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#and i didnt do a thumbnail for this one either but i think this drawing drained all my composition luck
ot3 · 2 years
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first of all, i am violently in love your ace attorney fancomic. that one panel of mia in the elevator and edgeworth on the stairs sitting back to back lives rent free in my head, i think abt it every 3-5 business days and go feral. tysm <3 second, would you ever consider showing us ur process behind it? like how you plan it, the dialog + composition, etc? id personally love to get that insight !!
thank you so much!!!
i actually do have a TON of behind the scenes/process stuff up on my patreon for $2. every thumbnail/color rough/scrapped page comp i've done is up there, and i've been writing detailed commentary on the comic as a whole because it's something people expressed an interest in reading. there's a decent amount of it right now and ill have a new batch of commentary up sometime in the next few days
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as for more generalized stuff about process ill stick that here under the cut but unfortunately it is going to be EXTREMELY unhelpful because my process habits are very bad.
so as for prewriting/pre-planning i do almost none of it. i've been trying to get better at doing that but i get so so so bored of that so fast. here's a screenshot of my first outline, cropped to just show everything i've drawn so far.
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as you can see this all means pretty much nothing and i also didnt quite follow it. we didn't get the mia and greg postmortem and swiss rolls stuff for turnabout samurai because i later decided to scrap it. later down in this document there are slightly more detailed notes about some specific scenes, but really its all super lose.
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Recently i tried to write a more detailed outline for the upcoming parts of the comic, and the stuff that happened in this most recent batch of pages was documented there pretty well
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but already the stuff i wrote in this outline for later batches is not accurate to what i want anymore so to be honest the outlines are kind of a wash for me. what's really the meat of my pre-planning process is i just have a private discord server where i dump notes.
the reason i use a discord server for this is because its super easily accessible from every device i have, and doesnt require backing up between locations. i also just dump chunks of canon text in there that i want to pull exact dialogue from when i'm doing my transcript rereads.
a lot of these notes are completely useless and redundant
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most of them are snippets of dialogue i want to put in on later pages. almost none of this dialogue will ever be used. for starters, a lot of it is different takes on the exact same handful of scenes and so by default are mutually exclusive bits of content. i like to just dump as many ideas as i have in there even if theyre contradictory, and then just read back through and pick my favorite/most appropriate ones as i get to actually drawing whats coming up.
every now and then ill dump all this in a google doc and arrange it roughly chronologically so related takes go together, but i havent done that in like six months so its all just a huge mess right now.
the reason i can get away with such bare bones planning is because i have a very strong mechanical understanding of how this story is supposed to function. in the two and a half years that has gone by since i came up with the idea and started working on it, almost nothing has fundamentally changed in my big picture narrative goals. knowing the exact shape of what i'm building towards makes it really easy to let the more minute details come to me in the moment. they either are congruent with that end goal, in which case they can stay, or they're more extraneous/irrelevant in which case they get cut.
when i get stuck, more often than not i just slide into mia @demonkix's dms and make her hear out my rambling. thanks mia. shoutout to mia.
now, here's probably one of my biggest sins: i do not script anything. there is no finalized dialogue until i am writing it directly onto the page. unless i'm directly lifting from the text, that is. ill have a rough idea of what needs to be said in each page when im drafting, and sometimes i'll write in rough dialogue on the draft. but most of the time ill just sketch out the approximation of the speech bubble andd either leave it fully blank or jot in one or two keywords in to remind me of what the dialogue should be. then the actual dialogue gets written in once the art is finished
do not do this. i can not stress how frustrating this is for myself. i do this every time and i always hate it.
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the reason i dont bother with any proper scripting is because the dialogue bends to the art. not the other way around. a massive amount of my process is dictated by what im in the mood to draw, and by keeping the actual character interactions as flexible as possible until the art is done, i can ensure i dont get stuck at key points because the thing that has to happen is something i dont feel like drawing.
in general, my process for drafting pages is just rough thumbnail -> color rough -> go actually draw the damn thing
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however there ill be times when i just do not bother drafting at all and jump immediately into drawing a page. if you go look at the stuff on patreon youll see that in the beginning i pretty much just drew everything after the first batch straight through.
this comic is a lot of work so the most important thing is that hte process is fun for me. i really hate granular planning and itd just slow me down a ton so the process is really just vibes from point a to point b. hope this somewhat answers your question
i talk about my general approach to comic composition in my big composition writeup too, which is pinned, if thats something youre interested in.
#qm
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cybermeep · 5 months
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bursting through my front door & screen and chirping “i’m home!” to the look of a completely pitch black house.. im glad to be home! today was a bit long.. not entirely, but long to my own perspective. went up and visited my grandmother and the like. stopped and visited another place again— the house next to the water. god i love the house in the ocean*.. anyway! i got to walk on one of the docks. was pondering bringing a certain book with me and taking a photo of it on the dock, but was far too afraid of something going wrong to do said thing. also because it would be reckless.
its worth noting the dock was stable, yet simultaneously finicky at parts. had to make sure i had a decent amount of balance. it was scary! i got to see some seaweed and algae growing, also a horseshoe crab shell. didnt get the chance to catch it, but yknow. (The reason i think it was just the shell was because it wasnt moving— they have their telson for the whole reason of helping themselves flip back up, so i don’t think it was still living..) i also saw a good chunk of other things like tiny minnows swimming about. was able to borrow a net and a small rectangular.. container? not exactly a box.
low tide, found a variety of mussels in the sand. they were strong! glued in there. pulled some out to inspect what ones were alive and what ones were dead. once i was done, plunked some back in the water— quietly regarding how they should get a bit further away from land if they could. didn’t keep any of the mussels, because i dont exactly know the laws surrounding them— but also because i have no clue how i’d take care of one. also because of the simple fact im not a seafood person, so it’s not like i’d eat ‘em either. as i was inspecting along the bay, found the shell of a crab! remarked they must’ve really treated him dirty… then also found the same crabs arm! one of them, anyway. a very mesmerizing red & blue mixture with some white as well. not sure what specific species, but ill make sure to research it later. kept the shell and arm as both a souvenir and something to investigate. feet also hurt extensively after said walk along the bay— water was absolutely freezing. still, was very fun! enjoyed basking in nautical nature..
not sure what ill do now that im home.. likely going to do some sketches and portraits. wish to specifically draw different kinds of noses.. i have a few ideas i haven’t started, might get to those. have a three canvas idea for ‘beauty in the mundane’— and or cyber saying a vague statement because hes dumb again.. the ideas are all different animals but same focal point in each piece! have some thumbnail sketches for it. last time i painted on canvas it didn’t exactly go great.. i’ll see how i feel. also should clean my room a bit more & read more of house of leaves, but that’s always something on my to do list anyway. cant wait for my buddy asbestos.. or hal… im trying to pinpoint what my final names are but because of space odyssey and my indecisiveness theres always more.
*house in the ocean is one of the projects mr. manticore has made! silly and goofy, but its overall message always seems to punch me in the gut.
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myxinidaes · 1 year
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sage and ivy?
sage ⇢ what ‘medium’ of art (poetry, music, fiction, paintings, statues etc.) is the most touching to you? why do you think that is?
oh MAN i go inSAAAAAAAAANE over everything always but i think..... absolutely nothing can beat a perfectly illustrated comic. it's got it all. art. fiction. imagery and shit. and then you have to make it all WORK TOGETHER???? wild. i genuinely think that sequential illustrations are like. peak art. and yeah obviously when its done bad it sucks but i would argue you have a lottt more to think about than illustrating or writing alone. bc its a combination of the two!!!!!! and your writing has to compliment your illustrating and vice versa. if one thing is out of balance it detracts from the entire effect. and since it's a visual art form even the font and font size and the word bubbles/ lack of word bubbles are integral to the experience!!! scott mccloud wrote this book on comics that i think about CONSTANTLY like its so so so complex there are so many things that go into even two panels. and since it's illustrating you can make each individual snapshot of time as complicated with as much symbolism as you want...!
.... my ultimate goal for drawing in 2023 is to start dipping my toes into sequential illustrating. over time my daydreaming has slowly become little comic thumbnails which is kind of embarrassing but also i really really really want to do comics. sorry this isnt actually the question at all i just think comics are so fucking cool.
howEVER. good poetry????? life altering. mary oliver lives rent free in my mind. good writing? makes me feel shrimp emotions. good music? on the ground sobbing. there's this one statue of a woman holding her baby and i saw a picture of it and stared at it for like three minutes straight.....
i don't vibe so much with abstract art, but sometimes it's cool too! someone said that the point of really basic-seeming abstract art was to make people think about why they didnt do it either and i guess that's interesting in the hypothetical but then i go to a modern art gallery and likeeeeee man i dont really care.
ivy ⇢ what are your ‘tells’ for your emotions and moods? how can someone tell you’re happy, annoyed, upset or tired?
i'm pretty constantly tired due to *waves at sleep disorder* so i dont think i have any special tells for that other than yawning and being quiet haha. upset/annoyed is withdrawing or getting snappy
happy/content is for sure talking a lot or singing quietly i am soooooo annoying but also i dont really care! it's nice to be happy and if its not hurting other people. whatever! u know? nobody is being forced to interact with me
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hey! i just wanted to pop by and say that i love your blog loads 🥺🥺 also, i have a question! does roman ever give vee tickles? when they’re big OR small? 💗
aaawW thank u so much for saying so !!
heads up i accidentally made this a ficlet halfway through lol
warning for tickling and teasing
and YES roman tickles vee a lot hsjshdhs you see it on the ic blog quite a lot - if they're hanging out they are actually pretty touchy feely. even when big vee usually ends up in romans lap and he will purposefully be cheeky because he knows roman ends up tickling him as revenge jdhds
just yesterday roman was holding the video game controller out of reach of virgil and fondly teasing him abt being too short to reach it, so vee twisted his septum piercing with his tongue to freak roman out. roman is very grossed out by things easily and dropped the controller to get vee to stop
vee started playing the video game, still sitting in romans lap with a smug smile on his little face... but he was kinda disappointed roman didn't put up more of a (tickle) fight.
so he licked romans cheek
roman freaked out, went to scrub his cheek withm soap, compained on the blog about vee being gross and 'baby snot on his face', then vee just denied it all (purposefully being cheeky to try to get roman to retaliate) until roman started chasing him for revenge
they ended up in virgils room with roman pinning him to the floor. virgil THOUGHT roman was going to lick his cheeks back, but instead roman asked him to admit he did it. virgil denied it and roman started wiggling a finger under his ear
vee squeaked and a giggle escaped
"admit it!" roman demanded
of cours vee knew what would happen if he didnt. so: "no, im innocent!"
then romans other hand circled a finger around the side of his ribs. virgil gasped and started giggling constantly and wriggling under roman
"Last chance, vee-vee!" roman warns with eyebrows raised and a big smile
virgils gigges are squeaky and breathless already, he really is too sensitive for a lot of tickling. but he meets romans eyes for a brief second before they fall shut with another gasp when romans finger brushes a particularly bad tickle spot. "n-no-ho" virgil protests... then he licks his deptum piercing again just to add fuel to the fire
roman cries out in disgust then immediately starts scribbling both his hands quickly over the sides of virgils.
virgil screams and bucks and gasps and blushes so hard
at this point logan appears in the doorway to check what is happening
"h-help, lo-ho" virgil pleads, eyes watering and cheeks aching from laughing so much
"no, don't help Lo!" roman argues, chuckling at vee and kindly slowing his fingers enough to give vee room to breathe between giggles "this is justice for a heinous act!"
logan sniffs in amusement, "well i am not one to stand in the way of justice"
virgils eyes fly open and land on logan "no! pl-hee-he-ease, M-ha-Mama!"
hearing vee call logan mama immediately makes roman stop his fingers, because if vee is starting to regress theres no way he would enjoy such intense tickling
logan steps closer and leans down to better speak to vee. "are you alright, little one?" he asks in a very babytalk voice, then roman stops pinning him and pinches his cheek a little
"hi vee-vee, do you feel tiny?"
and virgil goess BRIGHT RED because he isnt regressing at all, he just used the Mama card to try to get logan to feel sorry for him. he covers his face with his hands and shakes his head and mumbles through his fingers "not little, sorry... just wanted.."
the other two frown. "wanted what, virgil" logan asks.
"do you want me to stop?" roman asks sincerely
virgil wriggles on the floor a little and pulls his hand down from his face enough to chew his thumbnail and reveal one eye and one very pink cheek "no.. just wanted, um... attention" he admits quietly
roman immediately lights up "Ohhhhhh-"
vee whines and covers his face again. roman takes his hands and pulls them away. "let me get this right... did you want more teases?"
vee's silence speaks loudly
"oh my god youre insatiable" roman laughs, but before virgil has time to feel insecure about it roman's fingers start teasing at his ribs again
"i think you have this under control," logan chuckles, then leaves.
"so teasing how tiny you are earier wasn't enough?" roman muses, his fingernails tracing lightly over each individual rib. virgil holds his lips tight to contain a squeal, but it just comes out as a highpitched whimper. "its not enough to just tease how your little arms can't reach when i hold a controller above my head?"
virgil cant respond because one of romans fingers is back under his ear and tickling right under his earlobe and making him titter and squirm
"and i dont think its enough to tease what an itty bitty widdle baby you are, either," roman says in a babytalk voice, laughing when vee whines and tries to hide his red cheeks but then roman pokes his tummy teasingly and vee immediately drops his hands to his tummy protectively. "because we all know what a tiny little cutie you are, with your baby bottles and pacis and your diapers"
"ro-ah!" virgil tried to protest but romans fingers went for the sides of his tummy and all he can do is gasp and wriggle and giggle and hope his cheeks dont catch fire with how much theyre burning
"so i think we'll just stick with teasing you... for how much you love being teased" roman says confidently
"nooo" virgil whines between breathless laughter
"yes, vee-vee" roman laughs. he's drawing little spirals over vee's sides now and it's making vee writhe and squeal
"you love the teases sooo much, how adorable is that, huh?" romans fingers slow down and atart tiptoeing over vee's ribs one by one like theyre stepping stones
vee gasps in a deep breath and lets himself calm down, all while squeaking and smiling so hard
"you pretend to not like it when we tease you for being the shortest, but everytime you get the biggest smile!" romans fingers go up so one wriggles under his ear again and one scribbles at his cheek. vee squeals and shakes his head
"no?!" roman gasps dramatically, "aw, but it's true vee! youre tiny and you love it! and you cant hide it anymore with those cute dimples popping out and your squeaky laughter whenever i hold something out of reach..."
virgils far gone from talking now. he's a flustered giggly mess
"hm and what about how much you love tickles? thats pretty adorable too you know" romans fingers go back to his ribs to circle around slowly and vee instantly curls up, legs bent up to his chest and accidentally trapping romans fingers there
"see!" roman laughs "you love being tickle tickle tickled so much you wont let me take my hands away!" he scribbles his fingers quickly now and vee squeals and rocks on the floor and gasps but his legs still hold romans hands there.
