#Like if you dislike North for reasons such as her personality or values fair enough

[ifthejemfitz]

Reasons why you should stan North:

First point she’s hot asf. Those doey brown eyes, all that red hair down to her bum. That first mission when they go to the warehouse in the pouring rain - No thoughts, head empty. Just tiddies

She’s infinitely selfless. Countless times we see she’s willing to give her life for Markus and the cause. Being willing to give your life, something you’ve fought for, for a cause bigger than yourself and for others knowing that you won’t be around to enjoy the very rights you’re fighting for, but it means that others will is imo completely admirable

She’s actually a strong and caring leader. Someone who’s willing to pick up the mantel and continue the cause whilst others may prefer to hide away. Yes, she leads a revolution and yes, she can never be victorious in her crusade. But she refuses to back down, and refuses to let her people be the target of an out and out genocide

She’s compassionate. She certainly makes brash recommendations but imo they always come from a place of protection and self-defence. We see with Connor that she never once holds his past against him, besides in jest, even if he’s potentially hunted down other deviants at that point. In fact she withholds judgement on any deviants’ past, because I’m sure that she’d hate for own to held against her

Controversial point (though it shouldn’t be) but her anger is justified. She’s been systematically abused in one of the most violent and horrendous ways for a prolonged period of time with no access to therapy. I’m not trying to justify her approach but I really don’t see any other way a person who has only witnessed violence, only been able to escape using violence and then seeing other deviants in hiding also been victims of violence how she wouldn’t respond using that exact same force. She’s a fighter plain and simple, and victims have no obligation to be tolerable of their oppressors or be the “perfect victim” and respond to their personal trauma in ways that are palatable to others

That being said I’m so glad that certain scenes show that she can be vulnerable. Sometimes bad bitches are also soft bitches and regardless of how you feel on shipping I’m glad that we see a side of her that can emotionally open up to others, talk about her trauma openly, openly sob on multiple occasions and clearly demonstrate the ability to love/receive love/be emotionally intimate (side point which could be its own post but I am so grateful we don’t ever see flashbacks to said abuse. Far too many pieces of media have opted for “realism” by showing unnecessary sexual violence and personally I don’t need to see it graphically displayed in order to believe her. Also props for not making it an “empowering feminist moment!!!” either. Abuse is not something women need to undergo to make them “stronger” and it’s abundantly obvious she’s furious about it and struggling with what is essentially ptsd)

She has a super unique role in the story. When Kara is killed and Connor permanently decommissioned that’s it for their stories. However, even if Markus is still alive but is removed as leader the narrative chooses to follow her. Yes, it’s more to do with the revolution by that point but it’s still surprising that she essentially fills in his role in his absence, even persuading Connor to deviate. And the fact they only made slight changes to the dialogue (conscious changes rather than completely rewriting or having them say the exact same lines) that her and Markus share in those scenes only proves how similar they are in that role. I’m just bummed she can’t be victorious (even with Connor on their side) because the success of a revolution should not be built entirely on the role of one person but alas.

Lastly she’s a bad bish, she takes no shit, she serves cunt, she kills her own r*pist and riot police, she’s bi because she can never sit properly and I say so, she leads a whole revolution with painted nails, her 5ft 3 ass literally hauls Markus out of danger multiple times and personally I’d let her break my face

#dbh north #north dbh #dbh meta #Yes I know I’m like three years late #In fairness I only got into this fandom properly like two months ago #Is this still the equivalent of taking a swinging bat to a hornets’ nest? #I feel I needed to get this out in the world bc I’m sick of *checks notes* internalised misogyny #and *further checks notes* ridiculous shipping drama #Like if you dislike North for reasons such as her personality or values fair enough #She’s not infallible and definitely has unlikeable traits #But that makes for a more well-rounded character #This is for those that sensationalised it to the point of making her a genocidal maniac #Usually not understanding the full implications of that word either #Like we have a real issue with accepting anger and aggression from female characters #Yet completely accept it and even woobify it from male characters #And ultimately that says more about fandom spaces than this character

[gaygoetia]

GoT S8E1 Ramble/Analysis

It’s endlessly fascinating to me how a bunch of people can watch the same scene and interpret it in totally different ways, and this is something that seems to have happened a lot this episode. 

