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#but i didn't like him with boys either
chirpsythismorning · 2 months
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Can we talk about how Jonathan might've been able to clock Mike simply because of what happened with him and Nancy in season two?
This will be a long post, so you might want to strap in or save it for later.
In Will and Mike's case, it would obviously be much different from Jonathan and Nancy's situation, given that you know, they're gay. But we still have Jonathan arguably going through a similar experience as Will, while Mike is going through a similar experience as Nancy.
In s2, we see Nancy confront Jonathan about how she waited for him before getting back with Steve, which is a revelation to him. Then they're at Murray's and she's struggling to say she loves Steve, after a handful of moments between them that felt like she might return Jonathan’s feelings. And you can clearly see it in his eyes, listening to Murray imply that they have feelings for each other, with him looking back and forth sort of in awe of what's happening, like he's starting to question if she might actually like him back.
Will doesn't have that same affordance as Jonathan to really hope, at least not anymore. Which is why these relationships in s2 and s4 end differently for these two brothers.
Based on all the signs he was seeing that Nancy felt the same, Jonathan decided to take the plunge to admit to Nancy how he felt, and at that same moment Nancy had the courage to show how she felt. In Will and Mike's case, Will wasn't ready to take the plunge to admit to Mike how he felt, at the same moment Mike didn't have the courage to show how he felt.
What's so painfully hilarious to me about all of this though, is that Jonathan arguably starts the season in the same shoes as most of the audience, where from his perspective, it's becoming obvious to him now that Will like's Mike, but that Mike does not feel the same way.
First at Rink-O-Mania, Mike appears a little uncomfortable upon hugging Will. Then as the happy couple continues on their adventure into Rink-O-Mania, he watches Will lagging behind moping. And then unfortunately he's out of commission for the rest of the evening...
But once he's sober and back to being an attentive brother the following morning, we see him watching them at breakfast, with Mike barely sparing Will a glance, all while Will is blatantly staring, almost like he's waiting for Mike to look back, only for Mike to get up and walk away.
All of these instances gotta be SCREAMING unrequited gay love to Jonathan. He's already gotten signs for years that Will is gay, these are now just the signs that are instilling his suspicions that Will has feelings for Mike. He could have easily interpreted their relationship in the early seasons as young best friends, with Will seeming to have a crush on Mike, and with them growing up and that potentially including Will's straight friend distancing himself from him because he doesn't feel the same. It's not the most unexpected thing in the world considering.
But then there's a shift.
Suddenly he's creeping up on them talking in his room. And we know he was listening in on the conversation because he brings up Owens when he sits down. As he's eavesdropping, he's probably thinking something innocent like Aww they're making up! And like, hey! Even if Mike doesn't feel the same, which is okay and entirely expected honestly, at least he still cares about Will enough to make things right after acting so out of character. Still, I'm not gonna lie, that sounded a lot like flirting to me--
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Then he's knocking on Will's door like 30 minutes or less later only to find Mike and Will back on their bullshit. Mike suddenly isn't going out of his way to ignore or put Will on the back burner. In fact, he's on his bed and they're talking, again! The door is even closed this time, which is interesting. This has gotta be a good sign in Jon's eyes. Nothing to worry about! Right? Right...?
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But then suddenly this shift continues, going in a direction he probably didn't expect.
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I mean, this is literally an identical jancy parallel we have here with byler on the hood of the car, with Jonathan right there to witness it. Despite him maybe only now subconsciously picking up on the similarities between Will and Mike to him and Nancy here, he's at least taking note (I mean he's even got his gay map out and everything).
It isn't until the van scene happens, that I think Jonathan starts to genuinely consider his suspicions, which is that Mike might actually like Will back.
EVERY time we get a shot of Jonathan looking back at Will and Mike in the van, followed by a shot of his POV from the rearview mirror, we're faced with Mike looking at Will while Will is looking away.
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As Jonathan is hearing Will confirm his suspicions about his feelings for Mike, he's simultaneously witnessing Mike not looking at Will with disgust, but something more akin to reverence. All of those moments in the van that we witnessed, including all the ways Mike looked at Will and everything that was said, Jonathan was right there.
And what's even more insane about this scene, is that it circles back to Jonathan as a character himself.
I remember when people were talking about how odd it was that we never saw Jonathan with a camera in s4. After 3 seasons in a row of making his passion for photography a big part of his identity, that part of him was apparently absent entirely this time around... But was it really?
This is the same guy that said, "Sometimes, people don't really say what they're really thinking. But you capture the right moment, it says more."
Jonathan might not have had his camera in s4, but this was without a doubt one of those moments where he captured something more.
Something that I also think get's highly overlooked about this scene, especially when it comes to Jonathan looking back at them, being followed by a shot of Mike staring at Will, is that he could see both of their reactions the whole time, from beginning to end. Will nor the audience had the affordance of knowing because Will was facing the other way at the end, while we on the other-hand were blurred from even having the chance, despite Mike literally being in the frame. But not Jonathan. He even lets us see what he sees, a few times, but not at the very end, which would have been nice after they didn't let us see Mike's reaction seconds before this.