"n-n-no d-doh-ho--"
"no you don't?" roman guesses and virgil nods, eyes squint shut tight with laughter. "yes you do~" roman teases with a sing song babytalk voice. it makes virgils chest feel melty. "you love the tickles vee! Little vee is a little tickly cutie, aren't you?~"
virgil squeaks and gasps. romans fingers slow down and vee breathes through his giggles for a few moments. he's getting to his limit now
"cmon, vee~" roman sings and wiggles his hand sout from between virgils chest and knees. virgil squeals even tho roman wasnt trying to tickle him. roman laughs "if you admit you love teases and tickles then i'll stop"
it takes a couple of minutes for vee to be ready - both because he is so breathless and he keeps getting interrupted by giggle fits even though roman isnt touching him anymore, which just makes roman laugh too - but eventually virgil opens his eyes, squinting past tears of laughter and not bothering to hide his hot cheeks anymore and admits under his breath "i- i um i like being... teased and - and tickled"
"yeah you do" roman agrees with a big smug smile, then he gets up and helps pull vee up from the floor - vee's knees are wobbly and he collapses a little into roman when he is standing and they both laugh and roman keeps an arm around vee's shoulders when they go back to his room to carry on with the video game.
"that wasnt too much, was it?" roman asks a bit meekly after several minute of gameplay.
virgil looks iver to him and sees he refuses to take his eyes off the screen. romans fingers are fidgeting a bit with the controller even though its a cutscene on the screen.
"no," vee whispers, then lets himself wiggle back into romans lap like they'd been before. he looks at the screen as well and breathes deeply when romans arms circle around him. he feels secure and safe in his big brothers lap. "it was perfect" he admits quietly, stroking his fingers over romans arms
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judehayward · 4 years
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lady gaga voice slowly fadin in: ju-Das juda-ah-ah… this depressed goblin bastard is honestly my fav male muse like i dnt typically stick w male muses tht long i struggle bt................. i’ve played him the longest of them all n always seem to return to him. jst cnt stay away. way 2 attached to this absurd little man. it’s nai btw!!!! (josefine on the main). launches right in to jude’s intro without further adieu..... (u can also find his playlist here) 🧙‍🎨
「douglas booth & cis-male」⇾ hayward , jude, the senior radcliffe student’s records show that he is a pisces and 23 years old. he is studying ART, living in moris and can be protective, laidback, nonsensical & apathetic. when i see him i am reminded of wearing a faded smiley face sticker on your forehead while receiving a serious lecture, saying “fuck off” to inanimate objects, lead marbles instead of eyes. ⇽「nai & 23 & gmt & she/her.」
he pinterest:
me in the voice of a card magician performing on the street: round up round up pick a pinterest any pinterest!
ta-da it’s aesthetics:
lead marbles instead of eyes, a stolen hearse careening down the wrong lane, wearing a faded smiley face sticker on your forehead while receiving a serious lecture, bags under the eyes that are so big they could pack enough clothes for a three week vacation, a cigarette wobbling from your bottom lip as you squint against the sunlight, passing out on a stranger’s rooftop, placing sunglasses over the eyes of a biology lab skeleton, gangling around the place like shaggy minus his scooby snacks, saying “fuck off” to inanimate objects
about tha Bitch:
born in sheffield in england, bt they went back and forth between there n san fran a lot
jude was an unhappy accident. his parents never rly used protection bc they were super Liberal n Au Naturel n believed in the pull out method bc… they were maniacs. bt then the ONE time they used a condom in an effort to b safety conscious it broke n hence…. jude was born
they just kind of ran w it bc they had such a passionate relationship tht they were like What The Hell…. may as well! itll be fine we’ll learn to be good parents n love him like normal ppl do
spoiler alert: tht didn’t work out
they were ok to him like they weren’t fully Bad bt they just found him to be a massive burden n hindrance to their plans. pretty absent n irresponsible. they literally….. had sex all day every day n acted like a pair of teenagers. it ws a super weird environment for a kid to grow up in bc he literally had no role models or… guidance or…. anything rly. occasionally they’d joke around w him or pretend they properly knew what grade he was going into but for the most part they just Didn’t Care the way parents shd. they lost his birth certificate n dnt remember what they put as his middle name so he’s jst kind of like hmmmm............. n gives himself a diff one every time ppl ask. past variations hv included: jude pauly hayward, jude maureen hayward, jude van winkle hayward. says all of these w a very straight face
despite this he does hv some nice memories w them. usually he definitely sees them fr holidays. frm being rly young their christmas tradition hs been to get a bunch of chinese food like a Banquet Feast n spend all day smoking n drinking into the early hours. perhaps not the healthiest or most responsible bt 😔 jude rly likes it it’s kind of the one time of yr he feels he has a proper family
they r both suuuuper into the arts. rly good sculptors bt they paint too n they actually own a successful gallery in sheffield n san fran
(trauma tw) as a result he grew up around a lot of creative n sometimes pretentious ppl. the friends of his parents were more present in his life than his ACTUAL parents bc they were always jetting off to diff countries to scout out new pieces fr their galleries n just have a gd time in beautiful places without…. the annoyance tht ws being responsible n looking after someone. tbh some of his parents friends were rly damaging too bt….i won’t go into that just yet. it doesn’t rly…need properly explaining bc jude never talks abt it anyway n it….is rather triggering so i’ll jst….leav it for now tbh. basically they just were Not Nice n jude had a lot of bad memories he keeps repressed bt he also??? has some gd ones..... it was a strange environment bt he’s a survivor
(death n grief tw) he hd to do community service bc he kind of… hd a bit of a breakdown before the funeral of his elderly neighbour who bsically raised him bc her kids rly didnt care abt her they jst wanted her inheritance?? so he… stole the hearse w her casket still in it n ws jst like… drivin around the place sort of… tryin nt to cry…..KJJFHSFKJGHKFG i mean. it isnt funny its actually sad bt :/ in a very bizarre n jude way. he gt caught n taken in fr questioning bt her son kind of realised hw… broken up abt her death jude ws n had a heart n didnt press charges. regardless he stil hd to do community service bc it ws like taken seriously even tho it ws his first proper offence. doin it rly exhausted n depressed him so when he wsnt doin tht he ws just hibernatin in his room……. this ws like 4 months ago nw............ just some fun lore fr u all
bc of how he ws raised he has a p cultured taste. he luvs classic lit n p much anything artsy. he can play piano 2 n sometimes gets rly high n thinks he’s mozart level gd at composing he’s jst going fking wild on the keys in a trance...... i mean he’s gd bt… chill
he’s rly sarcastic n so deadpan like he’ll say smthn completely ridiculous bt he’ll say it w his whole chest so sincere.... it’s rly hard to tell when he’s joking or serious honestly. has an overflowing secret sketchbook n if he cares abt someone he’ll probably secretly draw them. does NOT share these drawings w the person he hates being openly sentimental. at heart he is jst a very Sad Boy w lots of repressed issues like depression genuinely just does NAT giv him a single break bt he plasters over this w wise cracks n never discusses his emotions ever. he’s actually p decent or at least tries to b. he’s kind of like tht bit in superbad where michael cera gets rly drunk n makes a toast to women like tht energy...........
he has rly bad insomnia so he like never sleeps idk how he’s Alive straight up. please go to bed sir............. he always has rly sleepy eyes n rubs them tiredly mid conversation. he smokes a lot of weed to try n compensate fr this n make him tired bt he still struggles a lot
ANYWAY that aside he’s at radcliffe doing art, focusing on fine art like painting is............... the thing he luvs most...... his style is kind of.......... taking normal things n painting w surreal colours.... he likes A LOT of colour in his paintings which is kind of a stark contrast to his personality bc his world’s so.... washed out n grey............ lovs art n philosophy n literature n photography n music.... 
ummMMMMmm honestly idk i’m blankin on what else to say. ull find him smoking weed reading an american classic or gnawing at his thumbnail n getting charcoal smudges on all his clothes. wandering the streets in plaid pj bottoms n dr martens eating frm a cereal box without care in the world. he’s p broody n scruffy n he’s mostly here fr a laidback time....... doesn’t rly like when ppl take themselves too seriously........ likes strange ppl thinks the world is mde richer by them n likes when ppl can jst bounce back jokes at him without being like erm. u dont make sense mate. bc frankly he can come up w some strange stuff sometimes.............. talking to him cn b like navigating a dark n bendy road without a flashlight....... 
(drugs tw) once did shrooms n woke up naked in the woods curled up in a pile of leaves. to this day he recounts this as his werewolf transformation. hs no idea hw he ended up there n when ppl r like are u not. concerned jude. tht is so strange? he jst shrugs like.............. dunno....................... suppose i’m jst a werewolf upon occasion. so casual abt it. jst truly does Not care abt most things at all..... almost to the point tht it’s concerning (sometimes way past the point tht it’s concerning too :/)
this is the desc on an aesthetic i mde of his style once n sums it up well!! ‘additionally: too many pairs of trousers, a hideous amount of white t-shirts all somewhat stained with charcoal, a jumper so thinly knit it almost looks sheer, chipped teale nail varnish, a cream corduroy jacket with a cigarette hole singed onto the cuff, vintage wiry reading glasses he almost never wears, a freshly rolled cigarette behind his ear, a thrifted t-shirt with a warped bart simpson wearing a stethoscope with the caption ‘bard knwos cardiology’ and two crops hacked that way with kitchen scissors that he sometimes wears to paint.‘
EXPERT at rolling spliffs like jst. mkes them so precise n neat....... it’s his super power. his fav thing to smoke frm is banana flavour papers.................... linking 2 this he’s like. bad w emotions bt he does try..... once his friend (maggie) ws sad so he brought her a spliff wrapped in grape flavoured paper bc it’s her fav fruit n jst like. wordlessly gave it to her. it’s the thought tht counts.....
PLOTS!!!!!
plays bass in a band which cld b a fun connection to get together??? i picture the music being like surf rock type like........... mac demarco...... bt he also luvs elliott smith n glass animals n the cure n metronomy n neutral milk hotel n talking heads n radiohead n mazzy star n wolf alice...................... idk jst like.... within tht ballpark i suppose i imagine it being................
mayb ppl he shares classes w?????? i’d like someone tht does a similar course n they hang out tgether when it comes to trips fr the module to museums or exhibits or wtever................ they both stand in front of paintings analysing it rly wrong n saying stuff like hmmmmmmmmm....... i do declare i see a, uh..... large phallus protruding from the centre of this image...... moves something in me.......... n some elderly person looking at it besides them is like Ergh. sickened n disgraced. leaves w a brow severely furrowed
someone he smokes w on the moris rooftop late at night when he cnt sleep??? mayb they’re up n cnt sleep either fr whtever reason n it’s become an unspoken kind of ritual where they always clamber out n find each other there n jst wordlessly keep them company
jude is kind of like. protective almost to a fault sometimes........... mayb some guy he’s punched......................... if they hurt someone he cares abt........... typically it wld hv been a girl he ws kind of like. affected by his first relationship bc she had a bad home situation n ever since jst wnts..... to Protect it’s kind of like an automatic instinct ingrained in him nw 😔 all sounds very noble n well bt sometimes it cn b a bit of an escalation i wnt lie
perhaps a few hook-ups??? jude doesn’t tend to sleep w ppl he rly knows bc he just..... likes it to b an impersonal thing doesn’t like getting attached fr various reasons so mayb they only kno each other via this OR mayb he bent his rules a bit..... cld either work seamlessly or hv added drama if one side hs mre feelings or whtever
currently living in moris w 2 roommates bt i’d love some neighbours perhaps..... mayb someone tht lives directly nxt door to his room n is like ://// bc he plays music loud n weeds always drifting frm his window n mking their room smell if theirs is open too................. or mayb they get on..... mayb there’s a rly mean seagull tht lands on a branch n poos on pedestrians n they both commentate on it frm their windows like david attenborough...... they’re like he’s at it again. they’ve named him n everything
HONESTLY anything if u have an idea hmu i’d love 2 hear it.......... rubs my hands tgether in excitement to plot up a storm w u all
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comicteaparty · 4 years
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June 20th-June 26th, 2020 Creator Babble Archive
The archive for the Creator Babble chat that occurred from June 20th, 2020 to June 26th, 2020.  The chat focused on the following question:
What is something you’re just not very good at right now writing and/or drawing in general?
Deo101 [Millennium]
mysteries. 100% I can not write mysteries!
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
ears
Deo101 [Millennium]
the connection between legs and torso. No not hips, I can draw hips fine, but like the movement aspect of it
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
Action scenes. Orchestrating fights or big motions on the page... it doesn’t come naturally to me! I have to look at a lot of reference to see how other artists do it. Impact shapes, speed lines, anything to convey movement...
But I am slowly building a vocabulary of... fight shapes? I’m calling them fight shapes, haha
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I feel that
Your feeling I feel deeply
"visual library" is a term that comes to mind
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Composition. I just talked about this earlier today, but.... yup. Composition is my bane.
Mitzi (Trophallaxis)
I'd like to get better at writing in general. I have a lot of trouble verbalizing things I see in my head, and so I gotta rely on images and thumbnails to get any idea across, sometimes. otherwise im a windbag and use 5000 words to say 0-1 things, lmao
carcarchu
I have trouble writing simply. I always want to embellish, add extra details, more characters and make everything more complicated and i worry it ends up making things unnecessarily convoluted
Drawing-wise i hate drawing hands
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
The legit thing I am worse at writing is fucking
Deo101 [Millennium]
omg
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
essays to convince people to hire me
Deo101 [Millennium]
OH OKAY
WAY TO CUT IT OFF
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
YEAH
Mitzi (Trophallaxis)
OH
carcarchu
let her finish deo
Mitzi (Trophallaxis)
comedic timing at its finest
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
omg
I was very confused for a sec(edited)
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
but seriously like speaking of filling gaps this is what I'm legit struggling most with right now so any help much appreciated
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
raises hand
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I need to write a personal statement and every time I sit down to edit I want to die
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I volunteer as tribute
writing is basically the only thing I'm really good at
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
It's not the writing I hate
It's the writing about me
carcarchu
is that the thing where you have to write in 3rd person? like those blurb things on people's websites?(edited)
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
It just feel so gross whoring out my deeply held passions and struggles for a spot in med school
No I'm talking about college essays lmao sorry for derailing
The blurb things are an interesting topic though!
Have you guys writtent those before and does anyone actually like writing them?
carcarchu
i had to write a blurb about myself for my university's website and yeah it was uncomfy
lemme see if i can find it
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I HATE writing those
because I just start like, "Crona J. is an artist and writer from Chicago......." And I have no idea how to continue
Deo101 [Millennium]
god yeah even just writing a profile or about me is hard enough!!!
I'm always like "deo - 22 - she/her - illustrator - webcomic author - student" and then i leave it
thats it thats all you get
depending on the platform i MIGHT put bi - disabled and thats it!!!!
