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crystalelemental · 11 hours

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So here's a question. How much of the Netherworld section of Nexomon 1 is actually...real?

Even before we go in there, we're in the nightmare. You go talk to the scientists first, and they explain that they cannot get in touch with anyone, a problem repeatedly brought up in the nightmare itself. You're already in it before even taking the portal itself. Presumably, everything past that point is pretend.

But Glacia is, in fact, gone. Juliet comments on it after defeating Omnicron, that Glacia just disappeared and no one knows where she went.

The creation of the device to send you to the Netherworld was clearly real. You got there somehow, after all.

Miriam is real. She expresses you only met her fake self in the nightmare, but you never met her before then. The nightmare doesn't even operate off of what you, specifically, know. You met her false self first. This implies conjuration of real world elements you may not even be aware of, similar to Grunda's human form. Nexomon 2 pretty much confirms that is how Grunda looks as a human, so this isn't just made up.

And of course, Nexomon 2 has repeated jokes about the Mandrasses. Which weren't even real. And which Deena wasn't even around for, yet seems to remember. Which implies that at least some of the events are true, and Ziegler is commandeering them for this nightmare to prevent recognition of discrepancy. The setting is a little wonky, but some of it, at least, seems grounded in reality.

But other parts clearly aren't. Is the vortex real? We don't really know how Omnicron truly came here, nor if they can actually be sent back that way. If it were, and Ulzar had the power to banish them that way, why wouldn't he have? That one seems entirely made up.

Similarly, the netherworld almost certainly wasn't created by Ulzar as they initially claim, much less the wardens being his creation.

The rangers are likely not real, given they'd have no way to be there, similar to the iteration of Spencer and the bounty hunter we see. The children of Omnicron likely aren't real, but...did you meet them too? Like, in the actual run? Because it seems likely they'd defend their father, or need to be dealt with first considering they can supply him with their power.

Then there are the completely up in the air components. Like...is Merida actually the weakest sibling? That may not be a hard fact, but rather perception; but whose? Does the protagonist believe that, or Ziegler? If it's Ziegler's...that's an outside objective opinion, he might be right.

In all their fake nightmares, does that align to them? It feels right for each of them, but they weren't entirely real. Is that truly what their nightmare looked like, or is that again just perception? And yours, or Ziegler's?

For being effectively just a big dream sequence, it does raise a lot of questions about what truly did happen in the initial run we didn't see.

#nexomon

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crystalelemental · 12 hours

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BOB, that's gold. That should be the one. Bob. Short for Bobert. Simultaneously blending in seamlessly and having no idea how human names work.

Also like...Metta's as old as the others, right? He'd have to be; Omnicron has been gone since his defeat at Ulzar's hands, so there's no chance for a seventh child to have occurred at any other time. Which means he's been alive and just kinda...hiding out. For 1000 years. Whether constantly in the frozen tundra or elsewhere, he winds up there for a stint, and it's that time we know for a fact he interfaced with humans. Maybe someone there gave him the name. Like he didn't have a name, he just showed up in this seemingly abandoned house and everyone figures he's a stray that wandered in and Ol' Granny Icebones is like "Poor thing doesn't even remember his name. We'll call you 'James.'" And that's how he became part of the village and assumed to be human.

"anacharafan: Also as an additional piece of trivia, someone was writing an x reader with the Nexolord so they asked if the Nexolord had an official like, human name. JV very obviously jokingly went "James." As a joke, I mean very much so, person complained that's like one of their childhood crushes jokingly and JV went "yeah definitely James then". So like a ton of the fandom saw that and RAN with it. If The Nexolord is anywhere and named he's named James.

Funnily enough someone asked like seriously if his name is actually can only james and JV went "that's the joke one. Nate was the intended one but still unused" which is so funny because nobody calls him Nate. That is James right there."

I think my absolute favorite part of this is that neither of those feel right. Like, sure dude, the children of Omnicron. You got Merida, Ulrich, Fenrir, Nadine, and James. Like, on the one hand, this does not at all fit the style of the other children. On the other, his is literally the only name that fits in with humans.

#nexomon #metta

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crystalelemental · 13 hours

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#anacharafan

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crystalelemental · 13 hours

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Talking about the children of Omnicron reminds me, I never shared what my wife and I talked about after the Big Reveal: babysitting Solus.