Let's just stop right there for a second though and circle back to what I consider to be the first time Jonathan really picked up on Will's feelings for Mike, which was at the end of s3, in a sequence that is a little too relevant to the van scene if you ask me, given that they are almost direct parallels.
While these parallels are pretty spot on visually, they are also near spot on narratively when it comes to the evolution each of these characters are experiencing.
For Will in the first scene, it's sadness that he's moving away from his friends in Hawkins and also feeling like he's losing Mike, after what looks like him and El making up, which makes him scared he'll distance himself again. For Jonathan, it's sympathy for his brother who appears to have some very deep feelings for his friend, feelings he can't quite grasp yet but soon enough will.
For Will in the second scene, it's heartbreak that he has to accept that Mike will never feel the same, knowing that supporting his relationship with El (encouraging it honestly) will likely turn out just as it did last time, with him losing Mike all over again, for the last time. For Jonathan it's sympathy for his brother who has now confirmed his suspicions that the feelings he has for Mike are more than just that of a friend.
Given that this parallel reinforces the same feelings Will and Jonathan had in s3 to now, why would this not also reinforce those same feelings that Mike had in s3 to now?
In the first scene, Mike was visibly distraught, with dialogue from Hopper in the background applying a little too perfectly with what he was feeling in that moment, which was scared. He’s apparently back together with El now, despite them doing just fine as friends for the last 3 months, as well as him and Will just having finally gone back to them being on good terms again. But now, it’s like he’s right back where he started at the beginning of s3, feeling obligated to be the perfect boyfriend to El, and as a result, having no choice in his eyes but to distance himself from Will. Mike then walks into his house looking like a zombie, almost emotionless stepping into his mother's embrace.
Now, I say almost emotionless because it looks like Mike was trying to hold back showing how he truly felt in this moment. He's not crying like he did in s1 when he lost Will that first time. Time has passed and things have changed (he doesn't want things to change). And he's trying his best to keep it together. But the in-focus close-ups make it clear that he is definitely not okay.
What's so impactful about these parallels is that it presents the inner struggle both of these characters are having, both queer and experiencing doubts, but in different ways and for different reasons.
Will is the one who covers it all up with lies, hiding the tears in his eyes, because boys don't cry.
Mike is the one who has never cried to them, just to his soul (RUN AWAY! TURN AWAY! RUN AWAY! TURN AWAY! RUN AWAY!!!).
If you actually try to get a gage on Mike's in-focus emotions in that first scene vs. his out-of-focus emotions in that second scene, well they're not that far off from each other.
We go from Mike smiling vibrantly at Will, to him now slowly turning away to look back down at the painting, with whatever the hell emotion this is...
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It's near impossible to catch because of how out-of-focus it is, but looking a lot closer, it honestly appears like Mike is feeling something akin to sadness that he's trying to mask. For a moment it even looks like he turns his head to wince emotionally, only to correct himself.
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And call me crazy, but these shots also low-key parallel each other. Mike looking down trying to keep his emotions in check and failing miserably, only to look up and meet eyes with someone whose witnessing it.
With each shot before this of Jonathan observing Mike looking at Will, with him showing all the emotions Will never got to see and everything else in between, I wonder what Jon saw this time? Probably another thing he didn't expect.
Can you just try to imagine the silence in this van, accompanied by Will's muffled sobs, and then try to imagine Mike turning to look down at the painting, only to sneak a glance, and then go right back to looking at the painting, IN SILENCE, and then try to tell me how the assumption that Mike didn’t notice Will crying makes any sense, like realistically?
Yeah me and Jonathan are confused too.
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Right now, Jonathan's probably wondering why Mike was acting a little fruity and repressed during the painting reveal. And that although he may have a penchant for being able to 'capture the right moment', Mike is sticking with his story (despite all the stalling and doubt). He is 100% straight!
And so maybe this is where Jonathan tries to accept what is being presented to him as the truth, despite the contradictions in front of him. It's likely that despite the way Mike looks at Will and acts around him, in ways he would have assumed coming from Nancy in s2 would've been evidence that she felt the same, it probably doesn't apply to Mike.
Maybe Jonathan's ready to accept that it's a lot more likely Will is experiencing unrequited love as a gay kid growing up in a small town, the most predictable experience a gay kid could go through, and in contrast Mike just feels too bad to let Will down easy.
Or who knows, maybe Mike could still be a little bit gay too...
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But it doesn't matter anyways. Mike seems to be adamant about this and so there's really nothing else Jonathan can he do besides tell his brother he'll be there for him no matter what. And so he does just that.
But then Mike just has to surprise him one last time.
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For those that don't know, the line Mike gives here in his monologue was in part pulled from Will's monologue in the van. Most don't know this because this line didn't make the final cut for the van scene, but in the official script the writers posted, what we find is an almost a direct parallel.
Which makes the reaction shots of Will and Jonathan directly after Mike says this all the more epic.
From Will's end he was probably hearing Mike say this and just thinking 'Damn. Well, that's what you get for using your feelings to inspire Mike to profess his love to El.'