One of the most interesting examples of this IMO is the differing readings of Sansa, Dany and Jon and their behaviour in this episode. I’m mostly gonna be focusing on different readings of Sansa in this post but I might touch on the others.  First of all there’s the scene where Sansa (very reasonably) questions how they’re going to feed all these new allies given that Winter is upon them and food is scarce. While most people generally read the scene the same way “Sansa undermines Dany in front of the Northern bannermen” what differs is people’s interpretations of why.

Quite a few people seem to view this as a reflection of Sansa’s personal dislike of Dany but I honestly couldn’t disagree more. In fact the whole thing seems very impersonal to me and in my opinion this scene is actually a great example of Sansa’s ability to keep personal feelings out of political decisions in favour of a approaching problems from a more objective standpoint. 

Sansa doesn’t address her question to Dany, but to Tyrion who is acting as Dany’s representative. This could be seen as a passive aggressive move to subtly undermine Dany and to be fair that wouldn’t necessarily be out of character for Sansa. But in my opinion this isn’t just Sansa trying to publicly humiliate Dany. It’s her expressing genuine concern about a problem that needs to be addressed. 

Considering that Tyrion is not only someone who Sansa knows and trusts but someone she knows to be politically and strategically minded like herself, it makes sense to me that she would direct the question to him. As Dany’s advisor he is the most likely person to be able to answer her. 

And this decision isn’t just sensible, it’s consistent with Sansa’s character. She’s acting as she has been since season 7, in the best interest of Winterfell and the North. This scene mirrors her challenging Jon in front of the Northern bannermen last season when she was concerned about his military strategy. She wasn’t acting out of dislike for Jon or a desire to usurp his place as ruler of the North (as many people theorised at the time). She was simply looking out for her people. 

The second and most divisive scene from the episode that I want to talk about is the conversation between Jon and Sansa where she asks him if he’s in love with Dany. On initial viewing I didn’t see any ambiguity in my reading of this scene. Sansa is concerned that Jon’s feelings for Dany are blinding him to what’s best for The North and their people. But looking online I was genuinely surprised to see so many people interpreting this scene as confirmation that Sansa has romantic feelings for Jon.

The scene starts with Sansa relaying the news to Jon that they have lost allies due to Jon’s decision to bend the knee to Dany and for me this sets up the main conflict of the scene - not the fact that Jon has chosen to ally with Daenerys but the fact that doing so has caused them to lose support from their Northern bannermen.  Of course this doesn’t disprove any theories that she might have feelings for Jon but it does emphasise Sansa’s priorities; keeping the Northern bannermen on side. Like in season 7, she wants to retain the loyalty and connections that the Starks have had with the other Northern families for generations. 

She explains that the Northerners feel understandably betrayed that they democratically elected a leader only for him to immediately transfer that power to a complete stranger with no apparent connections to the North or its people. 

Jon repeats his mantra that they can’t defeat the white walkers without Dany’s dragons but in comparison to Sansa’s hard logic, Jon’s vague argument that “we need her” isn’t exactly convincing. He insists that “who holds what titles doesn’t matter” but Sansa knows that it *does* matter. Because she values the loyalty and support of the North and while Jon is only thinking about the battle ahead Sansa is thinking about what happens next. 

Jon tells Sansa that Dany will be a good queen but he doesn’t offer any evidence to support this. He expects that the faith Sansa has in him is strong enough for her to take him at his word. But when you consider everything that Sansa has been through it’s not surprising that she’s skeptical. As she touched on last season, Robb died because he made stupid decisions. More specifically he died because his love for a woman caused him to go against his word and lose valuable allies. From Sansa’s perspective history is repeating itself right in front of her eyes.  “She’s not her father” Jon says and Sansa replies “No, she’s much prettier”.