Obviously this only works in a sort of AU situation where Solus isn't living with Ulrich, and the other children are free to move about, but just imagine Deena raising this kid herself, but getting busy with the guild work or dealing with the Kroma situation, and having to ask them to babysit. In priority order:

Ulrich is the obvious first pick. Even outside of being your father figure in-game, he runs an orphanage of human children. He knows what he's doing when it comes to kids. He's calm and reasonable, but firm. He's basically made for this role, and he takes it seriously. A bit of a stick in the mud sometimes, but the easy top pick.

#2 is Fenrir. He doesn't really like kids, but he at least does the job. A bit hands-off, and easily annoyed when Solus needs something, but he's still responsive even if he'll grumble about it the whole time. He just takes things too seriously to be truly lax with this task. And Nara's asking. That's his little sister, the next one in line, so there's a bit more companionship there. He can't really say no when she asks, even if he's bothered.

Nadine would be #2, given she's pretty reasonable and exudes fun wine aunt vibes. When she's in the mood for it, she's great. Not always a good influence, but she's the kind that teaches the important life lessons that go against what's typically taught, you know? And she is genuine with praise, when it's earned. The problem is, "when she's in the mood for it." Nadine also does not particularly like kids, and unlike Fenrir, is willing to refuse Deena whenever she just doesn't feel like it, and she often does not feel like it. She's not #3 by any personal failing, but rather, she's #3 under threat of violence. Even #3 is higher than she wants, but she does understand why.

Merida was supposed to be #2. Considering she has her Surfer-sona, you would assume she can be super sweet and upbeat and fun; all things kids would respond well to, right? She'd take them on adventures to the beach and everything! Who wouldn't love that? It worked out great until Merida decided hey, if this kid's gonna be a future Sovereign, they need to be the best in everything. I'm gonna teach this kid everything I know about volleyball. And it turns out the kid picks it up pretty quick. One comment about the game being easy while they were playing against each other, and Merida got Actually For Reals Angry. She is no longer considered an ideal choice, and is banned from playing volleyball with the child.

Zetta is not allowed to watch Solus. He wants to. God does he want to. He'll ask constantly about when Deena will ask him to help watch the kid, he's put together all sorts of fun uncle activities they can do together, exactly none of which are safe or appropriate for children. Deena just laughs it off as work being slow and not needing anyone, and he doesn't really question it, thankfully. He's just eagerly awaiting the day he's asked. Deena has honestly considered leaving the kid home alone before going to Zetta's.

BONUS ROUND: Metta is actually a pretty great babysitter. You wouldn't really expect it, given his disgust for humans and how connected to them Solus is, but he is nothing if not calculating and able to plan for the long game. Babysitting the future Sovereign of Monsters is an opportunity he can't pass up, and he can use that to undo Deena's attempts to imbue sympathy toward humans. He is trying to be a terrible influence. Solus will complain about a kid not sharing their crayons, and he'll be all "Typical humans, always taking what isn't theirs. What if there were no humans? What if you could have all the crayons to yourself?" And Solus, being a child, will be like "Yeah!" and run off to take the crayons. Unfortunately for him, when Solus does use force to take them back, the other kid starts crying and their empathy kicks in, and they're able to talk through the problem and be friends again. Inadvertently and despite his best efforts, he's a very effective conflict resolution manager. He hates it so much.

#nexomon #nexomon extinction

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crystalelemental · 13 hours

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That is...hilarious, actually. I wonder if they've always disliked Metta, or if that was just a product of not knowing what to do with him.

With the Abyssal portions defeated, time for the final thoughts on Nexomon Extinction.

The Abyssals are exactly what I wanted out of the Tyrants.

My biggest complaint story-wise for this game was that the Tyrants themselves really didn't matter much. There's a thousand-year war among the Tyrants going on, that pushed humanity so far that one Guild leader created a cult to revive Omnicron, and their successor created artificial dragons to hunt Tyrants, an artificial Tyrant to command them, and then another, bigger one when that plan failed. But despite how significant this war was...all of the Tyrants we meet are pretty inconsequential, and most are associated with a human who does most of the talking and planning to begin with. I understand that this game is the human errors side of thing after the last game's presentation of the threat of Nexomon, but it's still kinda rough to go through all these story segments with the Tyrants not producing anything substantial. You get to postgame where you can hunt them down, and they're all a pain in the ass to find, with nothing drawing me to them.