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
yeah
half of the stuff I write doesn't even feel relevant to the audience either
who cares that I have been drawing since I was 12 lol?
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Mate I don't even write those. My bio is like "UCSD" "Read my comic"
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
hahaha
Deo101 [Millennium]
I also always feel like when I see "ive been drawing since I was 5!" I kinda think like... well everyone has been -_- like this doesnt tell me anything, how long have you been an aspiring pro, how long have you been studying art...? that tells me more
so I never put that kind of stuff in my biod either
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
yeah, and also, I didn't go to prestigious school, so I don't even include my college
and I only have one comic project so far, just under a chapter
so what do I write?
Not that important an issue, but irksome nonetheless
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I don't include my school because it's prestigious, I include it because it's not an art college
Deo101 [Millennium]
owch
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I want fellow stem-y yet artsy people from my school to recognize me as one of them(edited)
DEO stop interupptung me at the worst points!!
Deo101 [Millennium]
i love jumping to conclusions. so no.
Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)
If it's a bio where I can talk about the comics, I try to spotlight a few tropes/genres that'll catch the eye of potential readers. Not a full-fledged summary, just a quick hit of If You Like These Words, You'll Probably Like Reading It. ("Fantasy, comedy, shapeshifters, PTSD, time travel, cats")
Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)
And if it's gonna be personal, same deal with bits of personal info -- not trying to be a Comprehensive Biography, just pulling a few details that are relatable connection points
The problem with "I've always wanted to be a writer/artist/cartoonist" isn't just how generic it is, the problem is also the vibe of "here's my thing, your role in this is to support me"
Whereas if you say something like "I like drawing cute girls and writing fantasy," the response can be "oh hey, I like seeing cute girls and reading fantasy, tell me more!"
Or if you go with "Sailor Moon fan, will put extra cheese on everything," people can go "cool, that's relatable, we can like Sailor Moon and cheese together." It gets at your shared investment in a fun thing, it's not about expecting them to be personally invested in you
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
I think perhaps the most fundamental thing is "you can't please everyone." I've never liked the 'random food related weird tidbit tacked on' thing because it feels too try-hardish to me, but I understand for other people, it's not a matter of trying too hard and is genuinely how they just talk.
Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)
Oh definitely, you hold out for a bio that connects with everyone and you'll never get it done
AntiBunny
Personally I'm not great at drawing cars. It's why all my cars early on in the comic were side view only, and old blocky looking things. It was all I could do. I've been getting better by using references.
Every so often I buy a little hotweels or matchbox car when I'm buying groceries. I aim for realistic ones based on real vehicles, especially utility vehicles like ice cream trucks, ambulances, fire trucks, and whatnot you'd see every day in a city. I keep a little box of them on my desk, so if the scene calls for a car to be visible, I have a reference that can help me get all the curves and angles right.
Sure beats drawing from memory, but also practice time in the sketchbook with them is a necessity.
Now crowd scenes are beginning to be my bane. Not because they're hard to draw, just because they're time consuming.
Suddenly I realize why old episodes of Sailor Moon has cities with people free sidewalks and empty streets.
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
That's a great idea, gathering the model cars! I should do that for a future comic.
kayotics
I also struggle with cars so, uh, my comic takes place in fantasy 1700-1800s
But also horses are bad too
Cars and horses! They suck
Deo101 [Millennium]
do what I did and make up an easier animal to draw than a horse ;)
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Vehicles in general. Should just put everyone on roller blades and be done with it
Deo101 [Millennium]
I'd lov that tbh
kayotics
I’ve considered making something other than horses......
Deo101 [Millennium]
I highly encourage it, the people love it and also so does my brain
kayotics
Or else lean into them being ugly
Deo101 [Millennium]
heres the trick about horses though they look really weird and as small as you make their legs, when you think "this is way too thin..." youre wrong and their ankles are probably smaller than that
kayotics
The thing that gets me is their faces
Deo101 [Millennium]
... mask
kayotics
Hahaha
I should just make deer the normal mode of transport
Deo101 [Millennium]
that would be really cute tbh
kayotics
I love deer and they’re cute
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Just exaggerate them to the point where it looks like a style choice
Your people already have unrealistic proportions
Why not the horses too
kayotics
That’s how I draw buildings tbh because I hate buildings
Deo101 [Millennium]
I also gave horses dog mouths, maybe do something like that? someone can be like "horses dont look like that?" and as long as youre consistent you can say "they do in this world!!!"
kayotics
Oh god no that’s like a devil creature
Deo101 [Millennium]
yeah they look horrible but its fun
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I legit remember saying that to you deo lmao
Deo101 [Millennium]
ive had dog horse for years you didnt give me this
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Not the they look horrible part
kayotics
I’ve already got beasts, I don’t need horses to look WORSE than they did
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Bwah I remember
Time to archive dig(edited)
Deo101 [Millennium]
I love dog horse
kayotics
Honestly it’s good but they scare me
Deo101 [Millennium]
yeah... maybe instead give them cat mouths
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
https://discordapp.com/channels/472908933045026827/634081658018070549/688589449562423422
wait omg this is the message that led to your first dm to me lmao
Deo101 [Millennium]
is it??? omg i think it is... historical moment
dog horse brings us together
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Another point to convince kay to draw uncanny animals!
Deo101 [Millennium]
what I do to make birds fun to draw is making them sparkly
maybe try that
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
god you're gonna ruin kay's carefully crafted aesthetic
is this your competitiveness showing its face again(edited)
Deo101 [Millennium]
they can make it work! why do you doubt their abilities
make this the main mode of transport
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
ah is that how it works in that case i have 10 shitty indie game ideas
make them pls
Deo101 [Millennium]
implying my ideas are shitty??? rude!
kayotics
I have an aesthetic?
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Or if you want to be very efficient, everyone in universe can teleport
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
lmao you have an excellent aesthetic
crona
i do that already
kayotics
Crona.... that’s my comic already!! Haha
Deo101 [Millennium]
kay does also have teleporting to be clear
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
don't underestimate my laziness!
Deo101 [Millennium]
LMAO
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
See
It must be great advice
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
oh crap you're right kay also does have teleporting
and unrealistic beasts, to be fair
kayotics
Sometimes on the same page
That’s the eyes I draw on the beasts
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Or be even lazier, and make it so that horses and beasts either don't exist or haven't been domesticated in that region. Everyone walks. Their feet hurt, but their calves are glorious.
Deo101 [Millennium]
you get it
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
wait crona and deo also have comics where teleportation could exist
will you join us?
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
lol, yup
Deo101 [Millennium]
nope
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
(nah, I've already drawn horses. They're not so bad if you stare at photos)
sierrabravo (Hans Vogel is Dead)
drawing horses is fun!!
[multiple people are typing]
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
And there will also be hella walking, because the leg game must be strong, otherwise I'm not doing my job
Deo101 [Millennium]
ive decided that millennium is like really in the future but things like time travel, teleportation, warp speed... nope! You can go really fast in a spaceship but like nothin crazy
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
man these planets real close together then
or maybe people just live a really long time ...?
Deo101 [Millennium]
I just do my version of teleporting which is "wow it'll take a week to get there" and then its a week later
dont worry about it
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
nice
Deo101 [Millennium]
its not realistic, but its consistent
🌈ERROR404 🌈
ahhhh horses are really nice to draw imo, if i can get it right lol
Deo101 [Millennium]
I like drawing horses a lot I just never do it tbh
🌈ERROR404 🌈
something needs to fuel my addiction to cowboy culture
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Consistency is key tbh
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I just do my version of teleporting which is "wow it'll take a week to get there" and then its a week later
when my whole comic takes place in like a week lmao
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
if you decide that gravity doesn't exist in your world, as log as you're consistent with it, you're golden
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
in the unlikely event i get tired of drawing my comic i can adopt deo's strat "wow it'll take a week to get to the ending"
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
My comic takes place in about a year (not counting flashbacks which span... uh... a very long time)
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
"man sure seems like this conflict will take approximately a week to be resolved" "one week later"
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
hahaha
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
"sure did get resolved"
the end
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
convenient
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
i wonder if anyone's done that
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
One Korean series I followed for years did it
and everyone was pissed, as you can imagine
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
lol
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
better than cancellation?
Deo101 [Millennium]
LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
what a way to go
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
I'd honestly have preferred cancellation/ abandonment
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Just have a fan finish it for you at that rate lmao
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
OH that's a good discussion topic. If you got tired of your comic, or life got in the the way of you working on it anymore, how would you end it as quickly as possible?
Deo101 [Millennium]
maybe rephrase that a little
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I would toss it at my little sis, and she would do it for me, no joke
Deo101 [Millennium]
My little sister also would probably take over it for me
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
let's move to general?
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
eyyy!
Deo101 [Millennium]
but also I could just be like "They got an email that john died of old age its over now"
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
MVP sisters!
lol
an email
what a way to end it
eliushi [Keyspace]
For me it’s panels. Past me thought that the four panel structure would make things easy. Nope. It’s limiting how I want to tell the story so... I’m trying to branch out now and looking for other inspirations for panel and layout
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Just change the shape of your panels. It forces you to be creative.
eliushi [Keyspace]
True true! I have those in upcoming updates
But my heart swoons for the page spreads
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
oh yes
They are so gorgeous, but difficult to plan
eliushi [Keyspace]
Initially I was planning on storyboards but now I’m more comfortable with comics I think I’ll be aiming for traditional layouts
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yeah, storyboards are an entirely different beast
Desnik
I'm currently working on clearly portraying character motivation
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I think for me I don't draw animals often and rip have to draw a few for the upcoming pages so I'm just doing my best at this point lol
AntiBunny
Panel arrangement is the heart of comics as an art form. It takes practice, and study to learn how the eye flows from one thing to the next.
And once you have a thorough understanding of the rules you can learn how to carefully break them to produce something truly eye catching.
If I had to say the simplest rule to understanding flow is, if you need arrows to tell you which direction to read, then you're doing something wrong.
DanitheCarutor
This is candy for my self-deprecating mentality. Lol Honestly though. I'm not the best at writing in general, I don't like doing it physically, avoiding it at all cost (outside of dialogue and poorly done bullet points on scrap paper.) so I don't really know if/think I'm particularly good at it. I remember the last time I tried to physically write something was back in high school, I still have it saved on my computer, but it was something else. Too many dialogue scenes and overly detailed descriptions of things and characters. I only made it a little ways before giving up with "You know, this will be easier to just show than describe.". Story and character wise for my current comic, I'm not sure how well it's turning out or how good it will be in the end, my brain defaults my work to mediocre so I tend to be totally blind to what I'm doing right. I know my characters aren't the best for sure since they're all fleshy flaw bags with too many flaws, and I know I could have presented certain scene changes and such better, but that's all I can think of objectively. The art portion is something I at least know I can execute decently, but my color composition is the worst. I'm aware that I need to improve it, and I know what needs to be done, but it's something I can't really accomplish with my comic since I just want to focus on finishing pages. I'll have to make time to draw up some throw-away illustrations to experiment with, which I hope to have a little bit of now that I'm not on a regular update schedule. Also I can't draw vehicles and architecture for the life of me, I've referenced and studied but I still can't wrap my head around it. ALSO extreme angles and perspectives are still things I need work on, like 4-point circular perspective, ground level shots and over the head shots.
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
There's a lot of things I want to improve, but something I haven't seen mentioned yet: I would like to get better at deciphering feedback, how to glean useful things from multiple conflicting feedback.
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Ooh that's a good one keii
I haven't really had to deal with that before though because all the negative feedback I've gotten is pretty consistent
Can I ask what the conflicting feedback you got is?
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Oh gosh, I legit spent a long, long moment trying to figure out where to even start
eliushi [Keyspace]
I really like this approach to feedback
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Yo Eli this is so good
eliushi [Keyspace]
Mary robinette is goals
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
this is spectacular already
wow
eliushi [Keyspace]
Pretty sure a wiser writer passed this onto me I have since used it a lot and it works for me
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
This is so so good Perfectly said about crits in creative fields
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
One example I can think of isn't actually something that was criticized, but showed up a lot in various ways: "this is (supposed to be) an exciting adventure romp centering Danbi" vs "this is an emotional journey story centering Ethan" ... Not a criticism, but two very conflicting interpretations. People who have one interpretation are shocked and confused when I tell them about the other one.
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Holy crap, Eli... This is one for the folder of absolute knowledge
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
woah, excellent advice
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
And yeah, that is a really good one. Symptoms are extremely useful, and diagnoses tend to be more useful in a conversation rather than a one-way "here is my diagnosis" thing
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I haven't heard it said before but the explaining eliminating a clean reaction rings so true to me
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Ahhh, this is literally the one document I have needed my entire life
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
also the helping someone tell the story they want
also the stream of consiousness, MAn
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I think I'll save that for my future high schoolers lol
some of the stuff said there is what I've noticed in the last few years critquing in academic settings but its nice to kno!
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
People have given me stream of consciousness reactions before and they were the most helpful. Almost all the changes in the story from others' reactions were from stream of consciousness reactions, not intentional critiques
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Yeah, one of the most helpful "critique" I ever got was also completely unintentional
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
One of the most useful tips in this guide for me in particular is the "As a writer don't:" section. I struggle with it a lot.
On the note of things we are bad at in the comic-making process, I am very bad at taking critiques!(edited)
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
tbh for a long time, my biggest struggling point that's not in the "as a writer don't:" is "don't throw yourself into the void of self-hate." I'm better now, but boy, when it was bad, it was bad.
But perhaps that kinda thing better fits into "as a person don't:"
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I am pretty good at taking critiques, but pretty bad at giving critiques! Right now the point I'm at is I'm just gonna not give critiques until I'm more mature
But then after I decided that an amateur writer friend told me his story idea that I not only disliked but was sort of offended by
and I really wanted to tell him but I didn't know how to do it nicely...
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
ooof
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
oh no
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
yeah, that's really tough
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
rip I tend to do kinda a sandwich method. I had to say some rough things few days ago on a practice pitch run and I pretty much said
Deo101 [Millennium]
Uh oh
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
"Your idea is developing for sure, but I think you need to reconsider some of the world building choices you done. Have you thought of researching such and such."
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
That's basically what I said
But I think I had to say "research ffs" in increasing intensity like 3 times lol
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Oh, nice, the "let's give them compliments too so that they know I'm not just being mean" method
It's a good method tbh
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
Rip it's not that like
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Deo might have something to say about this but it was about schizophrenics in a mental institution being portrayed in a real weird way by someone who didn't know anything about it(edited)
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Ooof
Deo101 [Millennium]
Ah man
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
ewww
Deo101 [Millennium]
I'll always stand by "asking people who've lived what you're writing about is the best form of research and can't be replaced"
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
Yeah I would said the to the person consider researching more on the topic and interview folks who have schizophrenia
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Dude I brought you up lmao
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
and also like "is there a reason you want to depict it this way?"