I have seen sooo many people interpret this line as jealousy over Dany’s beauty and/or Jon’s love for her but given the context of the scene I really don’t think it’s that at all. 

The whole reason this line is significant is because Sansa’s arc from the beginning has been about learning not to trust appearances.

Joffrey and Cersei were beautiful but cruel. She considered The Hound and Tyrion to be ugly but they were kinder to her than anyone else at King’s Landing. Brienne and Arya look nothing like the traditionally beautiful women she grew up idolising but they are unfailingly loyal to her and would protect her with their lives.

She phrases it as a joke but on a deeper level she’s implying that maybe Dany IS like her father, but that Jon can’t see past her appearance to what she’s really like underneath.

In my opinion, the sadness in her face in that moment is not because she’s jealous of Dany’s beauty or of Jon’s feelings for her. It’s because she knows that looks can be deceiving and she fears that Dany’s beauty is causing Jon to overlook the danger she poses to him and to the North. It’s because she knows that loving Dany could get him hurt. 

Finally she says what I suspect she’s been thinking ever since Daenerys arrived in Winterfell; “Did you really bend the knee to save the North, or because you love her?” I know that a lot of people interpret this as Sansa wanting to know if Jon loves Dany because she has feelings for him herself. But reading the scene and taking into account Sansa’s actions and motivations over the past two seasons I really don’t think that’s it. Sansa wants to know if Jon loves Dany because she’s worried about him and about what it could mean for their people. She’s worried that Jon’s bias could cost them their lives and cost them the home they’ve fought so hard to get back to. She’s also understandably concerned that Jon is making major decisions on behalf of the North based on personal feelings rather than a genuine desire to do what’s best for their people. Ultimately, in Sansa’s eyes, Dany is dangerous and she wants to know exactly what power she holds over Jon (and by extension the North).

*EDIT* Some things I forgot to mention:

Dany’s utterly unhelpful response when asked by Sansa what dragons eat. “Whatever they want”. Really Dany? I don’t know what response she was hoping for here but I really don’t think she thought through the implications of this comment. She’s essentially saying to a room full of Northerners who already dislike her that if her dragons want to eat them, their livestock or their children she’s gonna do fuck all to stop them. Unlike Sansa and Jon Dany doesn’t care what happens to the Northerners. Her dragons and her desire to rule are always gonna take priority over everything else. 

The fact that reading Sansa’s distrust of Daenerys as jealousy or cattiness does a huge disservice to her character. As someone whose main concern is protecting The North and its people, it’s no wonder she’s not going to immediately warm to Queen ‘Imma let my dragons eat your people’. 

#got #got spoilers #got meta #long post #game of thrones #sansa stark #jon snow #daenerys targaryen #game of thrones meta #game of thrones spoilers

[sydney-stylites-blog]

Love is the bane of honour, the death of duty | The Dragonpit scene

This episode was the physical embodiment of this warning, now that I think about it. And yes! I’ve been repeatedly watching Jonerys scenes on near-loop since the episode came out because I’m in love and that killed my duty, so see, it works on multilevels 😂

When Aemon Targaryen had said this to Jon, I had thought it applied to Ygritte later, but it wasn’t it. Because with Ygritte, Jon always chose honor/duty, and though the choice wasn’t easy, he never sacrificed his duty for love (technically, he didn’t sacrifice honor for love too, he did it for duty). Of course, the lesson that Jon finally learned was that if anything can make someone forget their duty, it’s love, and no matter how honorable a man is, honor seems a small price to pay for the warmth of love. With Ygritte, though he came close, he never forgot his duty because as I’ve said numerous times, that wasn’t a choice. Be with Ygritte and let the entire Night’s Watch, countless innocents, his family and who knows who else just die? Come on, we all knew that was so not happening. But with Dany… Here is where it gets trickier and I loved how the episode set up the honor vs love clash we can expect next season.