The Abyssals, though? This is what I wanted. A thousand years ago, the first Abyssal arrived. And their first act? Killing Hilda. Another is stated to have made an attempt on Eliza's life. These are a much more pressing, salient threat. Sure, Tyrants destroyed cities, but we've never seen them do anything. The Abyssals have personal connection.

Despite their power, the Abyssals are odd in that they never aimed to become Sovereign of Monsters, and they seem immune to Solus' influence as the current Queen. What's presented is a pretty interesting mystery that builds up more questions than it feels like it wants to answer. What's the deal with these weird engravings? Why are Abyssals so weird? Apparently each is born with a clear goal from its creator, but this creator is unknown to them, and their specific goals are incredibly simplistic, with no known overarching goal. They're super unusual.

By gameplay, the Precursor Island is really fun. It might be an odd comparison, but it reminds me of the bonus dungeon of Ib a bit. There's a central location, and your goal is running around everywhere to collect the things you need to progress, solving puzzles that sometime intertwine a bit. It's a really fun system, finding each of the Abyssals and solving their puzzles. The only annoying ones were the flying one (Inominox) and the electric one (Volcel). The rest was really fun. Even the weird maze puzzle was fairly clever, though the final solution was a little...obvious but still hard to figure out the hint.

I think what really sells me on the Abyssals...well, two things. The smaller one is design. The Abyssals are just really cool concepts. Venefelis shows up and is immediately incredible, being super imposing but kinda goofy, and stated outright that he shouldn't be strong enough to pull off the nonsense he has. Kroma is my absolute favorite, and she's set up as super imposing given her drive is killing Eliza, only for Venefelis to rant about how incompetent Kroma is for being the only one of them to fail in her mission. Then there's Screaming Fire Velociraptor, who is hilarious in concept. And Inominox, who is such a coward that it won't face anyone with more than one Nexomon, and that one Nexomon needs to be weak to Flying. Or the soup for Volcel. There's Caelesa, who ran across the world, and was attacked by the Guild for little reason other than paranoia, since she hurt no one in her efforts. There's Pluvian, whose entire goal was to show up, scream, and then get killed by the Guild for no clear reason. There's Rotrimus, who you try to order around, and initially agrees, but is intercepted by the force of their creator bending its will back to refusing your call. It's a really interesting and dynamic group, that apparently has no clear association. Many of them insist they worked alone. They had a creator, but they themselves don't even think of themselves as a unified group. Only Venefelis seems to confirm that they have association.

The other is that this group is delightfully aligned to the themes of the game. Nexomon Extinction has two general themes I can identify. The first is a bit more obvious and repeatedly stated: second chances. The children of Omnicron refer to their support as their redemption, the entire plot is Deena attempting to grant a second chance at saving the world, your resolution of the central conflict is trading the destruction of your direct enemy into granting them a second chance at life. There's an ongoing importance to the idea of getting a second shot at things...but a second shot isn't necessarily going to mean doing better. The former hero comments that your actions amount to the same thing she did, and despite the failures of the dragons, Amelie's second chance is doubling down on a decision that worked out poorly. This leads into the second theme, and the one I like a lot better: the limits of personal agency.

The former hero is a good lens for this one. Repeatedly throughout this game, their actions are referred to as if it was a huge mistake. They themselves talk about it as a mistake. Deena outright calls it stupid decision made by her moronic friends. Even Ulzar, who is more sympathetic to the situation, talks about it as if it were a mistake, if an understandable one. Absolutely everyone treats their actions as something that led to the present problem, and thus was the wrong decision.

But...we were there. Omnicron was going to completely destroy the world. You can argue that the destruction of his soul in the netherworld wasn't necessary, and that was the mistake. But it's well known that he'll come back time and again; it'd be pushing the problem out to the next generation. And Omnicron could follow through. When you fail to destroy him in the Netherworld, Omnicron devastates an area so badly that entire maps are wiped out of reality. This was done in hours. Omnicron tells you outright he could've annihilated the planet in a day, but he stopped solely to challenge his rival, the strongest human, as a matter of pride. This wasn't an idle threat. It was an active, immediate devastation looming on the horizon.