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
oooh
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah I know I'm agreeing idk... Idk what else I'd have to say on the topic
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
That's a very good question to ask someone
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
and depending on their responses, I would just put my two scents in there that rip
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah I always ask "what are your goals?" Before I ask anything else
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
critiques are kinda my strong point sinc eLMAO I do em all the time in my class
and teaching so yeah LOL
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Deo I mean I brought you up to this guy like saying "my friend messaged people online and they were super willing to talk to her you could do that"
Deo101 [Millennium]
OHHHHH gotcha
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I try my best to figure out what they want out of it and just deliever with some handful of suggestions
but I won't sugarcoat it unless you're a high school student or younger lmao
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah I'm often told I'm a lil too harsh but like idk
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I wouldn't say sugar coating it per say... More just telling them what their strengths are too, so that they have an idea of where they're at
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
telling someone their strengths is just as useful as telling them their flaws
that way they can highlight them
like just because you story has no flaws doesn't mean it's good right?
gotta have stuff that stands out in a good way as well
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Someone once phrased it as "Let's list everything that's wrong here, and find out how we can fix them" vs "How do we take this to the next level?" and that really resonated with me. It's not about sugarcoating; it's more about helping them get to the next level in the direction they wanna go.
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
THIS
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah I try to point out things that are going well, and I usually try to only point at things that ppl can work on immediately
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I should phrase my statement more clearly. But yeah Kei that's what I usually look for when critiquing
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
There's often no need to tell them "your writing is only at level 3, and that's bad because the max level is 99." Just tell them how to get to level 4.
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I dont' see it like its something bad but something that is challenging to them at the time
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Unless they have extremely unrealistic expectations or whatever that are standing in their own way
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
just have to figure out how to get out of the hump
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
Yep. I see this phenomenon in animation a lot. A good animation director will help you boost your existing work to something stronger, but still yours. A bad one will tell you to do it their way, and chide you for doing it ‘wrong.’
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
rip I know a person like that and lmao
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yessssss
That's why I always ask "what are your goals" to start
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yup
🌈ERROR404 🌈
I totally agree!!!! A LOT of the most important bits of great criticism is understanding exactly where the original creator was intending to go, and formatting your statements around helping them achieve that!!!!!!!
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Critiques are impossible if you don't know what the person is trying to achieve
🌈ERROR404 🌈
Just stating things that you would change if you were making it may seem useful and relevant to you the critic, but unless the creator is headed the exact same direction as you, they have just as much reason to invalidate the entire statement as they do to nit pick out the things they care to agree with
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Sometimes a prospective critic is simply too far removed from the target audience of the work, like on a fundamental level, and it makes it impossible to give them useful feedback. I think it's important to acknowledge that this can happen. It happens to me a lot and I just decline to give crits when it does.
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yeah, like don't ask me to critique a comic about sports lmao
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I agree on that notion, esepcially when seeing professional aritsts giving crits to folks starting out but it doesn't go as er ideal as they thought it would be
Deo101 [Millennium]
That's why I usually only seek out criticsm (for more than just general direction/advice) from people who's work I like
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I remember reading advice on getting beta readers, and it’s really REALLY important that they’re excited for your stuff. They want to make it better. They care. They can give critique, but they absolutely must be jazzed about your subject matter in some way, or else it’ll be a slog for everyone.
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
for me, I have my peers who I contact daily and we give each other advice, tips
despite having er difference interests in fields, but we experienced a lot in our program lol
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yes... (Speaking of if anyone wanted to beta read my next comic uhhhh let me know id love to have u)
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
very good point claire
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
100 percent agree Get people who are excited and know your vision
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah I have a small group of writer friends who know all my goals and a lot of my stuff? So they make a very good little critique circle, and we all help eachother
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I'm always ready to beta read if it's a concept I enjoy
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
like people who critique comics they hate. I'm like, damn, tough work but also ?? why
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
(Be careful about people who are excited about what they think is your vision.............)
Deo101 [Millennium]
Fish is this a callout for me
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
slightly?
Deo101 [Millennium]
Ahsjfkdjdkskdjdjdj
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
Keii I experienced the oppisisite like rip
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
it's just mystifying to me, I don't think it's wrong or anything
Deo101 [Millennium]
Also crona I'll send u when I'm at my comp
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
sure
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
What do you mean Tuyetnhi?
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Ohh that would be oof to deal with Kei
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I had to let a person down to reality bc I know they're excited about their idea but uhhhh
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
(Is it the fish romance?)
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
it wasn't engaging to me
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yes that one qjdjfkskdkk
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
nor my illustration friends
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I don’t have beta readers but I think that’s how it all goes lol
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
and we were like
"AAAAAAA"
Deo101 [Millennium]
Oh that's awkward
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Ooooooohhhhhhh... oof
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I have a couple friends I send pages to sometimes but they're always really positive about it
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
It was a rough critique
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Having creative friend circles is so essential for growth and screaming at eachothers works for motivation too
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yessss
Also just the ability to talk about your process without having to explain yourself
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
agreed lol
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I occasionally tap my fiance's shoulder and shove my sketches in his face with zero context, just to make sure he can figure out what's going on without me explaining. Super helpful
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I feel like I have a couple friends where, when I read their stuff, I know things that would amp their work up tenfold. But until they ask me... I’m screaming inside lol
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
lol
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
my friend always makes me feel like i'm a better writer than i am because she thinks so much like me she gets everything i write perfectly lol. But then I post and the comments are like "wtf i'm confused"(edited)
eliushi [Keyspace]
Yeah feedback is most effective when both sides are open and invested
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Claire Senpai Wants To Help
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
also same crona(edited)
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
It’s not bad, I just go I THINK I CAN HELP YOU MAKE IT AWESOMER AHHHHHH
eliushi [Keyspace]
Claire senpaiiii
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
But until then I remain still and supportive
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
why don't you ask them "can i suggest things?"
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah I try and keep my mouth shut
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
or "do you want suggestions?"
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
lol
eliushi [Keyspace]
I usually say what I like about it first and then. Are you looking for feedback?
Deo101 [Millennium]
Tbh hearing "can I suggest things?" Usually comes off kinda like "I see stuff wrong with this :)" which can hurt a little even then
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
YEeeeah
🌈ERROR404 🌈
At least for my comic, i have sent bits and pieces for critique from creators i am friends with , but i'm really hesitant promoting myself because I don't feel like I'm not at a place to even get a critique i'll be able to make anything of. O(--( i really don't know what I'd do if someone tried to seriously analyze my plot and break down the story right now
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
It's really hard, because a lot of people (myself included) get scared when someone else asks, "Do you need help?"
Deo101 [Millennium]
I usually trust ppl to say whether they're looking for feedback
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Its always so tricky to gague the reactions of that. Some people handle that better than others So i only offer when they open up
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
Based on how people can get about even the offer of critique, yeah, I tend not to say anything. That’s their baby. If they want to open that door, then I’ll poke my head in
eliushi [Keyspace]
True too. I’m already in forums where feedback is wanted so I’m already in selection bias
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yeah, I like to only offer crits if someone is asking for it for that reason
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
for the record i'm always open to critiques
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
kinda mutal agreement on don't chime in unless asked lol
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah, at least in my groups we send things like "hey this and this are bothering me? Can you help?" And other than that it's just support
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yeah, that's a good idea
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
for both parties. For me, If it's something that I need thoughts I ask but otherwise, lmao my social circles ask me for help for their art stuff
Deo101 [Millennium]
We never agreed on that btw it's just kinda how it goes
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
That's a nice group way to handle that AND make the space more breathable for others who are more nervous about crit work
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
exactly
eliushi [Keyspace]
There’s a time and place for everything and feedback is no different
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah! Like here we have seperate chats for help and sharing
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yuss
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
When someone asks me if I'm open to suggestions, my reaction is usually "nOOoooOo..." but not always. I think it helps a ton if there's an existing rapport, like if I already know this person gets, REALLY gets, my work.
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
And that's okay Keii!
eliushi [Keyspace]
Yeah I’m super thankful for my betas for that
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
yee same
eliushi [Keyspace]
It’s very rewarding when people are also invested in your work to make it better within your means and style
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Honestly u gotta do whats best for u and ur mindset in the end.
Deo101 [Millennium]
It also is a little but awkward to say "no I'm not open to suggestions' cause it feels like you're saying "I don't care to improve" when in reality it's more like "no... I'm happy with this and I don't want it to be soured"
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I love the fact that if I post in #creator_art_share, nobody will critique me unless I ask. And if I post in #art_help, I can get that help. So incredibly nice
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Yes! Thats very respectful
eliushi [Keyspace]
So key
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Omg Deo.....such a mood LOL
Deo101 [Millennium]
I always feel so bad saying no thanks but it's like it looked good I thought
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
omg, I felt that in my soul
We beat ourselves up enough as it is
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Sometimes i know my work can be farty but... I dont also want perfection in every facet of my pieces too and thats okay! Some are learning pieces, others more indulgent
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah!
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I think I'd be very hesitant to accept ideas that will utterly break my core plot... unless someone comes out and outright tells me something about it is offensive or wrong or otherwise bad. But critique on the connective tissue between the bones, so to speak, heck yes. I've gotten some much better ideas from that.
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
e.e even if i post in art share i would be honored to receive a critique from any of you
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Oh, if someone comes to me with suggestions that are that incompatible with my vision, I'm getting outta there.
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
but i don't wanna post every single thing i do in art help hm
but maybe i should
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
I am SO getting outta there.
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I did had some suggestions that didn't... really help with my comic most of it are just comments and not pure criticism
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Just post it lol
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah it's probably best to leave crit in the crit section so as not to break that unspoken rule.
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
To signal to the rest of us
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Yea your vision is key, and i find that people who crit the work need a basic understanding of it for it to be a True Crit
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Yeah it's probably best to leave crit in the crit section so as not to break that unspoken rule.
good point
i wouldn't want people critiquing me to make others feel like it's okay to do that to everyone
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
A good attitude!!! Y'all are very respectable this is a wonderful topic
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
yeee
eliushi [Keyspace]
I think the best feedback is one where it makes your work become more effective within your vision. Sometimes it’s finding the betas who are invested but I also find betas who focus on different crafts also can offer a lot of wisdom. I find it comes down to being open and it’s never a bad thing to ask for clarification
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
[also writes this down for a potential lesson actvity for high schoolers] (edited)
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Yeah, a critique is supposed to help the work become a better version of itself, not a better [something else]
Deo101 [Millennium]
Mostly with true beta reading I am looking for "how clear is my work coming off to someone who knows nothing of my lore and backstory etc?"
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I like the idea of having at least one beta reader who's a writer, and at least one who's not. The writer can dissect things a bit more than a 'civilian' could while the civilian can look at surface-level things and react as the audience majority might.
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
multiple beta readers are a blessing lol
Deo101 [Millennium]
Cause with my friends, they already know everything I'm planning, so i worry a lot that they are putting together things that a regular reader wouldn't
So yeah same thing as a "civilian" reader, sort of!
eliushi [Keyspace]
For sure. Within my critique group I have novelists, webcomic creators and artists. Those who read the complete script and those who haven’t. It’s important to have all sides I find
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
Dang you people with your luxury of multiple beta readers... I don't even have one (but it's mostly my fault; my scripts are unreadable)
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
omg lol
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
i'm sure you could use many of us as beta readers if you wanted to!
varethane
that surface-level 'first gut reaction' crit can be SO useful
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I change dialogue too frequently for a beta reader to have a fair chance, lol
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I started early with one years ago, but now I have like 5-10ish but they can't help me at the same time lmao
varethane
I agree upthread with when it was said that some of the most helpful crit was given unintentionally lol
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
same. i asked some people, including deo and crona, for a beta read of a script a while back but then ended up changing most of it lol(edited)
eliushi [Keyspace]
Most of my betas I found in forums like these! I’m sure a lot of us want to help each other out!
Deo101 [Millennium]
I usually only share stuff once I have at least a solid sketch and dialogue is in
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
so much changes in the thumbnail/layout stage for me. SO MUCH. whole scenes get swapped/cut/extended
I never keep it the same way
Deo101 [Millennium]
I don't like to share scripts cause also I don't usually script much anyways lol
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
@keii’ii (Heart of Keol) As a long-time reader of HoK, I would be more than happy to beta read if you ever wanted it. Just throwing that out there!
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
same Lazuli like
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I'd love to beta read for anyone too
varethane
I prefer sharing sketched pages because my scripts usually change SO much in between being written and going onto the page
like, sometimes they're outright unrecognizable
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
@Deo101 [Millennium] Same. The couple times I really wasn't unsure about a scene, I had to find someone and give them cleaned up thumbnails
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah I don't share more than sketched pages with dialogue
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
SUPER cleaned up thumbnails
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
from thumbnail to final, like they aren't the same from before lmao
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Most helpful critique for me was just someone engaging with the story. "Man I love - and -, they're such good friends, but - pisses me the fuck off" and that was my intention, but i realized it was coming on a bit stronger than i liked and changed the next scene dramatically to make a future plot point where the last character needs to be trusted feel more earned(edited)
varethane
(anyone who seriously is down for beta reading, I have 3 finished chapters burning a hole in my buffer hhnnnnggggg)
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah cause also like, 80% of the crit is usually "well this paneling is unclear" kind of stuff too
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
also i don't mind if anyone is asking me to beta read
Deo101 [Millennium]
Which you can't do from a script anyways
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
or (I don't usually do this often but)
I'm also a sensitivity beta reader too
so if you have questions about POC stuff, asian-american, er mixed-asian or mixed-black experiences
I'm willing to help lmao
but i'm just one perspective to the table
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
A lot of comments, not critiques, have influenced scenes I put later too. Things to clarify, expand, emphasize. I take every comment like that as an idea. I love knowing what the readers hope to learn.
eliushi [Keyspace]
I’m in the midst of a 180k plus word count novel beta and alphaing a couple works but once that’s all done, happy to take a look too
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
holy
Deo101 [Millennium]
Wowie
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Getting trustful beta readers i gotta say again is so important bc sometimes when asking for some, u run into betas that are there to just exploit that privilege too (tho rare) And!!!! Be respectful of ur betas on the other side of the spectrum
Deo101 [Millennium]
Exploit how?