But from Jonathan's end, I don't think his outside POV of these events overlapping was nearly as naive as his brothers understanding of the events. Because why the fuck would Mike need to use Will's feelings to inspire him to profess his love to El in the first place? Is this what Mike has been struggling with? Really? Why before every moment Mike takes action in this scene, is Will's hand literally pushing him into it? Why is Mike being so dramatic about saying I love you, stuttering and rambling about her being a superhero, not saying nearly as meaningful of things as what Will said in the van?
And then it hits him.
Mike is reminding him a little too much of another Wheeler right now...
Nancy Wheeler, who was afraid of what would happen if she accepted herself for who she really was, leading her to retreat back to the safety of Steve. Because Nancy liked Steve, but she didn't love Steve.
And now here is Mike Wheeler, who has went from being incredibly distant with Will after reuniting with El, something that is very unlike the Mike he knew in previous seasons, to something more himself again after they make up, with him looking at Will with adoration after hearing his words in the van, only to turn away and look heartbroken. Mike who is now struggling to simply tell El he loves her with Will right behind him literally yelling at him to do it.
And now it's like all those little moments are starting to add up to Jonathan.
Suddenly all those signs he picked up on from Will when he was younger are now blending in with moments Will shared with Mike. It was Mike who jumped in after him and his mom's speech to Will in the shed in s2, with tears in his eyes recalling the day that they met (without being asked, let alone pushed to). And it's Mike who is now looking like he's at war with himself as he attempts to give encouragement to El, just like he did with Will in s2, but this time he needs someone to push him to do it, and that person just so happens to be Will. After just finding out about Will's feelings and also while assuming El wants him to love her that way still, Mike is stuck.
I don't think it's takes a genius to consider Jonathan is capable of realizing how fucked they all are in this situation.
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As much as Mike isn't ready for a sleuth of reasons, Will isn't ready either.
This provides a huge contrast between the bylers ², because while Jonathan and Nancy went through a similar experience to Will and Mike, them being ready to accept it and act on it didn't involve nearly as many factors and risks. Will and Mike also have the added barrier that is homophobia.
Will's internalized homophobia lies in part with assuming Mike could never feel the same based on some of the words he said in their last two fights, with parts being painfully reminiscent of the things his dad and bullies used to say about him. These are also words that contradict Mike's own words and actions from the previous seasons, things that did once give Will hope. The shame and guilt that comes with falling for your best friend, who you now know will never feel the same after being foolish enough to believe it not too long ago, and who might not even want to be your friend anymore upon finding out the truth, is understandable. He can't have hope like Jonathan can. It's just not the same.
Mike's internalized homophobia lies with assuming El wants him to love her, along with their relationship being expected and socially acceptable from everyone around him. Though unfortunately for her he feels abundantly more in love in the moments he shares with Will. Despite trying to make it work with El as hard as he could, because she's amazing and all any guy could hope for in a girlfriend, he can't ignore the fact that the feelings he has for these two people are different. The shame and guilt that comes with you, a boy, falling for your best friend, who is also a boy, and who is starting to show that he feels the same, all while you can't muster up the courage to break up with your girlfriend, nor can you muster up the courage to tell her that you love her, not when she's begging you, dying or even just simply at the end of a letter, is pretty understandable too. He can't have hope like Nancy can. It's just not the same.
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Spoiler: They were not ready.
PS: I'm still not over the fact that they low-key confirmed these events elsewhere in the story...
#byler#st analysis#pocketgate#lettergate#i'm aware this is a hot (big brain) take#but i'm like 76% sure mike understood will in the van scene#also why mike is gonna finally be dealing with some personal business in s5...#just want to add that this makes the scene at Nina hit harder#also#mike trying and failing to tell el he loves her or break up with her at surfer boy and stalling because he just can't fucking do either?#mike's face when will pushes him to profess his love to el right in front of him???#honestly i dont think mike would've gone through with his monologue if he didn't think this is what el wanted in large part#i think he thought that if he did break up with her she wouldn't need him at all anymore#or more specifically if told her the truth she might hate him for it and just not want to be in his life in the aftermath of that#this is why he struggled so much with being honest#it was either lie and suffer but get to keep her in his life most likely or tell her the truth and potentially lose her and still suffer#it's just that now he has literally no choice but to conform and be with her all while knowing it's not what his heart truly wants#the heart not being true to himself jumpstarted the apocalypse#everyone act surprised#byler getting jonathan’d in s5 can be something so personal#no but imagine jon getting even more signals mike feels the same 😭#and he tries to talk to will about it but will just gets upset like pls stop why are you saying this?#or imagine him talking about it subtly with Nancy and her being like no way#only to see it for herself#maybe then Nancy would try to talk to Mike about how he’s feeling#idk I could genuinely see byler just getting byler’d individually#but it’s clear at this point Jonathan is extremely suspicious#honestly all I think it would take is him having intel about their previous fights#if he found out mike defended his behavior by insisting that they’re friends…#jonathan would just be like… oh shit.. the first lie…
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spookberry · 1 year
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Continuation of this post <3
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groguspicklejar · 6 months
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Honestly, I don't know anymore. Am I aromantic? am i demisexual? Am I grayromantic? I don't fucking know.