Faced with that, what choice did you really have? Yes, there was a technically a choice. But who could choose the alternative? When humanity is faced with its destruction through the war of the Tyrants, yes, you had a choice to make those dragons or not. But faced with the destruction of multiple cities and further looming threat, what choice did you have? When those failed, you had the choice to stop. But then the destruction of the Tyrants continue unabated. Who would choose to stop? Vados embodies this. He's a creation of Amelie, born to hunt Tyrants to protect humanity. The thing about Vados is that he has agency and beliefs of his own. When told to destroy Petram in spite of the Laterians interfering, he refuses to harm humans. But we know that will happen anyway. We're told repeatedly that the Tyrants will continue to rise, until Vados has destroyed so much that the world is inhospitable to humans as well. He has his own agency, his own desire to protect humanity and protect the world. But he'll betray that through his own actions, regardless of what he wants. He was made to hunt Tyrants, and so he shall, til the end of days. The only way to avert this is to refuse to fight every Tyrant, to refuse to wage this absolute crusade. And that's the only choice he cannot make. He doesn't get a choice.

The Abyssals continue this theme. Like Vados, the Abyssals are created for a singular purpose. They are born with a goal, and that is all they have. They have their own personalities, but few of them seem interested in the specifics of what's going on. Kroma doesn't seem particularly interested in killing Eliza, she just has to. Pluvian doesn't seem to function as a willing sacrifice, but she does it anyway because that's her goal. Regardless of what they want, they will carry out their goal.

Unlike Vados, though, they have no overarching philosophy. Nothing that specifically guides their actions beyond the immediate. Caelesa runs around the world, but she doesn't seem to understand why. So when their goal is accomplished, despite getting a second chance at life...none of them know what to do with it. So they just sit around, completely docile, until you strike them down again. What other choice did they have? They never knew what they were aiming to do in the first place.

Except for Venefelis. The first Abyssal. At first, he had no idea what his point was. He had a goal, carried it out, and got sealed within the woods forever. Not ideal, but mission accomplished. Then 300 years later, another entity like him appears, carrying out a similarly short-sighted goal. Then 200 years later, another. And another 100 years after that. They appear faster and faster, until we get two within ten years. And as the only one to really survive, even if just as a spirit...you recognize the pattern. After all, Venefelis understands Caelesa's goal better than she understands it herself. She thinks it was just running, but Venefelis identifies it as a scouting mission. You know there's a grander design here; a purpose. But you can't figure out what. Because no one will tell you. You creator, the one guiding your motions, won't speak to you.

What else can you do but try to divine their intent? With nothing else to go off of, you watch their actions, and notice only one thing stands out. Kroma failed, and following that, no other Abyssals were created. Maybe your creator quit. Maybe it's because of Kroma. You don't know that, but what else could it be? You don't understand your purpose, but you desperately want to understand it; to know why you're still here. What choice do you have but to force a second chance on her? To enforce your creator's will, regardless of what she'd want? What choice does she have but to obey?

The twisted thing is, there really is nothing else for them. Rotramus shows this definitively. When you attempt to issue a command, he thinks about it, and passively decides sure, I'll help. It's not the resounding success of an authority check commanding its allegiance. It's someone making a choice, as if it has nothing better to do and no reason to argue. But its creator's will forces it to refuse. Even with its goal accomplished, and no reason to refuse, they interfere, denying your freedom. Quite literally, you have no other choice.

Everything that happens in this arc is driven by Venefelis' desires. His agency, his desire to understand his creator, drives everything forward. No one else even understands why they're here. They didn't have much choice either way. He brought them back, gave them a second chance they had no use for. But what else could he have done? To see what he wanted done, all he could do was solve Kroma's failure by pushing her into another attempt. And it wouldn't have even worked. It was entirely for nothing. But what can you do but try? You technically have a choice. You finished your goal, you could just let it all rest. But faced with the dread of an eternity devoid of purpose, who would choose any different?

Despite how many open-ended threads there are, and how many mysteries we're left with, this does feel like a self-contained story. We don't know what the point is. We don't know what it means. But neither did they. And the result of that ignorance, that impossibility, is they existed unable to live for themselves, and no second chance could get them to defy that fate. Which really resonates with me. I loved this side story a lot, and these open questions have really gotten me interested in the sequel game. I've heard they officially announced its existence but not a release date or any details. I can be patient. But I'm really invested in this one. They really hit a sweet spot here.

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crystalelemental · 14 hours

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Hmm...that's honestly an interesting theory.