So, the first scene (after Dany’s extra extra appearance 😂) is when Jon publicly pledges himself to Queen Daenerys of House Targaryen.

Oh wait, do you hear that? The sound of complete utter silence? That’s the sound of all the antis who were loudly clamouring about how Jon is playing Dany. And that whirring sound is their brains switching to a really high gear as they desperately try to ‘reach’ for a new explanation other than Jon being in love with Dany. Funny isn’t it, how one section of the antis is completely okay with butchering his character which is literally a symbol of honesty and honor and staying true to his word. Cersei’s deliberate ‘Ned Stark’s son’ was a reminder that Jon stands for not just honor in the narrative but duty, and unnecessary cruel treachery is by no means part of that code of honor and duty; but to part of the Jonsa Fandom what matters is that he shack up with Sansa even if it be the biggest OOC action ever for him, while the other section, of course, is happy to pile hate on him because he loves someone they don’t and are now loudly proclaiming how he isn’t even good enough for Sansa anymore. Like really? Dislike a ship all you want, but in this house, we do not tolerate any disrespect of the purest of all puppies Jon Snow, and we defend his honor and will continue to do so to best of our abilities.

So anyway this scene, Cersei makes a very reasonable offer in exchange for the truce, [and of course we now know that all she was trying to do was deal with her enemies one by one by dividing them (classic Cersei)], and listen no one, not one person, even considers that Jon will turn her down, not even Daenerys!

In that moment, everyone believed that they had succeeded and it was a done deal and let’s all pack up and go home. This scene simply smashed any theories of Jon playing Dany (like any reasonable person thought he was? 🙄) Why do I say that?

Every person, most notably on Team Dragonstone looked various states of surprised/shocked when he announced his allegiance to Daenerys, not just because it was a foolish thing to do, but because none of them were aware of it happening! Dany hadn’t informed any of them about what had happened between them on the boat, which is definitely odd because if the King in the North has submitted to you, shouldn’t you inform at least your Hand about it? But she didn’t do it. Why?

Because she did not take his submission seriously. Say what you will about Dany, but she knew that his swearing allegiance to her could stem in part from an overwhelming feeling of gratitude (and possibly the other overwhelming feeling of love? 😂) and she respected him enough to give him the chance to declare his submission to her in his own time and way, without pushing him into a corner where he would have no other option but to back her. She wanted his allegiance to come of his own free will, and that, ladies and gentlemen, made me love her like crazy. It was almost like giving him a way out, because she didn’t even tell Tyrion what had happened between them, and that’s interesting because it only emphasizes how much she trusts Jon and trusts that he will be true to his word.

And Jon, oh Jon! 💖😍 If Daenerys has come far from her first meeting, he has too. If this same offer had been made before he met Dany, he would obviously have accepted it because his priority was the White Walker threat, the Northern independence and the staying as far as possible from Southern politics. This offer was literally everything he had wanted at the beginning, all neatly wrapped up and handed to him on a platter, which is why everyone expected him to accept it. Because there is no reason to refuse! Right? Right?? Now I kept saying all along that Jon wasn’t playing Dany, he couldn’t possibly be doing that because his actions are not that of a player. And no moment more strongly proves my point than this one. The ‘undercover lover’ theory could have worked if Jon had agreed to the truce. He wouldn’t even have needed to justify it to Dany or anyone else, and if he did, all he had to say was that of course he’s still loyal to her, but she doesn’t need the North as much as she needs a truce with Cersei, and she would have agreed. Like seriously, it was such a neat solution. Jon would have gotten everything he wanted without having to give anything in return, Dany wouldn’t have doubted Jon’s loyalty and would have still helped him defeat the Night King without assuming that he’s fallen in love with her (which is what she’s probably been trying to convince herself about anyway after the intense hand holding, that it was a spur of the moment thing and ’Jon Snow isn’t actually in love me and the longing stares were just him being hopeful for a successful military alliance!'😂), and of course, the antis would have had a field day because if Jon was truly in love with Daenerys, then why didn’t he publicly stand up for her in the pit? And what did our precious puppy decide to do? What he does best! Make a stand because it is the honorable thing to do, and also because there is no way he’s not going to help Daenerys take down Cersei at a time when she will need all the help she can get! It’s honor born out of love! And my Jonerys heart has never danced such a gig as it did in that moment. Because in this scene, Jon not only does the honorable thing, but he also reveals that his feelings for Dany go beyond political alliances, or the crass 'use her for her dragons’ theory.