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anneapocalypse · 2 months
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"Why didn't the Orlesian Wardens try harder to get into Ferelden?" Senior Warden Riordan did not sneak across the border alone, try to negotiate opening the border at what he thought was a good-faith parley only to be imprisoned and tortured, still manage to bust himself out as soon as he saw an opportunity, make contact with the remaining Fereldan Wardens, fight with them in the final battle despite being unable to get the rest of the Wardens in, and die giving them a fighting chance to kill the Archdemon for us to say that the Wardens all gave up on Ferelden.
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fleshadept · 2 years
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Antlers are associated with power, growth, and resurrection. They serve as a defense and deterrent from predation; when broken, they grow back completely.
Boy (2010) dir. Taika Waititi
#HAPPY TAIKA TUESDAY EVERYBODY#SOOOO UM A FEW THINGS.#second gif stoned haircut scene. the antlers are framed to look very small for boy#like this either represents that the antlers are growing in for him in this scene#as it's a very literal transformation for boy allowing alamein to take him into his own hands per se#and as a result allowing alamein to live the fantasy represented by the crown of antlers#OR.#it is positioning boy as a baby deer#a younger version of alamein essentially#something something mr langston saying boy is a lot like alamein used to be#NEXT#fourth gif alamein is staring DIRECTLY. at the camera#this is the peak of his fantasy he holds all the cards at this point he has Become shogun. he believes he is the protagonist#so he looks directly at the audience watching what he believes to be a story about him#interestingly when boy sits on the throne he is looking up not forward/at camera#AND.#i didn't notice until i was making this that boy sitting on the throne is the last time we see the antlers until#alamein's fantasy is completely destroyed#if we look at it thru protag theory that implies that as the protagonist boy simply taking alamein's role for a minute#even though it ended badly for boy#started the destruction of alamein's fantasy#AND FINALLY#the growth/rebirth symbolism around antlers is very interesting considering the way the antlers are broken#in the last two gifs#and then it immediately cuts to the next morning#and the rest of the film after that is very much themed around new beginnings#especially when you take into account the shot of the finished carving on the chair#that deliberately excludes the antlers from frame#anyway. that's all of it! jesus christ#if you read this far i'm kissing you on the mouth
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dollypopup · 8 months
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looking back at the whole Colin Marina Penelope situation and i need someone
anyone
to PLEASE
explain to me
how after, with 0 consideration whatsoever for his feelings, getting used as the unknowing rope in their personal tug of war, and walking away from it fully heartbroken, why Colin is the only one who apologized, to both Marina *and* Penelope,
whilst he was also the only one who did nothing wrong
#polin#colin bridgerton#penelope featherington#marina thompson#bridgerton#addendum that Marina *also* apologized to Penelope#and also weirdly to Daphne? 'your brother is a sweet boy' he would probably appreciate being told that tbh#and Penelope hasn't said sorry ONCE to EITHER of them#but absolutely *no one* has apologized to Colin? (except anthony and it almost floored him that he did)#colin did everything right and everyone still got mad at him for it#he was the realest of the real ones with Marina don't even *try* to deny#and like i get why Marina didn't apologize especially after their breakup i'm not on her about it they don't even talk anymore#but Penelope????? for all your 'what about Colin?'s you sure don't seem to care very much for his feelings?? that's supposed to be your boo#girlie was out here about to confess her crush on him 5 seconds after personally blowing up his engagement#thankfully she didn't like IMAGINE how squicky that would be#instead listened as he told her she inspired him to travel and that he's sorry and that he appreciates how she was looking out for him#(completely unknowing she's half the reason he's hurt)#and then got upset at him????? for some reason??? and denied him a dance and got all in her own feels????#and NEVER APOLOGIZED?????#Colin said 'oh the bar is 25 feet tall? it's okay i know how to pole jump i'll just get a running start'#and Penelope said 'i could fart and get over this bar but i don'T FEEL LIKE IT'#girlfail girlcringe girlflop#colin baby boy PLEASE#i am on my knees begging you#be more selfish#someone come care about this man and treat him right
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aashiyancha · 7 months
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I felt like doing a solo doodle for Reinhardt
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marfian · 1 year
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Been playing re4 remake and so far this is all I've got
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tennessoui · 10 months
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The pool boy au was really interesting from a character study perspective. How much more was Obi-Wan actually manipulating from behind the scenes than he actually let on? Was he already putting on an act by the moment he gave Anakin the scotch, or did he start way earlier, like when he was breaking Satine’s glass statues? (Rhetorical question, ofc) If so, sounds appropriately pretentious for a hotshot film director.
I feel like a lot of the things he said were clues that he was not actually pretending to talk to Satine the whole time (for example, how he seemed to be talking to someone a lot more submissive and complacent than Satine is characterized as being). I imagined Satine as another wealthy aristocrat/famous actress with nothing to lose by divorcing him, so I was surprised when he implied that she was a gold digger. I like the room left for doubt and how since Anakin is an unreliable narrator, it’s hard to tell how much he was actually being played.
