance.

Check back with me when we're at least halfway into season 2 👁

Lmao I'm kidding. But also I'm not!

Honest answer is that I don't know. There's no real way to know – anyone who says otherwise is lying to you – but certainly not before we see what season 2 is doing and if it continues all the things that season 1 seemingly laid down.

Here is some of what I know about what the story has given us so far:

When it comes to "love is a dagger"... Loki always had 2 daggers. (Which we see Mobius hand him at one point.)

Loki's already explicitly canonically bisexual.

Loki wants a "real" love / relationship at the end of his "crusade." As of right now, a relationship with Sylvie has been defined as being "fiction" in so many words, and we've also seen her represent "love is an imaginary dagger" specifically because she played him and hurt him.

Loki needed to learn to trust others and how to be trustworthy. The only person he had that mutual trust with was Mobius.

Loki no longer thinks he "deserves to be alone." If they follow that through, then he can't/shouldn't end the show by being alone. Now, who will he be with in the end, romantically or otherwise? Who is to say! Not me! But it's much to think about!

Can any of this change? Sure. It's not out of the realm of possibility that they could try to turn Sylvie into the "real" love for Loki now, as he's probably going to have to teach her how to trust while proving to her that he can be trusted. He is now clearly the superior Loki, and he will likely now be her mentor instead as the example for her to follow (if she's receptive).

I just think them trying to create a romance between them now is... the least likely case? I've endlessly said this before at length in other places when I've written meta, so forgive me for repeating myself, but the 2 themes of this story have always been self-love and love/trust for others. Narratively speaking, Sylvie represented the former and Mobius represented the latter. And I simply think it would be truly bizarre for them to try to overhaul that now. They could! I'm sure they could. But I'd be surprised by it!

(And I'm also the rare deranged lunatic on the internet who thinks Sylki was never actually framed as a romance, misleading kiss of betrayal notwithstanding, and that people have misread everything going on with them. But I digress.)

Does any of the above guarantee canon Lokius? No lol. Secret third thing is also always possible, aka classic Disney no homo move. I'm not an idiot on that front. But the low bar I'm setting for myself and my hopes is Loki and Mobius doing a (perhaps literal, on a jet ski) ride off into the sunset together ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ That's all I want and all I expect realistically speaking.

Anything else (👀) will be a bonus.

#asks #foreverdeadforyou #lokius #all that being said: they're going to kiss actually. on international television.

[dendrite-blues]

So I'll start by saying that it’s totally valid to write whatever version of the character that you personally enjoy. AO3 is your oyster, go find your bliss. If jealous Mobius amuses you and gives you life, I am not shitting on your fav. 

This is meant to be a meta analysis and a vent about people’s crap reading comprehension.

With that in mind:

It annoys the crap out of me that this entire fandom seems to think Mobius is a jealous bitch. Because that indicates that the majority of fans completely missed the point of one of the best acted scenes in the show.

I love this ship, but we have to remember that Lokius is not canon. Canon Mobius does not give a crap who Loki bones. They have bonded during Episode 2, but ultimately they both know that circumstances make it impossible for them to be friends. They don’t blame each other for being on different sides, but they are still very aware of it.

Canonically Mobius is in that interrogation room for one purpose, and that is to figure out why the Variant energy spiked on Lamentis, despite it being an apocalypse. Per the rules of the universe, that should be impossible. 

Mobius works for Renslayer, and she’s ordered him to solve that mystery. So the intention behind everything he says in that room with Loki is to extract that information. What the fuck happened that allowed us to find you. That’s it.

This is not a scene about Mobius being jealous. This is a cop who’s under pressure from his superiors to get results by any means necessary. And he uses extreme methods to do it. 

He tortures Loki physically and emotionally with the time jail. He uses their budding friendship to emotionally blackmail Loki. He taunts and provokes him by pretending not to know Sylvie’s name, by calling him a narcissist, by saying his affection for Sylvie is sick and disgusting. He intentionally misleads Loki into thinking Sylvie is dead literally just to see if the feelings are real.

This scene is not a good look for Mobius. So I get it, okay? I get why it’s more fun to say he’s jealous and move on. It’s so hard to see Mobius treat Loki this way, especially when you know that he really likes and admires Loki. An hour later in the same damn episode Mobius makes a heel face turn and dies breaking Loki out!

But that’s why it’s such a shame that people take a scene with so many layers of lies, manipulation, and conflicted feelings and flatten to “LOL Mobius, you’re so jealous!”