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
like to read your work early?
eliushi [Keyspace]
Definitely pick your betas wisely
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Usually just the free ride of Knowing the Story or the opportunity to just Constantly Crit (non helpful) bc of personal reasons
Deo101 [Millennium]
Damn
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I'm imagining having someone sneak in as a beta and reveal they're a rabid toxic fan trying to influence the plot to their liking. As an absolute worst scenario
Deo101 [Millennium]
Spooky
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Yea.... There's def ppl out there that would do that THOUGH RARE again. I think that's more of like Competition in the field or spite? But ive heard it happening and its not cool
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
like people just looking for a free ticket to complain about your work?
i can see that
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
Oh yeah, I had folks like that before
after that I'm just like "thank you for your time" and block them after LMAO
Deo101 [Millennium]
That sucks :(
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
hhhhhhh
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Yea And u can always tell a sincere crit from a one that comes from a place of malice and ill intent pretty easy.
eliushi [Keyspace]
Exactly
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
oof
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Still!!! A horrible experience
Deo101 [Millennium]
:< yeah
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yeah.. I've never had anything like that happen, but wow... that's a terrifying notion
eliushi [Keyspace]
You tend to want to know your betas more than just them being a reader too. I like to think my betas are my friends and it’s a two way street where I help them too
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Some betas sign papers of confidentiality to avoid these instances of people running off with ur work too
eliushi [Keyspace]
There are paid betas but that’s business side and yeah Krispy
Deo101 [Millennium]
/stress
eliushi [Keyspace]
I don’t have them for mine
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Its scary bc we're all so small and our work is mainly for free U have to be wary of this
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I could easily see myself getting sucked into a bad situation like that I trust people too easily sometimes
but ugh... ya gotta learn
eliushi [Keyspace]
It’s good to know the risks. That being said, I think the rewards of having a good beta far exceed the bad apples. You have to set good boundaries
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Not that any of yall would do this omgjghg
Deo101 [Millennium]
Same Claire ajdjdnsdjjjdjdjdjddj
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
gonna steal all y'alls IDEAS
eliushi [Keyspace]
It’s also totally valid to say, hey something came up and I can’t beta anymore
Key is communication
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
lmao ya gotta kill me for my ideas
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Isossn Watch out for that Claire lady
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
https://tenor.com/view/laugh-giggle-mutley-dick-dastardly-snicker-gif-5552702
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Omg Eli yesssSSSSS that!!! Is important for both creator and beta to have that communication
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Oh no, my precious ideas!!!
Deo101 [Millennium]
Eh even if u steal my ideas you can never steal my characterizations!
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
just steal everything and make a horrible hodgepodge of all of our webcomics, like some sick frankenstein's monster
Deo101 [Millennium]
I don't think my ideas are the best part of my stories anyways :P
Ahsjdjfjdjfjdjfjdififiididkfkdje Frankensteins webcomic
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
my ideas are relevant to my cultural background so I'm like lmao
eliushi [Keyspace]
I learned from my novel days that ideas are dime and dozen and it’s the execution that counts(edited)
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I would actually love that tbh
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Oh no id read it tho XD
Deo101 [Millennium]
Massive crossover event
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
YES
PLEASE
eliushi [Keyspace]
Super smash bros when
varethane
lmao
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
hahaha
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I really want people going into healthcare to critique my personal statement, but I won't send it to anyone because I've legitimately heard of people stealing others' personal statements and getting both people rejected
Deo101 [Millennium]
Wow
eliushi [Keyspace]
That’s scary and unfortunate
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
ooof
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
it's almost worse than stealing a story idea because you're stealing like
someone's life story??
or their personality??
it's extremely strange to me
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah that's ??????
eliushi [Keyspace]
I would consider having a mentor look over your statement but that’s veering off creator babble territory
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
oh i am doing that and very very thankful to them
Deo101 [Millennium]
Good suggestion and good point
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
After recently seeing a whole comic style/theme completely and obviously lifted from another one... yeah, the things that make your comic yours? They can absolutely be stolen whole-cloth
It's scary
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
oh no
god what even is the fun in that??
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I don't know. I really don't.
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
you know what i want to spend years doing? telling a story that's already been told, except worse!
varethane
D:
Deo101 [Millennium]
I've had someone steal designs before
varethane
dpsofasdj I am so curious about these cases now aaahhh
Deo101 [Millennium]
Ppl do steal stuff. But what sucks for them is I'm the one with a brain and I can make new things
eliushi [Keyspace]
I’ve seen similar styles but have not seen a purposeful recreation of another’s style whether as impersonation or plagiarism
Haruh2 (Colony Life)
i just read a webtoon that was "inspired" by an anime with many ideas from anime too
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
It was a case where I always thought the two looked surprisingly similar, but then... yeah, you learn more things and you go AW GOD OKAY
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
this, and offensive stuff, is a case where i think unsolicited critique is 100% okay
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah, though then it's the line of "is it offensive just to me? Or overall?"
Though I guess saying "this offended me" isn't horrible or whatever
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
i think of the trend of lgbt youtubers making videos making fun of anti-lgbt crap and that's a case where i'm like yeah! pile on!
You have a good point and there are cases where something is almost objectively offensive
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah, and then there are other cases where ppl are offended by how I've decided to have no homophobia where it's like "okay sure but I'm not doing anything wrong"
But yeah there are definitely times where it's like "no that's bad for sure and I'm allowed to be critical of and mad about it"
I also think there's a difference between criticizing mass media and criticizing independent media
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Wait What what omg???? Thats???? So backwards
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
well, here's an anti-critique. it offends me when someone says that being lgbt must be hard and sad all the time!
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah! I'd agree with that LOL
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
can I just be happy
as a bi woman
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
"IT'S NOT LIKE MY LIFE THEREFORE IT'S INACCURATE"
Deo101 [Millennium]
Ahdjfjskfkdkckskfksdksk yeah
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
So true tho!!
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
God, I hate that argument
Deo101 [Millennium]
Though I do think that its worth it to open yourself up to that kind of critique to potentially reach the people who do need your story
Krispy §[Ghost Junk Sickness]§
Yes def agree
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
True true
If there's a blind spot you're missing, then for sure
Deo101 [Millennium]
Well, I was meaning more like "you can't please everyone, but that shouldn't stop you from trying your best anyways!"
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
Ah! also true
Deo101 [Millennium]
Like not necessarily blind spots, but more like. Some people will be mad no matter what sorta thing
Yee
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
so tru
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
Yeah for sure. I've tried to cover my bases on certain things in my own work, but I'm sure if it ever gets bigger, someone will be unhappy about something.
I'm not ready for that day, but... maybe it'll come
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah. Like I said I had someone get mad at me for not having homophobia
Where it's like... Okay stop reading then cause this isn't the story for you
Actually my friends replied to then and they did kinda turn around on their thinking, I think, so that was nice!
There's something I'm bad at for the question, is replying to my comments
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
oh? :0
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
okay sometimes i've said to my friends "yo weird ass comment, right?" and they've gone and defended me like way extra hard
i'm always grateful but also a little (edited)
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah same. .
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
too mch man
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah it's like Thank you but
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I do have some weird comments but the ones that I just kinda trying to offend me
I don't look at it till after a few months and respond to them calmly lmao
no point for me to just get rilied up for someone trying to get on my nerves but rip that's probably just me and how I deal with that stuff in irl too
I don't let my friends go after bozos lmao
Deo101 [Millennium]
Yeah for me I just like. Try really hard to be diplomatic, I guess? But it takes a lot of energy
When what I WANT to say is "lol read another comic then" or something but I try to think of a way to be nice
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
yee I understand on that. for me I'm just say it as it is if at's the moment but for more heated comments I address them after a few months lol
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I haven't gotten any weird randos yet apart from... one legendary one But things are always calmer on your own site far away from Tapas/Webtoons
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I agree on that but lmao
I did had one angry commenter going agro for few of my pages
and I looked at it and I was like "Oh worm man"
they were just reacting to my characters being shit LMAO
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
OH WORM MAN
very good
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I ignore it tbh. I recently had someone comment "All lives matter" at the end of my comic because I included "Black lives matter" at the end. And I honestly knew i didn't have the mental fortitude to explain to them why that was so rude and missing the point.
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
lol my mom is saying that stuff and i'm just like :|
okay mother
Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)
I guess for writing for me, now thinking about it is that
on the prompt: I don't respond quick and I'm not really active much on interaction but I want to try more
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I haven't gotten any weird randos yet apart from... one legendary one But things are always calmer on your own site far away from Tapas/Webtoons
I really haven't either though! Just a few people saying mildly :| things, no hate or anything. Wt is not always as scary as its reputation
or maybe i'm in the eye of the hurricane idk
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
lol
I have had mostly good experiences too
Deo101 [Millennium]
I've had mostly good too!
I know I complain a lot but really I'm just salty and that's just a few bad things here and there
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
The comment I was thinking about earlier was just an innaccurate interpretation of characters' feelings. They thought some people had a romantic history. I wasn't going to respond but my friend went all "if you actually read the comic you would see th- " and I was thinking omg tone it down a bit
Deo101 [Millennium]
Bajsjdjekdjdkdjd
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
never underestimate the Friend Army
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I had a reader I didn't know defend me in the comments once. The original commenter was complaining about the length of my updates, and the other reader started railing on them. It was powerful lmao. I didn't even need to say anything
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Oh! same
Deo101 [Millennium]
I've had some ppl defend me or explain for me and it's like. Idk a special kind of magic ahahahah
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Oh for sure! It feels magical to know that some of your readers passionately love your work
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
Update-length complainers are so cathartic to smack down. Not that I've done it, I just... like seeing it
You're getting a free comic. Made by a human with a life. Chill
sssfrs (JOE IS DEAD)
All my comments are normal where are my weirdos
boogeymadam
someone take some of my weirdos, my comic attracts them
but not really because i accidentally gave claire one of my weirdos and i feel Sooooo bad
Haruh2 (Colony Life)
i feel im still a long way off from getting anyone with my comic
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
weirdos are contagious apparently
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
You don't have to be popular to get a weirdo
Sometimes like... you could have 1 regular commenter and that person is a weirdo
or not even a commenter, you show your work to a RL friend before posting it online, and the friend takes off their mask dramatically, and reveals their True Identity as a professional weirdo
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
for real, i was posting on SJ and had all of like a dozen followers and one guy went through and heavily critiqued a ton of my pages
Like technical stuff like paneling and flow of action?
Also said my female lead looks like a man and my animation was nauseating lol
Haruh2 (Colony Life)
heh well after i do this current update im working on, i'll be scraping how ive been doing updates and following some tutorials i finally found
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
I like critique but even so that guy was :|
boogeymadam
omg noooo sorry that happened fish! D: unsolicited critics are some of the worst
DanitheCarutor
I guess that is the one thing I've been lucky with. I actually don't mind unsolicited critique, but I've never gotten any outside of one time someone corrected my character's grammar in the comments. Commentary like that is way more welcome than the occasional anonymous hate comment, and malicious article calling me a fetishist, which is all entertaining in its own way but not as easy to deal with. Now that critique is brought up I'm reminded that I need to work on how I respond to it. Like, I actually get kind of excited when someone takes the time to break down my stuff (even if it totally misses the mark with what I'm trying to accomplish), but I end up responding with a novel and sometimes it's worded in a way that sounds like I'm upset. I need to get better at keeping it short and sweet.
Feather J. Fern
I raise my hand to say I can't draw hands for the life of me still after praticing for a long time. I used all the techiques, tricks, and still my hands are just butts.
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
make a universe where people have butts for hands
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
This is a really minor one and thankfully easy to correct after publishing, but: my ESL-ness shows sometimes, especially with prepositions and articles. My English isn't terrible; there's just some occasional "wait did they mean 'on' where they put 'in'..." That's on the surface level. I also can't do that 'just write the dialog and see how the characters bounce off each other' thing in English. I hadn't thought much about that until I started writing a story in Korean, and I was surprised how much easier it was to get flowin' with the dialog. I'm not toooo concerned about this one, as Get Flowin' is just one way of writing a scene. But it is a thing.
Feather J. Fern
Eightfish stop calling me out that I can draw butts better than hands okay(edited)
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
feather have fun drawing the gluteus maximus
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I see nothing wrong here
Moral_Gutpunch
I'm bettign most people here can draw hands better than me.(edited)
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
S’okay, my hand drawing is pretty bad
Feet is...also an issue
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
The best reference is the one attached to you, I always say
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
or make your so pose for you
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yes
That
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
looks back at comic and sees lots of guy characters with slender palms MHMMMM
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Hahaha
Lol
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
ahahha i have the same problem
some guys have thick ass fingers when i look at them closely omg
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yeah, everyone has pretty thin fingers in mine, because I have thin fingers(edited)
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
Okay yeah not gonna lie I HAVE made my SO pose for me. Several times.
Oh yeah don’t forget
Guys can have hairy knuckles too
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)
I have had my SO pose his hands retroactively for me, imitating a panel I did And I was screaming inside LOL
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
this stuff makes me :00
Deo101 [Millennium]
I have hairy knucles and my hands are bigger than my dads
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Ughhhh, that's too much detail for me, Shadow
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
Yoslslzlzrhlzxzzkhzhlztututs funnily enough my SO’s hands and mine are of similar length
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
For such a small person, I have really long fingers
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
reminded me of a convo i had with some friends
they sent a reference and said they thought it was unrealistic because of how much the tendons stick out
and i said, no, that's how mine look
and it was interesting seeing the differences
Deo101 [Millennium]
everyone share hands
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I mean, especially since your fingers are stretched, the tendons stick out lol(edited)
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
Someone told me I have piano fingers
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
like i always think of my hands as the 'default,' because I see them the most but really there is much variation
deo has nice hands
look elegant
shadows hands look a lot like the rest of her :0
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
Whhhhhhhhh
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
tall librarian
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
GJOXJPSLZLJZDXKXYOF
Yeah true XD
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
My nails are super long rn
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
Holy shit the manicures
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I did it myself
Deo101 [Millennium]
thank U i have lovely hands that are big as fuck, and I can use as a ruler
because my pinky and thumb can stretch out exactly 10 inches
this cup is 10 inches tall
youre welcome
keii’ii (Heart of Keol)
I have stubby baby hands as well as double jointed fingers, so I'm very aware my hands aren't "average" looking. Yet if I don't pay attention, I tend to draw hands kind of like mine
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Hahahaha, Deo!!
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
wow so useful i should measure my hands
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Me too tbh
Deo101 [Millennium]
I atually suggest it it comes in handy (ha) more than youd think
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
i found a joint that measures exactly 1 inch and i use it so much
Deo101 [Millennium]
yeah!!!
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
Whoooooa
Mine goes 8 inches
Deo101 [Millennium]
my hands are fookin hyuge bro
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
Wait
8.5
YEAH YOURS ARE GIANT
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
exactly 8 inches
omg your hands are huge
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Mine stretch out to just under 7.5 inches
Deo101 [Millennium]
in yalls defense I also have ehlers danlos so theyre probably stretching more than yours too
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
I have smol hands because I am smol
Deo101 [Millennium]
tiney
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Yus
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
surprised shadow managed to find a way to measure in inches haha
Deo101 [Millennium]
she said it wrong its actually 8.5 cm
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
8.5 inches
I used a ruler
In cm it’s 21
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
she said it wrong its actually 8.5 cm
hm maybe that's why she thinks hands are hard to draw
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
LMHfhgzmzjKfhl
Deo101 [Millennium]
because she has tiny baby hands and can barely hold the pencil... yes
its all coming together
shadowhood {SunnyxRain}
I will slap y’all with my tiny baby doll hands
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
i'm learning so much about you all today
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Now you see my pain
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
o h wait do you play music crona?