Deena's got her own situation and goal going on, and it would fit in with things. Like, the first game in particular was very focused on the concept of legacy, protecting Ulzar's legacy, what your legacy will be if you destroy Omnicron, etc. Deena's sort of her own living legacy; the choices she made echo through time and still continue. Potentially, even the Abyssals and their creator are tied to her; we don't know for sure. There's also the fact that, as far as I'm aware, we don't know the new protagonist's allegiances either. Maybe there's a reason to oppose Solus, even if the Abyssal Mother isn't strictly good either, and that puts us at odds. Maybe Solus makes a decision Nara doesn't agree with and it comes to conflict there. That would be interesting; a full loop back to her being on the receiving end of a child betraying the family.

The children of Omnicron are a big mystery, though. They might care, but they're certainly not close. They're kinda mean to each other in Nexomon 1, even as they're working together. Like their goals are aligned, but Fenrir complains about Merida never getting anything right, and Zetta being pretty flippant all around. Metta's relationship is also a complete unknown. He revived them, but we don't see him interact much with the others at all. So who knows. There's definitely hurt feelings, but how much of it stems from genuine care and how much of it stems from a general sense of "how dare you?" At the very least, Omnicron never seemed to feel anything more than "she still can't stand against me."

...wait, the main dev hates Metta? Like, specifically and has openly stated? That's hilarious.

With the Abyssal portions defeated, time for the final thoughts on Nexomon Extinction.

The Abyssals are exactly what I wanted out of the Tyrants.

#nexomon

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crystalelemental · 14 hours

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#forklift

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crystalelemental · 15 hours

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guru guru

#touhou #hina kagiyama

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crystalelemental · 17 hours

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My least favorite thing in education is when people will complain about not having enough time in a five day work week. “Maybe we should teach our students how to read with like actual instruction” gets met with complaints about not having enough time to do all this instruction to catch them up, and it’s like…first of all, don’t you ever implicitly recommend extending my work day again. Second, maybe you can do actual instruction for like fifteen minutes instead of the hour plus on a computer program that isn’t teaching reading so much as how to guess through busywork and we could even save time.

#job shenanigans

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crystalelemental · 18 hours

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I didn’t see that description but that is hilarious.

Also the funniest outcome is that Solus is killed, and Ziegler gets to be like man. Finally, she’ll stop messing with my domain. Only for the new protag to revive her and then have Solus bring back more nonsense, maybe revive the Abyssal she can now control of something, and Ziegler just loses it.

Also I know they never talk about it, bht I wonder what his stance is on Hilda and Ulzar and the first protagonist. They’re dead, so they should be under his domain, but they wander the earth and do as they please. He’s gotta have opinions on this.

Personally, I think Ziegler might be the funniest character in Nexomon.

Dude is just trying to do his job, man.

Nexomon 1, your protagonist breaks into hell to destroy Omnicron's soul, and fucks it up so badly that you accidentally release eight souls from his charge. Dude is understandably pissed, and considering you apparently got your ass beat and possibly died, he's unwilling to let you go, as the wardens need a charge.

But you beat him up and escape, so he has minions go around the overworld map seeking you out and trying to stop you. But you can beat all of them, and then he's kinda just. Stuck. With no one who can stop you for being like this. Great. Spectacular.

Enter Nexomon 2, where honestly his inclusion is divine. Bolzen was my least favorite of the Tyrants, and Cadium my least favorite area, so I was ready to hate that section, but I love how it all tied together. Ziegler shows up because you're ripping souls out of hell again, this time to raise your Tyrant army in opposition to Vados. A conflict he has no interest in. He warns you against meddling in his affairs, and if you agree to release the Tyrants, he's pleased that you're reasonable about this and even gives you a Golden Nexotrap! And the Hilda and Eliza show up and arcane blast him back to hell as he screams about your betrayal.

Then the Abyssals. You were just trying to free Salem from a prison situation, something that shouldn't be anywhere near Ziegler's domain. But Venefelis redirects that power to revive not just eight other Abyssal Tyrants, but hundreds of extinct Nexomon. And Ziegler's just reeling like...what? Why? What the hell is the point of this? You didn't do it on purpose, but he doesn't know that. All he knows is your power caused this. And Venefelis, hilariously, insists that it is just you messing with him, so he's completely done and decides to stop you by force as needed. And you beat him up and he has to leave anyway. So he tracks you down around the overworld again, but he counts as a Nexomon so you can just trap him and now he has to be your friend for a while.

Dude just wants his job to go smoothly, and is being so rational about this. And you will not let him just have a normal day.

#nexomon #Ziegler

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