Because there is so much good shit hidden there: 

-Loki’s anger at the TVA for how they’ve hurt so many innocent people. -His frustration and disappointment at having to sit across from Mobius and watch him act out the TVA’s will. -That one moment where Loki tells an elaborate lie and Mobius has to decide whether to believe him. -The heartbreak on Loki’s face when Mobius convinces him Sylvie is dead. -The tiny, tiny look of surprise (and I think regret?) when Mobius realizes that Loki really does care for Sylvie and the words he’s been slinging have actually touched a nerve. I think under the Bad Cop persona Mobius really did feel bad about that. -That razor thin margin by which Mobius decides that Loki’s lying about the TVA being variants, and the wrecked look on Loki’s face when he sees that he’s failed to convince Mobius of the truth.

It’s just an incredible scene, and I really wish that people gave it a closer read. I see so many fics that base their entire characterization of Mobius off of these lines, and it drives me nuts because he doesn’t actually mean a word that he says in this scene. He’s just doing his job. He’s getting the information, and hurting both himself and Loki to do it. 

The conflict there is so juicy, the lingering guilt, mistrust, and confusion so powerful. I really wish more fics dealt with that and unpacked it.

#meta #discourse #mobius #loki #lokius #loki series #characterization

[ailendolin]

I posted 2.425 times in 2021

169 posts created (7%)

2256 posts reblogged (93%)

For every post I created, I reblogged 13.3 posts.

I added 1.840 tags in 2021

#art - 359 posts

#lol - 222 posts

#loki series - 198 posts

#lotr - 197 posts

#loki - 184 posts

#hornblower - 181 posts

#the terror - 149 posts

#loki spoilers - 132 posts

#the old guard - 110 posts

#mobius - 108 posts

Longest Tag: 138 characters

#so please stop telling your kids and students that hard work and determination and sacrifice and whatever will open all the doors for them

My Top Posts in 2021

#5

Of Lokis and Loneliness

I'd like to take a moment to talk about the recurring theme of loneliness in the Loki series (yes, this will be about The Hug). [...]

376 notes • Posted 2021-07-07 19:49:51 GMT

#4

After my previous meta post about Loki, Sylvie and self-love vs. self-acceptance, I felt the need to talk a bit about Mobius and Loki as well, especially this scene [...]

492 notes • Posted 2021-07-01 16:57:52 GMT

#3

Can I just say how much I love hearing Owen Wilson and Tom Hiddleston talk about each other in the making of? There's so much genuine affection there and I feel like these two just really get each other and their characters. [...]

629 notes • Posted 2021-07-21 10:16:21 GMT

#2

If it turns out that Mobius did indeed have a love interest in his past life said love interest better be played by Steve Coogan so we at least get Jedediah and Octavius riding off into the sunset together (on a jetski) out of all the angst if Lokius doesn't become canon.

1703 notes • Posted 2021-06-25 19:12:03 GMT

#1

I know we’re all freaking out right now about episode 4 but am I the only one who thinks that the Sylvie and Loki thing is not so much about self-love as it is about self-acceptance? [...]

6062 notes • Posted 2021-06-30 17:36:16 GMT

Get your Tumblr 2021 Year in Review →

#my 2021 tumblr year in review #aka #my journey of watsching Loki #lol #I'm not surprised those are my most popular post since Loki is the biggest fandom I've written meta posts for #but it kind of blows my mind that one of those posts has over 6k notes #how did that happen? #Loki #fandom

[inevitably-johnlocked]

A Little LOKI Theory Post

*SPOILERS FOR LOKI E1-3 BELOW CUT*

I am loathe to admit that I love the new LOKI TV series, mainly because of the Mobius/Loki dynamic, the interesting sci-fi plot, and just... I so far surprisingly like every episode. This was the show I had such low expectations for, because I didn’t really like LOKI – I felt he was the Moriarty of the MCU, overused when they didn’t need him, and making me annoyed by an actor I love.

EXCEPT I’m also a sucker for character-driven, psychoanalysis stories, like all these D+ Marvel shows are, and it’s leaving me super shocked about me liking characters I didn’t before. I’m fully invested in all these characters now.

I think the only reasom I really wanted to see this show for was because it ties directly into the next Dr. Strange movie, so YEAH, I’m in love multiverse and time travel things, so it was inevitable that I would enjoy this show, I think.

AND of course, I’ve theories and speculations because there’s a lot to work with, and I LOVE stories like these, so I decided I would take some time out and stretch out my meta-writing grey cells. And I wanted somewhere to have my theories/ideas written out before they come to fruition, because DAMNIT I have headcanons and hopes and dreams.

So here we go, spoilers below cut. Please note I know nothing about the comics aside from what other theorists and reviewers have mentioned:

The TVA are “the bad guys” but I think it goes deeper than that... Like the whole Timekeeper thing is really sus. I think it’s only one Timekeeper, who is Kang the Conqueror, who maintains the Sacred Timeline to ensure that he stays in power to PREVENT the Multiverse War which I think he knows happened to stop him. I also think Renslayer is behind all of this suspicious thing; I learned that in the comics Renslayer is a love interest for Kang, so like........... SUS.