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Uh... Not really. I've messed around on the piano, and failed at playing the French horn
Deo101 [Millennium]
LMAO
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
Playing instruments is hard for smol hands
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
rip
Feather J. Fern
My tiny hands compared to my pen XD
Also I took the picture close up and at an angle so not cone cna make fun of my writsts which are narrower than my computer mouse
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
my wrists are also narrower than my mouse, and my mouse is pretty small
Deo101 [Millennium]
mine's about the same as my mouse
Feather J. Fern
Yeah I got a pretty small mouse too, I been told by people to eat more becuase of my wrists (It's an Asian thing apparently) and I'm like "First of all rude, second of all my health is not any of your concern random lady on the street"
Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~
yup
Tiny wrist solidarity!
Eightfish (Puppeteer)
Solidarity!
varethane
I don't have especially thin wrists but my hands are lowkey shaped pretty oddly. I only posted a photo of my hand petting a cat to FB and got a lot of comments like 'cute cat but what's with that hand????'
(it did look pretty weird from that angle. Like a noodle with a couple of noodlefingers at the end)
spacerocketbunny
Oh no Vare ;;;;;3;;;;;;;;;
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wwounu · 5 years
Photo
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Still in shock, you continue to ask Seokmin questions ever since he has taken you upstairs to his comfy studio, asking you to take a seat as he takes a small break, cleaning the room.
“How long have you been doing this again?”
“Two or three years?” Seokmin replies, leaning more to a question than a statement. “Something like that.”
“Oh cool. Pretty long then.”
“Yep, it’s crazy thinking about it… Really crazy…”
“Aren’t there any clients after me?”
“Nope. My shift would be over right now since I usually work at the dog cafe this time, but I called in that I was sick so shush don’t tell anyone.”
The male lifts a finger to his lips, his lips forming a curl.
“So!” He claps his hands after your giggle. “You can get as much as you’d like. We can be here all night — What would you like to have?”
He’s now seated, in the middle of putting his gloves as you speak. He swivels in his chair to get a plain book and pen, opening to a clean page.
You awkwardly begin, “Uh… I’d like something simple — and hidden — so no one can notice it upon first glance.”
“I get you, ‘small and simple’.” Seokmin jots down his words in the book. “Anything else?”
“I’d like it to be a flower.”
“Ah, of course! Anything in particular?”
“A cherry blossom.” You cringe once saying it aloud. “I must sound basic right now, but I’d like to keep it minimalistic. Maybe not so much because I want there to be detail, but I think the blossoms should be the focal point of it all, while they’re growing scattered on the branch…”
Not knowing why, your voice says away at the end, watching Seokmin’s hand move left to right.
“So like this?”
He holds up his notebook, showing an ideal sketch of the tattoo you imagined perfectly, and you hum in agreement. “Damn, you really get me.”
“I guess I do.” The man grins. “That would look great on the ankle I think. It’ll sting a bit, are you ready for it? You can choose anywhere else if you want.”
“No I’m good with your decision, I trust you.”
Seokmin pauses at your final words, almost zoning out, but he eventually comes back on earth and gets himself started. “Attagirl!” He laughs, getting straight to work
A few minutes in and the silence is unbearable for you. You didn’t want to distract Seokmin either, but you quietly say, “Can I talk while you work? I don’t want to ruin your focus or anything.”
Seokmin hums. “Feel free too. I love talking to clients about anything — And you as my client makes it even better.”
“What made you want to start doing all of this?”
“It came out of nowhere, really. Soonyoung was busy doing thumbnails for a drawing of his, I think it was a back tattoo? For one of his characters, and I would it pretty cool, asked if I could contribute to some ideas. I think he only told me to go for it because he couldn’t care less.”
“And then?”
“I get to work too and after a few songs yada yada, I show him my ideas and stupidly start talking about the details I included. It was rushed but I don’t think Soonyoung realised that — You should’ve seen his face! I felt intimidated and proud. Next thing you know it, he tells me I’m really good and that I should be a tattoo artist. And now look at me! A very stupid story, but it’s close to my heart.”
“Cool! What do you prefer to do on people?”
“I’m cool with anything but I love doing complex tattoos — people are always satisfied when I do them, it feels really great helping them. But when it comes to myself, I prefer something uncomplicated.”
“Hm, why?”
The male snorts, rubbing his nose shyly. “Mainly just the backlash and looks from everyone… Plus I don’t think big, bold tattoos would look great on a guy like me-“ He’s stopped by the slip of your laugh, which is caught on by Seokmin too.
“Don’t your friends know about this? That you do this for a living?”
In reply the male chuckles. “Well… At first they didn’t, I wasn’t vocal about it and everyone already knew about my jobs with dogs. I think hearing about me being a tattooist would freak them out…”
“Tell me about it!”
“On one night my four friends were gathered somewhere near the parlour to hang out — at the time a friend was new to the city so they brought him there often to familiarise himself as the others were regulars…”
“My friend — Wonwoo; the new one back then — told me that he heard my laugh a bit away from the parlour and ‘knew my laugh but didnt at the same time’. He gets closer to the studio, and I don’t realise his presence, and he sees me laughing with some guys I’m close to while adding another tattoo onto his sleeve of ink…”
“With someone like Wonwoo, he doesn’t look like the strongest man but never underestimate him…” Seokmin shudders, flashbacks in his mind. “Um anyway, he has really bad eyesight and was too lazy to step into the parlour so late at night, but he apparently mistook me as Soonyoung because of our smilier hairstyles and laugh. Plus, it’d make sense for Soonyoung since the latter’s an artist, but even Wonwoo knew that Soonyoung wouldn’t do something like that at all…”
“At that exact moment, Soonyoung texts Wonwoo asking him to convince Minghao — Our model friend — to be his model, which didn’t add up for Wonwoo, and it was by the time Vernon yells out his name, wondering why he’s there, and I happen to hear it, seeing the two of them stare at each other Wonwoo stares at me, followed by Vernon, before yelling out my name in shock...”
“Apparently I’m ‘way too precious for that’ which is why they were all in disbelief. Only Joshua and Soonyoung knew about it before the accident, and apparently Jihoon too since he wasn’t phased by it.”
“I wouldn’t blame them,” You agree, smiling. Seokmin pouts but eventually smiles afterwards. “So have your friends asked you to do tattoos for them?”
“Here and there. Minghao asked me to do an infinity dragon for him in return of a favour. Other times it would be dumb tattoos my friends would want and I’d have to refuse the offer… Especially when it’s Soonyoung!”
Now adding the colour — and mainly because you had stopped distracting Seokmin from your non-stop chattering — you feel the pain come through on your ankle.
You’ve tried so hard not to feel the pain (as well as kick your foot due to how sensitive that area was), but the male puts you at ease, hushing you and telling you how good you’re doing.
A few more moments, chatting to Seokmin here and there, and you finally hear the “Ta-da!” From the latter.
“How does it look?”
“Why don’t you see for yourself?” Grinning, Seokmin grants you to sit and passes you a mirror, seeing the tattoo more clearly. “So…?”
“I don’t know what to say-“ You stammer, “It looks amazing! You’re amazing Seok’!”
“Ah, don’t flatter me…” He huffs, resisting his smile. “I’m just happy you like it. Oh, but I need to give you some heads up before you can enjoy your tattoo.”
You nod, letting Seokmin protect the tattoo with a bandage, watching him do the process before he sits back down again, cleaning his studio once again.
“Don’t take the bandage off after a day. Take extra care with it, sometimes the ink takes a while to settle, so no long showers or baths, and keep the tattoo dry — It’s better to gently wash over it frequently, but don’t go crazy with it though…”
“Got it. What else?”
“Do be aware that it will itch, so I beg you not to scratch it since it’s the ankle and that’ll definitely do a thing or two to you. It’ll be hard but I believe in you! Also, use moisturisers too. Do this for two to four weeks and you’ll be all set!”
You hug the male, thanking him countless of times before you let go. You couldn’t thank Seokmin enough. After letting go, you pay for the tattoo and he asks you to stay around as he cleans up the parlour.
What ended up feeling like an hour suddenly turned into six, with the sun beaming its golden hour and the streets filling with more people while you converse with Seokmin, listening to his oddly fascinating dog walking stories.
“What other tattoos do you have? I’m kinda curious now.” Casually, you look outside the window and notice the sky gradually turn darker. When you turn back to look at the male, he scares you another time as to how close he was. “I swear you need to stop scaring me like that.”
“Sorry!” He chirps, humming a little at the end. “Should I tell them in order?”
“Alright,”
He shows you each inked drawing one by one.
The first tattoo was one you’ve already seen. An inked outline of a sunflower, running down his inner left bicep. As it was his first, he was scared what the outcome of his tattoo would be, since the what ifs wondered in his head and that a mistake will be made, yet things went the opposite for him — in a good way — and the old man who tattooed him became somewhat of a father to him as he was desiring to become a tattoo artist.
The second, a tiny doodle of a puppy’s slanted eyes, upside-down triangle nose and ears shaped in an ‘M’. That was his first self-made tattoo, located on his ankle. And of course it was directed to his unconditional love for puppies. For a first try, it wasn’t that bad — The tattoo was mainly credited to Soonyoung who drew the tiny doodle in the exact location (You had no idea how he managed to draw on his ankle, but you went with it), which Seokmin looked at afterwards and thought ‘This is nice’ and behold the tattoo.
And for credit, he had his friend put his initials — ‘KSY’ — to tattoo it additionally, just to the corner of the tattoo itself.
Thirdly; A constellation. Seokmin had to remove his shirt for this one, which was awkward at first, but the awkwardness was taken away the moment you laid eyes on his shoulder blade to the right hand side. The tattoo didn’t have a special meaning to it, but as it’s Aquarius, he got it as he was one himself (quite obviously).
‘Say yes’ was what you remembered about his fourth tattoo. Just underneath his inked constellation, it was tattooed in a typewriter font. Briefly, he explained that it was a duet he had to with his friend for Jihoon’s project. All he said was that it hit home, which you thought he was going to continue, but he fell silent for a few beats and his shirt back on.
“Finally,” He heaves, the mood feeling heavier than usual, “this.”
He lifts up his left arm, stretching it out to move his sleeve, revealing the small tattoo you had a glimpse on his wrist.
“It’s a — uh — lock. It’s really small, you can’t really see it. I did it myself. It-“ All of his words sounds disjointed, panicked, “It means a lot.”
With the vague description, he didn’t look like he wanted to go further, and it was only for you to respect that. If it meant a lot, then it’ll take time for him to tell you. One day, maybe, one day.
He acts more quiet now, with less words and less liveliness in him. It was a long day for the both of you, and you didn’t want it to end on a bad note.
Fiddling with his hands, Seokmin doesn’t acknowledge your head weighing on his shoulder.
“Sing me a song Seokmin.”
“A song? My singing isn’t that great…”
“Either way — I like your voice, I want to hear it.”
“But…”
“Just sing to me, I won’t judge, you have a pretty voice. ‘If I’m good at it, I shouldn’t hide it’,” You mimic his words, choking a laugh out of him.
He silent for another moment, then begins to softly sing the lyrics to Half Moon to you, going falsetto when he reaches parts where it would be more pronounced at, and adding a breathiness to his singing. To you, it felt like you were on the moon — lost in space — because of his singing alone.
And your eyes begin to get heavier, Seokmin’s voice lulling you to sleep. You did it; You made the day end well. And for you and Seokmin, neither of you wanted to ruin it.
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OPPOSITES ATTRACT PART TEN — Tattoo Artist!Seokmin x Florist!Reader
finally back to updating! (hopefully...)
one • two • three • four • five • six • seven • eight • nine • ten • eleven
masterlist
109 notes · View notes
haeroniel-doliet · 2 years
Text
Turns out its a helluva mess when i start messing beyond flat colors!! Might be a sign to not do so much again (but yet .. practice to get to where im one day happy??)
Like ive done as much as i know how to do at this point in time to the portraits (still gratuitously bloody shame on me :') ) oh except for a background bc WHAT does one DO for a character shoulders up portrait background??? Settled for now on a gradient old school photo style lmao
I like the fix it one as is, a lot (but also i liked the lineart for the portraits better i think) and idk, imngonna try give it a light bit of shadows and lights, maybe step away from a lot of blending bc i think i think thats where i went wrong on the other one
Like, they look fine, but they also look. Meh. Like ive used too much blur tool (i havent, i tried using kritas wet brush thing and it looks....ok close up but the effect is no good when zoomed out like posting size APPARENTLY) and its all noncommittally washy.
(cont'd over thinking)
Am i gonna 'render' them a third time??? Do i have the mental strength?? Bc i think maybe trying for something not so, "realistic" could do me better, like a little more cell shady. But also i dont?? I dont know how to cell shade? I dont watch anime or cartoons v much and my style isnt that cartoony or clean lined?
Maybe on the fix it i can try a more....... Conservative and less blended shade/highlights? (And if i like it/learn smth new go back and re re do the portraits same style) I also just. Idk. How does one make it not look so. Flat and meh?? Im doing basic color stuff ok i think, ive got a bit of texture but its still? Eh???
Honestly i could just post them and move on but i dunno, i have the energy to problem solve a lil bit so why not?? (Not tonight. Im gonna sleep on this all)
Why post shit im not 100% proud of? (Ngl kinda been in the mood to take down that first sketch of the fix it bc it looks nowhere near as good as what i fixed it up to but ....... Ah fuck it i was happy w it when i did it so eh)
Why why why oh why is art so hard?????????
I wanna try and become one of those cool artists who post multiple fun things yknow, like u get inspired and can draw it beginning to post in one evening! Im probably way over thinking and pushing myself to some standard of unrealistic perfection i have for myself...
(also i like thumbnail doodled out like, all these things i wanna draw for a really nice fic i read and even after editing some i have like 8 bits i wanna draw?? 4 as like a mini comic bc i havent done one since i was a child and i think itd be kinda rad if i learned to draw short comics for fic scenes i like??? But yeah basically in one inktober post there would only be 5 ideas (a lil more complicated on average i do give for granted but like. Those took me WEEKS) but yeah i just. I wanna draw them. Even if itll probably take me for fuckin ever... (And i didnt even finish off the last two inktober batches, oh. And i have a uni thesis to do ew) .... I wanna push myself to draw faster (less iterations to get it right) and so i can have rly solid and good and quickly done drawings to then color in as i learn to for future?)