And this scene was yet another iconic moment in their relationship, when Dany - whose sole focus was winning the Iron Throne - is now giving much more importance to Jon’s original goal, and Jon - whose sole focus was defeating the White Walkers - is now giving more importance to Dany’s original goal. The dynamic is so beautiful because they haven’t just fallen in love with each other, no, they have come to understand the other’s viewpoint, they have come to know, respect and admire the other person and value their goals and give them the importance they deserve. Because if defeating the White Walkers is important to save humanity, so is defeating Cersei, who has shown time and again that all she truly cares about is her immediate family, completely disregarding the realm, unlike both Jon and Dany. Their relationship is so complex, so balanced, so beautiful. It’s not just as simple as ’ice and fire’ by any means. And this scene brought out their relationship dynamic extremely well.

So this tiny sliver of a moment between Cersei’s offer and Jon’s rejection gave me intense Jonerys feels because Dany’s trust in Jon is so unwaveringly strong that she expected, wanted even, him to agree to Cersei’s condition. Which is a glorious way to show how far she’s come from her initial stance of ’bend the knee’. Dany has realized the importance of the Northern threat and when she pledged to destroy the Night King in return for nothing, she meant it. How do I know that? Because she was willing to let Jon remain neutral ’for the greater good’. See, this is why I love Dany. The White Walkers are a threat to the entire realm, and Dany is dedicating all her forces towards their destruction, that is after losing already having lost a dragon. She could have gone the Cersei way of letting the world burn as long as it didn’t affect her, but she didn’t. [A lot of antis make her sound like a tyrant and I’m just so done, but that’s another post. This one is strictly 💖Jonerys💖]. She is actively contributing and asking for nothing in return. Cersei, on the other hand, is only being asked to not make Daenerys fight on two fronts. Dany could very well have demanded Jon Snow’s help in return later, and it would only have been fair. But she didn’t. Even knowing that after fighting the White Walkers, her forces will be heavily depleted and facing Cersei will be more difficult, Dany still does not expect/want Jon to help her. If that isn’t reason enough for Jon to support her, I don’t know what is. Antis claiming that she’s an entitled selfish supremist??? Antis claiming that Jon has zero reason to like/admire her??? When she’s thinking exactly the way Jon wanted her to, realizing the importance of the White Walkers threat and not demanding anything in return. My Jonerys heart melted at this scene! 😭💖

And of course, Dany’s face was priceless!

She was so torn between ’oh you idiot, now you’ve done it’ and ’my God, I love this man’. The perfect mixture of exasperation and admiration was so perfectly pulled off! Because of course she had wanted him to agree, that was the logical thing to do. But then he didn’t, and her face is like.. Yeah, no wonder I love him. Because this is part of who Jon Snow is, and part of the reason we adore him so much. Lies and deceit don’t come easy to him, this man doesn’t lie unless he absolutely has to, unless he has no other choice, and even then it’s not easy, and that makes him the hero we all love.

Another thing I found super interesting about this scene is Jon’s choice of words, but that’ll be a whole other post.

Also, I love how their ‘together’ness is echoed in everything. They will defeat the White Walker ‘together’ and then fight to overthrow Cersei ‘together’.

*jonerys feels intensify*

#jonerys #jon snow #game of thrones #sorry for the long post #i've now realized #i'll need to make a dozen more posts #before i'm done #i'm officially trash #because #no amount of jonerys is too much