AND I think Multiverse War they talked about in the beginning of the show IS the Multiverse War they’re ABOUT TO HAVE. This is a show about non-linear time, and there’s hints about multiverses in the next Spiderman, and Dr Strange is LITERALLY called “Multiverse of Madness”. Wild Theory: Maybe Doctor Strange IS one of the Time Keepers following the Multiverse War.

Loki initially wants to learn the enchanting that Sylvie does for his own selfish gain, and I think he was lying about breaking the TempPad so he would force her to open up. HOWEVER, I think he had a sudden change of heart after learning about the TVA’s Variant Staff; we already see him sort of fond of both Mobius and remembers Casey’s name, so I feel like that he will end up using this knowledge he gained very differently.

Further on this point, they established in Ep 3 that TVA agents / staff need actual real memories to “manipulate” them. So, I think Loki will use this power he learned from Sylvie (I mean, she explained to him how to do it, and this show is really good at using the “Chekov’s guns” given to us) to bring Mobius to “his side”, and TOGETHER they take down the TVA and make it what it should be. Mobius is very dedicated to the TVA, so I really do forsee that it will be Loki “freeing” Mobius as the catalyst to swaying to siding with Loki until the end. He’s a good man with a big heart for humanity, so I think he will totally side with freeing everyone else.

On that note, I think the reason Mobius is fascinated with the nineties is because he’s a variant jetskiier pulled from the nineties. I suspect in his original timeline he probably had a jetski accident and died, but in the Variant timeline, he survived, and out of pity I think Renslayer “saved” him and recruited him. The TVA wiped his memories after he couldn’t cope with the fact that he was SUPPOSED to die.

ALSO still on Mobius, I think every time he keeps questioning too much, he gets his memory wiped, which would explain why he never remembers leaving the cup stains on Renslayer’s table.

I think there’s more to Miss Minutes than meets the eye. Another theory I had was that she was similar to VIKI in iRobot, essentially running the company to her programmed “laws” after the TimeKeepers passed on. So like there’s no TimeKeepers at all, but there was at one time, and Miss Minutes was left to her own devices.

Another theory similar to this, is the Doctor Who episode, The Long Game, where everyone wants to be promoted to “Floor 500″ because it’s rumoured to be a paradise and is the top floor no one has ever returned from; It turns out it’s run by an alien that feeds on the human or something similar, and the people who went to the top floor ended up frozen husks of who they were. Not saying it’s this exact thing, but more the idea that everyone thinks what’s upstairs is a magical wonderful benevolent corporation looking out for what’s best for everyone, but instead it’s one evil thing doing stuff for their own purpose. Eh.

Another rogue theory: Mobius IS a Loki variant, which is why he’s obsessed with Loki himself, knows Loki better than Loki knows himself, and either knows and omitted it, or DOESN’T know but naturally is intrigued by the Loki Variant and him always finding out the truth is WHY his memory keeps getting wiped, and why everyone is always squeamish about having a Loki around. Mobius mentioned that Loki is the one Variant they have stopped more Lokis than any other Variant....

On that thought: IF Lokis are the most common Variant they capture, I think a LOT of the TVA are Loki Variants, trapped in the forms they were presenting as when they were brought in, and because magic doesn’t work in the TVA, they CAN’T turn off the glamour, had their memories wiped, and in turn could now be Codenamed Casey, or Mobius, or B15........ An abstract theory, but I think it’s interesting.

And another, since I learned that it is in the comics: Mobius is a clone drone. This one saddens me and I really hope he’s not. Because I love Mobius.

I think Sylvie was a Variant who worked for the TVA, but somehow had an awakening and wants to free everyone else... the only thing against this theory is her seeming surprised that her magic stopped working when she arrived at the TVA. If she was an agent, she would know that magic doesn’t work within the TVA.

And I think this series will inevitably – if the rumours of a Season 2 are true – have the Mobius / Loki dynamic solving Time Crimes... a.... Holmes and Watson if you will. :D HAHHA.

So yeah. This list will change obviously for the next 3 weeks, and I had a lot of fun with this so I will probably keep it up.