Ugh man. You know what i need to do/shouldve been doing before i jumped into coloring original stuff?? I shouldve done colored studies. Like ive been drawing scenes both from reference and original on the inktobers and i think thats why my drawing/character stuff has gotten decent. I really should just whip out like prettily colored movie screencaps and work on painting studies of them. That would really fix up why i cant figure out lights and shadows and blending in coloring! No horrid tutorials just figuring out how can i make it work for me
And you know? You know what it is okay to have pieces that are from before i figured it out right? Im gonna try a slightly different thing for the fix its (if i hate it, theyre good as flat colors too) and yes they dont have a background either please love of god someone tell me how to add random backgrounds bc im not in the mood of scene building further but they float in off white space atm.
If i learn smth ground breaking and can QUICKLY do a bette rendition of the portraits, sure the perfectionist wins. But maybe just maybe. It would be fine to post them as they are. Yea, they look roughly as lifeless as my first big painting/that dinluke poster redraw. And maybe thats okay. Because hi if i do dedicate to doing like a good few color focused studies of star wars scenes as a treat i can come back stronger and have a better piece???? Its about growth babes. YEA
Alright i said to myself thats it in gonna go sleep on it and continue tomorro but. I thought id slip in here a secret surprise for anyone unfortunate enough to have clicked read more... And i got a little whiplash opening the picture bc it looks. SO WRONG but the more you look at it its like ... Fine. Ok judge for urself and tell me pls, first and second attempts at 'rendering' the portraits (the darker bground was the first attempt just going by gut, the lighter one after trying to watch like 1 tutorial and using more brushes and just generally trying rly hard!!)
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yes ive clearly fixed issues in the sketch differently in both so they... look... like different expressions?? idk man idk idk idk see now this small they look differently off!! god the curse of the zoom in and out and perception.
0 notes
eirian · 4 years
Note
While I enjoy your art my biggest issue is mostly with your comics. They always appear very awkward in that they dont seem to carry the story well. Alot of the pages look even like filler and dont have much substantial story. I think if you looked up how to properly space panels,fill them and add slightly more dynamic shots it would carry the story easier with slightly less pages. Maybe it'd feel less like a workload for you as well.
YEAH i feel that, while i enjoy making comics theyre def not my specialty or anything.  i get really invested in dialogue and pacing and neglect the art part i think?  thats why there seems to be a lot of filler; i try to pace the pages a certain way so theres not like loads of dialogue on each page since i tend to write the characters speaking a lot u_u it might just be me who thinks this honestly but when u read the pages straight through the pacing is nicer than when ur just waiting for an update each week? i guess ??  THIS and also someone has pointed out to me in the past that i tend to work more in a storyboarder kinda way than a comic one b/c i like to draw like, the same shot, just slightly different, for multiple panels, just to show little things like changes in expression or something, so thats also probably an issue but w/e
as for the more dynamic shots i do think i should improve on that too and i desperately want to jasdklf its harder than i thought tbh.  that and…honestly i just really hate drawing backgrounds So thats why theres a lot of close-up shots of characters speaking if im being real LOL, i enjoy drawing characters way more.  but in future pages im going to suck it up and just go for it to make it look better
there hasnt been A Lot going on in mirrors so far besides exposition and talking (in the first three chapters) so its been hard to make it look super interesting art-wise tbh :c the later chapters are a lot less boring i think, plus i havent thumbnailed/drawn them yet so i can def try to improve on the dynamic shots and stuff!
i think the workload will be an issue either way b/c rn its a lot b/c i have a ton of pages due to how i pace things, but if i change that then it’ll be a lot b/c of how much drawing i’ll have to do for each page instead, yknow?  so the workload isnt rly..smth i feel like i can change, which is fine, im gonna go through with it anyway!
I DIDNT MEAN FOR THIS TO BE A LONG REPLY but thank u for ur input!  im trying to improve i promise ;v; this is only my second actual comic so im def still learning! i want yall to enjoy the comics as much as i enjoy making them so !!!  i hope youll like the future pages better than the current ones
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torifalls · 7 years
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hey um, do you have any tips for making an animatic? i've been planning to do one for quite a long time but i just can't get myself to do it ahh
This is gonna be scrambled as hell cause i just woke up and I have no professional idea about how they work?? but HMM heres what i did
1. I watched a lot of other animatics for insp!! Like everyone else i rly like galactibuns especially their latest one for candy store from heathers2. Listen to the song and imagine what u wanna do in your head, BUT imagine it animated and not as still images (it was kinda hard to focus on that so i didnt do enough but yeah)3. Do rly rough thumbnails of the frames, clear enough that You can see whats happening but so youre able to do them rly quickly and possibly do multiple ones for one frame till youre satisfied (also did not do that enough but hey it was my first one akdjks)4. People mostly go for the storyboard look but i think generally animatics are a bit more animated than that..? Well either way i suggest you try and bring a lot of movement into it. Those tend to be the best and get the best reviews. For example (im assuming youre doing a music animatic) the frames changing in the rythm of the music is v catchy, if a character suddenly yells you should see them yknow, yell
Another thing, animatics arent..lyric comics. Theyre technically what comes before an animation, so try and get more frames and not just a few very polished drawings in((Also im not saying those are bad theyre just a different thing so why not just call it that if thats what youre pretty much going for))
Also i suggest you dont try to linger on the same frame for like 30 seconds… the same shot for that long is already kinda hard to watch at least change the expressionsOfc youre doing this for fun and no one can really tell you what to do but hey u asked
HOWEVER its your first one it doesnt have to be a masterpiece, just go with intuition, mistakes are GOOD especially when they get pointed out to you it just means you can do better next time annnd youre doing this in your freetime so whatever. just have fun
And maybe look up actual tips from professionals bc i dont actually know what im doing
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celestialallstars · 4 years
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Episode #4: “Everyone hates a puzzle god.” - Drew
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This swap was PERFECTO, well, had I been on Nu Orfeo, it would have been but, Nu Tuatha was my next best choice and already it is great! I have Kori/Bryce and then Loris for sure. I talked with Mitch and Sharky a bit, so I'm optimistic on that. But I go and talk to Stephen. Lo & behold, he tells me there's a rumor that Kori and Bryce are working together. He says he heard it from Jared, but I figure hey, why am I not living a little? I say wow if we lose they go but...I immediately told Zach haha what he wishes to do with it is up to him, but if the rumor happens to spread, then I guess we'll see. If Mitch happened to feel this way, then I can at least use it to avoid being a target for a little while, even if I am sticking with KB.. this is gonna be one heck of an intriguing dynamic!
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Oh my goodness, what a great swap! I got Chris, I got Bryce, and I got Mitch all of whom I doubt will be voting me. If I play my cards right I'll also be able to use this opportunity to get closer to Sharky or Loris in the event we never go to tribal. Ideally I wanna make sure me and Loris are especially good since Sharky seems the more likely first boot from our tribe.
I'm not sure what to make of this 24 hour challenge, wanna be optimistic but who knows.
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I fucking love Alyssa, literally as soon as we swapped she looked at my teammates, messaged two of them to talk to me and gave me info on Zach and Stephen having history in the season. The equivalent of like "Okay go to the backdoor, meet the guard and tell them you like to fly with the eagles, he'll let you in, tell them you're with me and I'll leave the rest to you." So while yes I am the odd duckling out being the only one from Cyrena I'm going to do my best to work with what I have.
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So not very much has changed on Tuatha as far as I can tell. My tribe winning the immunity challenge has helped me delay any confrontation between my 2 alliances which is great, as it should theoretically allow me to maintain relationships with all 6 members of the tribe. Still, it's going to keep being important to win immunity or pray for a swap in order to keep these groups from clashing.
Jared and Rhys are still a ? for me. I don't know why/how Rhys was able to convince Kori to invite Jared to the alliance of 5 instead of Mitch, and it worries me that those 2 may have a stronger bond than I immediately suspected. Hopefully I'll have an opportunity to deal with that when the time comes.
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We're going to lose. I hate for it to sound so defeated/pessimistic, but the fact of the matter is unless we have a turn around in the AM, then I only see this setting the pace for the remainder. I know Bryce and Kori must be sleep. Mitch is trying, Loris possibly went back to sleep? And I guess Sharky is shooting for a late night swim or something. Regardless, I'm just already going over who the best person to leave would be for me. Unfortunately, with Kori/Bryce and then Loris, that only leaves me with Mitch or Sharky. Personally...I'd be open to Sharky, just cause, yea it would've been cool for Orfeo Seven to be a thing, but like I only feel secure with Zach/Loris and that's to a certain degree. All in all, this might be the tribal for Sharky to go and if the others are very sad over it, well, I guess they will have to come to terms with it.  I know Mitch is with Stephen and now that I know Steph is gonna probs wanna target Kori/Bryce, I'll need him and Mitch around for them to battle it out against each other...hmm decisions.
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So we swapped. Yay. I have Jared. Yay. Stephen, eh kinda doesn’t speak to me a lot, well he speaks to me the least in my tribe. But we’re in an alliance. So I’m gonna have to figure how to navigate that.
Chloe Mo and a Zach all talk to me more than Stephen. So If I can figure out a way to maintain numbers and sack off Stephen, bye bye Stephen.
Also Mo is amazing. Staying up to try to prove worth in challenges 😍 no one deserves mo.
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Y'all know me, one wrong social interaction which ends in humiliation or making me look like a dingus will ruin my entire day. Like oh no one laughed at my joke? Time to disappear into nothing and mope for a couple hours.
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I’m lowkey scared about this challenge. I’m on my phone which sucks cause I can’t really do much in terms of puzzles. I can do them just always not the first one to finish. So looks like I’m not doing much yikes.
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hi! we swapped! um. the last 2 hours. what a mess. so. like. kori posted a screenshot that showed the names of all his alliances and like. i told everyone maybe... ?? i told zach and then.. mitch.. and then.. i confronted bryce bc one was called 'three kings' so it was obv him chris and kori.. and bryce confirmed it. then sharky does the same thing but oh well thats insignificant hes only in 1. also. me and mitch r like. close now!! all because of this mess. but kori hates me. hehee
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So the tribe swap has hit, and I'm back with my old pal Zach! You know, the person from my season who I tried to vote out like a million times before finally succeeding due to finding the idol at F5. Woohoo.
In all seriousness, though, I'm kinda happy to be on a tribe with him because he's a challenge beast and I don't think our relationship is totally unworkable. I made it clear to Zach as soon as the swap happened that I wanted to work with him, not against him, so hopefully that'll work out.
Chloe and Mo are 2 people I've also been working to get to know since the game began so I'm not too worried about them targeting me right away. I think this is a strong group overall.
And then there's Jared and Rhys. Probably not the first 2 people I would've chose to swap with but at the very least they both have incentive to keep me around. We are in an alliance together after all!
I made the decision to tell Chris about my situation with Mitch and the alliances on OG Tuatha because I really want them both to survive and unite with them at merge, and if Chris knows that Mitch was on the bottom of the totem pole on Tuatha, then maybe he'll take it into consideration.
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So I had a glimmer of hope but we lost it and that's okay. I already prepared myself to vote for Sharky and it seems that is where we're headed...and yet craziness ensued in the time I was away! Kori accidentally reveals three kings and I try and do what I can to talk to others but nobody has said anything so they're either good at hiding things or they legit dropped it after questioning Bryce and Kori. ON TOP of it all, I learn from Loris that Sharkys alliance chat could be from an org..with Drew, Chloe and maybe Matt. It would definitely explain why Chloe didnt except the alliance offer..so that is fun. And now Stephen has told me he/Bryce/Kori/Rhys had majority alliance. So now I have a lot of info. It's just mattering how to use it
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Shoutout to Drew for carrying everyone’s ass while drunk for half the challenge
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I wanna explain my plan. It might sound ridiculous but... shut up. So I have this chart I made to show who’s doing the best and worst in challenges. I made four charts, three for each tribe, and one for everyone overall. The overall chart comes in handy if I make it to merge. So my dumb strategy is using said charts to kind of vaguely suggest who should be voted out each round. For example Tuatha is going to tribal and Mitch is doing the worst statistically so I can see him being eliminated (Mitch ily I’m sorry if you’re reading this). The bumpy part happens when and if I get to merge. Because then I’m going to be playing with a bunch of incredible comp players. My goal is to kind of use them as a way of getting to the end, by pinning them against one another until eventually it’s just me. Several problems in this plan, the first one is if my tribe goes to tribal which isn’t super severe because like I said I do feel comfy socially but I am doing the worst statistically so there’s a chance I could be eliminated. Second problem this is a very fragile plan and one crack could leave me looking like a goat trying to make something out of nothing and I’m not tryna get biggest goat in touchy subjects again. Will this all fail? Most likely. Am I gonna try to be a cool strategic genius? Yeah. But it’s worth a shot. Ok rereading this whole thing I’m kinda thinking this plan is garbo but I took so much time to write it so I’m gonna send it anyway.
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I’ve been like bouncing in between moods of. “I’m gonna be an early out” and “I’m gonna go far/win.” Right now I’m feeling like an early out again.
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appreciation the thumbnail + title please.
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God, the last 24 hours  could not have gone worst. We lost the challenge, AND I was such a dumb idiot that I posted a screenshot in the tribe chat where you could see my alliances.
So naturally I had to basically inform anyone I was aligned with that it happened. I feel like such a flop right now. I've missed the window 3 times for searching for an idol, and it's just like how can I be so absent minded. I need to get myself together if I want to even make the merge let alone win the game.
So far the only people I know for sure saw the Screenshot are Loris and Zach. Chances are other people know and just haven't told me. I'm just trying to keep a level head after having a mental breakdown over what an idiot I've been. We're at tribal and I'm hoping the votes on Sharky are there because we do talk the least. (I'd rather Loris goes but we're actually in a chat together because apparently Jared and him talk a ton.) I have 0 desire to keep working with Loris though, so if I can push it I wanna send Loris home next if we lose again, he literally went up to Bryce asking if he was in Three Kings and tried to draw attention to my screenshot without flat out saying it in tribe chat, asking Mitch if he saw it etc etc.
It's obvious he's trying to basically draw attention to me because I did win our season. His fake-nice apologeticism isn't fazing me. If it's genuine, well he's bad at seeming sincere then since the actions I've seen don't reflect it.
Boy I hope I wake up and get my shit together because I really need to. Granted I could also be seeing myself going right now, so who knows. I haven't been the most useful in the challenges even though I've never not been trying. So hopefully I stick around for awhile longer. I've still got so much more I've set out to do and I don't want to get sent home without accomplishing any of it.
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So we SWAPPED and I wanna give a little bit of insight as to my thoughts. New tuatha consists of me loris chris sharky kori and bryce. The first challenge was this 24 hour puzzle crap where Zach and Drew H from the other respective tribes CARRIED their teams to victory. It is about 5 hours before tribal and I already feel like I am on the bottom again. IDK WHAT IM DOING WRONG. I always seem to be on the bottom premerge,  but thankfully this is how I flourish. I am SO good at getting out of situations like these and finding myself in a power position at merge because nobody wants to get rid of me. RN I created a chat with Loris and myself just so he can keep me updated on what is HAPPENING with chris and sharky, and i also have my old alliance with Jared and Stephen who i hope are doing ok. The targets for this round are me and sharky for being perceived as inactive. The vote should be 5-1 with Sharky going, but it HAS crossed my mind to throw a vote on like Bryce to shake the cage a little bit. I dont trust Bryce one bit and I feel like he'd throw me to the curb the first chance he gets unless loris keeps him in check.