Also, I feel like Fetish would be the perfect song for this au.
what an excellent ask!!! love ok
for me, obi-wan's character is all about being opportunistic, manipulative, and in control -- i don't think he threw satine's statues in order to get anakin to come looking. i think that was a genuine slip of control where he wanted to break something and there they were: wholly his ex-wife's, wholly things she liked that represented a very unsavory aspect of his marriage. he's not thinking about anakin at all yet...
not until he sees him standing there, shirtless and sweaty like he always fucking is around obi-wan for fucks sake - but now, obi-wan is single, now anakin is of age, it's perfect and obi-wan is an opportunist. i think he decided to fuck anakin right then, but i think everything after was more hastily thrown together.
obi-wan's every action after seeing anakin is just so manipulative--they're the actions of a man who is desperately trying to regain his sense of control. he even asks anakin to walk over broken glass for him to see if he would do it, see how submissive he would be for him (and i think that's the moment obi-wan decides he'll keep him after fucking him)
the scotch is another test, to push his boundaries and see how much he'll bend for obi-wan. i think he's actually probably a little surprised anakin suggests that he pretend to be satine: he just really leans into it because it's an opportunity to dominate the memory of his wife (who was absolutely not as submissive or bitchy as obi-wan tells anakin)
from the moment anakin steps out of the bathroom, i think obi-wan enjoys the night in 2 ways. he's dominating his ex-wife, sort of, and he's fucking the pool boy, who is everything satine isn't: specifically, submissive and willing to go along with everything obi-wan says. so i think he finds pleasure in saying nasty things to anakin about his ex-wife, but i don't think he ever loses track of who is actually in his bed !! he's enjoying anakin too much for that
(but i think he's also really enjoying making anakin confused and dazed and needy by bringing his ex wife back into the picture every so often)
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storm-driver · 1 year
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kh4 fanfic scenario where roxas somehow manages to meet up with subject x and she calls him ventus over and over, but every time roxas tries to correct her, she sinks a little further into denial, insisting he must remember his past and the sacrifice he made for them.
and roxas, not really knowing who ventus is besides having a close tie to sora, has to start putting pieces together himself since the wayfinder family is in the realm of darkness
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theidiotabides · 9 months
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Would really love to hear about the angsty marcotobias fic if you're interested in sharing. 👀
Oh gosh, I feel like I'd have to actually write it for it to make sense because like 80% of it is subtext, but here's some rambling in that general direction.
I'm chiefly interested in the ways in which Marco & Tobias are actually incredibly similar -- their senses of humor, their attractions, their complete direspect for authority, and most importantly how they both lowkey hate themselves but insist on survival anyway, largely out of spite -- but how they treat their similarity as, like, a cautionary tale rather than the basis for a healthy connection that it could be.
Like, Tobias disappearing into the woods and giving up on everybody is exactly the kind of behavior that Marco finds incredibly triggering, having lived through it with his dad. Marco would never walk away from his remaining loved ones like that, especially in the post-war world where he's charged himself with being the public face of the Animorphs because somebody has to. But there is absolutely a part of him that wants to give up and disappear; ya boi is tired.
Meanwhile, I think Tobias sees Marco's devotion to Jake and refusal to abandon him even after how Rachel died (which Tobias blames Jake for) as a version of the hero worship complex Tobias used to have about Jake -- like, I think Tobias sees Marco as being too devoted to Jake to see "the truth" about him, and he pities that in Marco. But at the same time, Tobias envies Marco's close personal connections, and I think on some level he knows that the only way to get to that place would be to work through his anger at Jake to get to his anger at Rachel, and he just can't bring himself to do that. It's easier to stay mad.
And then there's the question of Rachel herself, whom they were both deeply invested in trying to keep alive at the end of the war. Like, we see this explicitly from Tobias, with his "just be Rachel" and constant emotional check-ins with her, but I don't think Marco gets enough credit for his active role in keeping her literally alive. Dude bodily removed her from battles, at risk to his own life, and I just refuse to believe that's not something Marco & Tobias talked about, given how much time they spent together in Ax's scoop during that period of time between Marco's fake death & the move to the valley. Rachel is both a mutual love and a mutual failure for them (and that level of mutual devotion to a third person gives my polyamorous ass A Lot of Feelings).
Basically I think there's a lot of respect and love between Tobias and Marco, but they can't get to it because it would require each of them to deal with Rachel-related guilt and confront parts of themselves that they don't want to acknowledge.
...so I want to get them high on Marco's fancy penthouse balcony and make them kiss about it
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uselessnbee · 1 year
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everyone understands that Will had a hard time helping El and standing up for her because he himself has trauma from being bullied his whole life and doesn't know how to fight them back, his reaction to bullying is to freeze. but suddenly no one understands it when it comes to Mike and he's just called an asshole for not being able to stand up and fight El's bullies
i'm not saying he is innocent and did nothing wrong. he could have done more and just handle the situation better but he was just too focused on Will and was in his head and being the otherthinking oblivious dumbass that he is
but just imagine your girlfriend tells you she is having a good time and has friends, she does not mention anything bad and then suddenly she's getting bullied in front of you. when you've been bullied your whole life your first reaction is to freeze, to panic and just wait and hope it passes quickly and they'll leave you alone. Mike did not have any knowledge about her bullying or having any kind of problems, as long as he was aware those people were her friends. he himself has trauma from being bullied (he literally mentions it later on why yall keep forgetting??) and being suddenly thrown into a situation involving bullying can be really distressing.