Some things I hope happen by the end:

A giant “probably not going to happen because this is Disney”: I hope they pay-off the “bisexual” confirmation by the end of this... highkey with Mobius (damn it I ship them okay), but lowkey just even a passing remark about anyone LOL. I really ship Lokius, okay. I need this dynamic in the MCU

PLEASE DON’T KILL CASEY, we love Casey. #FREECASEY

I’ll be really honest here, I will effing GROAN and be a not-happy Steph if they do the ship that I think they’re gonna do: Sylvie x Loki. Which is weird to me that Disney would be okay with self-love, but the OBVIOUS initial dynamic of Loki x Mobius is too much, “look we gave you bisexual Loki, aren’t you happy enough??” Just. I dunno. It’s weird / a pet peeve of mine that a lot of online reviewers are bitching about “woke” Disney the one time they ACTUALLY FINALLY let a title character say they’re queer, but are all “UWU SYLVIE AND LOKI ARE GONNA GET TOGETHER BECAUSE LOKI LOVES HIMSELF UWU”. Even though Loki spent legit more screen time with Mobius, and literally did everything he told Sylvie that he wouldn’t do around people he doesn’t trust around Mobius ALREADY?? It’s like they already forgot about the first two eps. LEGIT the whole dagger=love metaphor LITERALLY happened in the previous two episodes, but alright chiefs. Anyway. Sorry, it’s stupid to be bothered by it. 

We’re gonna get that heart wrench moment that the other two shows had, and I TRULY BELIEVE it’s gonna be between Loki and Mobius when Loki tells / shows Mobius the truth. LOOK I JUST WANT MORE OF THEM OKAY. And I need my heart ripping moment in this show within the next two eps LOL. We got one in WandaVision. We got one in FATWS. GIVE ME ONE IN LOKI. MAKE ME LIKE LOKI.

Anyway, so that’s my rambling. Thanks for taking time out to read all this. I miss theorizing, and this show is perfect for me to do it. I’m not AS good at these shows as I was with Sherlock, but it’s still fun, because it’s new and my brain is full of headcanons and idea things. I’ll write again after Ep 4, I think. <3 Thank you lovelies for letting me do this!

#my ramblings #my meta #my theories #loki spoilers #loki #loki meta #not sherlock #i just really miss writing meta #and i now ship lokius #so give me lokius fics please #long post under cut

[charcubed]

I love the way you trust your own opinion, you always sound like you're right, and I wish I could be like you. But I have a question. Have you ever been right about a movie/TV show meta reading? To be more specific, have you ever been right about a ship?

LOVE TO BE BASICALLY TOLD "YOU'RE VERY STUBBORN"

(I am. It's true.)

I have indeed! When I watched Black Sails, I was correct at every turn, over and over. I didn't watch the show while it was in progress–it was complete by the time I got to it, and I bingewatched in a week–but I watched it with zero spoilers. Along the way though, I was systematically correct about every character's sexuality, every ship (as in romance not pirate ships LOL), and every metatextual piece as I went along watching it. I livetexted to my friend lol. And I was correct about every piece of deliberately-subtextual story aspect too, because lo and behold, every creator quote I've encountered after watching has only validated or emphasized my meta writings. It's kind of bonkers, actually. I've yet to find a single piece I've been wrong about, I think? (I write very spoilery meta for Black Sails @freedom-in-the-dark / mostly @ gaypiracy on twitter)

This is part of the reason why I tell people with complete seriousness that Black Sails is the most validating unparalleled media experience I've ever personally engaged in: because aside from the fact that it's a complete masterpiece, a compelling narrative, an intricately woven story about stories, and a whole host of other things that make it perfection... Black Sails also confirmed for me, repeatedly, that I know what I'm talking about. Pure validation heroin directly into my veins, really.

Aside from that, there are really only 2 media properties I've written or shared meta specifically arguing "this queer ship is intended to become canon": Johnlock and Lokius. Both are unfortunately still in progress, so we shall see!

(I mean, a million years ago I also argued Damon/Elena from The Vampire Diaries was going to be canon / endgame, and that ended up being right. But y'know. Not really the same shit.)

EDIT: wait I’m adding something to this. I think there’s something to be said for the fact that like... as I often say, I can only call it like I see it. Queer subtext / queercoding can be in a story, and it’s a matter of whether or not the powers that be allow it to be brought to fruition. That’s the one thing that can never be fully anticipated, because it’s an out-of-narrative factor. (Supernatural is a prime example of this, obviously, as a censored text.) And all I can personally analyze is the story at play!

#anonymous #asks #writing meta for stevebucky is about pointing out subtext not anything having to do with proposed canonicity ever #and writing meta about supernatural in those last 2 weeks ended up being a totally different ballgame none of us could've anticipated #because chuck won lmao. but interestingly enough what sent me on the meta spiral I'm on as we speak re: this #is an old meta I wrote pre-finale predicting what was to come #and I expected it to be a subversion but instead... it WASN'T subverted and that is the POINT. which is insane. and not ship specific. #but anyway! hope this helps