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Everyone hates a puzzle god mwah!!
Lol so we swapped, I get Michael and Alyssa but the former blue tribe has 4/6 majority here, I like them enough as people but like...we're just gonna go ahead and not go to tribal here, if I have to drag them to the immunity statue kicking and fucking screaming. Which is what I did. F17 ladies
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Fourth tribal safe. It’s a weird feeling to be safe so many times in a row but I’m glad my all stars game is getting off to a strong start by making connections here there and everywhere. I’m praying for Sharky tonight because I know that he’s close to me and Chloe so if he goes it’s definitely worse case scenario.
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So it seems sides are forming so that's cool. Mitch is possibly going to end up with me [and Loris] and then there would be Bryce and Kori. However, after chatting with Stephen and Jared yesterday, I've concluded that I am in a pickle! Let's say Kori/Bryce are legit about this Three Kings thing. Well, I know I'm a possible third wheel for it. On top of that, I'm assuming Mitch might get boned if we lose again, however, Stephen trusts Mitch a lot and so wants us to use him to take shots at Bryce/Kori if we lose again. Mind you, according to Jared, Stephen is a sneaky dude (Sneaky Pete), and him and Rhys don't trust him longterm. SO what does this all mean? All of my allies are hot messes. And on top of it all, I am beginning to feel for Sharky. Yes! I get that its been optimal for me to get him out, but it still sort of sucks now that I've talked with him more. Unfortunately, it is for the best he goes for my game right this instant and hopefully the wrath of him and his allies shant be too horrible.
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So we swapped!!! And by some fucking miracle, we have a majority of me, jack, Alyssa and Bodhi. Was very unexpected tbh but we'll take it! Michael and Drew joined us which is good cause they r both v.good at challenges which I would hope means we can immunity run. Cause no thank u hate tribal not dealing with that. Drew also like carried us in the challenge which was a yeet, I swear I tried tho hehe. Mo and rhys I want to try and get to work together, would be very fun n flirty. Sharky messaged me like "lol I'm leaving" and if he does, I'm fucking fighting people, cause that is NOT ON. HE is my one true love and if he leaves I will be annoyed so much and will be quite fucked tbh.love that for me!!
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at orientation last year we were told about a “rule of 7” to not overcommit ourselves. I’ve just about doubled that threshold and depending how the next few days go it might go even higher. Pray for me.
I wish I had more energy to dedicate to this game but i need to fucking relax in my free time. So I’ll talk to people at my current rate and hopefully that’ll get me to merge. Then I’ll drop all other responsibilities and fucking dominate.
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I really think the game is starting to slow down for me. Now what I mean by that is I am continuing to get more woke and more misty, and the aura of this being all stars and the spectacle of the other players being so great is starting to dissapear.
I feel very much as though I have perfected my craft in terms of how I like to play, and I'm doing it very well here. It's cool to think about on a meta level like from AnnaJane's perspective: "oh my god Jared did really well for himself in Wakea and had major influence to where some people couldn't even notice, I wonder how he'll stack up against these all stars." I can feel myself back in that zone and coming into my own even in this field. To the point where these legends like Chris and Bryce and Sharky, I know deep down that I can play ball with them. Now, they may beat me at the end of the day and I may go home at some point, but I can understand even at this moment that I am probably top 3 if not the #1 best player here. Or at least I CAN be.
I want to zoom in on this and really get my shit together and take advantage of what is in front of me because with the game dynamics as they are, I can very clearly see myself as the winner. I need to keep doing what I'm doing, but at the same time make myself dissapear and be able to do this undetected.
My new strategy is called "fast and loose" because I'm going to get into these conversations, knock it out of the park and get out. Leave people feeling good about me every time I leave the room. I don't need to spend a ton of time working on anyone to the point they can tell what I'm doing. Calls? After tonight they are done. Not calling with anybody unless they ask. I want to be gaining social capital and influencing people's decisions without being detected so it has to be a hit and run.
I will reevaluate my position soon and probably recalculate my alliances, maybe I was wrong about Stephen and I need to get closer with him while no one else is. But at this moment I need targets going into the merge. That's how I'm gonna set it up. I want everyone to be shooting at each other and then at the key moment boom challenge advantage, boom idol, boom you gotta vote out Bryce can't vote for me, oh look I'm at the end.
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Having the One World twist is so interesting because in a usual game when you don’t know everyone until you get to merge usually. You don’t know what’s going on, on the enemy tribe, you don’t know who’s inactive, who is starting drama or who is messy in challenges. Because you’re focusing all your social energy into your tribe alone so when someone you haven’t made contact with on the enemy tribe gets eliminated you think nothing of it. But here there are no walls, you can see and communicate with everyone and it’s in your best interest to focus your social energy into the one world chat because that’s what everyone else is doing. So my point in saying this is it’s now incredibly difficult to imagine having to lose 8 people before we get to the final 10. Because literally everyone is social, there are like two quiet people but everyone else you talk to on the daily and everyone is kicking ass in these challenges (except like two people). I think that’s why I keep thinking myself as an early out is because it’s so hard to imagine anyone else getting voted out. But fuck that I got shit to prove.
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I can’t even begin to explain how it feels to have been immune for 10 days in a row. My glow up front wakea is real.
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Bodhi wants to get the 4 of us OG Cyrena's in a majority alliance, which is super convenient bc we can just combine our alliances into one. Problem is? I would HATE to vote either Drew or Michael out, especially given Drew singlehandedly got us immunity this time. So if there was ever time for an immunity streak...
Also I keep forgetting to search for idols this is why I never find one
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Sharky is voted out 5-1.
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ot3 · 4 years
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My approach to flat colors + limited palette drawings
This is a follow up to this post  i made about how i go about figuring out a color palette for my limited palette drawings. an anon asked me about my actual technique of finishing them so this is gonna be an explanation of how I work in a limited palette with flat colors. I ended up with these thumbnails for a sketch last time so we’re gonna work from here and I’m gonna sort of walk through how i got to the finished version
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first things first: every part of this process is just developed as a result of me messing around. take my advice with a grain of salt and if you think you know a way to do something better/that makes you more comfortable. go with that over what I say.
I’m honestly a little surprised when people express confusion about how i draw like this because it’s SUPER simple - literally all you’re doing is just stacking solid color blocks of shape. its very imprecise despite how sharp everything ends up looking. 
First things first is that you want to decide how you will be handling your edges throughout the duration. Do you want your shapes to be ultra-sharp and precise, or do you want a little bit of a wobblier, grainier edge? Both can look good but it’s VERY much a matter of situational basis. i’ve been favoring looser and grainier shapes so that’s how i’m going to be working on this. 
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on the left here, you can see the shapes made with precise rectangular selections and an untextured pen, on the right, freehand drawn shapes and a grittier pen. There’s something immediately pretty different feeling about them. So play around with that first - its not something that’s fun to change halfway through! But lets step back a minute. It helps to work large to small. The two biggest shapes here are these orange chunks and everything gets stacked on top of them so i’m gonna do that first. 
Now, a key feature of what i do: clipping masks. almost all digital art programs have them. What a clipping mask does is it constrains the pixels of a layer to the transparency of the layer below it. Here I have the light orange layer, and then on top of it the buildings and billboard are clipped to the orange. Most of you probably already know this and I’m overexplaining a bit, but there was a time when i didnt know how clipping layers worked and someone had to explain it to me.
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now you’ll notice the shapes of the buildings are rough, and sloppy. here’s the fun part: since this is all about stacking shapes, only your exterior edges matter. this all gets filled in. be as sloppy as you want when you’re making your shapes. in fact, the outside edges get trimmed out a bunch to when i do this - i go in and erase them clean. Don’t be too finnicky about drawing perfect and precise! its a waste of time. As long as the silhouette is what you want, the interior can be a nightmare.
Working this way, it’s important to keep your layers stacked in a way you can make sense of. Right now there are four layers here: the background dark orange, the two main orange rectangle shapes, and then the buildings on one layer and a billboard on the other. I rack up a LOT of layers doing this and it makes it annoying in some aspects, but being able to freely recolor any one chunk without losing my detail is a key aspect of this.
So, I block those out
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Next, I do the same for the smaller chunks that are still main shapes. There are once again, a lot of layers here. The top layer is the hair - you can see the head showing through it. The head and arm underneath the hair, same layer. Then the cup. Then the light green pieces of paper. Then the dark green ones.
The cup is technically farther forward than the head and arm so you would think it’d go on top, but the point isnt to recreate the foreground and background hierarchy with layers so much as it is to group things in a way i can work with. The cup goes underneath so it can be grouped with all the other objects on the table. 
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now, i just go and fill in all the shapes. i forgot to do the blinds but i get them later. you might notice a lot of these shapes are pretty rough, which was harder to notice before they were filled in. Now that I can see better, I go in with an eraser and clean up the edges until they’re the shape I want 
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sometimes erasing leaves little bits of ‘noise’ around objects like on this napkin here. i like to keep a little bit of this noise for texture, but if you dont like it make sure to get rid of it! if you’re working very crisp this will stand out a LOT
Next up is to add some detail onto the objects
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I flipped the canvas here because the head shape was wrong - the ears were uneven and i wanted to fix it. I want to go about adding detail onto the billboard and buildings. i do all detail with clipping masks - but the objects are clipped to another layer and so nothing can be clipped to them. instead, i unclip them and just erase by selection for the same effect
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all of the text on the papers is clipped to the papers below it. the buttons are clipped to the phone. the yellow photos and card are actually another independent layer on top, in case i want to recolor them separately. im indecisive and end up recoloring things a lot. For the most part these objects are starting to become recognizable as more than just shapes
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i go in an add the details on the background and character now. theres some more stuff on the table. the lines of the face and ears are on one layer, and the flats of the eyes below that. Here’s what each group of layers is, and what they look like on their own
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The background/bottom chunk. Just the table, window, and shirt.
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The middle bit. All the stuff on the table and the blinds.
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Finally, the top, which is just his head and arm. 
now this stage is the bare bones of the drawing. you can more or less tell everything that’s happening. it reads. but its very much lacking in something - it doesnt have a ton of depth or interest. and adding that additional detailing, the dept and interest, is where stuff starts getting REALLY tricky and subjective. 
im gonna take you to a much simpler scenario to show the sort of options i go through at this stage
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ahh its our dear friend, sphere casting shadow. this is, more or less, the kind of image we have. you can tell whats happening but it’s lackluster. there are TONSSS of ways frm here that you can go add interior detail to a shape once it has been established. here are some quick and SUPER rough examples
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from top left to bottom right: flat cel shading, softer airbrushed/gradient shading, halftone, and a textured brush. Each of these has their strengths and weaknesses. They can also be combined.
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for example, here’s the solid cel shading being used to contain a gradient/airbrushed detail. This image - probably the single oldest piece of my art i still willingly show people - is entirely colored with gradients being contained in cel-shaded chunks. It has a sort of soft, luminous quality but without losing its crispness.
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here’s a super quick bust with some variations of stuff going on. obviously this is no masterpiece but you see how different types of detailing can interact with each other and be used to distinguish materials too. 
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With the mob psycho comic I did, the detailing that wasnt line was done using a variety of halftones of different shapes layered on top of each other
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by contrast parts of my ace attorney comic use a textured brush and have a sort of blended, papery feel
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any of them can work for pretty much anything as long as you are using it with intent. practice around. mix styles of finishing together. find a comfort zone. the more you do it the more intuitive it becomes and at the heart of it this process is a very intuitive way of drawing because of how far removed it is from realism.
Now here is the trick - light and shadow.
Everything up to this point has been very flat and adding detail helps but there’s only so much that can accomplish. To get HEAVY light and shadow you need to think about things differently. I think if there’s any part of this process that’s complicated, its this one. 
To truly get the most out of your palette, you need to pick chunks of an image to be in higher/lower light and then either ‘step up’ or ‘step down’ the colors in that chunk. here’s what I mean.
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Here’s our ball with a beam of light on it. Everything Within the beam of light is one step in our limited palette lighter than anything outside of it. Here’s how I go about doing this: the shape of the beam of light is below everything else. Then, once I have the shape blocked out, i select it. With that selection in place, i go to EVERY SINGLE LAYER that’s effected, lock the opacity, and recolor that chunk. So what’s going on here is that there is only one more layer - the beam of light, below everything but the background, and the rest of this effect is just caused by every layer above it now being two-toned following the exact same silhouette. THIS is why it’s so important to keep your layers separate - if the shadow and highlight had been painted onto the base directly, i would not be able to do this without significant effort. 
This works with all of the finishing techniques I talked about above
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A combination of cel shading and half toning, all stepped up to give the appearance of heavier light on one area.This is also how I go about rendering transparency in this style. All of my layers are fully opaque and I allow the colors to do the work of conveying transparent material
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Here’s our ball with the patterned/textured brush  shading, being viewed partially through a window
it’s obviously not a very representational way of working, but as long as your audience UNDERSTANDS what you’re trying to convey, then you’re executing it successfully.
So with that, now we’re gonna go and finish this drawing.
For this one, I decide a big central shadow is necessary. In the original thumbnail, he was backlit, which I still plan on doing, and that wouldn’t make sense without casting a shadow.
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I’ve had to change the colors of some objects entirely in order to get this to work right. This is what I mean when I call this an intuitive process - some stuff felt weird, so I changed it. This also involves a bit of problem solving. The newspaper is now unable to be separated from his hand. Sometimes changing the color of an object makes that object look better, but ruins its relationship with the objects around it. It’s up to you to learn how to adjust and finagle things until you get it where you want.The paper he has and the napkin underneath it also all blend together now.
The next few parts of this process are REALLY just trial and error, where I toss a bunch of spaghetti at it until it works. It’s hard to decide what to screenshot, because I don’t know what will or will not be part of the finished drawing. To that end, you can watch the recording of this drawing here. This video isn’t edited at all so it contains a couple of minutes of really shitty sketching, and then all of the color thumbnailing work i did in the last post. Actually getting started on these final colors begins around the two minute mark. It is also sideways, I am sorry I don’t know why. 
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Now, here you can see where I’ve more or less worked things out. His hand’s not on the cup anymore because my friend pointed out it didnt have an arm attached to it. I added some halftoning to make a gradiating effect in the sky and on the table to give the impression of a sunrise. His eyes are different but as of posting this, I don’t like them and am probably about to go back and change them again. The Cup now has a shadow and some rim lighting. His hand is in shadow. The stain on the napkin is big enough to define the edge of the paper on top of it.
Little things like that. 
The more you draw like this the more the way you need to think about your space becomes natural. I hope this helps and I wish you all the best of luck!
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