when you have experience with being bullied even just seeing someone else getting bullied can make you freeze up and panic. and we know that Mike does not stand up for himself when he's the victim. even when you're not on the receiving end of the bullying but you just see it happening and suddenly you're a scared little kid again holding back tears desperately hoping for them to leave you alone.
and i know everyone wants to yell at me "you forgot about Mike standing up to Troy when they were saying shit about Will! so he can obviously stand up for his friends so why can't he for El??" and no i did not forget and yes you may be right but the situations are different. Mike was very well aware of Troy's bullying. he was involved in it. he was the victim there. he's had to deal with his bullying for years it was not a shocking revelation. however he did not know about El's situation at all and your reaction can be very different when you know about something and when you have no knowledge and it suddenly happens
again i'm not saying that he did nothing wrong. i'm just saying that we need to consider his trauma and his point of view and it could make him think less rationally and therefore not being able to help properly. maybe if he knew beforehand that something could go wrong he could be prepared and he would handle the situation better (even if it would be just them seeing Angela and her friends come and they would turn to Mike and say quickly that those people are mean to El he would still have at least some time and could prepare himself). but he did not know that and he was not prepared for this situation to suddenly escalate like this. he was unprepared and probably panicking and didn't know what to do so no he wasn't much of a help.
and maybe we should stop acting like this traumatised 14 years old kid needs to solve every problem and act rationally in every situation and not to make any mistakes (especially when he has no knowledge to prepare him for something distressing) and overall just putting everything on his shoulders and then insult and hate him when it does not end up perfectly well
and maybe i'm just being my overprotective extremely defensive self who's looking too much into this who knows
and i can't even properly put into words what i'm trying to say but if it makes sense to someone then great!
#mike wheeler#byler#Will is not a bad guy for not being able to stand up for El#that boy has so much ptsd from everything he's been through in his life he never stands up to his bullies#his survival tactic is to stay quiet and hope assholes won't bother him#and Mike isn't a bad guy either#no it is not an excuse for him being a bitch to El especially after she hit Angela#but again he was not prepared for anything like this to happen and it all escalated so quickly and ended up in violence#and he didn't even properly know and process what just happened#and i'm also sick of seeing everyone hating him and calling him a hypocrite for this whole thing#because 'he was okay with El using violence against his bullies' when those situations are so so different#El hurt the bullies because they literally made Mike jump off a cliff and threatend Dustin with a knife#El used violence against Mike's bullies because Mike almost lost his life he was not being humiliated#and i'm not saying that being humiliated like El was isn't bad because i know how painful and traumatising it can be#but in Mike's situation she used violence against violence and that is still different#also that happened in s1 and they were still kids and since then Mike saw so much violence and death#that it would be understandable for him to have a different view on it now#if El would humiliate Angela back like she did with Troy at first#i'm pretty sure Mike would understand that better so maybe calm down with that hate yea?#but then again it is just a speculation and my opinion so you do you#blue's 'Mike's extreme defender' ramblings
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estrangedandwayward · 2 months
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Human inuyasha because I guess 21 and 11 are the same thing
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dimiclaudeblaigan · 5 months
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Honestly though, this (what Ashe is pointing out) is exactly why I don't think GW could possibly end well. There's no "talking it over" after all the bloodshed (especially bloodshed started by them, and especially bloodshed started by them that didn't have to happen).
The way the narration leaves it "open" too at the end of GW just comes across as "it failed". It feels like... a kind of pointless story?
And I know some people might think that since Dimitri personally isn't as deeply affected by losing Matthias and so might be willing, that's still no good if his people and closest allies aren't. Rodrigue and Sylvain wouldn't be so forgiving, and I do think Dimitri would follow suit because that's his father (Rodrigue)'s closest friend and one of his own closest friends' father.
Add that to the fact that they have Sreng to deal with still (and I imagine sooner or Sylvain would figure out that Leicester had a hand in provoking Sreng to attack Faerghus) on top of losing Matthias and I imagine all the stress and aggravation wouldn't bode well for Leicester as far as Claude's thinking of things working out goes.
I just really can't see where GW goes afterward that would be "good" or works in Claude's favor at all. Maybe that was the intention and it was meant to be a route with a completely tragic ending, but apparently there are players who think it would end well and whatnot and I just can't see that happening (both from Faerghus' end and from Adrestia's end, the latter of which Claude discussed within GW itself).
If their intention was for a totally tragic ending, like yeah, I can see that... but as always the writing muddies the waters to make it sound good while something bad is happening. It keeps trying to have a positive spin on bad things as if they're just afraid to commit to a fully bad ending.
#DCB Three Hopes Run#also to be specific the reason I just call Rodrigue his father outright is bc he refers to him as a “second father” in Houses#but I'm not gonna literally write “his second father” every time I mention it and honestly “adoptive father” doesn't work for me either#bc him being an adoptive sort of parent doesn't make the fact that he /is/ a parent to him any less valid#like a parent is a parent and I don't feel the need to point that out and the feeling is mutual between them#if Rodrigue is literally calling him ''my boy'' it's a pretty cut and dry parent/child relationship#obviously I'm using Houses context in this case but it's still accurate in Hopes#and I just can't see losing Matthias going over smoothly at all and things getting better with time#I mean Matthias is such a major player in Faerghus and so important that I just can't see them being like#well it was only /one/ important bigwig who died. like no it was one important bigwig saving a whole lot of lives#who is also very intelligent and has a deep say in politics. that's ofc not counting#as Ashe says here in AM in reference to Adrestia that they've killed so much on both sides bc of the war#that he can't imagine just sitting and talking now. just because we as players only saw one named character die#and just because that character wasn't a playable character nor a returning character we already knew and loved#doesn't mean hundreds if not thousands more didn't die in Leicester's invasion#like Ashe says here I just don't see how both sides could sit and talk after all that#esp since Sylvain would prob be involved and uh... Sylvain is... a very emotional and angry person#and extremely vengeful (and they rly leaned into that side of him in Hopes in all routes)#I canNOT imagine talks with him involved not getting heated and aggressive#and he'd /have/ to be there bc he's the Margrave now in GW. if they want to have important talks like that#they need all their major players which like even if Felix say wasn't there#Rodrigue has basically equal authority as Felix bc Rodrigue has the respect of experience and has proven himself#so they could be swapped out for talks and Felix being the ''official'' Duke wouldn't affect talks in the least#if Rodrigue was/had to be present instead. with Sylvain you've either got no other options#or you've got Miklan who I can't imagine would want to even get involved with all of that#both bc of his mixed feelings on Matthias but also bc he's been out of the political atmosphere for so long#so yeah I uh... can't... see talks ever going well unless Claude legitimately makes amends somehow#or Houses Claude gets in there smacks him around and fixes some shit before heading back to his own verse lol
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evie-writes-sometimes · 4 months
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You've heard of 'people can't handle liking flawed characters and so they woobify them'. Now get ready for 'people try so hard not to be in the first category that they vilify them/make characters worse than they actually are in the name of nuance'.
#this is about many characters but rn it's mainly about five hargreeves#babygirl I've stanned more problematic characters than you can comprehend#and five has a shitton of flaws and has done loads of bad stuff#he's an asshole#but he's also not nearly as much of an asshole as a lot of you make him out to be???#he can be insensitive but no more than any other character#and usually in dire situations (like he was an asshole to viktor about leaving sissy but they were on a time limit??? and he was-#-actually pretty understanding after their argument??)#he comforts allison in s1? he's understanding to luther? he berates lila about diego? he immediately goes with klaus on the road trip?#he doesn't tell viktor that he caused the apocalypse#a bunch of other stuff I can't remember rn#other characters this is about include utena tenjou#love love love anthy but some people try to put the blame on utena for forcing her perceptions on anthy#and put it on the same level as anthy manipulating lying betraying stabbing etc utena#will byers is a much lesser degree but yeah people try to make him. more flawed in everything that happened (the rain fight and rinkomania#fight mostly)#that boy didn't do anything wrong in either and that's okay#kaeya in that genshin rain fight also counts#unless he was actually goading/intending to make diluc angry and upset what did that boy do wrong??? bad timing to confide your secrets#but so what if he did???#since a bunch of stuff is still pretty ambiguous i won't talk to much about#mostly talking about the fanon perception of the fight#but yeah#sometimes characters are just assholes and sometimes they're not assholes and it's okay either way
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azol-otl · 1 year
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Random Jason Hijinks I either wish would happen someday or find amusing to think about.
Rose and Jason break Eddie out of hell and steal his soul back from Neron. Jaime is dragged along by Rose because he and Eddie were “friends a few reboots ago”. Jason asked Roy who sent him Connor who is suffering™.
Pre-Red Hood Jason and Pre-Green Arrow Connor first meet up back when Jason was part of the All-Caste hunting a demon. It’s a one-shot adventure and the things you have to know are:  
a) this is before Jason’s growth spurt so he’s over a head shorter than Connor.
b) Connor isn’t a cape so excuse him for not understanding demons and fucking up hilariously a few times.
c) When Jason tries to kill the demon who is possessing the human, he and Connor fight about it. The fight ends when the demon explodes out of the person like the Pus of Man from Dark Souls 3.
d) Talia is the one who finds and picks up Jason from the adventure (Connor thinks she’s his mom and Jason just didn’t inherit the melanin) and is also the one who gives Connor contact information for Jason because she wants him to have some sort of friend.
e) They never actually learned the other’s name so anytime they’d hear about Red Hood or Green Arrow they literally don’t know it’s that guy they met as teenagers.
Jason decides to actually dust off his mystic training when Dick walks in and Jason gets hit with so many bad vibes he’s genuinely worried something is wrong with Dick.  
Jason: “Did they not fix the Brother Blood mind control thing fully? Did Raven miss something? Isn’t Dick friends with a million people? How have they all missed this????”
It ends with bringing Danny Chase back to life and the only person remotely happy about it is Jason and even that’s a stretch.
Rose, why are you part of the Wild Hunt?!!!
What do you mean Biz got taken by the fae?!
Roy, why is this werewolf saying he’s your husband?!
Eddie, why didn’t you tell me you were a prince of hell? What do you mean that one of Trigon’s sons is buried in Gotham?!!! No wait, you still haven’t told me how you’re a prince of hell!
Jason and Talia's road trip where Jason comes to the uncomfortable realization that he views Talia as a mother/aunt figure.
Bonus Artemis suffering Jason’s Mom Has it Going On.
Jason gets a new dog named Ellie and he loves her and Dog very much. What do you mean she’s a Blue Lantern!?
Ellie is short for Elpis and she’s absolutely Hope Corgi.
Roy finds out that he has a whole-ass checking account under one of his aliases that he never knew about. Turns out Jason created it for him years ago and Roy’s actually under W.E.  employed as an independent contractor and he’s been making 6 figures for years because Jason never bothered telling anyone that he still owns Wayne R&D.
Jason slowly but surely claims Park Row and the surrounding areas as his territory. It has the unforeseen consequence of magical folk moving into the neighborhood because Gotham is a nightmare to live in normally, Magic Gotham is even worse and the only people who can survive are big hitters like Blood, Zatanna, and Ivy or small fries like the kitchen witch near Leslie’s. Welcome to the big leagues, Jason.
Jason keeps getting mistaken for Jason Blood and it is annoying. One day some demon hunters threw something at Jason and did anyone know Jason used to be in heaven because he sure didn’t and these angel wings are a fucking nightmare.
Rose busts a gut laughing because she somehow became friends with the least demon-y demon Eddie and Jason as an angel.
Jason, Ivy, Sideways, and Impulse (Impulse voice: “Why am I even here?”) vs the Madness Wavelength in Arkham.
Jason kills Joker and finds out that he cannot. Not as in “He doesn’t die” or “There will be a new one” but a secret third option, “The universe literally resets the day every time he’s killed.” Instead of being a tragedy, it becomes a comedy as killing Joker slowly becomes Jason’s go-to when shit goes wrong/killing him is good stress relief. Stephanie discovers what happens because she’s had to write the same essay nine times once. Instead of being horrified they (and then Helena, Tim, Duke, etc.) make killing Joker a gag. The only ones not allowed to kill the Joker are Dick and Bruce because then the universe decides it’s the bad timeline instead of just resetting again.
Tim: *drops his latte on a hot guy and then embarrasses himself in public trying to apologize and becomes a meme.*
Tim: I guess I have to kill Joker now.
Jason and Kory remeeting and wow it’s really awkward that we only got close because of a universe meddler and then you dipped and never contacted me again even though I was a hundred percent serious that you were one of my first friends and are very important to me.
Oh no. Not the talking. Not communication! Kory take mercy on me and just drop me like a bad memory don’t have us open a dialogue where we reconcile all of the bullshit that happened to us and the fact that we did genuinely get close at very low points in our lives and be willing to try and be friends again!
Give! Kory! All! The! Friends! She doesn’t care if you think it’s a bad idea, it's her life!
Gotham Vigilante Tabletop Club (GVTC) featuring Jason, Tim, Stephanie, Duke, Helena, and Harper. They each get a turn as dm and every one of them brings in a different game.
Why is Damian’s friend (Colin) asking me for love advice? I’m a gay disaster ask anyone else please. ??? I guess I can try to help??? Who’s your crush?
It’s Lian and Jason regrets agreeing to help because Roy is going to murder him.
Countdown 2 Electric Boogaloo. Except for this time they were all shoved into the dimension separately and by separate events and there is no danger. It is just a multiversal road trip with the people who vexed you greatly but are slightly grown up now.
Bonus scene includes Jason’s gleeful face when he realizes he understands what all of those words Donna keeps muttering under her breath mean because Artemis was a bro and taught him Themysciran Greek.
#I didn't mean for all of them to sound like comedies but sometimes that just happens#People may hate on the all-caste for not being Jason enough or whatever#But have we ever stopped to think that Damian is related to an immortal cult and Duke is the son of an eldritch being#And Dick is related to an unrelated cult and just all the weird shit that happens in Gotham anyways?#Why can all these exist and Jason not also have mystic monk training he never uses#Listen I don't know much about Gotham's magic population but I'm pretty sure the place is awful to live in with the nine different curses#So having a dude that's basically a mage-killer claim a territory can only be a good thing for their safety#Plus I'm positive that magic folk would keep property values low because who would go looking for magic users in Park Row#Everyone was written terribly for rhato but Jason and Kory had the potential to be a really interesting relationship#Just this lack of judgement and ability to not have to shave down all of your sharp edges for one another#also I do really like the idea of them trying romance or sex and then deciding that they need friends more and then staying friends#Gotham Vigilante Tabletop Club my beloved#Look Duke and Tim canonically play tabletop games and if dc would finally acknowledge that Stephanie and Jason are nerds they would too#I miss Colin and the idea of him and Jason being disaster siblings or disaster guardian-child is important to me#I don't know if it's canon but considering linguistic drift Themyscira should either have its own language or dialect#and Donna should use it to say mean things under her breath#Jason Todd#I am not tagging anyone else their tags deserve to be Bat-Free#oh boy do I love how I can't make indents in even in html. Sorry for the eyesore whoever reads this mess
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